The Covid19 thread

[SGalisa]

As for returning to work...
Lots of people I've talked with would vote for those people who are super paranoid about working at the office in future months, then let those people work at home, and let the rest of us work in the office. Problem solved. People who have to work in other jobs, where they have to be in the building to process manufacturing, etc., well, they take whatever precautions necessary to avoid breathing in someone else's "germs"...

As for this COVID-19 potentially being "seasonal", that is, if someone gets sick with it in the future months, there needs to be a system set in place if that person gets sent home to stay on short-term disability (2 weeks or more), since they would not want to dig into any company paid sick days, just in case they end up getting sick with something else that keeps them out for a day or two... here and there.

'Fraid it doesn't work that way. The employee doesn't make the choice about whether to work at home or not. The employer does. And it doesn't matter if the job can be done from home or not.
. . .

As far as your ideas for using disability or something for re-infections won't work for most. While they can indeed legislate it for big companies, do such regulations cover small businesses, which employ roughly 50% of workers*? No. Laws are always written "this applies to companies with more than 50 people or some such magic number. So half the workforce isn't covered by your idea at the starting gate.

Then change the system, but obviously according to the type of job it might be. Just like the rest of us have to adapt to using electronic payments, instead of paper/coin cash, change the work environments to keep up with the changing times. Otherwise, die a sudden financial death for everyone... business owners and employees.

On premises workers cannot obviously work from home... that is a given. But many creative designers, customer service reps, and printed info workers using electronic programs, they CAN work from home. Lots of jobs already have this very system, especially for bad weather days and parents or guardians who have to care for sick or vacationing kids on the home front.


Unless some of those top billionaires, now alive and thriving on planet earth, want to send their money our way, money isn't going to last forever coming from Uncle Sam, for example. TPTB will start pooling it from our own accounts, if they haven't done so already... and then, they will declare it as a stimulus or some sort of magical name. Such *magic* won't work forever. Depends on TPTB controlling these operations, too... wish they could just enter a bunch of numbers into a digital or electronic system, and keep it going, so that we could all be living like millionaires without the real cash.

However, Life doesn't work that way. Someone has to MAKE things for other items to actually work for consumer use... Someone has to plant the food in the fields and harvest it; grow cloth fiber plants and process that for clothing, etc. Others have to prep, wrap, and package all these things for public use and consumption. Plus, the Current "don't work at all" system is killing retirement funds and decreasing (USA) SS input. Anyone who supports it *staying out of work* (hmmm... wishful thinking ... if only it could last forever that way!) is also supporting the GREEN NEW DEAL efforts... Just look at what is MIA clean off store shelves.. and how much "rush hour" traffic is OFF the roads. Lots of problems being analyzed and re-evaluated thru these COVID-19 situations.
It's a dream goal basically on a proverbial *silver platter*. Just keep it the way it is NOW... think about it.


BTW, how does anyone here think that the retail / "ESSENTIAL" folks feel being forced to work, while *non-important* folks / loonies stay home..? And if healthy people can shop in supermarkets, etc. with masks, why can't they work? This whole system currently makes ZERO sense.

On another note... Personally, I like the face nose/mouth covering, because it keeps most of the allergens away. The elastics still hurt the ears. The tie strings don't help either. Need a hair clip to hold in place...

[Annoyed]

You are limiting your experience to just the USA, which is like me arguing "just in AU"
The response and infection rates in nations with nationalised healthcare have been far better than the US.
Observable, objective FACT.
The US now has over 25% of the worlds deaths from Covid-19, more than most THIRD world countries, and when you start counting people that died at home rather than just those in hospitals, that number will spike dramatically. Yes, you have a higher population, and that must be taken into account, but even then your percentage of deaths are higher.
Why do you think that is?

We have these things called cities, and some of them have outgrown their britches by 50x or more. NYC comes to mind. Anytime you cram that many critters into that small an area, it will lead to very rapid spread of disease.

[Gatefan1976]

We have these things called cities, and some of them have outgrown their britches by 50x or more. NYC comes to mind. Anytime you cram that many critters into that small an area, it will lead to very rapid spread of disease.

The geographical "heart" of Sydney is in frigging Parramatta (some 20 plus MILES from the city) because of our massive urban sprawl.

Yes population density will add to disease, I'm not disputing that FACT at all. Explains why governors and mayors of "big cities" have come down so damn hard on people for doing moronic things.
Or are they wrong for doing so?
Liberate "X state", right?

[Annoyed]

The geographical "heart" of Sydney is in frigging Parramatta (some 20 plus MILES from the city) because of our massive urban sprawl.

Yes population density will add to disease, I'm not disputing that FACT at all. Explains why governors and mayors of "big cities" have come down so damn hard on people for doing moronic things.
Or are they wrong for doing so?
Liberate "X state", right?

There is an incredibly well organized PR push underway at this time to re-open everything, I strongly disagree with that push. Leaders are right in trying to nail people down for doing stupid things,

About two weeks ago, there were two articles in a local fish wrapper on the same day

1: Urban minorities appear to be more affected by Covid 19
2: Urban minorities ignoring social distancing.

These two articles ran on the same freaking day! And nobody put two and two together!

At the same time, the mayor of the urban area in question was complicit in urging them to ignore social distancing!

That is freakin' nuts! Right along with all the other people who want to ignore reality about this.

[Gatefan1976]

There is an incredibly well organized PR push underway at this time to re-open everything, I strongly disagree with that push. Leaders are right in trying to nail people down for doing stupid things,

About two weeks ago, there were two articles in a local fish wrapper on the same day

1: Urban minorities appear to be more affected by Covid 19
2: Urban minorities ignoring social distancing.

These two articles ran on the same freaking day! And nobody put two and two together!

At the same time, the mayor of the urban area in question was complicit in urging them to ignore social distancing!

That is freakin' nuts! Right along with all the other people who want to ignore reality about this.

Do you see me disagreeing?
NYC is in lockdown, the Governer is pushing for it to remain in lockdown, but you have the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT pushing for things to open up.
Sydney as a "city" is still shut down and yet there are fools going to the beach because as you say, they want to ignore the reality of this.
They miss their time at the beach, or at the park, or gym or whatever else because we are -by nature- social creatures. I however (and something you can fully understand) LIKE my peace and quiet, but I don't get that now because I have 3 kids and a wife at home everyday so that has been shattered.
I don't resent them, I love all of them, but after YEARS of adapting to this after I was so social, it's just a shock to the system.
I'll adapt, I always do, and I think you will have no problems either, but their are different challenges facing ALL of us right now, be it money, social isolation, fear, depression, anxiety and the list could go on.
The fact is, there is no "common cure" for this situation, let alone the disease.

[magi877]

sorry bastards... this pandemic,and those who caused it and profiting from it, may actually be the first legitimate reason for war in 70 years

hey, think of it--all the nations that have been affected. all coming together to destroy the ruling communist party-- could bring us one step closer to a 'star trek planet'

anyhow, wonder what else they made and sold is crap?

LONDON — Senior British doctors have warned that 250 ventilators the United Kingdom bought from China risk causing "significant patient harm, including death," if they are used in hospitals, according to a letter seen by NBC News.

The doctors said the machines had a problematic oxygen supply, could not be cleaned properly, had an unfamiliar design and a confusing instruction manual, and were built for use in ambulances, not hospitals.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/b...itals-n1194046

[magi877]

The article you cited only said that Medicare patients get extra funding for hospitals if it's said they have Covid. Medicare mostly just covers retired people (and people with disabilities I think) . It also said that there hadn't been any evidence of anyone saying a patient had/may have had covid when they didn't just so the hospital could get money yet, just that it's possible.

As for putting people who have been tested but not confirmed in the same room as confirmed cases, that might have something to do with the amount a space and resources a hospital has in it (a lot if these hospitals really don't have much space to deal with the patients they have in normal times). I don't exactly think it's a good idea, but it's better than putting someone they think might have it with people who don't have it while they're waiting on test results.

Even with antibody testing saying saying that over 2 million people may have been exposed to Covid in NY, the morality rate still comes up to 0.5%, the seasonal flu has a mortality rate of 0.1%. Covid spreads more easily than the flu, that's the big issue.

anyone who has either soc security supplemental income or social security disability income is automatically placed on either medicaid (low income) or medicare (disability and retirement) regardless of age

i have been on SSDI since 2012 and medicare became my primary insurance and tricare my secondary. i was 45 at the time

under the CARES act funding was extended so that all covid19 patients who needed to be covered were paid for via medicaid or medicare channels EVEN IF they are not entitled/already enrolled in medicaid/medicare

this is to cover those who are already un insured or under insured and to those who have recently become unemployed due to covid and have lost insurance

so, the pool for fudging numbers is quite large

https://www.healthaffairs.org/do/10....9.207680/full/

[magi877]

Site is behind a paywall.

now that is just false--1) i paid nothing and 2) i would never pay for the ny times

i believe all it asked for was to sign in with a facebook acct

but see, this is a great way to dance around stuff.. how hard would it have been for you to type "oxford vaccine" into a search engine and read the info elsewhere

wait a second!!! are you a "t" crossing and "i" dotting bureaucrat by profession?

are these enough for you?

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKBN22C0UK

https://www.france24.com/en/20200430...ord-scientists

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronav...rd-university/

https://www.businessinsider.com/monk...uraging-2020-4

[magi877]

I would ask an addendum to the above discussions about the *tattoo-vaccine* version...

Why in the world would anyone use this COVID-19 vaccination process as a means to be approved to work or not, when OTHER illnesses have occurred in the past, and employment abilities and opportunities didNOT stop those... So why this, and why ONLY COVID-19 now..?
This is pure insanity otherwise.

Plus, it sounds more like (a convenient *excuse* for) manipulative tactics against the GP than what the virus is actually causing to those who are not as affected, as the multiple immune-compromised folks...




:

yes.. if people out of fear, fall for this-- covid19 passport for work.. then they will fall for any other "requirement" the govt places on them

all a violation of privacy and the right to work

closer and closer to all things done by diktat and whipping up fear for compliance

[Gatefan1976]

now that is just false--1) i paid nothing and 2) i would never pay for the ny times

i believe all it asked for was to sign in with a facebook acct

but see, this is a great way to dance around stuff.. how hard would it have been for you to type "oxford vaccine" into a search engine and read the info elsewhere

wait a second!!! are you a "t" crossing and "i" dotting bureaucrat by profession?

are these enough for you?

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-h...-idUSKBN22C0UK

https://www.france24.com/en/20200430...ord-scientists

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/coronav...rd-university/

https://www.businessinsider.com/monk...uraging-2020-4

Actually, the NYT is behind a paywall, you can get 2 free articles a month, but ATM all Covid related information and articles are free.
I hate to support Annoyed, but he is correct here.

[magi877]

Actually, the NYT is behind a paywall, you can get 2 free articles a month, but ATM all Covid related information and articles are free.
I hate to support Annoyed, but he is correct here.

all i had to do is sign in with FB

but again, not really the point though, i used it because i think it came up first on google search.. and NYT is well known

if i would have used one further down the list then it may have been "that site is not reputable""

FFS! How about the headline?

[magi877]

I'm specifically AVOIDING the politics of this by stating that I don't care who is in charge.

All I am arguing is the response.

so, a yes then..got it!

[Gatefan1976]

so, a yes then..got it!

We are being given a very specific leeway here because of the subject. I fully expect this thread to close down once this is over to keep in line with the 2020 vision statement.

[Annoyed]

all i had to do is sign in with FB

but again, not really the point though, i used it because i think it came up first on google search.. and NYT is well known

if i would have used one further down the list then it may have been "that site is not reputable""

FFS! How about the headline?

And why in the name of all that is unholy should I sign into NYT with Facebook? Or, more succinctly, why should I help them farm information about me?

Granted, it's easy enough to beat most of these paywalls; they let you have X articles / month and then block you. But if you delete all your cookies from the site, it resets the counter.

But I generally won't bother for the NYT, Washington Post or any other left wing rag.

[SGalisa]

There is an incredibly well organized PR push underway at this time to re-open everything, I strongly disagree with that push. Leaders are right in trying to nail people down for doing stupid things,

About two weeks ago, there were two articles in a local fish wrapper on the same day

1: Urban minorities appear to be more affected by Covid 19
2: Urban minorities ignoring social distancing.

These two articles ran on the same freaking day! And nobody put two and two together!

At the same time, the mayor of the urban area in question was complicit in urging them to ignore social distancing!

That is freakin' nuts! Right along with all the other people who want to ignore reality about this.

Sydney as a "city" is still shut down and yet there are fools going to the beach because as you say, they want to ignore the reality of this.
They miss their time at the beach, or at the park, or gym or whatever else because we are -by nature- social creatures...

People who do not *obey* the "social distancing" recommendation either do so because
1) they may claim they haven't been told in CLEAR, simple words
2) they think it's cool to break "rules"... thus ignore consequences
3) they want to test the system to see if this virus is for real or not.

That is true for any place on this planet, and mostly, also especially true among the "young and restless" ages.... not just *urban* sprawlers and dwellers. Lots of *urbanites* working in rural / suburban locations, such as nursing homes and assisted living facilities in NJ... wonder just where all those infected folks came from that got sick with this COVID-19 virus...? Ummm. It wasn't the residents / patients already living in the nursing homes... those folks weren't permitted to go anywhere since near the end of March (2020) outside of their building premises, except maybe doctor visits. No visitors and no shopping... so many are currently low on personal supplies.

Up to a few weeks ago, the residents have been on lockdowns with NO visitors. Only staff workers and delivery people were allowed into the building ...and since everyone has to be tested daily with rigorous health exams, some of them showed up sick with the virus. So, where did *those* workers get infected from and how? Did they NOT "social distance", or clean their hands and keep their face clear of germs...NOT wear a mask, when they should/could have...?