The Political Discussion Thread

[garhkal]

It must be Obama's fault though.

I thought it was all canada's fault..!

[Gatefan1976]

I thought it was all canada's fault..!

You watch that left wing social commentary crap?!??!!

*Revokes Garhkal's Republican card*

[Coco Pops]

OK howcome it took countries like Canada 12 months to settle the refugees they took in yet in Australia it's going to take years?

[Ian-S]

Would it be because nobody wanted to go to Canada so they only ended up with 47 of them, whereas Germany took in a million?

[Falcon Horus]

Would it be because nobody wanted to go to Canada so they only ended up with 47 of them, whereas Germany took in a million?

It's a little more than 47... ...30,371 Syrian refugees

The refugee system in Canada explained.
#WelcomeRefugees: Canada resettles Syrian refugees

And then there's also this little restriction in place as far as Canada is concerned:

Canada's Syrian refugee plan limited to women, children and families

[Gatefan1976]

OK howcome it took countries like Canada 12 months to settle the refugees they took in yet in Australia it's going to take years?

Where do you want to settle them here?
Our cities are bursting because we still hold to suburbia, and our outback is just as red-necked as "the deep south". We may have the land mass of the continental US, but we don't have the arable land of it.

We like to call ourselves "the clever country", but really, there are some things we are utterly backwards in. We should be leading the field of solar power and desert reclamation, not be in a stupid backwards view of it. We could take some very, very good lessons from Israel in that regard.

[Annoyed]

Where do you want to settle them here?
Our cities are bursting because we still hold to suburbia, and our outback is just as red-necked as "the deep south". We may have the land mass of the continental US, but we don't have the arable land of it.

Are you saying that your own country doesn't want to let all comers in, legal or not? How about you, personally? Do you favor your nation controlling who may enter and remain? Or do you favor loose enforcement of the immigration laws in your country? Do you support illegal immigrants being able to enter and remain in your own country, without following the established laws?

[aretood2]

Are you saying that your own country doesn't want to let all comers in, legal or not? How about you, personally? Do you favor your nation controlling who may enter and remain? Or do you favor loose enforcement of the immigration laws in your country? Do you support illegal immigrants being able to enter and remain in your own country, without following the established laws?

Oh dear Lord.

[jelgate]

Oh dear Lord.

You called me?

[Annoyed]

Oh dear Lord.

Hey, it's a legitimate question. As I recall, GF is very much opposed to the US controlling its borders; ejecting those who have come into the country illegally and closing the borders to prevent future entry.

If he supports his own country doing the same or similar in order to look after its own interests first, the hypocrisy ought to be pointed out.

[Falcon Horus]

Maybe you should look at the Australian immigration laws before talking about them.

Immigration and Visas
Migration to Australia
Refugee and Humanitarian Programme

Illegal maritime arrivals

The Australian Government’s Operation Sovereign Borders policy to manage IMAs has not changed. Any people smuggling boat that attempts to travel to Australia illegally will be turned back. Settlement in Australia will never be an option for anyone who travels illegally by boat. The rules apply to everyone: families, children, unaccompanied children, educated and skilled.

[SGalisa]

Where do you want to settle them here?
Our cities are bursting because we still hold to suburbia, and our outback is just as red-necked as "the deep south". We may have the land mass of the continental US, but we don't have the arable land of it.

We like to call ourselves "the clever country", but really, there are some things we are utterly backwards in. We should be leading the field of solar power and desert reclamation, not be in a stupid backwards view of it. We could take some very, very good lessons from Israel in that regard.

Are you saying that your own country doesn't want to let all comers in, legal or not? How about you, personally? Do you favor your nation controlling who may enter and remain? Or do you favor loose enforcement of the immigration laws in your country? Do you support illegal immigrants being able to enter and remain in your own country, without following the established laws?

Hey, it's a legitimate question. As I recall, GF is very much opposed to the US controlling its borders; ejecting those who have come into the country illegally and closing the borders to prevent future entry.

If he supports his own country doing the same or similar in order to look after its own interests first, the hypocrisy ought to be pointed out.

Well, what GF wrote does sound a tad hypocritical .. "What's good for the goose is good for the gander."

This is the same good point that everyone else, in other parts of the world, keeps harping on against people in the USA who would prefer a complete vetting of the refugees (and the people they've associated with connections) to prevent more problems than what we've already got going on in various places, like gang violence in Chicago (Illinois), Detroit (Michigan) -- which seems to be on-going, so the news just gets ignored, and other places such as Baltimore (Maryland). If the refugees entering the USA are going to act like the ones in Sweden, France, and Germany, then yes, this situational reaction does apply.

It makes a greater impact when those same people have been placed into your own neighborhood, as anywhere else. And since my own regional towns/area have been living with this for decades, it makes it difficult on the so-called "neighborhood watch" folks if they *do* report suspicious activities (of anyone, regardless if the person reporting the suspicious behavior even remotely knows the other person by casual just seeing that person or persons suddenly change from their usual routines, and especially if something horridly bad occurs shortly after, because the behavior was not reported or dealt with by designated "official" authorities -- night or day.

Maybe you should look at the Australian immigration laws before talking about them.
Refugee and Humanitarian Programme

Well, I looked at this specific reference, and it still doesn't answer the question that Annoyed brought up about GF's comment above.

Illegal maritime arrivals

The Australian Government’s Operation Sovereign Borders policy to manage IMAs has not changed. Any people smuggling boat that attempts to travel to Australia illegally will be turned back. Settlement in Australia will never be an option for anyone who travels illegally by boat. The rules apply to everyone: families, children, unaccompanied children, educated and skilled.

The boat people.. we in the USA get them all the time (people jumping land to swim or boat across from Cuba to Florida!), and the authorities usually do not turn those people away (cause they're humanitarian enough to see those folks get proper food and water first). When the Vietnamese "boat people" came to USA shores, they were refugees who got promptly placed into shelters and homes and most of them are still part of our neighborhoods, because they have adapted to our way of living.

Live in the Middle East and (generic) you MUST obey the law(s) of the Land (gov't). Live in the USA, and it's almost an issue of live however way you want, until you get caught in a domestic dispute or other issue resulting in some sort of penalty fine or face jail, and that person might still be able to "get of jail FREE card" depending on the persons judging their case. Not so much in the Middle East. Penalties are often harsh and swift, especially if (generic) you are a foreign visitor.

People entering via the Mexican borders getting smuggled into the USA, often do so at their own risk (packed in trucks without ventilation) and many sometimes die before they even set foot on USA soil. Others smuggle in thru the underground tunnels dug that apparently the drug runners built -- and no wall is big enough or deep enough to stop those folks from continuing to cross into USA territory.


Back to the political nightmare topic--
That (fence/wall) is something that Trump NEEDs to be aware of, regardless of the folly of believing in Huuuuuuuuge fences or walls. There would need to be a 2ndary and maybe a 3rd barrier of perhaps some sort of electrical forcefield to work almost totally efficiently if that were the problem. Other countries do it, so why are parts of the rest of the world being exempt, and others required to absorb the masses..?

[Annoyed]

Maybe you should look at the Australian immigration laws before talking about them.

Immigration and Visas
Migration to Australia
Refugee and Humanitarian Programme

Illegal maritime arrivals

The Australian Government’s Operation Sovereign Borders policy to manage IMAs has not changed. Any people smuggling boat that attempts to travel to Australia illegally will be turned back. Settlement in Australia will never be an option for anyone who travels illegally by boat. The rules apply to everyone: families, children, unaccompanied children, educated and skilled.

The section you cite seems to indicate that Australia takes a zero tolerance approach towards illegals. What does it matter if they arrive by boat or sneaking across the border in a truck or in the dead of the night ?
This is the attitude that I would like to see the U.S. take, and that GF seems to oppose for the US. This makes his comments somewhat hypocritical at best, particularly if he agrees with his own government's stance when it comes to his nation.
If allowing whomever wants to come in free access/amnesty is good for the US, it ought to be good for his country, too.

[Annoyed]

People entering via the Mexican borders getting smuggled into the USA, often do so at their own risk (packed in trucks without ventilation) and many sometimes die before they even set foot on USA soil. Others smuggle in thru the underground tunnels dug that apparently the drug runners built -- and no wall is big enough or deep enough to stop those folks from continuing to cross into USA territory.

Have to disagree with you here. The US certainly has the means to prevent unauthorized entry into the country; we have surveillance capability that can read your license plate from orbit. Heck, you can almost do the same from Google Earth. And this is just the tech that you and I know about, I'm certain our actual capabilities that we don't know about go well beyond that. I'm simply not going to believe that we can't maintain control over the borders, it's just that we don't have the political will do so so.

[Falcon Horus]

People entering via the Mexican borders getting smuggled into the USA, often do so at their own risk (packed in trucks without ventilation) and many sometimes die before they even set foot on USA soil.

Desperate people will do desperate things.
Hiding in trucks is a trick used just about everywhere. And they know they can die in there, on the container they just crawled into.

The section you cite seems to indicate that Australia takes a zero tolerance approach towards illegals. What does it matter if they arrive by boat or sneaking across the border in a truck or in the dead of the night ?
This is the attitude that I would like to see the U.S. take, and that GF seems to oppose for the US. This makes his comments somewhat hypocritical at best, particularly if he agrees with his own government's stance when it comes to his nation.
If allowing whomever wants to come in free access/amnesty is good for the US, it ought to be good for his country, too.

Of course, I'm not GF but I think he mentioned it before that he does not agree to everything his government does with the boatpeople in particular.

Nevertheless, Australia has been called out on their harsh policies against boatpeople in particular.

As far as legal immigration goes -- everybody knows it's damn near impossible to migrate to Australia.