The Political Discussion Thread

[aretood2]

I don't get it. Why are the Republicans this way?

https://www.lgbtqnation.com/2017/07/...movement-know/

And further down the page they are wanting to change the civil rights act.

The Civil Rights movement made good use of the courts, but they also focused a lot on direct change to society and the actual laws (such as getting the Civil Rights Act passed). LGBT community focuses too much on the courts. And what happens when people focus to much on the courts? The Voting Rights Act gets gutted and in comes GOP sponsored voter suppression. There is something to be said about the argument that the legislative branch is the branch that...legislates, not the judicial branch.

Another difference between the two is how they push societal change. LGBT via vindictive tactics. I hardly remember reading about MLK Jr's followers issuing death threats to bakers or demanding the dismissal of every person who said "Negro" and vilified the police

This is my fault. I should have been more clear. I was talking about about Carson's comments about getting into fights. I wasn't even thinking about his time as a doctor. In that regard his record as surgeon is quite high IIRC

Just goes to show you that when a scientist of any stripe, no matter how intelligent, speaks outside of his field of expertise, his words should have no more weight than FH's or any of us.

But that's just it, they weren't offering the same message. Trump was the only one with even close to the right position on illegal immigration as far as I am concerned. The rest of the Republican field was fairly soft on the topic, allowing them to remain in the country, and various forms of amnesty. They wanted cheap labor for their business pals.

None of them lied about casinos in Florida and a bunch of other bold faced lies. My question is why were you willing to believe Trump even though he lied so much on the campaign trail? So I can become president as long as I say angry things no matter how impractical no matter how ridiculous and that's it?

Like it or not, a large percentage (roughly 75%) identify as Christian. ( http://www.gallup.com/poll/187955/pe...down-high.aspx ) And they take those beliefs and values quite seriously. The political left has been looking at these folks with disdain and outright contempt for quite some time now. Is it any wonder a powerful backlash would arise as soon as a "mouthpiece" was found? Pissing 75% of the electorate off doesn't usually play well for long.

Oh God, not this...

I find that claim rather dubious. I'll believe that 75% of the US population -claim- to be Christian, but I doubt less than half of them take those beliefs "quite seriously", and even the ones that do, I doubt would agree on just what Christianity is, it would be divided by sects.

I told you, you would not like the left when it acts like the right. Before you rail against that, consider how many people the right, by virtue of their religion, have looked at people with distain and contempt for hundreds to thousands of years.

That didn't take long. Christianity=Bad.
That is the Mantra in the Democratic party. It refuses to speak to Christians as much as the GOP refuses to speak to Hispanics. Is it any surprise that the end result is seen as a cultural war?

I also want to point out how you made the leap from "religious" to "the right". Why is that?

Because it is a very important issue, with far reaching implications.

Make no mistake, there are definite reasons for various camps pro-illegal positions. As I've said often enough, mainstream Republicans just want a large supply of cheap labor to suppress wage rates.

But the Democrats have a different idea in mind. They operate on the largely correct assumption that in general, illegal immigrants would vote Democratic if given the vote. And you've no doubt noticed that Democrats always advocate amnesty for the millions already here, with a fairly easy path to citizenship (and the voting booth) laid out for them.

Their long term goal is to flip the electorate of the U.S. so far Democratic that they are assured control of Congress, the White House and most statewide offices at the state level. Their goal is one party rule, with the Democratic party being that party. Being that I'm generally on the right side of things, I'm not so fond of that idea.

This is of course, in addition to very real effects on wages and jobs at the lower ends of the economic ladder.

So this is a very high priority issue for me.

It's more of a self fulfilling prophecy actually. Do you really think an entire Catholic/Conservative Christian Pro-life Homophobic population that is Latin America would freely vote democrat? nearly a third of Hispanics still voted for Trump. Trump of all people. It's safe to say that most Hispanics that don't vote republican don't do so for more complex reasons.

Sure, once here a lot of Hispanic kids do get liberalized. But those who immigrate here are much much more conservative than their kids and grand kids (legal or otherwise) who grow up here.

So ask yourself, why is it that the kids (who are already citizens) get liberalized?

Which you can block.



Here's the catch though -- first amendment states: freedom of and from religion, and the government is prohibited from adopting one religion or pushing for one religion.

Separation of church and state.
Religion has no place in government issues -- yet it's being used to dictate what others can't or cannot do more often than not. Hence why America is heading straight at becoming the Saudia Arabia of the western world.

Being a little dramatic aren't we?

[Gatefan1976]

That didn't take long. Christianity=Bad.

I did not say that, don't put words in my mouth Flytood.
Pointing out that you check a frigging box on a census form because your whole family does is not an attack on Christianity, it is a statement on what people do. Don't sit here and tell me that YOU don't and have -OFTEN- lampooned people for their confusion of "Christ-like" and Christian.

That is the Mantra in the Democratic party. It refuses to speak to Christians as much as the GOP refuses to speak to Hispanics. Is it any surprise that the end result is seen as a cultural war?

Bull.
Utter
Freaking
Bull
Democrats will reach out to Christians, they are a political party, they will reach out to damn near anyone to increase their base (a bit like Churches/Mosques/Temples/synagogues really), just like republicans will.
Evangelicals however (no matter their "team") have no interest in hearing that what they consider "sinful" should be deemed as "acceptable" by them in the secular arena.
You of all people should know better than this.

I also want to point out how you made the leap from "religious" to "the right". Why is that?

Why?
Conservatism is the hallmark of the right, to maintain the status quo as we have for centuries, and one of the few institutions to survive centuries is the moral dictates of the "religious body" we are born into. There is nothing more -morally- conservative than religion. It's not a leap, it's just a step.
In Addition, I would like to point out that where I made that "leap" was within the context of the question posed by Annoyed, with the main point being that the right, religious or not would not like it if the left acted like them. Trump has been in power some 200 days, and the left is getting mad, seriously, and dangerously mad, they are making their own Tea party, they are disrupting events, and some, some of them are getting physically violent. What is the response by the right? "Oh, tone down the rhetoric", or "Why are you victimizing us" or "I can't express my like for the president in public without fear of my safety"
So now, the RIGHT wants PC, it WANTS safe spaces, It fears being assaulted in public, it is afraid of public speech.
The "left" put up with it for centuries, it takes 200 days for the right to call uncle.

[SoulReaver]

unholy ****

theguardian.com/global-development/2017/jul/06/el-salvador-teen-rape-victim-sentenced-30-years-prison-stillbirth
(just another aspect conservative mentality: punish the victim)

[The Flyattractor]

But El Salvador is a country made up primarily of "Brown People". So what you just said makes you a RACIST Soully. You are such a Horrible Clone Copy Person.

[SoulReaver]

But El Salvador is a country made up primarily of "Brown People". So what you just said makes you a RACIST Soully. You are such a Horrible Clone Copy Person.

aah but actually it's spanish just like your master Torquemada & the browns are the victims of indoctrination living under chrislamist conquistador rule

[The Flyattractor]

But Spain is a country that has been conquered by both Islamic Extremist and Fascist Extremist and people in Spain are Also Brown being a large majority of Mediterranean Peoples so this still proves that you are Racist. So sad Clone Copy Boy.

[SoulReaver]

and people in Spain are Also Brown

lol you a redneck or something? btw spain is christian & being christian automatically makes you white, c'mon you drones should know that it's what they teach you in your private schools

[Gatefan1976]

aah but actually it's spanish just like your master Torquemada & the browns are the victims of indoctrination living under chrislamist conquistador rule

The inqusition's here and it's here to STAAAAYYY!!!

[SoulReaver]

The inqusition's here and it's here to STAAAAYYY!!!

I didn't expect it :/

[jelgate]

This is my favorite comedy

*eats bacon popcorn*

[Gatefan1976]

But bacon is not Halal, I mean Kosher, I mean..............

[The Flyattractor]

Thats ok. Jel is Islamic Hebrew which make eating bacon all ok.

[jelgate]

But bacon is not Halal, I mean Kosher, I mean..............

I don't have to be Kosher. Although I do love brisket

[aretood2]

I did not say that, don't put words in my mouth Flytood.
Pointing out that you check a frigging box on a census form because your whole family does is not an attack on Christianity, it is a statement on what people do. Don't sit here and tell me that YOU don't and have -OFTEN- lampooned people for their confusion of "Christ-like" and Christian.

I know where the argument is going and the "thousands of years" comment doesn't really sound like it's not an attack on Christianity.

Bull.
Utter
Freaking
Bull
Democrats will reach out to Christians, they are a political party, they will reach out to damn near anyone to increase their base (a bit like Churches/Mosques/Temples/synagogues really), just like republicans will.
Evangelicals however (no matter their "team") have no interest in hearing that what they consider "sinful" should be deemed as "acceptable" by them in the secular arena.
You of all people should know better than this.

The rank and file sure, but not the celebrities, not Hollywood, not the federal level politicians, and not many state level ones either. And can you show me where such outreach has happened? Anything to the level of Republicans, show me. Where is Christopher Hitchens most likely to speak, a DNC or a GOP convention?

Why?
Conservatism is the hallmark of the right, to maintain the status quo as we have for centuries, and one of the few institutions to survive centuries is the moral dictates of the "religious body" we are born into. There is nothing more -morally- conservative than religion. It's not a leap, it's just a step.

Why is it the hallmark of the right?

In Addition, I would like to point out that where I made that "leap" was within the context of the question posed by Annoyed, with the main point being that the right, religious or not would not like it if the left acted like them. Trump has been in power some 200 days, and the left is getting mad, seriously, and dangerously mad, they are making their own Tea party, they are disrupting events, and some, some of them are getting physically violent. What is the response by the right? "Oh, tone down the rhetoric", or "Why are you victimizing us" or "I can't express my like for the president in public without fear of my safety"
So now, the RIGHT wants PC, it WANTS safe spaces, It fears being assaulted in public, it is afraid of public speech.
The "left" put up with it for centuries, it takes 200 days for the right to call uncle.

Fair enough, Womble already made that point too. Albeit not the exact same point, he was more in the general "liberals can be more violent" area.

[Womble]

So now, the RIGHT wants PC, it WANTS safe spaces, It fears being assaulted in public, it is afraid of public speech.
The "left" put up with it for centuries, it takes 200 days for the right to call uncle.

The left hasn't even been around for centuries. And the left arguably has at least as long a history of speech suppression through thuggery. Even in the Weimar Republic, Rotfrontkämpferbund and Ruhr Red Army were mirror images of the fascist brownshirts.