ID4 #2 does poorly.. will that impact the SG reboot films?

[garhkal]

Not surprising to see him not greenlighting it...

[majorsal]

http://www.empireonline.com/movies/n...now-exclusive/

Looks like it's not happening anymore.

good. good. GOOD!!

that means the tv franchise still has a shot, even if it's brand new ppl in front and behind the scenes.

[meo3000]

Stumbled on the news while catching Enemy at the gate and Rising back to back on Action.

Im sacrificing a Toblerone and a six pack of Rickard's Red at the alter of Amelius tonight.

[aretood2]

good. good. GOOD!!

that means the tv franchise still has a shot, even if it's brand new ppl in front and behind the scenes.

I think it's done. At least for a few decades. Maybe down the road some lens flare happy director may take a shot at a reboot movie that will lead to a new holoseries. But it is done.

[Falcon Horus]

I think it's done. At least for a few decades. Maybe down the road some lens flare happy director may take a shot at a reboot movie that will lead to a new holoseries. But it is done.

*stab @ JJ*

[Bhousden]

You're right about Star Trek, but not Stargate:

You see in Stargate every alternate universes have something constant: goa'ulds are cruel, despotic, megalomaniac, egotistic figures who like to dress up and act like they're gods. Every alternate universe featured goa'ulds as parasitic snake like symbiotes. Every alternate universe had an SG-1, even if the members were not always Jack, Daniel, Carter and Teal'c. In the original film there is no Teal'c or Carter either and no Hammond, Doc Fraiser or any other staff member that we knew from the TV show. Instead we would likely still stuck with General West and co.
Every alternate universe had Ancients,Asgards and possibly Nox and Furlings too.
If we would try to fit the original film into an alternate universe... Well, you see my point. I hope you all see it now
So if I would have to place this new show I would go with a hard reset and a complete retcon.

Regarding alternate universes I think we are in the 7th, according to the TV shows. I'm not counting SGU.

Let's count them out: 1st universe SG1 (1969)->2nd universe: SG1 (2010 and 2001)->3rd universe: SG1 (Moebious) Now this one is tricky, because there is multiple timelines: Original-alternate-Close to original, but it still counts as one so->4th universe: SGA Before I sleep->5th universe: SG 1 (Continuum)->6th universe: SGA (The last man (I))->7th universe.

There can be some debate whether SG1 went back to their own reality from the alternative reality in SG1: Point Of View.
Because they had to "close" the Quantum Mirror to prevent the enemy from seeing it.

As for Star Wars: I still consider the Expanded universe as canon despite this obnoxious 7th Episode. I just hope George Lucas will regret selling "his" saga to the "Company with the Mouse".

You forgot about there but for the grace of God where Daniel witnessed the destruction of earth

[Peterking72]

You forgot about there but for the grace of God where Daniel witnessed the destruction of earth

No, I did not. Daniel got back to the same reality he left from because the mirror wasn't switched off after he used it.
His experience did change the course of events that followed, but it didn't create a new timeline.

[Bhousden]

No, I did not. Daniel got back to the same reality he left from because the mirror wasn't switched off after he used it.
His experience did change the course of events that followed, but it didn't create a new timeline.

That's stupid, he WENT to an alternate reality.

[garhkal]

It may have spun off an AR in THAT reality, but not this one.

[Peterking72]

It may have spun off an AR in THAT reality, but not this one.

Thanks for backing me up garhkal.

@Bhousden: I invite you to rewatch that ep. and get back to me in your next comment. I bet you will agree me next time.

[Bhousden]

Thanks for backing me up garhkal.

@Bhousden: I invite you to rewatch that ep. and get back to me in your next comment. I bet you will agree me next time.

I stand by statement. Point in fact is that Daniel went to an alternate reality, plain and simple.

[thekillman]

It may have spun off an AR in THAT reality, but not this one.

If every decision creates a new reality, then Daniel coming back from the Quantum mirror creates at least one new decision (tell them, or not). Therefore, under the rules of AU's, Daniel created a new reality when he returned.

Somewhere out there is a reality where Daniel came back, slipped and broke his neck and Earth fell regardless.

[Peterking72]

If every decision creates a new reality, then Daniel coming back from the Quantum mirror creates at least one new decision (tell them, or not). Therefore, under the rules of AU's, Daniel created a new reality when he returned.

Somewhere out there is a reality where Daniel came back, slipped and broke his neck and Earth fell regardless.

That may be, but we are talking about whether the show continued in a different reality or not. Daniel CAME BACK from the alternate reality he went to. Bhousden seems to think he remained in that reality and completely ignore the fact that he came back in the end of the episode. That would be completely evident if he'd re-watch the episode.

Anyway following thekillman's logic, (which actually one of the logics, theories of quantum physics) we create alternate universes every time we make a decision. In every second there are billions of new realities created which stem from these decisions, actions and conscious choices. That's why there is an endless and ever growing, close to infinite number of alternate realities.

BTW in that alternate reality he came back from, Earth fell. So there you go.

[thekillman]

That may be, but we are talking about whether the show continued in a different reality or not. Daniel CAME BACK from the alternate reality he went to. Bhousden seems to think he remained in that reality and completely ignore the fact that he came back in the end of the episode. That would be completely evident if he'd re-watch the episode.

I get the very strong feeling that multiple things are getting mixed up here. Unless the Quantum Mirror is a sophisticated cloning and mind-altering machine (or something infinitely more sinister, say device that forces universes to split), Daniel did return to a reality he left form. (note the phrasing)

But the thing is, saying that "he returned to *the* reality he left from" is a sentence that has no meaning. The very act of returning would create a split: One where whatever he did up to that point is the same, but one where he either decides or is incapable of returning and one where he does return. If the original universe is A, then he returns to A' or A'': One where he returns, one where he does not. Up to that point, these universes would've been perfectly identical and indistinguishable. The consequence of AU's is that the idea of an "original" universe makes no sense.

But the thing is, up to that point the universes are identical, and after that point they differ in one choice. Daniel could return to any of an infinite amount of universes, and would be unable to tell the difference. And yet there would be infinite amounts of universes more that would be different.

Besides, if you consider that the universe only has so much energy (and thus equivalently, mass), and thus can only have so many states (even if that number is huge), that means the multiverse also repeats. You could end up an alternate reality that is completely identical to yours yet it's not your own. And since they're identical, your AU counterpart would've done the exact same thing. So you could shuffle Daniels around yet never notice a thing.

And that's the thing: If universes are sufficiently similar, you'd never notice a thing. You could live your entire life and many more lifetimes in an alternate universe without ever noticing a thing. Therefore, the idea that you need to return to your own universe makes no sense.

[Peterking72]

That's how it should work in real life. However that's not the case with Stargate. They introduced this thing called entropic cascade failure, (ECF) which could be potentially lethal if you end up living in an AU, which is identical or almost identical to yours and if you have a doppelganger in that AU. In fact the closer the reality is to your own the worse is the effect of the ECF. They in fact explain how the mirror works in that same episode (Point of view).

They also have different concepts about the AU's. In Stargate each AU remains identical unless they change the timeline with time travel or other shenanigans. Different choices didn't alter the reality they're in. It creates an AU, but the all things in the mainstream reality remains unchanged.
This mainstream universe is the universe they depict in the series. It would've been physically and monetarily impossible to depict all realities simultaneously, so they picked one and decided it's gonna be the primer. All other AU's are still there, but we see just brief moments from their continuities.
Teal'c once asks O'neill (PoV), that which reality he considers real. He replies that the one they're currently in, which is the mainstream universe. Later Teal'c kills his double in that other AU they visit. When asked about he replies that because the mainstream universe is the only universe which is real to him and the only in which he considers consequences apply to him or others. So he backs up or accepts O'neill's views from earlier in that episode.

In fact the writers try to depict the same, with occasional heroics for other AU's, the main characters only care for the universe they currently live in.

So all in all the universe itself makes sure that you would notice if you returned or ended up in a different reality, 99,9% of the time.

So the sentence that Daniel returned to the real reality or mainstream reality is actually makes sense in the world of Stargate.

We all know that it's not how it should work, but we still enjoy it, because it's Stargate.