Drone Theory

[Crazy Tom]

those hit critical spots

[SmallTimePerson]

This would explain why Jumper-fired drones are somewhat less powerful than city/ship-fired drones and why the drones deactivated and fell from the sky when their powersource was depleted (see The Tower in S2).

Or a loss of signal caused them to do that.

[Col. Matarrese]

.... wow. Just wow.

1. Drones probably don't take ZPMs to charge up. The Orion didn't need a ZPM to fire drones. In fact, the one thing that DOES need a ZPM to use is the chair, and that has been the only reason we've ever needed ZPMs to fire drones. So theory shot down.

2. Drones are NOT organic. If it was, it would either be capable of decay, or be constructed from once-living things. If it was capable of decay, NONE OF THE DRONES WOULD BE OF ANY USE TO US BECAUSE AFTER 10,000 YEARS THE DRONES WOULD BE GONE BY NOW. As for constructed from once-living things, THEY WOULD STILL DECAY ZOMG.

Pick up a book before you make claims that make 5th grade science students laugh at you.

Not to be rude or anything, but do you know the definition of "organic"? It doesn't necessarily mean "living matter"...it simply refers to any compound with a carbon basis ("Of or designating carbon compounds" - Webster's II New College Dictionary, ISBN: 0-395-70869-9, page 772). Organic matter is found in living things, yes, but also can be found in non-living matter such as hydrocarbon fuels (gasoline). True, it is once-living matter, but it isn't living now, and fossil fuels don't decay; they just get used up by greedy Americans with their big expensive cars that get 7 MPG. Maybe YOU should do some reading before a 5th grade science student laughs at you...

[An-Alteran]

No i said that if you have a ZPM the drone would work better. You can use a laptop to fire a drone upwards, but thats it, like Mkcay did in the Tower.

The Drone didn't just fly upwards... it burrowed and incinerated through 20 square feet of pure metal in a fraction of a section withouth any discernable hinderance besides a loud bang.

Yes because if the drones were not organic, the ancients wouldnt have stuck a squid on the end of a missile unless they really were all about looks and style.

What use are the blocky lines and structures accross the hull of the Puddle Jumper?
What purpose do the swirls and organic look of the head-sucker serve?
What use are the curves and lines of the city of Atlantis but for style?
The stain glass?
The beauty of the Stargate?

Design does not demand purpose besides style.

That organic warhead must have some function.

Its not organic. It looks organic.

While the Ancients, granted havent made anything specificly organic, they have made things which appear organic, like the head grabber. Im not saying the entire drone is organic.

You are saying the parts that appear organic are organic because they aoppear organic inspite of the fact that you have already mentioned other Ancient tech and devices that are purely stylish in design and appear organic yet are clearly not.

Im saying the warhead and power source for the drones is Organic, a creature which can absorb energy, possible genetically engineered or grown.

This is baseless.
The Ancients are known for making things that look and appear like they are organic that clearly are not.

Yes but the chair itself doesn't need power to run, it needs power to use the technology it controls.

Now Networking thousands of drones takes alot of computing power im sure but not on ZPM draining scale.

A naquada generator can handle it if it has consistent powerflow.

[immhotep]

People seem to be stuck on the Organics issue. Now ill try and clear this up, organic in this context does not mean "alive", i'm not suggesting that, what im saying is the the warhead which is used on drones is some kind of organic based compound which stores large amounts of energy and releases it through a reaction upon impact this a target. Now this is not different from many other forms of organic based energy. Its simple combustion but on a much bigger scale. I am saying that the "squid" part see images:

http://www.stargatecaps.com/sga/s1/1...5F1%5F020.html
http://www.stargatecaps.com/sga/s1/1...l/101x022.html

In its native form, the drone does not appear to be anything but organic, i don't think anyone agrees with that, naturally it appears organic. We haven't been told that it isn't organic. I'm saying that it is part organic, part technology. The warhead, the yellow part, my theory puts forward is a compound which absorbs energy like a sponge through the tentacle part like wires plugging in to a larger source of energy. In the first image, on the monitor the Tentacles do appear like cables.
Now there are few things in its natural state that appear non organic, but it must have several features on board (unless it is a very special creature) including some method to phase through shields, a propulsion system, computing power/Communication to the chair. These may be nano technology based and configure themselves depending on the energy available.

As to the other issue about ZPM's and power. I never said that drones couldn't be fired without a ZPM. My argument simply state that if you have a ZPM, in conjunction with a chair platform drones are used more effectively than if they are fired from, for example a PJ. Now the PJ has 8 drones, 6 loaded and 2 as backup. That IMO means that it can only hold and use 8 drones at any one time. The PJ is not equipped to use more than this many drones. We have seen it use 3 at a time, but never any more. They are used like missile, point and shoot.

Contrast this with Atlantis in siege. Even with a Mark II, not a ZPM, Atlantis and the chair were able control 10x more than the PJ. Also note that the drones were still used in a "point and shoot" mode, not in the kind of drone swarm mode seen from the outpost and indeed an Aurora.
When the Asurians were in control with a ZPM the drones were used but again the effects were not phase through everything, but they were only using a few drones at the time. If we scaled up the piloting skill of those drones, we may have seen a larger, more impressive fight.
Now, the outpost, the pinicle of drone display arenas. Full control, full power, full destructive ability. Not only did they phase through shields, but were used in the thousands.

People keep saying that only a chair needs a ZPM for power not drones. Why? Why does a chair need a ZPM, surely there must be a reason, my argument is that its a failsafe. A ZPM plugged in ensures that there is enough power to sustainable fight with a full compliment of drones. The Chair has to maintain a real time communication and sensor link with all its drones. That takes power sure. It has to process all the calculations, moments, sensor and communications data. Again takes power. But it does not take as much power as we have seen it use up in the past. Having a ZPM plugged in allows the chair to send energy and instructions to reorganize the drones in to functioning at their very best depending on the target.

tep

[Col. Matarrese]

^thanks for agreeing, 'tep

[immhotep]

Thats quite alright PS Alkaline Trio are amazing, war brain, such a good song

[IcyNeko]

Not to be rude or anything, but do you know the definition of "organic"? It doesn't necessarily mean "living matter"...it simply refers to any compound with a carbon basis ("Of or designating carbon compounds" - Webster's II New College Dictionary, ISBN: 0-395-70869-9, page 772). Organic matter is found in living things, yes, but also can be found in non-living matter such as hydrocarbon fuels (gasoline). True, it is once-living matter, but it isn't living now, and fossil fuels don't decay; they just get used up by greedy Americans with their big expensive cars that get 7 MPG. Maybe YOU should do some reading before a 5th grade science student laughs at you...

Context of use, mate. I'm still correct when placed against his context of use. >

[Crazy Tom]

i think we should discuss the weird glowing prlupsion system, i don't get how that works.........at all.

[SmallTimePerson]

People seem to be stuck on the Organics issue. Now ill try and clear this up, organic in this context does not mean "alive", i'm not suggesting that, what im saying is the the warhead which is used on drones is some kind of organic based compound which stores large amounts of energy and releases it through a reaction upon impact this a target. Now this is not different from many other forms of organic based energy. Its simple combustion but on a much bigger scale. I am saying that the "squid" part see images:

http://www.stargatecaps.com/sga/s1/1...5F1%5F020.html
http://www.stargatecaps.com/sga/s1/1...l/101x022.html

In its native form, the drone does not appear to be anything but organic, i don't think anyone agrees with that, naturally it appears organic. We haven't been told that it isn't organic. I'm saying that it is part organic, part technology. The warhead, the yellow part, my theory puts forward is a compound which absorbs energy like a sponge through the tentacle part like wires plugging in to a larger source of energy. In the first image, on the monitor the Tentacles do appear like cables.
Now there are few things in its natural state that appear non organic, but it must have several features on board (unless it is a very special creature) including some method to phase through shields, a propulsion system, computing power/Communication to the chair. These may be nano technology based and configure themselves depending on the energy available.

As to the other issue about ZPM's and power. I never said that drones couldn't be fired without a ZPM. My argument simply state that if you have a ZPM, in conjunction with a chair platform drones are used more effectively than if they are fired from, for example a PJ. Now the PJ has 8 drones, 6 loaded and 2 as backup. That IMO means that it can only hold and use 8 drones at any one time. The PJ is not equipped to use more than this many drones. We have seen it use 3 at a time, but never any more. They are used like missile, point and shoot.

Contrast this with Atlantis in siege. Even with a Mark II, not a ZPM, Atlantis and the chair were able control 10x more than the PJ. Also note that the drones were still used in a "point and shoot" mode, not in the kind of drone swarm mode seen from the outpost and indeed an Aurora.
When the Asurians were in control with a ZPM the drones were used but again the effects were not phase through everything, but they were only using a few drones at the time. If we scaled up the piloting skill of those drones, we may have seen a larger, more impressive fight.
Now, the outpost, the pinicle of drone display arenas. Full control, full power, full destructive ability. Not only did they phase through shields, but were used in the thousands.

People keep saying that only a chair needs a ZPM for power not drones. Why? Why does a chair need a ZPM, surely there must be a reason, my argument is that its a failsafe. A ZPM plugged in ensures that there is enough power to sustainable fight with a full compliment of drones. The Chair has to maintain a real time communication and sensor link with all its drones. That takes power sure. It has to process all the calculations, moments, sensor and communications data. Again takes power. But it does not take as much power as we have seen it use up in the past. Having a ZPM plugged in allows the chair to send energy and instructions to reorganize the drones in to functioning at their very best depending on the target.

tep

• They don't phase through shields (Watch atlantis the return (Part 2))

• Are you saying that the chemical is naturally occurring? or are you saying its alive?

• It has not been established in the series that the drones use more power if there is more power available (The Orion for instance had no ZPM)

• We have not seen the Ancients use drones, and it has not been established that O'niell in the lost city recycled every done (after all he knows where to shoot to do the most damage)

Oh and BTW, nice sig, is it new? or have I taken this long to see it?

[Dev Corvin]

Okay, a couple of things seem to be clear from canon sources.

1) Drones are powered by an external source.

2) Drones are not living creatures, or genetically engineered creatures, or anything based on a structure of cells rather than chemical structures.

Evidence to back these up:

1) We've seen a couple of situations where a loss of power generation has caused drones to go dead mid-air, most notably in The Tower. This CAN be attributed to a loss of power rather than a loss of mental control as in the Atlantis pilot, we saw a drone be activated - by accident - by Carson, and then "seek a target on its own"; as the outpost was still beaming power to the drone, it stayed active, despite a loss of "signal" as I think it was put earlier from the operator.

2) Drones don't suffer from any of the problems exhibited by cellular organisms. They don't decay, they don't appear to respirate or masticate, and they don't (as far as we know anyway) reproduce. Also, when people have been seen physically interacting with them, they appear inert. Their "organic" appearance is mostly due to the flappy protrusions at the back, of a fairly flexible material giving them a fairly squid-like appearance.

This COULD be explained in a couple of ways.

Firstly, drones have the ability to propel themselves. Unlike conventional weapons, they can be lying inert on a table, and then rapidly accelerate to high speeds and navigate without forces applied from external sources.

They can also do this in both atmospheric environments and space, without losing or gaining mass, which rules out a couple of things. Firstly, they don't propel themselves through ramjet function as in space, there's no air to draw in and expel for propulsion. The fact that their mass appears to be constant (as compared between inactive drones pre and post flight, as seen in the Atlantis pilot), means that they also don't use a form of rocket propulsion, as this would require the loss of propellant and oxidizer.

The last explaination (with respect to show canon) would be a form of "sublight drive", which has never really been explained satisfactorily as it's somewhat of a get-out-clause when it comes to conventional (ie non hyperspace propulsion). However, we can assume that there's some form of energy-reactive substance that produces gravitons or ions or something of the sort when energy is applied to it. A satisfactory explaination for the flight process of drones would be that they're essentially a massive chunk of that sublight-engine core, which receive power wirelessly from the source. The flaps at the rear could/would be used for steering purposes to enable their incredible range of motion, with more energy dumped into the flap on one side to effect a shift to the side.

We've already seen examples of Ancient technology using wirelessly beamed power, as was seen with the Rand Protectorate's Ori-designed satellite, which used a ground power generation plant to not only supply power to the weapon but the defensive shield - enough power to provide complete immunity from the Prometheus' weaponary; and that was using 1950s technology limitations, imagine how much more efficient the Lantean systems are...

As for the destructive payload, it stands to reason that any massive chunk of reactive material would have the potential to not only propel itself forward, but explode with a massive force if contained (take gunpowder for example, if allowed to burn in open air, it expands slowly, but if contained and restricted, can create a large explosive force).

[SmallTimePerson]

We've already seen examples of Ancient technology using wirelessly beamed power, as was seen with the Rand Protectorate's Ori-designed satellite, which used a ground power generation plant to not only supply power to the weapon but the defensive shield - enough power to provide complete immunity from the Prometheus' weaponary; and that was using 1950s technology limitations, imagine how much more efficient the Lantean systems are...

No we didn't, the EMP disrupted the control room, that was the fear all along that they may send a signal to the satellite to power weapons/shields before the emp went off.

[Col. Matarrese]

well, that still isn't to say wirelessly beamed power isn't possible. How do the puddle jumpers charge up? Nikola Tesla was able to come up with something that wirelessly transmitted energy. No word on if it ever got built, but a concept does exist

[Silverbeacher]

My personal thoughts on if the drones are organic or not,withstanding (i see them as being engineered in an organic manner, a 'replica' if you may of what once may have been an organic creature but now completely synthetic) but some of the arguments being used so far is that the drones are over 10,000 years old and can not possibly be organic as they would decay, die, etc and/or they're kept on racks like a mechanical item. May I remind everyone that the HIVE ships are ALSO organic in nature, THEY have lasted over 10,000 years, AND they travel in SPACE (no atmosphere, would kill any "normal" organic creature). Its science fiction kids; he had a theory, he didn't offer it up as canon, don't walk all over him like he's stupid or something.

Also for the record, he did NOT state that the ZPM *had* to be controlling the chair/drones, just that using a ZPM's much higher energy output allows for full control and ability for the drones. The theories presented on drones needing power fed into the chair/PJ to work has been at least fairly proven in show.

[Orii]

Worst. Theory. Ever.

Drones don't operate from beamed power. Puddle jumpers fire drones that are quite powerful despite a weak power source on the jumper.

If beamed power were their source, that means ancients can beam that much power through an enemy's shields (first drones to reach a ship), and if you can do that why use a drone... just use your super duper beam weapon.

They go dead when connection to a chair is suddenly severed because they unexpectedly lost a control signal. The "wild" drone Carson fired was wild because the chair was still active without proper input.

They continue past a shield because there is an expected and programmed loss of control signal - they become semi-intelligent self-guided torpedoes at that point. Until the point where they expect to lose contact they receive control updates from the chair.

They may or not be organic, but who cares? Complete speculation without a single shred of evidence to support it.