Point of Origin

[6thMonolith]

"Now, where do you want us to load this 96-ton hunk of Titanium?"

[TechnoWraith]

Sorry if this has been covered elsewhere but so far I haven't seen it.....

OK, been thinking again!!! Why do we need to dial a point of origin to establish a wormhole to another stargate?

The first six glyphs are used to establish the 3D coordinates of space for the location of another stargate, but why dial a seventh? Surely the stargate you're dialling from can act as its own point of reference (especially now we know about the correlative update system that adjusts the network to compensate for stellar drift etc).....the gate should "know" where it is in relation to all the others.....

I can accept this is DHD related and seeing as the Earth stargate doesn't have one you need to dial a PoO........

But seeing as the Ancients were clever enough to build the stargate system, they'd surely make it easy to use and intuitive.......so why the PoO??

Just seems like extra work to have to check each DHD for its unique PoO symbol to dial out/home when it can be a built in feature.........

Any ideas??

The way i see it:

The reason a PoO is needed is the same reason you need to find out where someone is when they call for directions to, say, your house. If someone needs directions to your house, the first thing you ask them is "Where are you?" That way you can tell him or her where to go, based on their location.
The Point of Origin is sort of like "I am at the corner of Elm and First" and the first six chevrons of the gate address is like the directions you give to get to your house.

If that made any sense, i'll be surprised.

[_Owen_]

Ya, that is pretty much it, in stargate terms, the point of origin, tells the gate where to generate the first side of the wormhole.

Owen Macri

[Jarnin]

No.....it seems there are only 38 glyphs plus a BRB on a DHD but there are 39 glyphs on a stargate........therefore, logically, seeing as the gate has a unique PoO and the DHD lacks a glyph but has a BRB then the BRB IS the PoO on the DHD.........

However, it has been seen on the show that you dial 7 glyphs then the BRB on an offworld DHD......but having one lees glyph means you can't dial all possible stargate addresses, which is a massive oversight on the Ancients part..........OR a bit of an inconsistency on the part of the shows writers.......

And seeing as the Ancients are big-glowy-know-it-alls............i'll believe they got it right

The DHD is missing a symbol; the symbol for Aquila (the one that looks like the square root symbol). It's been like that since SG-1 began.

What's really going to twist your noodles is that the Stargates in Pegasus only have 36 symbols, and that includes the PoO. The DHDs in Pegasus still have 38 symbols, because they're reusing the same DHD prop from SG-1, so those DHDs have two symbols that are not used for any gate address.

I haven't seen a good picture of a Pegasus DHD yet, so I haven't been able to figure out which symbols are redundent.

[_Owen_]

They probably only used thirty six because Pegasus is a smaller galaxy and not as many locations would be needed. As well, the Puddle Jumper DHDs have 38 because the puddle jumpers were originaly created in the Milky Way. For Pegasus, they could just remove symbols, and the extra ones would not work in pegasus, however if you only had thirty six and wanted to use the gates in the Milky Way, you would not be able to for many planets.

Owen Macri

[6thMonolith]

Here's a fan site with some models of the Pegasus DHD:
http://www.chevron26.com/atlantis/planet/eplanets.html

I'll look for some screen caps of the DHD.

EDIT:
Found some Caps.

http://www.stargatecaps.com/sga/s1/1...erhood443.html
http://www.stargatecaps.com/sga/s1/1...erhood444.html

Looks like an entirely different DHD to me.

[_Owen_]

Nice site!

Owen Macri

[Jarnin]

They probably only used thirty six because Pegasus is a smaller galaxy and not as many locations would be needed.

Unless of course you wanted to dial a gate in the Milky Way. Then again, since you need a special control crystal to dial outside Pegasus, I don't think this is a problem.
Of course the real reason why there are only 36 symbols on the Pegasus gates is because a different company built the prop

As well, the Puddle Jumper DHDs have 38 because the puddle jumpers were originaly created in the Milky Way.

Actually, the Puddle Jumper prop was created specifically for Stargate Atlantis, so they have 36 symbols. The one used in It's Good To Be King and Mobius pt 1 & 2 was just an Atlantis PJ with different symbols attached to the dash. However, it was also missing symbols because the PJ only has room for 36 symbols.

There's a couple pictures floating around this board that shows the dash of both PJs from Atlantis and SG-1. It's definately 36 symbols.

[_Owen_]

Nice, I was talking within the Stargate universe, although props are the true reason for the symbols, etc. that is no fun, this Stargate!

36 symbols were used because the galaxy is smaller and there would not be as many possible locations.

Allthough the Puddle Jumper prop was created for Atlantis, the Ancients developed them in the Milky Way.

Owen Macri

[6thMonolith]

They probably only used thirty six because Pegasus is a smaller galaxy and not as many locations would be needed. As well, the Puddle Jumper DHDs have 38 because the puddle jumpers were originaly created in the Milky Way. For Pegasus, they could just remove symbols, and the extra ones would not work in pegasus, however if you only had thirty six and wanted to use the gates in the Milky Way, you would not be able to for many planets.

Owen Macri

I have some proof!

There are thirty-seven keys on the Pegasus(different from MW, they were probably made in Peg) PJ DHD.

If you look at http://www.stargatecaps.com/sga/s1/1...l/104x006.html You can see 21 keys(there are none past the arm).

And, when you add the keys from http://www.stargatecaps.com/sga/s1/1...etters156.html You can see 16 keys. Adding them together, you get 37.

36 symbols and a PoO/enter key.

[Jarnin]

36 symbols and a PoO/enter key.

Yeah, I suppose the BRB and PoO would have to be the same in a PJ, simply because the PJ can't possibly have all the unique PoO symbols for every planet in the Pegasus galaxy.

[PrimalAscended]

The way i see it:

The reason a PoO is needed is the same reason you need to find out where someone is when they call for directions to, say, your house. If someone needs directions to your house, the first thing you ask them is "Where are you?" That way you can tell him or her where to go, based on their location.
The Point of Origin is sort of like "I am at the corner of Elm and First" and the first six chevrons of the gate address is like the directions you give to get to your house.

If that made any sense, i'll be surprised.

A good analogy, but not quite right as I see it.......the gate "knows" where it is in relation to other gates (thanks to the wonders of correlative updates), therefore it doesn't need to be asked "where are you?" by the other gate.....so you don't need to enter a 7th symbol as PoO......in my little opinion.......even though you technically do in the show.....

From other stuff posted in the forums it seems the consensus is that the 6 initial glyphs designate a star system/volume of space for the sending gate to search for another gate..........the gate "knows" where it is and with the six glyphs "knows" where its going and just has to establish a wormhole through the space-time continuum.........no 7th glyph really required....

The gates are incredibly intuitive.........or am I just giving them too much credit???

But don't worry, my noodle is completely happy with 7 glyphs..........it just likes to know what other people think.....

[_Owen_]

Yes, it is incredibly likley that on a puddle jumper the point of origin key would be a universal symbol that automatically dials the point of origin, of the gate that you are dialing, but the symbol would not be specific.

About the thirty six symbols, that would have to be an oversight by the props guys, the Puddle Jumpers were originally built in the Milky Way, therefore originaly used in the Milky Way, with thirty six symbols, that would not work. Allthough if Atlantis was built soley for the Pegasus galaxy, then the Puddle Jumpers could have been aswell. The problem is that you would only be able to dial some gates in the Milky Way, because the symbols wouldn't be there, with or without the control crystal.

Owen Macri

[YodaMate]

Not so sure about the Gates been smart, i think the DHDs are the components with the awesome Ancient programming.

My theory is that the PoO system is a back-up for a manual dial (which is essentially what the SGC does every time they dial, they have to spin the inner wheel). Normally, the DHD takes care of the Gate's position in the galaxy, but if there's a problem with the DHD (say, if you lost yours ) then you can manually put in the 7th Symbol as the PoO.

[_Owen_]

The DHDs do have programming input into the crystals, however the gates themselves are somewhat intuitive.

The point of origin just gives the gate a point to lock the first end of the wormhole, it doesn't represent an area or a volume, it is a single point where the gate resides, it gives the wormhole a point to lock onto after it was generated, otherwise the artificial wormhole would either deactivate immediatley or it would become stable and the two ends would jump around the universe.

Owen Macri