them ancient stones...

[D Toccs]

It was my impression Daniel and Vala did not switch fully because of the distance to the Ori galaxy and because there was no second communication device at the other end. When they briefly engaged it Daniel's and Vala's bodies woke up. In all other cases there was either a second device or the distance was rather short.

The distance from where Destiny is to the MW is almost certainly longer then from MW to the Ori galaxy.

Herod and Sallis not being in Daniel and Vala's bodies can not be due to there not being a second terminal. There was no second terminal present in Atlantis but Keller and the criminal chick swapped because at some point Keller had touched one of the stones in Janus' lab. This is exactly the same thing as what should have happened with Herod and Sallis who had touched stones in the past which is why their bodies were used.
The same thing happens again when Vala swaps into Daniel's body, Daniel is not in Vala's body on the other end. The way the stones work in SG1 is inconsistent with how they later work in SGA and SGU. This is almost certainly due to the writers not having fully developed how they wanted to use the stones at that stage.

[Rylor]

The distance from where Destiny is to the MW is almost certainly longer then from MW to the Ori galaxy.

Herod and Sallis not being in Daniel and Vala's bodies can not be due to there not being a second terminal. There was no second terminal present in Atlantis but Keller and the criminal chick swapped because at some point Keller had touched one of the stones in Janus' lab. This is exactly the same thing as what should have happened with Herod and Sallis who had touched stones in the past which is why their bodies were used.
The same thing happens again when Vala swaps into Daniel's body, Daniel is not in Vala's body on the other end. The way the stones work in SG1 is inconsistent with how they later work in SGA and SGU. This is almost certainly due to the writers not having fully developed how they wanted to use the stones at that stage.

Yeah, but the distance between Keller and the criminal was much smaller. In a similar manner Young was able to swap with a Blueberry Alien despite the fact that they posessed no second terminal.
I am not sure if I remember this correctly, but when Vala (in the Ori Galaxy) swapped with Daniel, the SGC no longer had a terminal, right? If so, then this fact would actually confirm my theory.

[D Toccs]

So just to make sure I've got this straight. you're theory is that unless the distance involved is relatively small, then a second terminal is required in order for the "receiving" mind to swap as well?

If that is what you are saying then I can't find any fault in your logic. I'm not sure that I agree with it 100%, but it certainly fits with what we have seen so far.

[knowles2]

Here a better in universe answer.

The stones and base station SG1 use were a merlin special one off.
Merlin redesign the system he had to be one way, so that he could visit and explore the Ori Galaxy but why he was there he did not have anyone to look after his body and so he modified the technology so that his body would go into a coma when his mind transfere to the Ori galaxy, so he did not have to worry about the person who he exchange with causing trouble why he was gone and the body would only awaken once he finished his research and return to his body.

We do know that Merlin mostly worked alone after all, we did not even get confirmation about the knights and the round table.
The version we see in Atlantis and SGU are the technology in it unmodified pure form design to provide two way communications and mind transfere.

Like it also did when we first encounter the stones, O'neil and that other bloke sharing each other memories.

I think it safe to presume that Merlin made modifications to the stones and base stations to make his visits to the Ori galaxy safer.

[D Toccs]

I had never thought about it like that. That makes perfect sense, and it's just plain awesome.

[Aurora24]

I agree that the SG-1 stones must have been specially modified since both Jack and Joe were able to see a great deal of each others lives while they had the stones, but I wonder if having some residual memories from the other person that you connect with was a common feature of the stones that the SGU stones were toned down. We've seen instances of a person retaining some memories from the person they swapped with, the most detailed so far being Rush remembering Telford's meetings with the LA. That implies that even though the stones are different from the SG-1 stones that the problem of some residual memories still exists.

If there is that deep of a link between minds at some level while the stones are being used than it would make sense that if one person abruptly died the person on the other end of the stones would experience something. I agree with the discussions I've read here about the feedback killing the other person as well. If two minds are that closely linked than having one suddenly get severed would have a traumatic effect on the person on the other end.

[garhkal]

Well the Daniel and Vala incident is kinda different from all the other times the stones have been used. When Vala and Daniel swapped with Herod and Sallis, for some reason Herod and Sallis did not swap with them.
So I deliberately chose not to use that example because the Rush/Telford was a normal mind swap and proved the point without having to wonder about whether the situation was different.

Well, I think the writers messed up the comm stones. Like, with daniel and vala, they swapped because stones were tagged with peoples identity. Which also, how do the stones know who to switch with? I'm sure there are other stones in the galaxy that people have mistakenly touched. Why not switch with them.

I think with the Vala/Daniel incident, because no one had the stones in their end, on the pedestal device, OURs took priority.. ergo vala/daniel took over the others who had been imprinted on the stones in their galaxy.. (herrod/salis). BUT cause we were priority, neither of them came here.

The distance from where Destiny is to the MW is almost certainly longer then from MW to the Ori galaxy.

BUT both sites us a 'backwards engineered pedestal device.

Yeah, but the distance between Keller and the criminal was much smaller. In a similar manner Young was able to swap with a Blueberry Alien despite the fact that they posessed no second terminal.

And the same thing with Jack and the barber..

So just to make sure I've got this straight. you're theory is that unless the distance involved is relatively small, then a second terminal is required in order for the "receiving" mind to swap as well?

Yup.. Same galaxy, no pedestal required. More than 1 galaxy distant, pedistal on both ends required. OTHERWISE the transfer is determined by which side has a pedestal device..

Here a better in universe answer.

The stones and base station SG1 use were a merlin special one off.
Merlin redesign the system he had to be one way, so that he could visit and explore the Ori Galaxy but why he was there he did not have anyone to look after his body and so he modified the technology so that his body would go into a coma when his mind transfere to the Ori galaxy, so he did not have to worry about the person who he exchange with causing trouble why he was gone and the body would only awaken once he finished his research and return to his body.

We do know that Merlin mostly worked alone after all, we did not even get confirmation about the knights and the round table.
The version we see in Atlantis and SGU are the technology in it unmodified pure form design to provide two way communications and mind transfere.

Like it also did when we first encounter the stones, O'neil and that other bloke sharing each other memories.

I think it safe to presume that Merlin made modifications to the stones and base stations to make his visits to the Ori galaxy safer.

That very well might be the answer..

[D Toccs]

Here a better in universe answer.

The stones and base station SG1 use were a merlin special one off.
Merlin redesign the system he had to be one way, so that he could visit and explore the Ori Galaxy but why he was there he did not have anyone to look after his body and so he modified the technology so that his body would go into a coma when his mind transfere to the Ori galaxy, so he did not have to worry about the person who he exchange with causing trouble why he was gone and the body would only awaken once he finished his research and return to his body.

We do know that Merlin mostly worked alone after all, we did not even get confirmation about the knights and the round table.
The version we see in Atlantis and SGU are the technology in it unmodified pure form design to provide two way communications and mind transfere.

Like it also did when we first encounter the stones, O'neil and that other bloke sharing each other memories.

I think it safe to presume that Merlin made modifications to the stones and base stations to make his visits to the Ori galaxy safer.

I still really like this explanation and it works for the stone use in Avalon and Origin. But it doesn't explain why Vala swapped into Daniel's body in Crusade but Daniel didn't swap into her body.

[Rylor]

So just to make sure I've got this straight. you're theory is that unless the distance involved is relatively small, then a second terminal is required in order for the "receiving" mind to swap as well?

If that is what you are saying then I can't find any fault in your logic. I'm not sure that I agree with it 100%, but it certainly fits with what we have seen so far.

Yeah, exactly. I am not sure if my theory is correct, it just fits the facts we know so far.

[SoulReaver]

btw where's it said that the ori galaxy is closer to the MW than the Destiny is ? iirc that galaxy is also supposed to be at the other end of the universe (which is probably why the ori didn't even know of the MW, despite their ascended "omniscience")

[D Toccs]

btw where's it said that the ori galaxy is closer to the MW than the Destiny is ? iirc that galaxy is also supposed to be at the other end of the universe (which is probably why the ori didn't even know of the MW, despite their ascended "omniscience")

It's never explicitly said that the Ori galaxy is closer MW than where Destiny is. I just figured that since we know for certain that Destiny has passed through at least 40 galaxies in the millions of years it's been around, and iirc the Alterans only took hundreds of thousands of years to get to the MW from their galaxy.
I always just figured that while the Ori galaxy is not in the local group like MW, Pegasus or Ida, it must still be relatively close compared to how far away Destiny is.

[SoulReaver]

It's never explicitly said that the Ori galaxy is closer MW than where Destiny is. I just figured that since we know for certain that Destiny has passed through at least 40 galaxies in the millions of years it's been around, and iirc the Alterans only took hundreds of thousands of years to get to the MW from their galaxy.
I always just figured that while the Ori galaxy is not in the local group like MW, Pegasus or Ida, it must still be relatively close compared to how far away Destiny is.

how fast are the Destiny's warp drives compared to recent alteran/atlantean ships ?

[D Toccs]

how fast are the Destiny's warp drives compared to recent alteran/atlantean ships ?

There's no real way to accurately compare them.
But the only Alteran ship we know of that is older than Destiny and the Seed Ships is the ship they used to leave their galaxy in AoT. If they didn't invent hyperdrive until much later, then it is not unreasonable to conclude that the ship from AoT must have used a similar FTL engine to Destiny and the Seed Ships which is why I was comparing the travel times.

Ultimately though it's all just speculation, the writers have never really cared to much for consistency within one show let alone across two shows. It does raise the interesting question though of why the Alterans would need to send Destiny at all if they had already traveled from the other side of the universe.

[garhkal]

Which makes me wonder WHEN they made the switch from FTL drives to hyper drives.

[Ben 'Teal'c would WIN!!' Noble]

Which makes me wonder WHEN they made the switch from FTL drives to hyper drives.

50,905,994 BC .