Riley & TJ's Actions Concerning Him

[LoneStar1836]

The argument is moot anyway. Riley isn't trapped at the knee. He's trapped at waist height, well above any easily choppable joints. Moreover, TJ didn't have the supplies on-hand to do such a thing, and by the time Destiny was able to provide assistance, Riley was beyond help.

People in real life have amputated their own limbs after becoming trapped under fallen trees, falling into rock crevasses, etc. and all they had on them was a knife so, imo, it's kinda hard to make the not having supplies argument.

I still think they should have made every effort to have freed him, even if he was going to die anyway.

[morbosfist]

How many of those cases actually survived? Amputating a limb isn't something to be done lightly, and they were hardly sanitary conditions. Not to mention the many other problems.

[LoneStar1836]

The ones that lived to tell the tale of them having to cut off their own limbs. Rather than die trapped under a tree....


I didn't say there wouldn't be problems, but just resigning him to his death. They gave up way too easily, imo, sanitary conditions be damned when he had a 100% chance of dying by being left like he was.

[zainea13]

They could have used the shovel to cut off his leg. I know its bad, but its a viable option. Also, my old friend is in the army, I asked him if he had a shovel cuz we were going to go camping, they don't carry tents or shovels with them anymore. So they shouldn't have one on the ship... but that's beside the point.

[garhkal]

Evidentally, the object could be lifted enough for TJ to decide that it was preventing Riley from bleeding out... at which point I ask... why the hell didn't she apply a tourniquet? That should have inhibited any catastrophic bleeding, and if the rest of the team had lifted the object, TJ and one other could have slid Riley out of harms way. Even if he DID have a spinal injury, a casualty can be moved in such a way.

If there isn't a damn tourniquet in that kit of TJ's, it makes me wonder what the bloody hell she has in there. For military personnel, a tourniquet and a field dressing are bare essentials in terms of battlefield first aid...

Hell.. they all had belts. I know in the various medical field trainings we have had, they say to use a belt if you need to do a leg tourniquete and don't have a proper one.

I have to agree with FOB. I wasn't aware of the Crush Syndrome aspect, but once they established a connection with Destiny, why not bring ten people to lift the console and pull Riley out. If it came to it, why not try cutting off his leg? I'd rather someone try that then suffocate me.

Being we don't know if they have any of that bug anesthetic, whos to say trying to cut it off would not have pushed him into shock, killing him anyway.

[quote]1. To get a tourniquet around his legs they'd only need to lift the debris for a short amount of time, twice - once for each leg if TJ/someone else is quick about it. She can then tighten it in her own time.
/quote]

And each time you lift, those chemicals get a chance to flow into the rest of his body.

3. If it hurts to much dull the pain with some alien snake venom.

You assume we still even have any.

4. Before making the decision to kill him - try everything. Really. ANYTHING is better than that choice. Knock him out with the venom and forcefully pull him out. If he dies, at least they did everything they could. It's not like he would suffer while being unconscious and there was still a chance as opposed to guaranteed death. Even if they're sure 100% that he won't make it drugging him would be the more humane choice compared to suffocation. And he was conscious. Horrible...

I know 2 people who were in situations where a loved one was on life support, and were still going to die... do you try and prolong it, keeping them in pain/making them lose dignity/suffer, or to you honor their request and end it quick.
Both of those coworkers chose option 2...

5. He told Young he was in pain - while earlier in the episode he said he was completely paralyzed in the injured areas. Inconsistency in the show...

He said he could not feel his legs. Pain was more than likely from the rest of him.

Assuming he lived - being a double amputee is not much of an issue in the SG 'verse considering they can clone him some new legs with Asgard tech.

And pray tell where the F are they going to get said asgard clone body from let alone to him?

Depending on how well the tourniquets worked an on-site transfusion might have been enough until they got a chance to properly close everything off/amputate

Thaat's assuming someone is of the right blood type. I am B+.. not that rare a type. BUT out of 180 or so people at the site i am at in okinawa, only 2 others are also B+..

Whose to say they couldn't have amputated him at the knee, then you only have to cut through the ligaments, tendons, and cartilage.

The fact he was covered up to almost his hips!!!

[Flyboy]

I can certainly see the arguments against amputating based on the position of the console, but I don't think it should have even come down to that. There should simply have been a much faster effort to unpin Riley. Let's be frank, there's at least one genius there, nobody thought of using somekind of lever to lift the console of him? After that, they wouldn't require it to be lifted MUCH in order to pull Riley out. After that, maybe a CAT wouldn't have worked, but it would have given him much more of a chance.

[Shadow_7]

It could have also been that Riley was a rare blood type and TJ knew that there was no donors to help him out. Too many IFs IMO. As much as we'd like to think they're Darth Vader capable. The basic premise is still donner party-ish. They just have a fancier wagon. Pulled by an oxen that doesn't know how to stop long enough do anything substantial.

[Wayston]

I can certainly see the arguments against amputating based on the position of the console, but I don't think it should have even come down to that. There should simply have been a much faster effort to unpin Riley. Let's be frank, there's at least one genius there, nobody thought of using somekind of lever to lift the console of him? After that, they wouldn't require it to be lifted MUCH in order to pull Riley out. After that, maybe a CAT wouldn't have worked, but it would have given him much more of a chance.

I greened you for your OP, but personally I think it's realistic that they didn't unpin riley asap. Their first and foremost mission was to set up the gate asap. I don't have any medical expertise so wouldn't know how much they could have done afterwards for Riley, but I think it was a spot on decision of the crew to initially leave only TJ and that promiscuous woman with the wounded Riley... it's unfortunate really, if only his waist hadn't been covered he would have been able to receive a proper send off....

[morbosfist]

"Out with a bang", as it were? As one might say, "I never thought I'd die this way, but I'd always really hoped."

[Shadow_7]

In the case of self amputation, it was to get free so that they could get TO medical help. And not done as this is the only medical help I need. But yes, just saw the man in half, and torch the wound and he'll be singing beer barrell polka by monday. Not everything is as hollywood makes it seem. Or vancouver or where ever it's located this week.

[SciFiRick]

I think it is an interesting point that the time issue for Destiny to jump could have been avoided. Since Rush wasn't going to tell anyone that he found the bridge and that he has already stopped the ship twice already meant that he wasn't willing to prevent the jump to keep Destiny in range of the planet in fear of being discovered. So, that action took out any possibilities in having more options to save Riley. Rush was right in saying that it was ALL his fault. If he hadn't been so desperate to find food & water and if he had not found the bridge then Destiny would have continued on is next destination with out incident. No one would have made decisions to go or not go to the planet and so on. Shuttles never launched and so on. That one decision set into motion the domino effect that we witnessed in this episode. Little did Rush know that Destiny would soon run into an object in space that might have the means to acquire food & water or even shuttles. Once Young finds out that Rush found the bridge and when he found it Young will go bullistic and throw him in the brig (if they had a brig) I think once the crew finds out then they will easily blame Riley's death on Rush and there will be issues

[TheLastSunset]

I'm not versed in knowledge in these areas such as medical knowledge but a multitude of things didn't seem realistic concerning Hunter. Perhaps everything was realistic though, it just needs to be explained by the people who wrote it. Or most, or some of it is accurate to reality. I just don't know, but I don't see why everything wasn't being tried to keep him alive instead of the hopeless attitude. And if Young suffocated Riley it seems unrealistic one would suffocate so quickly. Sure, it would cost screen time to show it all but they could just cut to parts instead of making it unrealistic and happening so fast. I also have only watched it once so I'd have to watch it more. Perhaps it all can be explained by those who created it.

[garhkal]

I can certainly see the arguments against amputating based on the position of the console, but I don't think it should have even come down to that. There should simply have been a much faster effort to unpin Riley. Let's be frank, there's at least one genius there, nobody thought of using somekind of lever to lift the console of him? After that, they wouldn't require it to be lifted MUCH in order to pull Riley out. After that, maybe a CAT wouldn't have worked, but it would have given him much more of a chance.

And pray tell what would they have used for the lever? I saw no piping.. rails.. rods.

[Flyboy]

And pray tell what would they have used for the lever? I saw no piping.. rails.. rods.

It's a broken shuttle. I'm sure they could have found SOMETHING, besides, that's only ONE advenue of approach.

[LoneStar1836]

In the case of self amputation, it was to get free so that they could get TO medical help. And not done as this is the only medical help I need. But yes, just saw the man in half, and torch the wound and he'll be singing beer barrell polka by monday. Not everything is as hollywood makes it seem. Or vancouver or where ever it's located this week.

Nah. Really!?!?

Sorry, I couldn't resist. My point in bring up people who have had to cut off their own limbs was to point out that IF joints could be reached such things are possible with nothing more than a knife since others were arguing that TJ didn't have the necessary tools to even consider amputation.

Riley was essentially a dead man. Even if they could have gotten him out, he'd probably have died of his injuries or from infection anyway, but I agree with FOB that they should have tried much harder than they did to free Riley in an attempt to save his life.