Can Stargate Command dial Destiny from Earth?

[AnonyMoose]

The Pegasus Project

They used a small stargate in the Pegasus galaxy too connect to another star gate in the Milky way using a blackhole for power.

This was done using the blackhole with no issues of connecting. The reason they had a problem was they needed to make the connection jump too the supergate.

Yes, they used that technique to effectively lock up the supergate with a perpetual wormhole to prevent the Ori from using the supergate. However, it's not practical to use that wormhole for cargo or human travel because they would be captured forever by the black hole at the small gate and eventually be torn apart by gravitational tidal forces. That's why the SG-10 team could not be saved in SG1 episode 216 "A Matter of Time".

[sandalhatman]

I had to register just to get into this discussion.

The SGC should be able to dial destiny but won't be allowed to for plot purposes. Let me now point to my proof. In season 8, episode 4, "Zero Hour" Dr. Lee was examining a booby trapped ZPM. From Gateworld's transcript...

LEE: We were gonna send it to Antarctica! Look, can you imagine if someone had taken it and plugged it into the chair in the Ancient outpost? I-I can't even imagine the magnitude of the explosion. A charged Z.P.M. detonating that -- I don't know, I mean, it could have destroyed the whole planet.

What happened when when they dialed the Destiny? The planet exploded. So that shows that all that is required to dial to the other side of the universe is a planet-sized explosion, which a ZPM is more than capable of making.

So yes, the SGC should be able to dial Destiny, but they won't be allowed to. Perhaps its for a legitimate reason, like the Earth gate doesn't have the necessary power conduits to handle that much power, but I think its more likely for plot reasons, which just means its a bad plot in the first place.

And to stave off the argument of "But Dr. Lee said it only 'might' destroy the planet" he also says in that episode that that ZPM is only 50% charged (says so in that same episode). So a fully charged one should be more than enough.

[Alterran1.]

Differece is the gate doesn't need to be so close after all the supergate is far enough away that an Alkesh isn't bothered.

A puddle jumper would likely be sufficient or they could use a drone of somekind.

[AnonyMoose]

One ZPM allowed Atlantis to dial Earth regularly, and it barely scratched its surface in terms of power consumption. Dialing Destiny could take 10-20% of its power, but it would still do it.

Your avatar image of Anubis is appropriate. You obviously like the "Dark Side". From several of your posts it looks like you enjoy fabricating baseless misinformation just to get your thrills from trying to upset other people. You are exposing yourself as a "Forum Bully". Seek help from a professional soon.

Everyone should take note of this Anubis worshiper and ignore all his comments... unless you also enjoy baseless arguments...

[AnonyMoose]

It's clearly the series premise that this time, the team won't be able to establish a Stargate connection back home by second season and get regular starship visits from back home by the third.

Dain, could you tell me where you got this info?

[Lightning Ducj]

NO

That's the answer to the question..."No"

The writers have put Destiny so far out in space that no known combination of power and technique available to the characters at this time will allow a wormhole connection from Earth to Destiny or vice versa. Power requirements, distances, it's all order of magnitudes too high to worry about entertaining the supposition. It is fait accompli by TPTB and defines the working environment of the new series.

Move on

[Lightning Ducj]

Dain, could you tell me where you got this info?

Because then Air would be a Direct-To-Video one-off rather than a pilot for a new series

[thekillman]

With the Ancients, I don't think it was a question of raw power requirements. If your math is correct, that means the Ancients themselves wouldn't be able to access the Destiny--and it's their own ship. If, as you say, it takes millions of ZPMs to create this connection, it means the Ancients wouldn't be able to access the Destiny even with all the energy resources of their entire civilization at their command. I highly doubt that the Ancients had millions of ZPMs.

My point is, I don't think they would setup a very specific stargate connection to the Destiny in the first place if they themselves were incapable of dialing it due to the vast amount of power involved. I think there's a piece of the puzzle still missing and I think it's some piece of Ancient tech needed to establish a connection that's either hidden somewhere in Atlantis or has been lost over the eons.

Whatever the case, I think TPTB are going to leave this particular mystery left unsolved because for the purposes of dramaturgy, being able to gate to the Destiny would essentially create a situation similar to Atlantis and I'm sure they're looking to avoid something like that. They're going to want the Destiny crew to be as isolated as possible to create conflict for the story.

except that it can be both right and fitting. remember, it's been out there for millions of years. if the ancients had dialled it when it was much closer, say, a few hundred million lightyear from earth, it would merely take a ZPM. or something like that.

now, it takes probably hundreds of ZPM's. or dozens, depends on the actual drain of power from the vast pool that Icarus had.

i do not believe the people on the ship are worth saving

[AnonyMoose]

Differece is the gate doesn't need to be so close after all the supergate is far enough away that an Alkesh isn't bothered.

A puddle jumper would likely be sufficient or they could use a drone of somekind.

I still think that its totally impractical. Think ahead a little bit - there are just too many problems with this suggestion.

We don't know how close a small stargate would have to be to a black hole to get power from it, but far enough away to avoid serious time dilation and gravitational force problems. Once you establish a wormhole from a black hole to the Destiny gate, could it even be turned off? You certainly couldn't cut off its power supply. If you couldn't terminate the wormhole to destiny, then the ship could not go back into FTL and might tear itself apart. Would the wormhole effects translate through the gate and cause other problems for the Destiny? Would there have to be a permanent presence of a mothership at the black hole stargate to protect it. If you send a puddle jumper through the small black hole gate into the Destiny gate room, would it even fit, or smash into the 2 stairs. Then what do you do with the jumper. The next kawoosh would partially destroy it and the Destiny gate room would be filled with a partial jumper. You don't have a black hole sized power supply on the Destiny stargate, so you could never send anything or anyone back to Earth. Using smaller drones has some similar problems. How big are the drones, and could they be removed from the destiny gate room, or would it just get filled up with multiple drones. And so on...

I seriously doubt that the writers would even consider doing this.

[AnonyMoose]

Because then Air would be a Direct-To-Video one-off rather than a pilot for a new series

You lost me there...

[Stormtrooper]

Your avatar image of Anubis is appropriate. You obviously like the "Dark Side". From several of your posts it looks like you enjoy fabricating baseless misinformation just to get your thrills from trying to upset other people. You are exposing yourself as a "Forum Bully". Seek help from a professional soon.

Everyone should take note of this Anubis worshiper and ignore all his comments... unless you also enjoy baseless arguments...

You are a very funny man/woman, O Oracle of Truth

[Dain]

People need to get to understand the dimensions involved here and that there will be no magical solution to this problem.
It's firmly established that Destiny is several billion lightyears away from Earth. That's a significant portion of the visible universe. They are completely lost in an ocean of galaxies, a mind-bogginly huge distance away. As a comparison, the Pegasus galaxy is in the immediate galactic neighbourhood with 3 million light years. Destiny is a thousand times further away than that. No ZPM is going to bridge that.
The ship won't be rescued by strapping a few glowing magic batteries together and saying "abracadabra, all your problems are now solved". That's not how this show is going to work.

Dain, could you tell me where you got this info?

It's only my opinion and that was a reference to SGA. I doubt they want a thematic repeat of a series they already did.

It's simple. If the characters were capable of returning home, over two-thirds of the cast would have to leave the show according to their in-character motivation. The premise here is that they aren't part of a handpicked expedition like in SGA, but rather an unqualified bunch of civilians and base personnel who are only on the Destiny by accident and all desperately want to return home.
And since such a huge change in the cast of the show isn't going to happen, they will be kept together somehow - most likely by not being able to return home until the series is finished.

It's still only my throughts, of course. I could be completely wrong and it turns out that they will solve all their problems by the end of season 1, get reconnected to Earth and go on to something completely different.

What happened when when they dialed the Destiny? The planet exploded. So that shows that all that is required to dial to the other side of the universe is a planet-sized explosion, which a ZPM is more than capable of making.

No. It has been said multiple times now: If a ZPM had been sufficient, they would have used one instead of blowing billions of dollars on building a secret base on a highly dangerous planet. It's the series entire premise that Earth won't be able to help the crew for a long while. It's NOT the authors being mean to the stranded people and not sending help because they don't feel like it.

For what it's worth: You cannot compare a ZPM with the power output of an entire McGuffin-planet based on this single quote.

Firstly, the destruction of the unstable planet wasn't part of the plan to reach Destiny. It exploded because of the attack on the base.
However stupid that sounds, the explosion was the result of the weapon fire hitting the surface, not because of the dialling process. Remember, they tried to dial Destiny before with similair power output (the demonstration to the senator) without blowing up the planet they were standing on. The base was intended for repeated usage.

And secondly, you cannot take a character's guesses as fact. He didn't know himself what the results would be and it's likely that this is a complete exageration. Furthermore, you don't even know what he really meant with that quote. Earth would be uninhabitable/destroyed without literally flying apart as if it was blasted away by a Death Star.

And to stave off the argument of "But Dr. Lee said it only 'might' destroy the planet" he also says in that episode that that ZPM is only 50% charged (says so in that same episode). So a fully charged one should be more than enough.

If I examine an ordinary nuclear bomb and then proceed to say: "This could blow up the whole world!" would you assume that I'm probably wrong but two bombs would be sufficient to do it?

[soulgazer]

People need to get to understand the dimensions involved here and that there will be no magical solution to this problem.
It's firmly established that Destiny is several billion lightyears away from Earth. That's a significant portion of the visible universe. They are completely lost in an ocean of galaxies, a mind-bogginly huge distance away. As a comparison, the Pegasus galaxy is in the immediate galactic neighbourhood with 3 million light years. Destiny is a thousand times further away than that. No ZPM is going to bridge that.
The ship won't be rescued by strapping a few glowing magic batteries together and saying "abracadabra, all your problems are now solved". That's not how this show is going to work.



It's only my opinion and that was a reference to SGA. I doubt they want a thematic repeat of a series they already did.

It's simple. If the characters were capable of returning home, over two-thirds of the cast would have to leave the show according to their in-character motivation. The premise here is that they aren't part of a handpicked expedition like in SGA, but rather an unqualified bunch of civilians and base personnel who are only on the Destiny by accident and all desperately want to return home.
And since such a huge change in the cast of the show isn't going to happen, they will be kept together somehow - most likely by not being able to return home until the series is finished.

It's still only my throughts, of course. I could be completely wrong and it turns out that they will solve all their problems by the end of season 1, get reconnected to Earth and go on to something completely different.




No. It has been said multiple times now: If a ZPM had been sufficient, they would have used one instead of blowing billions of dollars on building a secret base on a highly dangerous planet. It's the series entire premise that Earth won't be able to help the crew for a long while. It's NOT the authors being mean to the stranded people and not sending help because they don't feel like it.

For what it's worth: You cannot compare a ZPM with the power output of an entire McGuffin-planet based on this single quote.

Firstly, the destruction of the unstable planet wasn't part of the plan to reach Destiny. It exploded because of the attack on the base.
However stupid that sounds, the explosion was the result of the weapon fire hitting the surface, not because of the dialling process. Remember, they tried to dial Destiny before with similair power output (the demonstration to the senator) without blowing up the planet they were standing on. The base was intended for repeated usage.

And secondly, you cannot take a character's guesses as fact. He didn't know himself what the results would be and it's likely that this is a complete exageration. Furthermore, you don't even know what he really meant with that quote. Earth would be uninhabitable/destroyed without literally flying apart as if it was blasted away by a Death Star.



If I examine an ordinary nuclear bomb and then proceed to say: "This could blow up the whole world!" would you assume that I'm probably wrong but two bombs would be sufficient to do it?

Vary sound arhuement. Ppl have 2 realzise that a zpm isnt gonna power the stargate 2 destiny. Also, nobody nos how far the explosion of icarium planet went. 4 all we no, it could have destroyed the hole solar system, like in trinity

[AnonyMoose]

NO

That's the answer to the question..."No"

The writers have put Destiny so far out in space that no known combination of power and technique available to the characters at this time will allow a wormhole connection from Earth to Destiny or vice versa. Power requirements, distances, it's all order of magnitudes too high to worry about entertaining the supposition. It is fait accompli by TPTB and defines the working environment of the new series.

Move on

Agreed! I've been trying to persuade people to this premise for a while now, but some of them have learning disabilities and others are just trouble makers.

[AnonyMoose]

Why do people keep repeating that? It's clearly the series premise that this time, the team won't be able to establish a Stargate connection back home by second season and get regular starship visits from back home by the third.

Dain, who is suggesting that they will "establish a Stargate connection back home by second season and get regular starship visits from back home by the third"?