Originally posted by fems
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Originally posted by jelgate View PostThats just unfair bias. Just because their status of living is different then what we consider normal, we shouldn't automatically stay their lives is less important.Unmade Plans (WIP: 11/20):
Sam's life takes a turn in an unexpected direction when she's faced with an unplanned pregnancy. The decision to keep the baby and raise it on her own will alter her life forever. Relationships are put to the test, especially the one between her and Jack. She doesn't know what to expect from him and he surprises her at every turn.
On FFnet or AO3
My S/J fics can be found on FFnet and AO3. I also tweet and tumble about the ship and my writing/stories.
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Originally posted by jelgate View PostThats just unfair bias. Just because their status of living is different then what we consider normal, we shouldn't automatically stay their lives is less important.
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"I'm not gonna eat it - that's disgusting... I'm gonna wear it as a worm-stache." - Misha Collins (Supernatural Season 6 Gag Reel)
"Becker, it leads to the Victorian Era. What do you think is going to come through, an Oliver-Twist-Asaurus?" - Connor - Primeval.
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a game for Teal'c fans ~ Skaara/Klorel disscussion ~ Character Connection Game ~ "Beyond Redemption"...
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Originally posted by jelgate View PostThats just unfair bias. Just because their status of living is different then what we consider normal, we shouldn't automatically stay their lives is less important.
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Originally posted by fems View PostBut at that point they basically weren't alive, therefore they wouldn't have lives...
Originally posted by Lunaeclipse View PostDidn't Daniel say something like that once?
Originally posted by hedwig View PostWould you be willing to give up your home and life for a society that is stored in tissue samples so that those tissue samples could be regenerated while you had to die so they could live?Originally posted by aretood2Jelgate is right
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I thought the Gadmeer had been reduced to tissue samples and were embedded in those plastic/crystals in the drawers, which also included plant and animal tissue samples. They were in storage, so to speak (for who knows how long and could have stayed that way for another long while), and regardless of what Lotan said, it was possible (even if minimally so) that another planet could be found for them that would have been suitable for them to live on. There are always other possibilities, even if we or SG1 weren't informed of them in this episode.
And since the Gadmeer were supposedly a peaceful race, I doubt very much they would have willingly killed off another civilization in order for themselves to be regenerated. After all, that is exactly the kind of destruction they were running from at the hands of some enemy of theirs. I don't think Lotan's instructions included a specific order that he demand the surrender of a planet or all on it would die. That doesn't sound peaceful to me.
Originally posted by jelgateIts wrong because they are different to write off their desire to liveLast edited by hedwig; 30 November 2011, 09:39 AM.
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Originally posted by hedwig View PostI thought the Gadmeer had been reduced to tissue samples and were embedded in those plastic/crystals in the drawers, which also included plant and animal tissue samples. They were in storage, so to speak (for who knows how long and could have stayed that way for another long while), and regardless of what Lotan said, it was possible (even if minimally so) that another planet could be found for them that would have been suitable for them to live on. There are always other possibilities, even if we or SG1 weren't informed of them in this episode.
And since the Gadmeer were supposedly a peaceful race, I doubt very much they would have willingly killed off another civilization in order for themselves to be regenerated. After all, that is exactly the kind of destruction they were running from at the hands of some enemy of theirs. I don't think Lotan's instructions included a specific order that he demand the surrender of a planet or all on it would die. That doesn't sound peaceful to me.Originally posted by aretood2Jelgate is right
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Originally posted by jelgate View PostThey were alive. They were basically in a form of statsis/storage. That is still alive.Unmade Plans (WIP: 11/20):
Sam's life takes a turn in an unexpected direction when she's faced with an unplanned pregnancy. The decision to keep the baby and raise it on her own will alter her life forever. Relationships are put to the test, especially the one between her and Jack. She doesn't know what to expect from him and he surprises her at every turn.
On FFnet or AO3
My S/J fics can be found on FFnet and AO3. I also tweet and tumble about the ship and my writing/stories.
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Originally posted by jelgate View PostNo. Lothan said the ship could only terraform one planet and had started the process before the Enkarians had been implanted on the planet by SG1.
Probably not but at the same time I don't think they would want to become extinct themselves
After all, they were in stasis or nothing more than tissue samples. For them, no time would have passed between becoming tissue samples and being regenerated somewhere else. This one planet was not the end of the line for the Gadmeer, no matter what Lotan said. We don't know that he was interpreting his directives accurately. There was no actual rush for them to be regenerated. The ship was not in danger of being destroyed if it went off searching again.
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Originally posted by hedwig View PostThe point is that they were in stasis, and even if it were true that the ship could terraform only one planet, it doesn't mean the ship could not have gone looking about the galaxy for another planet that would suit their needs. After all, they bypassed the Enkarans homeworld because of one little bitty (or maybe a little bigger than "bitty") flaw. Given the number of worlds throughout the galaxy, it's hard to believe another one could not be found for them.
After all, they were in stasis or nothing more than tissue samples. For them, no time would have passed between becoming tissue samples and being regenerated somewhere else. This one planet was not the end of the line for the Gadmeer, no matter what Lotan said. We don't know that he was interpreting his directives accurately. There was no actual rush for them to be regenerated. The ship was not in danger of being destroyed if it went off searching again.
However, it does appear that the process could be halted for a time and then resumed again later as the ship took the Enkarans back to their homeworld before completing the planetary transformation. Therefore, the obvious solution would have been for Lotan to halt the process while they negotiated a settlement and/or searched for another world for the Enkarans. The error was for Lotan not to offer this information (that the process could be halted for a time and resumed later) or for us (ie Daniel) not to ask that question initially. As a result, the ticking clock that caused all the contension (stop the ship before it destroyed the gate) was unnecessarily self-imposed by the poor communication, which arguably was exaserbated by Jack's hasty favoritism, Lotan's intransigence and Daniel's petulance.sigpic
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Originally posted by hlndncr View PostI think the problem was not that the ship couldn't have searched longer but that the process of transforming the planet had already begun before the Enkarans arrived, just so far from the gate that the ship was not noticed. Remember Lotan stated that there were no sentient inhabitants when the planet was scanned and when the ship discovered them it was too late to stop the process because the ship only had enough material for one planet once the process had begun.
However, it does appear that the process could be halted for a time and then resumed again later as the ship took the Enkarans back to their homeworld before completing the planetary transformation. Therefore, the obvious solution would have been for Lotan to halt the process while they negotiated a settlement and/or searched for another world for the Enkarans. The error was for Lotan not to offer this information (that the process could be halted for a time and resumed later) or for us (ie Daniel) not to ask that question initially. As a result, the ticking clock that caused all the contension (stop the ship before it destroyed the gate) was unnecessarily self-imposed by the poor communication, which arguably was exaserbated by Jack's hasty favoritism, Lotan's intransigence and Daniel's petulance.Unmade Plans (WIP: 11/20):
Sam's life takes a turn in an unexpected direction when she's faced with an unplanned pregnancy. The decision to keep the baby and raise it on her own will alter her life forever. Relationships are put to the test, especially the one between her and Jack. She doesn't know what to expect from him and he surprises her at every turn.
On FFnet or AO3
My S/J fics can be found on FFnet and AO3. I also tweet and tumble about the ship and my writing/stories.
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I'm kinda in Col. O'Neill's camp in this episode. While I sympathize with the Gadmeer and their wish to rebirth their race, they're already dead. Unless I got it wrong, all that was on board the ship was skin samples. It's not a hibernation ship - it's a seed ship. It terraforms the planet and seeds it with flora and fauna to make it resemble the original. If I die, but my DNA samples are frozen in some lab, I can't argue that because the DNA samples can be used to generate other humans that I must still be alive. Or if my organs are donated, that I'm still alive and occupying the chest cavity of some other guy.
It's not ideal, and obviously the solution that they came up with is much more preferable to all parties involved. But if it truly is nothing more than a seed ship, then I'd have to argue that the Gadmeer are already dead and gone. And the Enkarans are very much alive. Destroying the Gadmeer ship would not kill them again.
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This is one of those philosophical episodes where they have to decide on an ethical issue. But they did come up with a good alternative. As for the Gadmeer, I have to disagree that they are already dead and gone since they still have in place a system to continue their species. It's kind of like smallpox. Supposed to be completely irradicated around the world, but... the CDC (and other countries I'm sure) still have some frozen in special freezers for research. So it's not really gone, just in a kind of storage, like the Gadmeer.sigpic
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