The Cam and Vala discussion thread

[AGateFan]

Vala and Cam

Spoiler:

killed the Asgard!!!

j/k but figured I needed to post somewhat on topic.

[Rogue]

as to rda's availabiltiy...from all i heard he WAS available. in fact, for s10, when they signed him for '5 episodes' he honestly thought he'd be doing stargate...instead they put him over on atlantis for 3 of them. he made some comment like 'i thought i was coming back to my family, instead i came back to someone else's'


so the actor was apparantly very willing to come back to stargate to deal with his character, instead TPTB decided to put him over on atlantis. we don't know precisely WHY they did it. rumors/supposition includes such theories as stunt casting for atlantis and the fear that, wtih jack's return, cameron's flaws would be oh so much more evident, thus they tried to keep the characters as separate as possible.

and even if the actor couldn't come - such as for unending or trnt...why can't the character even be mentioned? why didn't sam ask after jack in trnt? she asked after everyone short of Walter. why wasn't jack a topic of a line or two of dialogue in unending? given the situation that they were in, why wasn't what they were missing a topic of discussion?

not that the show must revolve around old characters, however the lack of even a mention of a very prominant one sticks out like a sore thumb.

in the case of unending, we can have scene after scene of daniel and his girlfriend and coop seems to go OTT in any effort to promote his favorite little characters...but also seems to go OTT to banish any and all he doesn't like...and he doesn't seem to like Jack very much.

Having RDA in Unending would have made alot of long time SG-1 fans happy. But I don't think RCC is interested in the long time fans. He has been given us the finger since the beginning of S9.

[Skydiver]

well, rda isn't part of STargate Command...so yeah. that's the center of coop's universe


not the 8 years that gave him the ability to play show leader

[Pitry]

RDA said in the past he'd love to come back but only if the story called for it - he doesn't want to be written especially into a story and have the character out of place.

It's possible inserting the character to Ark of Truth would have been quite a stretch, either in RDa's or RCC's mind - I've no idea about the plot other than the very basics, I'm trying to remain unspoiled.
Another possibility is that with rDa's schedule they realised they can either put him in Ark of Truth or Continuum but not both, and thought he'd be ebtter used in the second than the first.

[suse]

I don't think it would've gone on with just DST JMHO. Where's the hook where's the drama there was a need for new blood. I think the dymamic between the old team orignal team had been completely explored that's why it wasn't focused on everything had been covered. I am not saying they should never interact anymore that's not what I am saying but it makes sense that the new characters needed to be intergrated with the old team so that was the focus not orignal team.

So if you (gen) know (more than acquaintance) someone for eight years the friendship should be ignored if not thrown away because...well, what else is there to learn?

The point imo is that the characters weren't integrated. The show was disassembled then reassembled to showcase the Chinese proverb take on the word
... interesting... new Stargate Command. As in they were shoehorned. Showcased. But MOST definitely not integrated.

suse

[suse]

Re: Jack:

How can they move on if they keep talking about him I see 9 and 10 differently than you do I have read over and over again how 8 had the highest ratings well that's why Skiffy wanted another season and RDA wasn't coming back and I understand probably RDA felt the show Story Lines were wrapped up they were, enemies were all defeated goal attained and I have read by some the REAL SG-1 ended at 8 well if Jack is the only member of SG-1 that may be true but there were 3 other members not just Jack

I think people meant that the feeling of team was gone. As you said there were 4 members. But the only one used (and not even as a member of a team but off in another galaxy w/Vala) was Daniel. Sam and Teal'c were completely ignored unless they had to 1) have someone spout technobabble then have the general make fun of her doing it or 2) torture someone ad nauseum

well that ratings were so high and from what else I have read TPTB wanted to make another show SKiffy said no and I understand why they did it wouldn't have that known name like SG-1 so they had to retool and since they wanted BB for SGA but couldn't get him so now they could have him for SG-1.

And having him for SG-1 was a boon. It's the way his character was added (not integrated but shoehorned in, warping 8 years of canon) that's a problem.

Re: RDA (I think):

So there is politics what else is new if he just wanted to be just on SG-1 he should have made that clear negotiated for that he is not stupid he knows what goes on. How can they move on and develop the characters if they keep bringing up the old ones

Yes it was a bad assumption. But I can see why he (and his agent!) made it. Bringing up is relative. A mention is continuity, not a discussion about what he is doing

I want to add one more thing that has been bothering me I don't think 9 and 10 are Stargate Command let me tell you why if the SGC was the focus then why would they still focus on the SG-1 team huh they had many roles to fill when RDA left cuz at the end of 8 Jack was the head of SGC and SG-1 to a certain respect we never really got to see Sam lead we got to see Jack ? his sanity I hated that ep I would've rather seen the team in action with the 3 of them. 9 and 10 were a retooled SG-1 I know some of you wish they didn't retool but this was the result of many different actions.

And they ignored 8 years of canon to retool it. It might not totally be SGC but it sure isn't SG-1 anymore.

suse

[windy]

as to rda's availabiltiy...from all i heard he WAS available.

Yeah he was. I asked him directly if he was going to be in Unending and he said nobody had approached him about it.
Personally I find it an utter disgrace to not have him there, but sadly I wasn't surprised at all. After all they never even stated *in the show* that he's the head of Homeworld Security. Only that he's in Washington. So yeah, out of sight, out of mind.
Personally I thought Unending sucked due to a multitude of reasons, and not even mentioning Jack didn't help as far as I'm concerned.

[poundpuppy29]

I don't know what the issue is with RDA and Coop I don't know but I do know there are 3 sides to every story yours, mine and the truth. I don't think it is clear cut, black and white there is usually shades of grey. I do know in other t.v. shows when an actor leaves or what ever shows usually recast and add new characters this practice is not new or rare, does this go smoothly not always but it does happen the world doesn't end and shows are still entertaining with the new characters too. I wonder if some of you are willing to admit you are taking out your frustration that RDA/Jack isn't there on Cam and Vala and not looking at the characters themselves. I do agree that Jack should have been in the finale but when they got the news it was late they were shooting Bad Guys correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't that the 4th or 5th to last ep of the season not a lot of time to wrap up a 10 season series that's JMHO. I think from a storyline point of view yes Jack should have been there 2 issues come to mind. I do understand them not discussing him they moved on they already told you where he was in beginning of 9. Maybe they should've mentioned Jack in TRNT but I was glad he wasn't there to be honest I thought that was a very strong ep for Sam one of the best Sam centric I've seen, they have done J&S in AU together so many times before does have to be in every AU ep remember if there is an infinite number AR AU where anything and everything happens. Can you guys give me examples of how they ignore 8 years of canon please be nice. I really liked the Cam scene in the TRNT and I am sure you all loved where they had Vala

[Skydiver]

ignoring canon

the most obvious, the absolute dirth of mention of jack in places where he logically should have been mentioned. such as TRNT

Spoiler:

when sam asked after every member of the sgc BUT jack

or in unending

Spoiler:

which was a perfect time to either - if they really wanted to show the 'team together, to actually HAVE the team together. what the heck was landry doing there???

the goa'uld, or lack thereof

in a place as large as the galaxy you don't just 'defeat' them all. there were thousands of goa'ulds, hundreds of system lords...and none of them ever rose to power? it's inconceivable. you kill off a warlord in iraq, one will rise to take his place within hours. folks as genetically wired for submission and power like the goa'uld don't just fade away

teh tok'ra

they're still out there spying, still out there looking...they couldn't be used to help against the ori?

responsibility for their actions

like someone has said, in SOG the SGC turned in thier own to make them be responsible for thier thievery...but now we are little more than galactic treasure hunters? and characters bear no responsibility for thier actions anymore. they do what they want, which is what the plot needs, and no one cares if it's wrong or not

the sgc was always put forth as the 'best of the best'. only the cream of the crop gets assigned there. in prodigy and proving ground, we even saw academy kids being vetted and having to EARN their place at the sgc
then comes cameron and apparantly anyone with the right friend can get an assignment now...and be given tehir choice of jobs within the sgc

teh sgc is top secret and even talking about it can get you held up on charges of treason...and vala can run around, her daddy can do whatever he wants, aliens can beam down and attack parts of kansas, killer critters terrorize colorado...and we're supposed to believe that it's still a secret????

[poundpuppy29]

OK first point when they introduced Vala in season 9 she was searched before she came and she did have some thing they were curious about a tablet if memory serves and they didn't capture her she came to them I give you she did do a bad thing but if they wanted some technology they have to investigate it, that is the standing orders of the SGC to seek technology that could defend earth against all threats right that tablet might lead to that. She's a former goa'uld host so she could have memories that could help them against the remaining Goa'uld and she did she did tell them not to trust that one that was in BH and she was right she is not pure evil and she did have guards outside her door before she came back in FB. The Goa'uld was defeated in Reckoning 1 and 2 by the Ancient device along with the replicators. (I did think the battle in TLC was better) They no longer had the Jaffa armies to fight for them the power was taken away from them so of course they are no longer main enemy. I do believe the reason ToK'ra are not used as much is because they were mainly used against the Goa'uld and the Goa'uld were more about power and prestige so their spying and tactics were useful. They were mentioned and used when Ba'al was involved but how could they be used with the Ori the Ori are about control and will. But in Dominion how they were used tells me that they were talking all along just we didn't see it. I will give you Jack should've been in Unending and asked about in TRNT and I understand why Landry was there spoilers for Unending

Spoiler:

As the head of SGC if a major ally the Asgard asks for you to witness something makes sense for him to be there I do agree Jack should have been there too but I don't know what happened behind the scenes

Cam was in that major battle in TLC we just didn't see him so he was part of the air force and I don't see any black mark or bad behavior on his record not like Jack and Sheppard so why couldn't he be the leader the old team scattered they originally wanted him to be a new leader of a new team the SL wise. In Bad Guys they didn't get the treasure. You do remember in season 6 those funky things that spread around people thought they were having delusions remember they were everywhere it was like someone was on drugs those funky things. Remember the Asgard ship that crashed in season 4. Wormhole extreme remember that one space ship landing with a film crew there. Vala has proven herself and earned trust. I don't know about Vala's Dad he was on surveillance while he was there but he did not commit a crime against them before he came and he was giving them info.

[scarimor]

Since this thread has had an unsolicited name change, I guess it's open to discuss any aspect of Cam and Vala now. Nothing is specified. So... Vala's manicure preferences? Cam's favourite boxer shorts?

I think Vala goes for rounded unpolished and Cam could be a white-with-cherries pattern. What do you all think?

[Jackie]

Puppy--paragraph please:


OK, first point. When they introduced Vala in season 9 she was searched before she came and she did have some thing they were curious about--a tablet if memory serves. And they didn't capture her; she came to them.

Yes, she came to them and tricked Daniel into finding the treasure using Jaffa version of handcuffs. She wanted her "share" of the treasure.

I give you she did do a bad thing, but if they wanted some technology; they have to investigate it. That is the standing orders of the SGC to--seek technology that could defend earth against all threats, right? That tablet might lead to that.

Standing orders was to explore and find new technology. However, when Vala came to them, there was no threat to us.

She's a former goa'uld host so she could have memories that could help them against the remaining Goa'uld and she did she did tell them not to trust that one that was in BH and she was right. She is not pure evil and she did have guards outside her door before she came back in FB.

The remaining Goa'uld are not precived as a threat. The show even went as far as to make Ba'al into a running joke to make sure we got that point.

Have no idea who BH is and you kind of lost me on the rest.

The Goa'uld was defeated in Reckoning 1 and 2 by the Ancient device along with the replicators. (I did think the battle in TLC was better) They no longer had the Jaffa armies to fight for them the power was taken away from them so of course they are no longer main enemy.


I do believe the reason ToK'ra are not used as much is because they were mainly used against the Goa'uld and the Goa'uld were more about power and prestige so their spying and tactics were useful.

The Tokra are not used much becuase all the old allies have been written out of the show. Haven't seen much of anyone lately. It wouldn't matter if the Goa'uld were in power or not. The Tokra would still be in the show if the writers WANTED too.

They were mentioned and used when Ba'al was involved, but how could they be used with the Ori? The Ori are about control and will. But in Dominion how they were used--tells me, that they were talking all along just we didn't see it.

The complaint isn't that the Tokra was "not talking all along" the complaint is the shows lack of utalizing old allies in the new arc. Then when they do utalize someoen it's either to make them into a joke (ba'al)--plot device for quick ending (Asguard)

I will give you Jack should've been in Unending and asked about in TRNT and I understand why Landry was there spoilers for Unending

Spoiler:

But if Jack was in Unending; they couldn't let Daniel and Vala get under the sheets without Jack and Sam.

Spoiler:

As the head of SGC if a major ally the Asgard asks for you to witness something makes sense for him to be there I do agree Jack should have been there too but I don't know what happened behind the scenes

Cam was in that major battle in TLC. We just didn't see him, so he was part of the air force and I don't see any black mark or bad behavior on his record. Not like Jack and Sheppard, so why couldn't he be the leader the old team scattered? They originally wanted him to be a new leader of a new team the SL wise.

We didn't see him becuase he wasn't invented yet. Jack didn't have a black mark on his record. He was suicidal after he son died. Sheppard was the rebel. The main complain about Mitchell is his perfect record and his perfect memory. Yet, this guys screws up all the time.

In Bad Guys, they didn't get the treasure.

In bad guys they were searching for information and technology. Daniel couldn't figure out why the scripture was all goofy at first.

You do remember in season 6 those funky things that spread around people? Thought they were having delusions. Remember, they were everywhere it was like someone was on drugs those funky things.

Episode please--go to episode heading on GW and find which one you are talking about. Too vague on your description

Remember the Asgard ship that crashed in season 4.

Underwater as I recall

Wormhole extreme, remember that one space ship landing with a film crew there.

That was the 100th ep and it was an out of character ep like 200. But, way better than 200. 200--was just plain bad, even for a comedy.

Vala has proven herself and earned trust.

Quick as a bunny, ain't she!?

I don't know about Vala's Dad, he was on surveillance while he was there but he did not commit a crime against them before he came and he was giving them info.

Is them the SGC? If so, the SGC never heard of him. Vala identified him as he father. I guess, Jasek was a low tier criminal.

[Skydiver]

The Tokra are not used much becuase all the old allies have been written out of the show. Haven't seen much of anyone lately. It wouldn't matter if the Goa'uld were in power or not. The Tokra would still be in the show if the writers WANTED too.

which is one thing that supports 'ignoring the past/canon'

the SGC has 8 years of allies and contacts...but every planet beyond that overused medieval set seems to be off limits. no one mentions, mmhm, wonder if the nox would have any insight?' or 'wonder if xe'les would have any clues to help us' or any other nice powerful contact over the years.

but heck, they can't even be bothered to mention cassie when her mother dies, so what do you expect???

coop doesn't seem to care about the 8 years of history taht laid the groundwork for him to grace us iwth his wonderful vision of a space spoof, all he seems to care about IS his wonderful vision...and anyone that can't appreciate it just have issues and are too stupid to see how great it is

[Zelda]

[B]Since this thread has had an unsolicited name[/B] change, I guess it's open to discuss any aspect of Cam and Vala now. Nothing is specified. So... Vala's manicure preferences? Cam's favourite boxer shorts?

I think Vala goes for rounded unpolished and [B]Cam could be a white-with-[/B]cherries pattern. What do you all think?

Unsolicited name change -- nothing like changing the horse in the middle of the race. It's pretty funny since the same old beating of said dead horse takes place on 2 threads.

While the cherries might appear in your head, on film, we've already seen which underwear Cam prefers -- he's a sports brief kind of guy. sigh.

Vala gets manicures? Wow. She's alien -- does she have fingernails? Didn't notice. She does, however, like colored lingerie.

Does Commander Sam polish her halo nightly or once a week? Curious minds want to know. Oops! Off topic. But, since a lot of posts refer to General Jack, I guess it's not so off topic after all. So, which is it?

[pittsburghgirl]

Having RDA in Unending would have made alot of long time SG-1 fans happy. But I don't think RCC is interested in the long time fans. He has been given us the finger since the beginning of S9.

indeed he has. but then we are the ones with the "issues".

I really believe, as I have said aud nauseum, that season 10 was supposed to be the season of Jack who? just like they have managed to ignore Janet and Jacob the wanted to ignore Jack too. anybody see a pattern?? the curse of the 3 J's.
RDA left-fine-then everything is gone. It is a wonder they didn't kill him off-that would have settled things wouldn't it? I mean The actor who played Henry Blake on MASH-he wanted off-and they offed him. Had his plane shot out of the sky. Jack forever trapped in the event horizon.