How did Moros retain ALL his ascended knowledge and many powers?

[Mitchell82]

I'm willing to bet Merlin is dead. Once he descended, he spent his time with Arthur et al. and therefore, no time to meditate and reascend. We know that to ascend, you need to a) meditate for a long time or b) die and have one of the Ancients (like Oma) help ascend you. I don't think the Ancients helped him reascend after because of what he did.

Who knows I mean Anubis was asacended! It's possible they did reascended him or he found a back door.

[Lord Shiva]

But that doesn't explain why Orlin didn't do that in the fourth horseman.

A childs brain learns adapts faster then an adults - so my taking the form of a child, Orlin's physical body could retain the Ancient knowledge a lot longer then he could have if he had Descended as an adult.

[Blinded]

Moros was First of all an Atlantian to Begin with Before his Acension. So when he desended he should have been able to retain all his Knowledge. He was Apart of the First Evolution of humans. The Reason why the other were not able to retain there Knowleadge was because they must of been apart of the Secound Evolution and there Brains were not advanced enought.

[Jarnin]

that sounds good n all but why put them on different planets?

So if one got taken out there would be others. I know I'd want redundancy if I was storing my memories in a gadget like that.

also why wasn't there one in his house in Camolot?

Why wasn't there one in Glastonbury Tor? The ones we've seen in the show seem to always be located on uninhabited planets. Maybe he doesn't want them where humans would easily find them.

To my knowledge Orlin has been the only one to descend and have the 'losing all the knowledge' effect.

He descended in Ascension, and he didn't lose his memores. Of course that's because he was still being punished for his 'crimes'. In order to come clean, he had to destroy the weapon he helped build, so he'd need his memories for that.

Seems to me it was a bit of a cop-out by the part of the writers, otherwise Orlin would simply be far too powerful an ally.

Yep.

Merlin had the ascended knowledge, not the repository knowledge. The repository didn't hold the ascended knowledge.. unless merlin created them.

Exactly

[Xanderic]

Who knows I mean Anubis was asacended! It's possible they did reascended him or he found a back door.

What the hell are you talking about?

1) Oma helps ascends people.
2) Anubis found out information about ascension and tricked Oma to ascend him.
3) The "Others" found out he was a gou'ld and TRIED to use their combined power to descend him.
4) Anubis wasn't able to descend completely. Meaning he became HALF-ASCENDED
5) Half-ascension meant that Anubis wasn't really in our plane of existance... and only at the "half-way house" in the ascended plane. He was a black energy in our plane of existance and could only take over a body for a short period of time because the body began to decompose once he took it over. He was "in between mortality and ascension".
6) Anubis was forbidden to use the ascended knowledge that he gained when he ascended in our plane of existence so he found ways around it. Oma is punished to watch over Anubis but cannot interfere with what he does in our plane of existence.
7) In Threads, when he was at the half-way house with Daniel and Oma, he was boasting about the galaxy being destroyed. Oma went into a battle lasting forever with Anubis such that Anubis would be unable to return to our plane of existence or the Ascended plane of existence so he would not be able to cause more trouble.
8) Conclusion. Anubis was never reascended. Oma is in an eternal battle with Anubis. We won't see either of them again (hopefully).

[Mitchell82]

What the hell are you talking about?

1) Oma helps ascends people.
2) Anubis found out information about ascension and tricked Oma to ascend him.
3) The "Others" found out he was a gou'ld and TRIED to use their combined power to descend him.
4) Anubis wasn't able to descend completely. Meaning he became HALF-ASCENDED
5) Half-ascension meant that Anubis wasn't really in our plane of existance... and only at the "half-way house" in the ascended plane. He was a black energy in our plane of existance and could only take over a body for a short period of time because the body began to decompose once he took it over. He was "in between mortality and ascension".
6) Anubis was forbidden to use the ascended knowledge that he gained when he ascended in our plane of existence so he found ways around it. Oma is punished to watch over Anubis but cannot interfere with what he does in our plane of existence.
7) In Threads, when he was at the half-way house with Daniel and Oma, he was boasting about the galaxy being destroyed. Oma went into a battle lasting forever with Anubis such that Anubis would be unable to return to our plane of existence or the Ascended plane of existence so he would not be able to cause more trouble.
8) Conclusion. Anubis was never reascended. Oma is in an eternal battle with Anubis. We won't see either of them again (hopefully).

Sorry my point was that Anubis was the eviliest person we came across and he was ascended so someone who just broke some itty bitty rules should have no problem reascending.

[Jarnin]

What the hell are you talking about?

I would ask the same question of you.

1) Oma helps ascends people.

Yes.

2) Anubis found out information about ascension and tricked Oma to ascend him.

Yes.

3) The "Others" found out he was a gou'ld and TRIED to use their combined power to descend him.

No. They banished them (Oma and Anubis) to the lower planes of existance, in particular the plane that humans live in.

4) Anubis wasn't able to descend completely. Meaning he became HALF-ASCENDED

No. Anubis was being punished along with Oma. They weren't allowed to use their ascended powers on the lower planes, else they get a smackdown from the others.

5) Half-ascension meant that Anubis wasn't really in our plane of existance... and only at the "half-way house" in the ascended plane.

No. Half ascended means that he can't use his ascended powers, only his ascended knowledge. There were conditions to that rule also, like not being able to use his ascended knowledge to create new technologies. That's why he was always searching for ancient technology.

He was a black energy in our plane of existance and could only take over a body for a short period of time because the body began to decompose once he took it over.

No. He was black energy because that's what the special effects team decided to do. In the episode Full Circle he was a normal misty white ascended being.
The reason why he could only take a host for a limited time was because he was an ascended being: Ascended beings exist as energy, and energy is radiation, like light and all the other spectrums. Anubis as an ascended being was radioactive, which cooked his human hosts from the inside out.

He was "in between mortality and ascension".

No. He was an ascended being living on a lower plane of existance.

8) Conclusion. Anubis was never reascended.

Anubis was never descended. Oma unwittingly helped him to ascend, and for that 'crime' the others banished them both to a lower plane of existance (our 'plane').
While in this plane, Oma and Anubis was forbidden to use their ascended powers to interfere with lower beings. If they did, they'd be punished by the others. They could still use their ascended knowledge, as long as they didn't share it with lowers; that's how Anubis knew how to read ancient which led him to their technology and weapons, and how Oma could help others ascend.

In Threads Oma and Anubis are locked into an eternal fight, yes, but the reason why it's an eternal fight is because they're both ascended, with equal knowledge, powers and abilities. It's a draw, but Oma has to keep Anubis occupied or he'll start wreaking havok on the lower planes again.

[JanusAncient]

Something should probably be said about this last part. In "Kheb" Oma used her powers to kll Jaffa, not once but twice, and if she was really afraid of being punished by the Other's, why would she risk it twice. She wouldn't. So Oma could use her ascended powers, and her ascended knowledge, Anubis couldn't use his ascended powers, or his ascended knowledge. He learned to read Ancient before he was ascended, remember he found Ancient research on ascension, before he went to Kheb, meaning that he could read Ancient before he actually ascended.

[Jarnin]

Something should probably be said about this last part. In "Kheb" Oma used her powers to kll Jaffa, not once but twice, and if she was really afraid of being punished by the Other's, why would she risk it twice. She wouldn't. So Oma could use her ascended powers, and her ascended knowledge, Anubis couldn't use his ascended powers, or his ascended knowledge.

I suppose you're right; Oma needed her powers to contain Anubis (which was her punishment), and Anubis would be able to defend himself since another ascended being would be attacking him.

He learned to read Ancient before he was ascended, remember he found Ancient research on ascension, before he went to Kheb, meaning that he could read Ancient before he actually ascended.

Right again. I suppose Anubis wouldn't have had much time in the higher planes to really learn much. He'd have to rely on what he knew prior to ascending.

The whole bit about Anubis tricking Oma seems dodgy to me. Either Oma is really naive, or Anubis wasn't a symbiote when he ascended. He supposedly recreated his DNA prior to his ascension in the form of Khalek, and Khalek wasn't a Goa'uld, he was a Harsesis.
I'm thinking that when the System Lords thought they killed Anubis the symbiote, they really did. His Harcesis lived, and that's who became the Anubis we know and love. Since his Harcesis would have all of Anubis' knowledge up to the point of his creation, he could pick up right where Anubis left off.

[JanusAncient]

Yeah, I suppose, but why that Harcesis? I'm talking about the one from "Threads," kind of an odd look for a Harcesis, but then again you wouldn't have expected him to be if he was.

[ancientaction]

i havn't read all of the thread, so excuse me if this is already said.

Moros/merlin, was not just a human, as said by Morgan le Fay, he was advanced, and obtained several advanced abilities. Moros cheated. by decending into an advanced human, there hence he was able to retain alot of knowlege. he was probally one of the first ones to decend, with an atempt. so the others didn't know what to expect.

orlin, who had a .. history of going over that "thin line" was watched like a hawk. so when he decided to help us, the only way he could do it without being stoped or having everything erased BEFORE he could help us, was to put himself in a position where he wound't be offering .. Acended help.

orlin was not alowed to come back like merlin did.

[Xanderic]

Wow. You've got to be kidding me.
Please read these: http://www.gateworld.net/omnipedia/c...a/anubis.shtml
http://www.gateworld.net/omnipedia/c...madesala.shtml
http://www.gateworld.net/sg1/s8/transcripts/818.shtml

I know what I'm talking about. I think you might need to do more reading before you write.

No. They banished them (Oma and Anubis) to the lower planes of existance, in particular the plane that humans live in.

Yes. Anubis was banished. Oma was not. She was still able to do her work.
From the first link: "Once a powerful Goa'uld System Lord, Anubis was banished by the others because his actions were deemed unspeakable, even among the Goa'uld... But the Ancients did not want the Goa'uld to join them on a higher plane of existence, and tried to force him to descend. They were only partially successful, and Abubis became trapped between the two planes of existence."
Nowhere in 2nd link does it say Oma is banished. Of course it is a bit outdated since Threads isn't included in the "key episodes" but I'll address that in a minute.

No. Anubis was being punished along with Oma. They weren't allowed to use their ascended powers on the lower planes, else they get a smackdown from the others.

Yes. Oma was being punished. Anubis was not.
From 3rd link:
"JACKSON: I don't understand. They let him wreak havoc. They don't care if he destroys all life in the galaxy -- life they themselves created?

OMA: They haven't stopped me from continuing my work. I've tried to make up for it -- help when I can.

JACKSON: It's your punishment. You're forced to watch, powerless to interfere, and let Anubis do whatever he wants just to punish you?"

No. Half ascended means that he can't use his ascended powers, only his ascended knowledge. There were conditions to that rule also, like not being able to use his ascended knowledge to create new technologies. That's why he was always searching for ancient technology.

Semi-Wrong again. From 3rd link:
"OMA: They warned him -- he wasn't allowed to use any knowledge or power unless he otherwise would have gained it as a Goa'uld. "
meaning NO KNOWLEDGE, NO ASCENDED POWER. He was searching for ancient technology that he would have searched for as a Gou'ld.

No. He was black energy because that's what the special effects team decided to do. In the episode Full Circle he was a normal misty white ascended being.
The reason why he could only take a host for a limited time was because he was an ascended being: Ascended beings exist as energy, and energy is radiation, like light and all the other spectrums. Anubis as an ascended being was radioactive, which cooked his human hosts from the inside out.

if you're talking about that's Daniel using his powers and Oma stopping him.
Inside the Darth Vadar-like suit is Anubis in his half-ascended form because he can't take the form of a human body like Oma who is fully ascended. The reflection we see when Anubis lifts his shroud is Daniel trying to stop him, not the true him. We see the true him as a black energy. And yes, energy is radiation thus that argument is valid. I just didn't go in that much detail. But yes, radiation destroys the body.

No. He was an ascended being living on a lower plane of existance.

Again, from the first link: "They were only partially successful, and Abubis became trapped between the two planes of existence."

Anubis was never descended. Oma unwittingly helped him to ascend, and for that 'crime' the others banished them both to a lower plane of existance (our 'plane').
While in this plane, Oma and Anubis was forbidden to use their ascended powers to interfere with lower beings. If they did, they'd be punished by the others. They could still use their ascended knowledge, as long as they didn't share it with lowers; that's how Anubis knew how to read ancient which led him to their technology and weapons, and how Oma could help others ascend.

No he was not descended. If you had read, Mitchell82 said he reascended. My argument showed that he never descended so therefore, he could not have reascended.
Again, Oma was not banished. Anubis maybe. We just know the Ancients didn't want Anubis in their plane of existance.
Again, Oma was still able to help people (like Daniel and Shifu) ascend even after the incident with Anubis. Oma could only watch but not interfere with anything Anubis did. She did it with her powers not with her knowledge. How else was she able to take Shifu away in that ep Maternal Instinct?
Again, Anubis was neither allowed to use his new knowledge or powers as the Ancients decreed upon him. Therefore, he would have to search for the Ancient weapons as though he didn't have the knowledge.

In Threads Oma and Anubis are locked into an eternal fight, yes, but the reason why it's an eternal fight is because they're both ascended, with equal knowledge, powers and abilities. It's a draw, but Oma has to keep Anubis occupied or he'll start wreaking havok on the lower planes again.

No, they are not both ascended. One is half ascended because the Ancients failed to deascend him because he is pretty powerful, especially with the gou'ld. His extra power allowed him to semi-resist the Ancients and therefore, he his on a similiar power level as the Ancients. His powers would have exceeded the Ancients had he ascended to their level.