S10: Critique & Contemplation

[Melora]

I disagree to me it seems like those were more her passion than military IMHO it was always what she got up for emotionally. Not that she didn't take pride in her military career because she always did but IMHO she was more passionate about her scientific work than in her military service where she wasn't always assertive unlike her scientific work where she was very assertive and will speak up for and fight for. I agree with Silver Wings I think the command of Area 51 was logical and in character for Sam and where I would like Sam to end up in my mind because I think it would be easier for Sam to be in future movies.

You all were talking about Company of Thieves earlier this was not one of my favorites I really felt bad for BB this and Bounty.

Well people see characters in different ways. You see Sam as primarily a scientist and that is fine. We are allowed to have differing opinions, after all.

I tend to see Sam as someone who has dedicated her life to both the military and science. Why does one have to be more important to her than the other? If science was her primary love, why did she stay on a front line team for so long? IMO if science is your first and only love, you devote yourself to science. You spend the majority of your time conducting experiments, coming up with hypotheses to test out, and writing papers about your findings. You do not spend the majority of your time traipsing about the galaxy carrying a P-90 and shooting at bad guys. If Sam didn't love being in the thick of the action, she could have just as easily contributed from the safety of the labs at the SGC. To me, it just doesn't make sense that science is her only real love. Why would she risk her life every day being a soldier then?

For me, the only way I can make the transfer to Area 51 make sense is the fact that Sam was trying to create a more normal personal life for herself. She needed to deal with losing her father, her fiance, and she needed to take care of Cassie. Otherwise, I don't think she would have ever left the SGC. I also think it was a temporary thing that Sam decided to do to help her get her personal life in order. I think she would've eventually missed the action of being in the field and the adventure of exploring the galaxy. If she was so happy doing science at Area 51, why did she consent to coming back to SG-1?

As for future movies, Sam would not be very involved in any plot if she were in charge of Area 51. The only time the head of Area 51 was ever part of Stargate was when Maybourne was in charge back in Season 2+3. Why would someone stationed at a remote base in Nevada have anything to do in an SG-1 movie? She would have more chance being involved in a future movie if she were put in command of a ship.
(AoT spoiler)

Spoiler:

Like Cam was in AoT.

Ohh... that's another possibility. Maybe Cam has been given command of a ship and Sam is allowed to be charge of SG-1?

[RealmOfX]

Well people see characters in different ways. You see Sam as primarily a scientist and that is fine. We are allowed to have differing opinions, after all.

I tend to see Sam as someone who has dedicated her life to both the military and science. Why does one have to be more important to her than the other? If science was her primary love, why did she stay on a front line team for so long? IMO if science is your first and only love, you devote yourself to science. You spend the majority of your time conducting experiments, coming up with hypotheses to test out, and writing papers about your findings. You do not spend the majority of your time traipsing about the galaxy carrying a P-90 and shooting at bad guys. If Sam didn't love being in the thick of the action, she could have just as easily contributed from the safety of the labs at the SGC. To me, it just doesn't make sense that science is her only real love. Why would she risk her life every day being a soldier then?

For me, the only way I can make the transfer to Area 51 make sense is the fact that Sam was trying to create a more normal personal life for herself. She needed to deal with losing her father, her fiance, and she needed to take care of Cassie. Otherwise, I don't think she would have ever left the SGC. I also think it was a temporary thing that Sam decided to do to help her get her personal life in order. I think she would've eventually missed the action of being in the field and the adventure of exploring the galaxy. If she was so happy doing science at Area 51, why did she consent to coming back to SG-1?

As for future movies, Sam would not be very involved in any plot if she were in charge of Area 51. The only time the head of Area 51 was ever part of Stargate was when Maybourne was in charge back in Season 2+3. Why would someone stationed at a remote base in Nevada have anything to do in an SG-1 movie? She would have more chance being involved in a future movie if she were put in command of a ship.
(AoT spoiler)

Spoiler:

Like Cam was in AoT.

Ohh... that's another possibility. Maybe Cam has been given command of a ship and Sam is allowed to be charge of SG-1?

Whereas for me the transfer to Area 51 still makes no sense at all and was just a lazy, not well thought out plot device to get the woman out of the way so the unqualified and inexperienced male could take over. Sexism still reigns in the 21st century

[Melora]

Whereas for me the transfer to Area 51 still makes no sense at all and was just a lazy, not well thought out plot device to get the woman out of the way so the unqualified and inexperienced male could take over. Sexism still reigns in the 21st century

Well, that too.

I have this annoying habit of trying to make sense of everything, even when something is undeniably illogical. I had trouble making sense of Sam accepting Pete's proposal too, but that doesn't mean I didn't try. Too bad I failed to convince myself in both of these cases. They still don't make any sense to me.

[AGateFan]

I agree that nothing would be worse then her going back to SG-1 unless she was put in charge of SG-1. As a non-shipper I would prefer even that stupid running off to get married excuse over being put under Cambos command again. Though even command of SG-1 would probably be a bit of a step back. Being put on a deep space exporitory ship would not be IMHO. However it would highlight more ships instead of the real star of the show (you know that stargate thing). Being made liason to the Tokra or Asgard (who are still alive of course) or some other advance alien race that choose Carter as the human they want to work with would not be as well.

Probably they will have the IOA just kick her out and give her some lame assignment. Because unlike Cam who gets to choose whatever he wants, even usurping more experienced people Carter actually did save earth and the galaxy a few times. Remeber TPTB like "dark" so the good guy cant win and fairness can't reign there is just no "drama" or "fun" in that*. Poo-wii to TPTB.

*now-a-days on the crpfest that is\was SG-1 (stargate command). I am still constantly amazed by the greatness of some of the early season eps. When Daniel was cool and Carter and Teal'c had there mojo.

[ReganX]

The press release announced Woolsey as the new leader of SGA as well as Danel being in a few episodes

Woolsey could be interesting. With Daniel, it depends on a couple of factors; will we be seeing Daniel or Jackson, and will TPTB be able to resist the temptation to turn the episodes into "Daniel and the Chocolate Factory"?

[smurf]

Whereas for me the transfer to Area 51 still makes no sense at all and was just a lazy, not well thought out plot device to get the woman out of the way so the unqualified and inexperienced male could take over. Sexism still reigns in the 21st century

I thought the move to Area 51 made perfect sense for Sam as both a scientist, and a career soldier - it was a command position after all.

It just stopped making sense as soon as she gave it up to become "co-commander" of a four man team.

[ReganX]

I thought the move to Area 51 made perfect sense for Sam as both a scientist, and a career soldier - it was a command position after all.

To me, it was too sudden, which pushed the bounds of belief past the 'benefit of the doubt' point. I can't remember Sam ever saying anything that would indicate that she would prefer to focus more on science and give up field work. On the contrary, by all indication she loved her job and it was very important to her.

Daniel had been wanting to go to Atlantis since they found it, and it made sense that Teal'c would want to help his people build their nation but had I been writing, I would have thought that Sam would be ecstatic to be able to explore, instead of concentrating primarily on defence. With the Goa'uld out of the picture, the Stargate Program would be able to focus on exploration.

If it had genuinely been a case of Cassie needing Sam, then I could buy it (the Area 51 part; inexperienced newbie being given command because the position just happens to have been vacated doesn't fit unless there is no possible way to get an experienced candidate) but the timing simply doesn't fit. Sam was away from the SGC for a matter of weeks, during which she seems to have been kept very busy, so if Cassie's problems were long-term and serious enough to merit her leaving the SGC, why did she come back? If Cassie was undergoing a short-term crisis, then taking leave would surely be a far more appropriate course of action than changing jobs and moving house - both of which are major adjustments and tend to eat into time.

[smurf]

To me it wasn't a case of deciding to give up one aspect for another, but to take the promotion when it was put to her - although I acknowledge the Cassie thing messes this up a little. Area 51 should have been a straight promotion rather than a sideways move TPTB made it seem. (And would have made more sense given her move to SGA.)

Mind you, if I had to get our new WMAH in, I'd have made Sam "Head of Research, Stargate Program". That way she could have been promoted out of position, still be sited at the SGC - except for those eps she wasn't in where she would be "reviewing things at Area 51" - and be available to join missions when necessary - in a very Jack O'Neill "I am the man, I can do whatever I want" kind of way.

Although, I'd still have trouble fanwanking the complete newbie over a sea of experienced candidates issue.

[jckfan55]

That's the problem. There is no where for her to go that would be a step up from Atlantis. That's why I think she will be kicked out of command by the IOA. I think Sam is going to do something that will make the IOA mad and they are going to replace her with Woolsey. The Air Force then should give Sam her choice of commands. Since I assume Cam is still in command of SG-1, I could see Sam wanting to command the Odyssey instead so she could play with the Asgard tech more.

See I'm hoping that if they kick her out of Atlantis command, it is clearly shown on screen to be unjust. And that she gets to do something in the field again, which she would enjoy more anyway--such as command of a ship doing some special exploratory mission. With the Cam situation they tried to pass it off as just fine.

I just had a terrible thought. What if they put her back on SG-1 under Cam's command again?

It was bad enough having that happen once. I think I would rather have Sam willingly leave Atlantis to have babies with Jack than to have her lose her command and have to go back to serving under Cam on SG-1 again.

As an anti-shipper I can't believe I'm saying this, but I agree.

I thought the move to Area 51 made perfect sense for Sam as both a scientist, and a career soldier - it was a command position after all.

It just stopped making sense as soon as she gave it up to become "co-commander" of a four man team.

Exactly. Though I do agree with ReganX (below) that it appeared out of nowhere.

To me, it was too sudden, which pushed the bounds of belief past the 'benefit of the doubt' point. I can't remember Sam ever saying anything that would indicate that she would prefer to focus more on science and give up field work. On the contrary, by all indication she loved her job and it was very important to her....

If it had genuinely been a case of Cassie needing Sam, then I could buy it (the Area 51 part; inexperienced newbie being given command because the position just happens to have been vacated doesn't fit unless there is no possible way to get an experienced candidate) but the timing simply doesn't fit. Sam was away from the SGC for a matter of weeks, during which she seems to have been kept very busy, so if Cassie's problems were long-term and serious enough to merit her leaving the SGC, why did she come back? If Cassie was undergoing a short-term crisis, then taking leave would surely be a far more appropriate course of action than changing jobs and moving house - both of which are major adjustments and tend to eat into time.

TPTB knew well in advance that AT was going to be on maternity leave so there was no excuse, imho, for the poor handling of the "where is Sam?" issue and the her coming back to play 2nd fiddle (actually more like 4th or 5th fiddle ) on a team she had just been leading. Not to mention that she'd just been head of a whole department.

[Jackie]

Instead of the "sam is in area 51" angle the show used there was a whole host of other things that could have explained her absence without robbing her command. A broken leg takes months to heal, an illness in the family, donated a kidney. Heck, she was kidnapped by aliens could have worked too.

TPTB deliberately split up SG-1 and had cambo come in on his black mustang and "put the band back together" so he would look like a bigger hewo than what they already tried to make him as.

TPTB had no intension of leaving Sam in command, she wasn't the shiny new toy and truly thought that fans would accept their "band-aid" to the made up problem.

Now, AT has gone onto greener pastures ( happy she's going on her own show) and TPTB are looking kind of foolish for all their poor people management skills.

[ReganX]

Although, I'd still have trouble fanwanking the complete newbie over a sea of experienced candidates issue.

That's because it can't be fanwanked. It's simply too illogical.

Inexperienced newbie as leader can only work in a situation where there is no alternative but to have the inexperienced newbie as a leader. This is probably most doable at the beginning of a show.

One example would be Atlantis; at the beginning of Season One, Sheppard was a major, and one with a spotty record at that. Under ordinary circumstances, he would never have been given the position of military leader of Atlantis, but given that Colonel Sumner died and they were cut off from Earth, there was no option but to place him in command. While he grew into the role, it is a job he would never have been given had the Atlantis expedition been able to contact Earth after Sumner's death. A higher-ranking officer with more command experience would almost certainly have been sent out.

Likewise, at the beginning of the Stargate Program, the program was new and there were so few people with experience that there was no alternative but to bring in newbies.

The situation at the beginning of Season Nine is not comparable to either scenario; there were plenty of experienced officers available, and the SGC had access to those officers. Since putting the inexperienced newbie in command was not absolutely, 100% unavoidable, it doesn't make sense.

[Arga]

but you forget that all the events of season 9 & 10 are only the "dreams" Cam is making in his coma, that he fell into, just after the battle over the Antartic.. none of it is true.

[Jackie]

but you forget that all the events of season 9 & 10 are only the "dreams" Cam is making in his coma, that he fell into, just after the battle over the Antartic.. none of it is true.

maybe the battle was a dream too? Perhaps Cambo is in a coma after crashing during flight school? never graduated to begin with.

He must have found one of those ancient recorders that they had in Citizen Joe in grandma's house.

[ReganX]

but you forget that all the events of season 9 & 10 are only the "dreams" Cam is making in his coma, that he fell into, just after the battle over the Antartic.. none of it is true.

I thought it was a fantasy that played out in his head as he was dying.

[Arga]

please, can anyone answer me that..:
I can't remember if they mention the Ori in any Atlantis episodes... Do you know?


(I'd do a search with "Atlantis" and "ori" as keywords, but 3 letters words are not valid for a database search here, unfortunately)