S10: Critique & Contemplation

[the dancer of spaz]

Stupidity because they don't like her character? Everyone is entitled to their opinion...

Stupidity imo is when people deliberately take critiques of actors too far, in order to make a point, get a rise out of a rival fan, or make their fave actor look better. Granted, everyone has different thresholds. For me, when posters repeatedly say things about people's age or how old they look, physical appearance - you know things that people have absolutely zero control over - it annoys me.

There was a time when some people were saying that CB looks as old as AT (I think they're about 8 years apart), and I was a little uncomfortable about so many people saying it because, even though it's an honest opinion, that's not exactly the best thing to say ad nauseum about an actress who's already forced to look five years younger than she is for marketability purposes. Both women, along with their many, many, many other colleagues, already feel that pressure on a daily basis, I'm sure. So, for me, talking about it on a public forum (whether I agree with it or other opinions, or not) is unnecessary.

But that's me.

And there's a distinct difference between mere "opinion" and statements made with malicious intent and blatant disregard. People try to muddy the issues from time to time, because perhaps it suits their views at the moment. But in the end it's all the same to me. YMMV, though.

[Crow T. Robot]

For me, when posters repeatedly say things about people's age or how old they look, physical appearance - you know things that people have absolutely zero control over - it annoys me.

Agreed. I wish they’d leave the actors out of it. Characters on the other hand IMHO are fair game.

I should be able to state for the record I honestly think Mitchell has to be the lamest and poorly introduced lead I’ve seen in years and Vala has been reduced to mental age of a 6 year old nit wit and not worry about a fan accusing me of attacking Ben and CB. But there are a lot of fans out there that can’t make the distinction between character and actor.

It’s like people stating they thought O’Neal was off and flat in the first part of Return that didn’t bother me. The fans announcing that it looked like RDA had a face lift was another story. Of course maybe they simply don’t realize what a great make-up artist can do.

[Crow T. Robot]

"stupidity" in that some people aren't always very analytical in their approach.

Very true.

That and a lot of fans don’t realize that actors have to work with what their given. Writing is the backbone of ANY show. You don’t have the writing and any show can make a B actor look great and an Emmy award winning one look terrible. The writing is the key to any show.

I don’t blame any of the actors for the lack of development. I lay the blame squarely on the writers shoulders for that. BB and CB are working with what their given.... which isn’t much. BB dealing with writers that have absolutely no idea what approach or nitch they want Mitchell to fill in the group. CB is dealing with a character that the writers are switching around to a different cliché every week. AT has to deal with and work with them making Sam dumb as a post to push the plot along, ect.

It’s none of the actors fault. I wish people would lay the blame on the writer’s shoulders where it belongs. (Though the directing and editing in recent episodes really IMHO hasn’t been spectacular either.)

[Crow T. Robot]

It seems that Daniel might get the least amount of criticism these days, but some say this was not true several years ago. Weir and Teyla seem to get a lot of criticism as well.

I think because as a whole the Daniel fan base was more unified. That’s starting to change from what I’ve seen. Vala is cracking it down the middle. There’s those Daniel fans that love her and the changes we’ve seen in Daniel the last couple of years.

And there are the older “not true Daniel” fans like me that really prefer the Daniel from seasons past. You know the Daniel that believed that violence should be always be the last alternative. That used to get upset when he had to kill someone (not joke about it like he does now days) and would prefer lugging his books to ammo around. Daniel in his earlier days was a scientist first and reluctant hero second... But a hero none the less.

BUT I’m a woman with issues and not ‘a true Daniel fan’. So I’m told.

As for the criticism of Weir, she deserves it. But this is not the tread for my reasons why.

[ReganX]

That and a lot of fans don’t realize that actors have to work with what their given. Writing is the backbone of ANY show. You don’t have the writing and any show can make a B actor look great and an Emmy award winning one look terrible. The writing is the key to any show.

True. The greatest actor in the world can only do so much with crap writing. Then again, a poor actor can make Shakespeare painful.

I don’t blame any of the actors for the lack of development. I lay the blame squarely on the writers shoulders for that. BB and CB are working with what their given.... which isn’t much. BB dealing with writers that have absolutely no idea what approach or nitch they want Mitchell to fill in the group. CB is dealing with a character that the writers are switching around to a different cliché every week. AT has to deal with and work with them making Sam dumb as a post to push the plot along, ect.

I think they knew exactly what niche they wanted Mitchell to fill in the group; that of glorious hero and undisputed leader. I don't think they ever seriously entertained the idea that it would actually bother anyone to see Sam lose command. If they had, they might have had the sense to make Mitchell an experienced full colonel.

Now that they know differently, they're caught in a trap of their own making. The background they've provided for Mitchell makes it doubtful that he would be assigned to SG-1 in the first place and canon shows that the only reason he got a place on SG-1 was because he asked for it and the only reasons he got command were because (a) Sam was conveniently absent and (b) Because for some reason Landry didn't think that it would be sensible to have one of the experienced leaders or officers from another SG team command SG-1. Next to this Sam, who has been involved with the Stargate Program longer than almost any other character, who had eight years of experience on the flagship team and one in command, looks like a far more suitable and deserving candidate.

Although it wouldn't have taken an oracle to predict that people would be angry about Sam's loss of command - I guessed as much as soon as I heard, and I had only seen a handful of episodes on DVD - this seems to have taken TPTB by surprise, but while it would have been possible to correct the situation and return Sam to command, they did not do so. It is possible that they were worried about how some of the new fans, particularly those who followed BB to the show, would react.

Their solution in Season Nine was to try to please everybody with the co-command situation, to highlight the reckless "fun" side of Mitchell, but that didn't work out. In Season Ten, the character seems to have become more serious, but the damage has been done.

They envisioned the character of Mitchell as the leader. Without that role, he has no purpose save as comic relief and plot pusher, neither of which do the character any favours.

It’s none of the actors fault. I wish people would lay the blame on the writer’s shoulders where it belongs. (Though the directing and editing in recent episodes really IMHO hasn’t been spectacular either.)

While I agree that the actors are not to blame, I don't think it's right to lay the full blame on the writers either. Overall responsibility lies with the show runner, who should have been reading the scripts with the future of the show in mind. If the scripts aren't up to scratch, it is the show runner's job to tell the writer to rework them and, if the script is unsalvageable, to have them pen a new one.

[andr3w_iii]

The only comfort i get is that in an alternate universe SG1 S9 and S10 are actually better than this crap here

Vala and Cam worse characters ever in my opinion if u like these characters good for you cause i dont

rules

[pittsburghgirl]

Very true.

It’s none of the actors fault. I wish people would lay the blame on the writer’s shoulders where it belongs. (Though the directing and editing in recent episodes really IMHO hasn’t been spectacular either.)

Oh yay! the voice of reason. I can't keep beating that poor dead horse either.

To take a James Carville quote and corrupt it. "It's the writing, stupid."

[SionnachOghma]

Living in Ireland, I'm a bit behind the times - S10 just started this week here.

Something else that only got here this week was the last ever Alias. Great show. Loved it from start to finish.

At the end, just before the credits rolled, that caption "Thanks for a great five years" appeared.

I wonder how SG-1 will end..."Thanks for a great eight years, please forgive us for the other two"? "Please allow the good memories of SG-1 to stay your hand and not hunt us down in retribution for the bad"?

[esoap524]

I have strayed once in a while into the anti-forums and cannot believe some of the stuff that people can actually voice.

the meaness of some people still really upsets me-and as old as I am, I shouldn't really be surprised. i have told my children, that there are people in this world that feel so bad about themselves that they have to make other people feel bad in order for them to feel good about themselves.

Not knowing her personally I would only hope that she would just turn off the computer and go back to her real life with her husband and her daughter and leave the delusions to those that can't see past them.

I like the way you think

[Skydiver]

I wonder how SG-1 will end..."Thanks for a great eight years, please forgive us for the other two"? "Please allow the good memories of SG-1 to stay your hand and not hunt us down in retribution for the bad"?

That'll never happen cause in coop and the boys' minds, s9 and 10 are the best the show's ever been and anyone that can't see and appreciate thier greatness is just too stupid to even have their opinion considered and obviously have issues

the arrogance of coop and his boys will not allow them to even consider that the last 2 y ears have been a craptacular waste of time. just like it wouldn't allow them to think that anyone would care that vala is a joke, cam is a marty stu of th worst order and that fans would take exception to the boy blunder being put in command while sam gets effectively demoted

cause in thier perfect little fanficesque world, they truly are emmy/oscar caliber writers and the rest of the world is just too stupid to acknowledge it

to even consider that s9 and 10 are junk they'd have to show some humility and i don't think they're capable of that.

[Skydiver]

I think they knew exactly what niche they wanted Mitchell to fill in the group; that of glorious hero and undisputed leader. I don't think they ever seriously entertained the idea that it would actually bother anyone to see Sam lose command. If they had, they might have had the sense to make Mitchell an experienced full colonel.

they did. they wanted the 'white male action hewo' and wanted to appeal to the youthful market, thus made mitch far younger than he should have been and ignored the fact that, in the military, with time comes leadership. adn with minimum time in grade/time in service, mitch can't be as young as theyu'd have liked and still be the boss that they wanted.

they tried to have their cake and eat it too in trying to portray the oxymoron of youthful leader. he can't be a rogue young maverick and an experienced leader at the same time.

thus in creating something impossible they created something unsustainable.

and then just stood back and scratched htier heads adn wondered why the intelligent viewing public took one look at the train wreck that was cam and didn't buy the line they were selling

Now that they know differently, they're caught in a trap of their own making. The background they've provided for Mitchell makes it doubtful that he would be assigned to SG-1 in the first place and canon shows that the only reason he got a place on SG-1 was because he asked for it and the only reasons he got command were because (a) Sam was conveniently absent and (b) Because for some reason Landry didn't think that it would be sensible to have one of the experienced leaders or officers from another SG team command SG-1. Next to this Sam, who has been involved with the Stargate Program longer than almost any other character, who had eight years of experience on the flagship team and one in command, looks like a far more suitable and deserving candidate.

Although it wouldn't have taken an oracle to predict that people would be angry about Sam's loss of command - I guessed as much as soon as I heard, and I had only seen a handful of episodes on DVD - this seems to have taken TPTB by surprise, but while it would have been possible to correct the situation and return Sam to command, they did not do so. It is possible that they were worried about how some of the new fans, particularly those who followed BB to the show, would react.

all it would have taken was a modicum of intelligence, and humility and wilingness to listen to anyone but themselves.

from the very first spoilers that were leaked reception to mitch was guarded. I can't think of very many that hated him on sight, most were receptive to the character as a whole, but as more and more was leaked, most especially him basically demoting sam, more and more people shoook thier head at the stupidity of it all.

TPTB do lurk and look, but they don't seem interested in reading anything but 'bestest ep evah!!!!!!!!' and anything else that panders to thier egos. they don't want real and constructive crit. all they want is ego boos. and anyone that won't pump up thier egos is summarily dismissed and ignored and writtten off as being stupid.

their arrogance is their downfall. they are so full of themselves and thier own greatness that they can't and won't even try to pay attention to anything else..

Their solution in Season Nine was to try to please everybody with the co-command situation, to highlight the reckless "fun" side of Mitchell, but that didn't work out. In Season Ten, the character seems to have become more serious, but the damage has been done.

They envisioned the character of Mitchell as the leader. Without that role, he has no purpose save as comic relief and plot pusher, neither of which do the character any favours.



While I agree that the actors are not to blame, I don't think it's right to lay the full blame on the writers either. Overall responsibility lies with the show runner, who should have been reading the scripts with the future of the show in mind. If the scripts aren't up to scratch, it is the show runner's job to tell the writer to rework them and, if the script is unsalvageable, to have them pen a new one.

seasn 10 is nothing more than frantic damange control. someone tied them down and forced them to realize that they screwed up on a massive level with cam and vala and the stupidity that was s9.

but it was too little too late and teh damage is done. they killed the show, not only with their incompetance but thier arrogance. and the worst thing about it is that they're just gonna move onto atlantis and kill it off. they won't be out of their jobs. it's the actors - the very people the writers and coop have been ignoring - who will pay the price of being out of work while the little boys club of arrogance will just move on, pandering to their own egos and hiding from any real crit as they delude themselves with excuse after excuse to hide the fact that they're not as good as they wish they were

[AGateFan]

I was flipping channels.... I saw Stargate SG-1 and got excited.... I looked at the ep name "The powers that be"..... I moved on to the next channel... maybe I will just play some video games.

[Skydiver]

Oh yay! the voice of reason. I can't keep beating that poor dead horse either.

To take a James Carville quote and corrupt it. "It's the writing, stupid."

a good actor can take a crappy story and make it decent
a bad actor can take a crappy story and it's still crappy
a good actor can take a good story and make it gold
a bad actor can take a good story and make it crap

stargate has a lot of good actors. and if the writers and directors and producers (which happen to be teh same group of people by the way.;...something that i think is sg1's biggest downfall, the decreasing creative pool) were half as good as some of the actors, we'd still have decent tv to watch

but the best acting in the world can't redeem crap

[Mandysg1]

I was flipping channels.... I saw Stargate SG-1 and got excited.... I looked at the ep name "The powers that be"..... I moved on to the next channel... maybe I will just play some video games.

Same here, I haven't watched any of the newer syndicated shows either( read S9). I put it on and feel the need to switch channels. I believe I saw that the syndicated ratings are also down...tells ya something doesn't it

[AGateFan]

Same here, I haven't watched any of the newer syndicated shows either( read S9). I put it on and feel the need to switch channels. I believe I saw that the syndicated ratings are also down...tells ya something doesn't it

Tells me not a lot of people want to watch crp. Oh wait, I already knew that. Can someone find where TPTB put their memo because they obviously didnt read it.