Sam Carter/Jack O'Neill Ship Appreciation Thread

[dexterav]

Where have I said I'm not a shipper? I am a shipper.

My point is, if the anti-shippers are no longer waging war and a kiss is seen as safe... they must feel they've won.

And in some ways they have. Look at the lack of ship these days.

About your shippy , honey, i know, sorry (i am little angry)

Yes about talking, kiss is nice, but any little shippy moment, this is a worse again "no kiss"
Yes "Not,Exactly", or timing in 9.06, but i am a not hm, fool (thinking ), this
moments saying a more things mainly "Not , exactly"
9.06 says 2. things only, this is a random (accident) 95%
or Sam timing this with Jack (foolish idea, miracle) 5%

[nell]

**REPOST**REPOST**REPOST**
I am reposting this for any new Shippers and a refresher for us all about
The Real Sam and Jack Ship Post-Threads episode!!!

From Anunnaki post on Sept 9, 2005

Sam & Jack (post THREADS): What's Not To Get?

I was kindly asked to edit this post to make it a 'protected thread' ... not sure how, but hope this works!



A friend of mine asked if I would post this (very old) rant I had back in June on the samandjack listserver. It's a shipper rant regarding fan reactions to the season eight episode of "THREADS". So if you cannot stomach the thought of Sam and Jack in a romantic relationship, please read no further.

At best, you'd end up smoking through your ears, and at worst, you might end up skulking in my back yard with a bag of rotton vegetables or an effigee with my name on it and a cushion filled with sticking-pins ... <gulp> ... either way, I implore you, PLEASE, turn back now.

Cheers.

All right then. Here it is. My little temper-tantrum. With respect to fan speculation after the airing of "Threads".

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From June 2005
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Apologies for what may constitute the great deal of poor grammar and spelling I'm about to inflict on you all. I'm venting. But I mean no disrespect to anyone whose personal opinions may be trod upon during the course of this post.

SPOILER SPACE (Threads/Season Nine)
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So the obvious problem with season nine ('shipper-wise') is that there isn't going to be any on-camera nookie between Sam Carter andJack O'Neill.

Quick, stop the presses!

But before we do that, can someone please explain to me where the great mystery is? I don't get it. Truly, I don't. There's so much hand-wringing over the potential 'non-future' of Sam and Jack, romantically, I'm just about ready to switch off my PC and check my glasses (well, I would if I wore glasses), because I don't think I've been watching the same "Stargate SG-1" series that some of you have. (I suppose that's possible, I do live in Canada, and the satellite reception in my igloo just isn't what it used to be since my polar bear died and fell over onto my... well, never mind).

Seriously... Sam and Jack.

I don't see where there's room for doubt. Yet there's a unified (and horrified) gasp building slowly in the corners of 'shipperdom' over the possible notion that Carter might end up either a) romantically involved with someone else--cue "Love Interest X", or, b) become completely estranged from her feelings because of Jack's absence this year. Hence the terror in trembling fingers hovering over keyboards all over the globe.

Therefore I must ask: What part Sam's character-arcduring "Threads" was vague?

Let's break this down.

I think everyone's essentially resigned themselves to the concept that regardless of the way canon plays out this year, there's not going to be a torrid on-screen love-affair between Sam and Jack, but the reason for that has more to do with cast than it does with character. We're aware that Rick's physically not going to be there; hence Jack won't be around to 'play' with. On screen, at least.

He's not dead. He's just... elsewhere. That doesn't mean that Sam is simply going to 'move on' from the emotional epiphany she had in "Threads". If you didn't happen to notice that she had anemotional epiphany in "Threads", then please forgive me forwondering ... what show were you watching?

Sam and Jack went through eight years of character development to get to the point they ended up in with "Threads". To me it's been absolutely obvious from the moment that episode wrapped. Sam and Jack had finally, unequivocally, decided to explore a romantic relationship together. It won't be on-camera. It can't be. And it won't be obvious or plot-centric to the season nine narrative. I think most people who consider themselves 'shippers' can live with the fact that it'll have to be hinted at and alluded to betweenr ousing strains of "Pharoah Pharoah let my Jaffa Go!" and "Kiss me Claudia!", but it'll still be there if you're hoping to see it. Just open those beautiful eyes and watch.

It would be disrespectful to both the O'Neill and the Carter character-arcs (especially the Sam Carter arc) if they did anything else with her (romantically) at this point. They built and built along those lines (for eight years), then culminated with "Threads", and all of a sudden--what? Dropped the ball? No way.

If there was nothing further to Sam and Jack; if their feelings towards one another and their 'relationship' was to be terminated with the end of season eight, then the dialogue and scenes which took place during "Threads" would not have been written into canon. That episode would not have taken place in the manner in which it did. The whole idea behind "Threads" was to clear a path for the big changes coming up in season nine (providing season nine was approved). It was to 'tie up' (threads?!) eight years of 'loose ends' (threads?!), in such a way as to leave those storylines either completed or at a crossroad to a new beginning.

Sam and Jack love one another. That's never been in question. We know it. The writers, the producers, everyone involved in the creative on the show will admit to that. It's been stated unequivocably. And "Threads" was a tribute to those pent-up emotions for the two of them.

They scripted whole scenes around that single premise. They wrote in Carter's ambivalence and apprehension surrounding her fiancé. Her uneasiness and embarrassment with him was palpable during the scene where he meets Jacob for the first time. That wasn't adlib, that was directed.

Sam shows up at Jack's house because she's terrified she's making a mistake and she wants to tell him (once and for all) how she feels.

Kerry then proceeds to break up with Jack over his feelings for Sam. Seeing as how that might be too vague, she goes on to mention that she thinks it's obvious how he feels about Sam and that she thinks it's a big mistake if "rules and regulations" are the only thing keeping he and Carter apart.

We may not be convinced yet. So let's go on...

In preceding scene, Jacob said the exact same words to Sam that Kerry would later use.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob
Jacob: "Don't let rules stand in your way."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kerry
Kerry: "Is the Airforce the only reason the two of you aren't together? Rules and regulations?"
Coincidences like that happen in real-life, they don't happen in scripts. There's a sledgehammer here. It's big. Huge. Colossal. But just in case there might still be any room whatsoever for doubt, they added even more.

Sam breaks up with Pete.

Again, the might be too vague, so again, he uses the exact same phrasing that Jacob used in a previous scene
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacob
Jacob: "You can still have everything that you want."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete
Pete: "Ihope you get what you want..."
Gee. I wonder what that means?

Hmm...

OW! Hey, that hammer really hurts!

But wait. There's more! No. Really.

Carter's been refusing O'Neill's invitations to his cabin for eight long years. The reason for that is so long-lived and obvious, it's moot. But suddenly (in the end of "Threads") she accepts! (Wow, neat episode, huh?).

Let's step back for a minute and pretend we're not fans of Stargate. Let's pretend we actually wrote the episode "Threads". Why did we (the writers of "Threads") write all that Sam Carter / Jack O'Neill sub-plot in? It didn't have much to do with the "Free Jaffa" plot, or Anubis' "Grand Design". What was the point? We'd have to be first-class dopes if we scripted all that into a 90-Minute special length presentation, just because we were planning on turning Sam Carter back into the alien love-interest of the week. Or (oh, say...) bringing Narim or even Orlin back so that Sam might fall madly in love with either of them.

Eight years of UST. That's what "Threads" was about for the Sam and Jack subplot. We never saw so much of their 'relationship' discussed in canon as we did during that single episode. At no point were we ever given to understand that they intended to go their separate ways thereafter. Quite the contrary, given the "fishing moment" we saw in the end.

Why not? If they're not going to explore being together in an 'off-camera' world as season nine progresses, why not end "Threads" with, say, a tearful, yet beautiful marriage for Carter to her much loved, erstwhile fiancé? <ducking> What difference would it make to season nine's "action-rock-em-sock-em" canon if Sam was married to Pete? Not much. But if certainly would make a difference to Sam's character arc. And the fact that she's been in love with Jack for half a decade at least. The writers/producers knew that, and wanted to be respctful to her character. Hence the plot we actually saw.

And at the end of it all (or the beginning, as the case may be!) why would "Threads" open with an entire montage (half of which was dedicated to Sam/Jack moments throughout the years) intermingled with several poignant scenes where we see her restless and uncomfortable about her upcoming 'marriage'? Could that be a strange coincidence as well?

Hmm...

OW!! Again with the hammer! Stop that!

Does Carter have to crawl out of a pentagon supply closet, with tousled hair and an "I JUST DID JACK" t-shirt on for the message to be clearer? (Okay, yes, I'd like to see that t-shirt, too... but that's hardly the point).

What is there not to get? I'm asking here, I really, truly am. Of course, as irreverent as parts of this post were, I harbor no enmity towards anyone who really does believe the 'shipper' group is SOL. I'm just astounded, quite frankly.

I'll crawl back into my igloo now. We're making blue-raspberry kitchen-tiles out of Jello mix ... can't miss that.

.A. (I left out the 'always' scene on purpose)

Last edited by Anunnaki : September 9th, 2005 at 11:14 PM. Reason: I was kindly asked to make this a 'protected thread' ... not sure how, but hope this works!


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Anunnaki replies Sept 9, 2005

Re: Sam & Jack (post THREADS): What's Not To Get?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ali888
Is this a protected thread, or can non-Jack/Sam shippers give their side of things?

I'd love to say the more the merrier, myself. But I think the purpose of this thread would quickly end up obscurred by a battle over the fundamental (and age-old) disagreement between shippers and non shippers.

That's one of the reasons I suggested non shippers might wish to skip this thread entirely. Because it isn't about the fundamental argument of whether Sam and Jack love one another (I've put that forth as a given); it's about which moments during THREADS can effectively (and correctly) be interpereted by shippers as canon acknowledgement of a pending exploratory relationship for Sam and Jack (after the episode completed).

I'm certain there are a lot of very logical points of view vis-a-vis the "non-shipper" sect regarding how to alternately interperet the episodic canon of "Threads", but I don't think this thread is a great place for those points.

If you're a shipper, and you disagree with me, then by all means, I'm happy to discuss that. But if you're not a shipper--you'd fundamentally disagree with me, and that I'm not very keen on 'having out', so to speak. I know where it would end up, so I'd rather skip the pre-amble and agree to disagree in advance.

Really. I'm scared of the flame war. Scared like a little girl on Neetu...

.A.

[Tracy Jane]

Nell. Thanks for reposting that. I'm now waiting for the "I Just Did Jack" T-shirts to be added to the cafePress Shipper Shop!!

[dexterav]

**REPOST**REPOST**REPOST**
I am reposting this for any new Shippers and a refresher for us all about
The Real Sam and Jack Ship Post-Threads episode!!!

Nice! But a don't know new shipper. IMO all shipers S&J is old fans SG1 (1.-8.season)
People seeing 9. season and a haven't seen older episode has will not be shipper (not Jack, not shippy moment) is sadly, but true

oh, yes S&J is CANON, no after THREADS,no after Solitudes, after 1. episode SG1

[Lys]

Actually, I disagree to a certain extent. I mean, there are moments that the anti shippers would construe as overty shippy, such as not exactly.

I was musing the other day, however.

Once upon a time in the Kingdom of Gateworld, two opposing factions battle for supremacy. One was called Ship Ship Hooray and the other the Anti Ship. The great Ship Captains in the Sky (Lords Mallozzi, Cooper and Wright) gave us enough blessings to stop mental breakdown, and the war continued.

After seven years of war, a new Suburb of Gatonia emerged, named Atlantis. The Gods on high turned their attention to this new suburb, concentrating the ship, and drawing the Anti Ship away from the heart of the Kingdom.

What's all this rambling about? Well... there was a time when the Ship/Anti ship wars were all consuming and the most controversial topic around. Now that the conversation has turned to Atlantis ship and kirking, Jack/Sam ship is seen as a positively neutral topic.

To quote Lys, when discussing my new sig...
"Noone can complain about the Grace Kiss"

Sad, isn't it?

He ! Tracy ! please don't ruin my reputation ! Noone can complain about the Grace kiss, true, because it's canon.
Don't give false hopes to Oma please. Non shipper I am, non shipper I stay. That doesn't mean I have anything against you guys.

[Zoser]

Yep, blame it on Moebius. My Sam and Jack died in ancient Egypt.

That's how I felt the first time I saw Moebius and I felt like a fool cause it made me cry.

[Tracy Jane]

That's how I felt the first time I saw Moebius and I felt like a fool cause it made me cry.

That really upset me, at first, because Sam and Jack had just got together, then wham, bam, thank you Sam! All gone in a puff of smoke.

Having said that, though, you have to remember that they still went fishing at the end of Moebius, so we can still assume.

As for Orlin and intimicy.... surely Moebius is their get out clause.... "How o you know Sam and Orlin didn't sleep together. "Watch Ascenscion." "Watch Moebius."

[dexterav]

Yes golden Threads and Moebius2 (but timetraveling not for me, for many errors )
Another CANON is Jack & Sam fishing = TOGETHER (first date of fishing is, hm Nemesis, and very close to Sam say YES )
Remember in T. and M2 Jack & Sam fishing , is TOGETHER

p.s.
this day is very nice for me, in this Topic
i am writing like a Jack writing professions of love for Sam

[Zoser]

Is anyone else like me? It seems that the longer season 9 goes on the MORE I miss Jack (RDA). By the time season 10 rolls around they will be taking me away in a straight jacket.

When I manage to keep my eyes open I'll see a scene and think 'Where's Jack?' or 'What would Jack do?'
What the heck is Jack doing????
In this latest episode 4th Horseman, Part Deux Jack

Spoiler:

would have made more sense than Hammond coming to the base or at least mention of Jack in that scene

[nell]

When I manage to keep my eyes open I'll see a scene and think 'Where's Jack?' or 'What would Jack do?'
What the heck is Jack doing????
In this latest episode 4th Horseman, Part Deux Jack

Spoiler:

would have made more sense than Hammond coming to the base or at least mention of Jack in that scene

You are absolutely, positively and EXACTLY CORRECT!!!!

[dexterav]

Forgot Jack
Greeting from TPTB

am i speaking about little naquadah bomb?

[Tracy Jane]

Yeah, but.... you can't go running to Jack every time. Unfortunately. Plus, RDA's not coming back in the forseeable future. What can ya do? He has limited guest appearances.

[dexterav]

Yeah, but.... you can't go running to Jack every time. Unfortunately. Plus, RDA's not coming back in the forseeable future. What can ya do? He has limited guest appearances.

Indeed!
Such a nice day it was
IMO little (5x5x5cm) naquadah bomb is inadequate, 5x5x5m bomb is nice for me

p.s.
my time is shorten (2h )

[dmovies]

THAT'S where jack is then!?!



sally super duper misses -->

I agree with you. No mention of Jack but Hammond comes in person. I like Hammond and it was good to see him again, but the complete lack of Jack mention is deplorable. IMO the casting of BB in the lead, and make no mistake, he is the lead, was a terrible job of casting. He looks great, but that's it. Bad choice, followed by another bad choice, etc. I don't know if I can continue watching this show. It's kinda like rubberneckers on the freeway when there's been an accident, so don't want to look but somehow you just do.

[SqueeG-1]

Where I am they're just showing the start of Season 9 now. I take it there's no hope in the immediate future? Grrrrrrrrr. Thank goodness for fanfic!