Sam Carter /Jack O'Neill Ship Appreciation Thread 2.0

[SOtogether]

^ Can't get enough of those pictures! Love seeing them together like this

[SamJackShipper93]

You know what makes my heart happy? The fact that Amanda finally looks like Sam again.

[SOtogether]

As for actors not buying into the Ship. . .

I really don't pay much attention to anything that RDA says. I think that he's sort of bitter about the whole thing - feeling a little typecast and thrown out. I just get the feeling that he's a little "over" the whole SG-1 thing, although he can't afford to be because it's his bread and butter, and he resents it.

It's clear from cons, though, that he doesn't remember the show. I doubt he even watches it - ever. And where we as Shippers (rabid ones, in my case) watch the show over and over and over and internalize each and every moment, he was gathering up his paychecks and moving on. The other actors had a little more personal stuff invested, and I know that they used to get together and watch the show as friends (I don't have a reference for that - I read it somewhere here on GW once), but again, this was their job. They were probably always looking for things to make the job more exciting and new characters/love interests that weren't allowed by the AF/character arcs would have been mother's milk to them.

So many great points of view here. I agree with basically everything you said, though honestly, didn't even realize I think so before you said it. That's a big green for you!

[Akamaimom]

So many great points of view here. I agree with basically everything you said, though honestly, didn't even realize I think so before you said it. That's a big green for you!

Thank you!

[Akamaimom]

You know what makes my heart happy? The fact that Amanda finally looks like Sam again.

[video=youtube;1Dgfw-8w1NM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Dgfw-8w1NM[/]

She is so goofily adorable. Holy Hannah!

[hedwig]

As for actors not buying into the Ship. . .

I really don't pay much attention to anything that RDA says. I think that he's sort of bitter about the whole thing - feeling a little typecast and thrown out. I just get the feeling that he's a little "over" the whole SG-1 thing, although he can't afford to be because it's his bread and butter, and he resents it.

It's clear from cons, though, that he doesn't remember the show. I doubt he even watches it - ever. And where we as Shippers (rabid ones, in my case) watch the show over and over and over and internalize each and every moment, he was gathering up his paychecks and moving on.

I think this is the first time I may disagree with you.

I don't think RDA feels that way at all. He never really had to do SG1 for the money, given how much he made on MacGyver. He's worth about $30,000,000, as opposed to about $5,000,000 for each of the other three. He was never doing it for the money. He was quoted at one time as saying (around season 8 when he deciding whether to return to the show for 9 and 10) that he had more than enough money and didn't need more, even though it's always nice to get more. They all get residuals (or whatever it's called) for reruns.

From everything I've read about him, he's the kind of guy that just shrugs and moves on if there's a dispute of any kind (like with Robert Cooper). I really don't feel like he'd hesitate too much to say exactly how he feels if he felt so moved for some reason.

My impression comes from reading through many of the interviews on his website, and I could be totally wrong. But I just don't see him as being a bitter guy.

Add on:
On thinking about this while watching the season opener of Scorpion is that in the early years, RDA spent his socializing time with the rest of the team during weekdays. In the first few years, he likely spent the majority of his off time keeping track of his pregnant girlfriend, and then after Wylie was born, he spent the majority of time thinking about her. Apryl may have spent some time in Vancouver, so RDA would go right home and grab the baby and spoil her rotten. He said in an interview that after a workday, he'd go right home and say "gimme that baby" the minute he set foot through the door.

Also, he is 15 years older than a couple of team members (Amanda and CJ) and likely thought of them as "the kids" - just as he referred to them as "kids" in various episodes.

[Akamaimom]

I think this is the first time I may disagree with you.

I don't think RDA feels that way at all. He never really had to do SG1 for the money, given how much he made on MacGyver. He's worth about $30,000,000, as opposed to about $5,000,000 for each of the other three. He was never doing it for the money. He was quoted at one time as saying (around season 8 when he deciding whether to return to the show for 9 and 10) that he had more than enough money and didn't need more, even though it's always nice to get more. They all get residuals (or whatever it's called) for reruns.

From everything I've read about him, he's the kind of guy that just shrugs and moves on if there's a dispute of any kind (like with Robert Cooper). I really don't feel like he'd hesitate too much to say exactly how he feels if he felt so moved for some reason.

My impression comes from reading through many of the interviews on his website, and I could be totally wrong. But I just don't see him as being a bitter guy.

We are totally allowed to disagree. We can still be besties.

I just don't see him as having been invested as much as the others were. Dunno. I'm probably totally wrong on this. At cons, the other actors seem to have been paying attention, and when I met Michael Shanks, he answered detailed questions and knew episode titles (some from Season 2). I've never seen RDA talk about specifics at a Con, or even know which episode was which. He always seems confuddled about the story arcs and the intricacies of things. As a person, I think he's awesome (he's done a lot of great things). And I truly believe that he's an underrated actor. He's capable of SO much more than he was offered. He's just the one that I kind of cringe when I listen to, because he doesn't recall basic stuff--or he doesn't let on that he remembers. I'd LOVE to be totally wrong about my opinion, and I'll happily rethink this at any point. Because, he's totally freaking adorable and I want to like him more.

But yeah--we are completely okay with disagreeing.

[SaraBahama]

There were SO many things that I didn't get about the symbiote thing. Size was just one - maybe there were different races of symbiote and they varied in size and shape and violence?

My biggest problem with the Goa'uld was actually introduced in this episode. They remove the Goa'uld, but the host retains the Goa'uld personality. In the episode with Skaa'ra, the Tokra remove the symbiote and he's returned to normal. Why woud the Goa'uld voluntarily remove itself completely if it could hang around and still have control over the host? That makes no sense. Additionally, Selmak was dying, which meant that Jacob chose to die with him. All of his memories and personality could have been saved in Jacob and they could have removed the symbiote like they did in this episode, right? And yes, there was a "toxins" talk with Sam, but it still made no sense to me at all.

Rules for convenience's sake, IMO.

There is SO much in the early seasons that is just inconsistent because they are figuring out how this (fictional) world works. I can't help but mentally minimize (or completely ignore) this whole Kawalski symbiote thing (or ret-con it so that it fits with later rules -we all know goa'uld's lie). My head canon goes: Kawalski is goa'ulded, *ignores problematic surgery scene + recovery*, goa'uld and Kawalski die in horrible gate incident. I know that's awfully simplistic, but I can't reconcile this episode with the way the world works later on when it comes to implantation and co-existence, as well as removal of a symbiote.

If we were going to go back and do a Director's cut of the show, THESE are the things I would fix, not the briefing room scene!

<big snip>
12. I really liked Kawalsky and wish that he’d been around longer. I love that this episode fleshes out that Jack and Kawalsky actually are friends, and in “Gamekeeper” we find out that they’ve actually known each other for a long time, which is why I hate that Kawalsky says that he never knew Jack had a son (a son who, for all we know, could have been named after Charles Kawalsky). I’m certainly glad they were able to bring him back for several other episodes. Personally I wish that we’d seen Kawalsky interact more with Sam (you know, when he’s not throwing her around the elevator), since it would have been nice to be able to compare their interactions with the Kawalsky and Dr. Carter who come through in “Point of View.”

Another start-up problem: The only way I can imagine he didn't know Jack had a son (assuming the backstory they created in "Gamekeeper" is real), is if Jack simply didn't talk about home life very much, and if Kawalsky only served periodically with Jack.

The main way I choose to deal with it is another head canon mental edit. I simply ignore the statement that Kawalski didn't know Jack had a son.

As for actors not buying into the Ship. . .

I really don't pay much attention to anything that RDA says. <snippy snip>
My point is this:

The show happened as it happened on screen.

The Powers That Be, whether they supported Jack/Sam shipping personally, ALLOWED EPISODES AND MOMENTS THAT CLEARLY SHOWED OR ALLUDED TO SHIP.

Regardless of how the actors felt about it, what happened on screen is canon.

Now, certainly, the actors have a right to feel how they felt about things, but that's not going to quell how I feel about watching it. The end of "The Other Side" is a classic example. Amanda Tapping has stated that her look was meant to say that she was disappointed in Jack for having judged and sentenced Alar's people. She thought that they didn't have the right to do what they did, and that it was wrong. I've never seen that look in that way. I've always thought that there was communication between Jack and Sam on a different level. (as evidenced in Tilting at Windmills). Sure - Amanda Tapping and Richard Dean Anderson are entitled to their opinions, but that doesn't mean that I have to nullify the way that the show has always come across in my brain because of it.

I'm not going to put RDA down for his statements (SamJackShipper93 has the excellent post on the actor's perspective), and his desire to not portray something that would be at odds with the Air Force. But the character and plot are not entirely up to him. Aka says it well: TPTB allowed episodes to air that showed or alluded to the ship. This, and other things that were shown post-Threads, allows me to construct my own idea of how their relationship progressed. I don't need support from RDA, and his lack thereof doesn't shake my mental image of Jack, Sam, or S/J.

Just some thoughts regarding acting that have been on my mind for a while and especially with Rick’s comments. It’s generally off-topic – feel free to skip the whole post – but I do think it’s an interesting discussion to have. I don’t mean any of this as a slight to fans at all, but we need to remember that there are real people on the other side of the characters that we love so much.

As a (sometimes) actress myself, I’d like to say that it’s important to remember that acting is just a job. Being an actor is a career just like being an accountant or a plumber or a teacher. In whatever job you have, any talented, ambitious person has a desire to continue to grow and get newer, better opportunities.

Spoiler:

Actors certainly enjoy their work and their characters, but it can be very tiresome when you’re only remembered for a character you played ten, twenty, or thirty years ago (and in Rick’s case, he’s got both Jack and MacGyver that define him). This isn’t as big of a problem for actors in theater, since most of the time, nobody can rewatch a production after the show’s closed, but television is strange because twenty, thirty, forty years, people can still watch the same TV show. Fans fall in love with the show, the characters, and the actors that are playing those characters, but in the meantime, the actors have already moved on to other projects. Take Star Trek, for example, most of the actors on the original series and TNG will forever be immortalized as those characters, even though they did many other things later.

Moving on isn’t a betrayal of a show or the character or the fans, and it isn’t an indication that they didn’t enjoy being on the show. Many actors do a lot of grieving when they’re done playing characters, but if you didn’t grieve and move on, there won’t be any other opportunities. Amanda has said that at first it was very difficult to throw off Sam’s mannerisms when she started playing Helen Magnus because she was so entrenched in Sam’s character, but Sanctuary gave her incredible opportunities as an actress, a director, a producer, and as a founder of SanctuaryForKids, and I love that she’s become known for that role as well.

Die-hard fans of TV shows love it when their favorite actors cater to what the fandom wants. But ultimately, actors aren’t required to be die-hard fans of the shows that they’re on, especially after they’ve been off the air for a long time. I doubt that Rick ever watched Seasons 9/10, and he’s not nearly as in tune with the fans as Amanda is. I think she’s truly very supportive and appreciative of sci-fi fans and is usually very gracious to all of them, and she also knows that post Stargate, Jack and Sam’s relationship is still exceptionally important to a great number of fans, and she’s been more supportive of the Ship because of that.

All that's to hopefully say, actors have a unique and intimate perspective on their characters, but what they say is not necessarily gospel. Jack and Sam's relationship was present throughout SG-1, but it never was the main goal of the series, so people had/have different opinions of exactly how much they mean to each other. Rick and Amanda may not agree on what happened to Jack and Sam, but they still play to the fans sometimes because they know what we like to see.

When Rick and Amanda are together on stage, they often give us moments like this that send the crowd into hysteric whoops and hollers, and it’s not because the crowd thinks that Jack and Sam are mutual friends…
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo330/SamJackShipper93/Stargate%20Behind-the-Scenes/0d714785-ef70-4f0a-814a-56561e6a480c_zpskupnmthz.jpg

And this one’s from a con as well…
http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo330/SamJackShipper93/Stargate%20Behind-the-Scenes/RDAATComicConPromo.jpg

To anyone who gets uncomfortable when actors say things that don’t match your interpretation (let’s be real, Rick’s comments certainly don’t match canon either!): Don’t let whatever an actor says diminish your love for a show. Odds are, you’ve analyzed more than they ever did or have. Love the actors and their work, but also appreciate the people in the fandom, who are still here loving and discussing the show a decade later. Enjoy the story and show your love for it in your own way.

You are loved and welcomed here. *huggles*

Thank you. This was perfect.

And no, I've never - not once - been able to see Jack and Daniel as a couple. There's neither the history nor the canon for it. If other people want to see it, or do see it, then bully for them - I just don't see it that way. And that's okay - because everyone gets from a show what they're going to (if that makes any sense). Taking the show solely from what's shown on screen would be a form of Stargate Deconstruction, I guess (for all my literary analysis friends out there. . .), but that's my take on it.

I'm not going to pick on slashers --whatever floats your boat. I just don't see it in this way. I see a wonderful brotherly relationship developing between them, rich with the family tensions that anyone who is a sibling can comprehend. I love this friendship, and I think not having a similar friendship between Sam and Cam was probably a lost opportunity.

You know what makes my heart happy? The fact that Amanda finally looks like Sam again.

[video=youtube;1Dgfw-8w1NM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Dgfw-8w1NM

Aww...that's adorkable!! I love her!

[SaraBahama]

All right, campers, we're rolling right along! It's time for the very best episode Stargate ever made! I'm sure you'll all agree!

#sarcasm

Episode of the Week
Emancipation

But sass and hashtags aside, we still need to give "Emancipation" it's due! Many thanks to those who are participating!

[RadicalDreamer]

I just needed to say I feel super shameful for feeling this angry over what RDA said. But I really can't help it. He spoke like so many anti and slash fans speak and it rubbed me the wrong way. As if he was simply validating the stuff some fans said, stuff that ruined fandom for me in the past.
I may be too sensitive and unstable to handle fandom, seriously. And like I predicted, I could't sleep at all this night because I kept thinking about it and feeling cheated. I will always love the ship no matter what, but I deeply wish I never watched the show and got so pathologically attached to an unresolved, unevenly written and so frequently bashed fictional pairing because of another much more beloved ship in the fandom and creative team.
As a result, I think it's best for me to leave Stargate and the fandom before it destroys my health and life completely. It saved me back in the days, but now, it turned into unwanted suffering. I'm currently mentally and physically ill with severe anxiety and sleep problems and dealing with fandom makes it worse. I'm so sorry if I came across as unpleasant. I wish all this stuff didn't affect me like this. Because fandom and escapism is supposed to be fun and lighthearted but sometimes, it only reminds me how miserable my life is. And I'm ruining the thread with my feelings so I need to say goodbye now and move on so I can take care of my health. I will probably still lurk a bit and read some good interesting thoughts about the ship from you in the future... but right now, I need a total break from anything SG related. Take care, fellow shippers !

[SOtogether]

You know what makes my heart happy? The fact that Amanda finally looks like Sam again.

[youtube;1Dgfw-8w1NM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Dgfw-8w1NM

Love this! Amanda does look amazing well

[SOtogether]

I just needed to say I feel super shameful for feeling this angry over what RDA said. But I really can't help it. He spoke like so many anti and slash fans speak and it rubbed me the wrong way. As if he was simply validating the stuff some fans said, stuff that ruined fandom for me in the past.
I may be too sensitive and unstable to handle fandom, seriously. And like I predicted, I could't sleep at all this night because I kept thinking about it and feeling cheated. I will always love the ship no matter what, but I deeply wish I never watched the show and got so pathologically attached to an unresolved, unevenly written and so frequently bashed fictional pairing because of another much more beloved ship in the fandom and creative team.
As a result, I think it's best for me to leave Stargate and the fandom before it destroys my health and life completely. It saved me back in the days, but now, it turned into unwanted suffering. I'm currently mentally and physically ill with severe anxiety and sleep problems and dealing with fandom makes it worse. I'm so sorry if I came across as unpleasant. I wish all this stuff didn't affect me like this. Because fandom and escapism is supposed to be fun and lighthearted but sometimes, it only reminds me how miserable my life is. And I'm ruining the thread with my feelings so I need to say goodbye now and move on so I can take care of my health. I will probably still lurk a bit and read some good interesting thoughts about the ship from you in the future... but right now, I need a total break from anything SG related. Take care, fellow shippers !

I hope you get well soon. Come back to us when you're ready. We will be here

[Nerwen]

I also wish you all the best.

but I deeply wish I never watched the show and got so pathologically attached to an unresolved, unevenly written and so frequently bashed fictional pairing because of another much more beloved ship in the fandom and creative team.

Honestly I think we are not that much badly off, first Sam and Jack is the main pairing, TPTB decided to highlight Sam and Jack (after all we got eps like Divide and conquer and Threads, among others) and Jack and Daniel is just a bit of fooling around by the actors and partly by TPTB, rethinking it, it´s more a fun thing for them to do (the gay subtext) than anything else.

Things could have been much more worse, Sam could have married Pete (she could even have his baby if they would have decided to include the pregnancy ), Jack could have stayed with Kerry or he could have a picture of Daniel in his personal belongings but no, Sam had one of Jacks in hers, they could have decided to ship Sam with someone else...

And regarding the fandom, I googled a bit and hardly found some threads or forums that discuss the Daniel and Jack gay relationship, regarding Jack and Sam you find much more, so I would say the general fandom prefers Jack and Sam, so I wouldn´t say J/D is seriously beloved at least not by the creative team, otherwise there wouldn´t be jack/sam in the first place and the fact that the third movie had a romantic scene between Jack and Sam (according to Brad Wright) and the confirmation of their relationship (according to Mallozzi), not to forget the delated Trio scene.

So what does the Daniel/Jack slashers have in comparison? Not much!

[SamJackShipper93]

I just needed to say I feel super shameful for feeling this angry over what RDA said. But I really can't help it. He spoke like so many anti and slash fans speak and it rubbed me the wrong way. As if he was simply validating the stuff some fans said, stuff that ruined fandom for me in the past.
I may be too sensitive and unstable to handle fandom, seriously. And like I predicted, I could't sleep at all this night because I kept thinking about it and feeling cheated. I will always love the ship no matter what, but I deeply wish I never watched the show and got so pathologically attached to an unresolved, unevenly written and so frequently bashed fictional pairing because of another much more beloved ship in the fandom and creative team.
As a result, I think it's best for me to leave Stargate and the fandom before it destroys my health and life completely. It saved me back in the days, but now, it turned into unwanted suffering. I'm currently mentally and physically ill with severe anxiety and sleep problems and dealing with fandom makes it worse. I'm so sorry if I came across as unpleasant. I wish all this stuff didn't affect me like this. Because fandom and escapism is supposed to be fun and lighthearted but sometimes, it only reminds me how miserable my life is. And I'm ruining the thread with my feelings so I need to say goodbye now and move on so I can take care of my health. I will probably still lurk a bit and read some good interesting thoughts about the ship from you in the future... but right now, I need a total break from anything SG related. Take care, fellow shippers !

You will be very missed, but I'm glad that you recognize when you need to take a step back; all of this can be very unsettling. My thoughts and prayers are with you. I hope that you will be able to return in the future. *hugs*

[Fresh_Horse]

OK guys, I have seen RDA at more than one convention. He absolutely does not remember a thing. At Avalon in 2006 most of his answers were "What was the question again?". He had zero clue what people were asking about.
He just couldn't get into the whole "die-hard Stargate fan" mindset.

You shouldn't really take anything to heart he says.

Actors will get a feeling of the crowd at conventions.
If there are a bunch of slasher questions, they will answer pro slash. If the shipper questions outweigh, their answers will be pro ship.

In the beginning Amanda was really careful what she said at conventions because she got so much flack from the slashers.
Then she got flack from the Weir fans.
The bile spilled over her is beyond anything I'd want anyone to have to endure.

Shanks will instigate this kind of nonsense by asking at a con where he is the main Stargate guest: "So who wants to see Jack and Daniel together?" - which of course is answered by loud hollering.
He did that once and then followed it up with "Who wants to see Jack and Sam get together?" - which was of course followed with lots of booing.

It takes 20 people in a crowd to swing this but of course the slashers see it as a confirmation.

So if there were 3 peeps in the autograph line asking shoving slash pics at RDA, of course he will pick up on that and get people riled up.

He just thinks it's fun and I am convinced that he doesn't care one bit as long as he is entertaining the crowd.