Sam Carter /Jack O'Neill Ship Appreciation Thread 2.0

[AmberLM1]

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[fems]

Yes, thank you, fems. *deep, calm, slow, breathing*

Glad I could help!

As some of you probably know I'm actually glad with the lack of confirmation, especially if I look at how they handled it in "Bones" or "Castle" and other shows (admittedly, "Castle" is handled better than "Bones").

[LadyGalaxyJ]

I think Castle is handling it beautifully, but then, that's MHO. (I haven't watch Bones though!)

Hi there by the way, I'm pretty new

*waves* Welcome to the thread! I'm a part-time poster, but I do read most of the time.

Ok. I was just watching bits of Grace and I know we must have discussed this before but....

...I just realized that as hot as the Grace kiss was, it was actually Sam 'telling' Jack goodbye. Her giving him up, in her belief that she needed to stop using her feelings for him as a crutch or excuse for not putting herself out there.

That kiss was 'goodbye'

You see, I get that impression when I watch only the kiss (in a .gif or a vid) but not when I watch the whole seen. I think that's because they first filmed it as part of the scene and then edited it as a 'dream within a dream'. I don't know what the first version of the scene with the kiss was like, but it could have been a sort of goodbye/thanks-for-everything/I-love-you-so-much-it-hurts kiss. But I guess we'll never know for sure (unless they some time decide to release what the original scene with the kiss was like, ah!).

I agree. The forum is very large, so I would suggest people take it one sub-forum at a time to get an idea of what's there.
There are many funny and interesting posters that aren't S/J Shippers, but it can be good fun interacting with them.

Yep! One of my best online friends is actually an anti-shipper. (We met on Livejournal.) And I actually sometimes forget she doesn't ship S/J , but we just laugh when we 'argue', and it's not really arguing because we respect each other.
So anyway, just seconding your post!

I have also learned that it's a good idea to take a breath and give yourself some time to think before you reply to a post that you may not agree with. This is all good training for real life.

Hi, not sure if you guys remember me but I'm AmberLM (I forgot my login details and no longer have the email address I registered with back in 2004-ish!) *waves*

I don't think we know each other, but *waves anyway*

[trinity3]

I guess I missed that discussion. Not surprising. Anyhoo, I guess I'll have to rewatch the episode because I don't remember thinking of it as a goodbye kiss. My thinking is more in line with a last ditch effort to convince herself to tell him that she cares about him more than she's supposed to.

I thought that way as well, it's what her subconscious (and conscious) longed for (give me a day or so and I may go back to that thought LOL). Jack basically told her it was time to stop letting him hold her back, agreeing with Jacob. She says what now...

Jack(Sam) focuses Sam on the task at hand, then she says to him ... One last thing, dreams of kissing him the way she's always wanted to no doubt, then tells him Never mind.

After Sam got home, she still called him Jack, still looked at him with the loving eyes but in the end tells him thanks (for giving her what she needed to let him go (?))

Then goes out and hooks up with Pete. For me, looking it over, it seems like it was goodbye.

This pic is so cute! Never fails to make me smile. I forget. is it a manip?



While I like both reasonings (goodbye kiss and last ditch), I always thought that it was a "well, since I CAN, I might as well fulfill my dreams"....she knows she's seeing things so she thought she'd take advantage of it, have some brief comfort before going to save herself

Possibly, but today, I don't think so. Like I said give me a day or so and maybe I'll change my mind

I've been following along with this, and I think there's an important factor that we're forgetting. After the kiss (which is all too brief in real time when its not slo-mo'd), Sam actually says "never mind". So even in her hallucination it didn't actually happen. She only had a brief thought flash about it, then thinks better of it.

To me, that indicates that she's still too hesitant about it to consider letting the possibility go. Maybe it's because she's not ready to knock on that door, or maybe because she's holding out that the real thing is going to be so much better, and might be happening soon. She might have been letting the dream go if she'd actually let herself have that dream kiss, but she didn't. It's still verboten, even to her subconscious. Personally, I think it was because it was too tempting--if she started, even in a hallucination, she'd never stop!

Maybe. I take your point but with everything that happened before and after, I think, in her mind, Sam was kissing Jack, the dream she'd been holding onto, goodbye.

Hey still just my opinion. I could be wrong and I still say thank goodness Sam came to her senses eventually

OK, I'm going to share the invite/sig/avi for Valenship.
Feel free to use them!

Great job. Thanks.

Hi, not sure if you guys remember me but I'm AmberLM (I forgot my login details and no longer have the email address I registered with back in 2004-ish!) *waves* https://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=e...RuepJ7F5Mu4sM:

Hey Amber. Great to have you back.

Yes, thank you, fems. *deep, calm, slow, breathing*

*Puts arm around Ramona and joins in with the deep calm slow breathing.*

[majorsal]

I swear whatever I said (it was sooooo many years ago) was benign and just a fact of the show - no speculation, wishing they were together, nothing. If I watched a show and disliked a character or relationship, that doesn't mean I would pretend it doesn't exist, forbid others to talk about it, and especially be rude to someone who does mention it. I love the set up on the Gateworld boards but I think, just like why the Ship never went anywhere - neither forward or completely tanked - lack of cohonas to say ""yes we wrote it, it exists, now here is what we're going to do with it." Even if that "do with it" would have been to put the complete kabash on it after Season 4. But they didn't. Let's try to please everyone and no one and string folks along.... ok, nevermind. I feel a rant working up and I just hadn't had a good one for a while *hangs head and retreats in shameful defeat*

i understand completely.

*super hugs*

[majorsal]

Just for a moment consider how badly they handled all that... and then be glad they didn't ruin our precious ship with some bad confirmation stuff and go on to ruin the characters, their integrity and probably their relationship (they'd undoubtedly have to break up and/or at least have kids, meaning at least one of them would have left the Program/military etc). This way we can all imagine how it would have gone ourselves.

but to me, *too much* was left to our imaginations.

it could have been as simple as someone saying sam was on her honeymoon, and the other person asking if she was changing her name to her husbands now and the response being that sam thought two o'neills at the sgc would be too confusing, so no.

it's simple, and would have answered the question.

*then*, we could have filled in the pieces of the puzzle.

i'd still complain , but at least we'd have *confirmation* that they were together.

[AmberLM]

LadyGalaxyJ, I don't believe we've "met" but hi, nice to meet you! Hi trinity! Great to be back! Nice to see Kliggy and Bev too *waves* hi guys!

Bagpuss kindly fixed my password for me so I'm officially me again!

As for valenship day I'm fine for whenever really. I notice there have been a few hints on s/j confirmation in the latter years of sg1 (I'm a little late to this party, I haven't seen much of seasons 9 and 10 at all and only saw "continuum" last week!) have I missed much big news?

[selene0789]

Hi Amber! Nice to meet you. I think. I might have met you right when I first started on here, but hi anyway!

I'm infinitely pleased with how TPTB handled the ship, for the most part. It could have been much, much worse. Don't even get me started on Bones. That's no longer a ship, it's a prison sentence.

I don't think I've seen a ship that's been handled better. I love ; if others don't see it and cherish it for what it is, then that's their loss.

[fems]

but to me, *too much* was left to our imaginations.

it could have been as simple as someone saying sam was on her honeymoon, and the other person asking if she was changing her name to her husbands now and the response being that sam thought two o'neills at the sgc would be too confusing, so no.

it's simple, and would have answered the question.

*then*, we could have filled in the pieces of the puzzle.

i'd still complain , but at least we'd have *confirmation* that they were together.

But the only time they could have gotten together without either one of them resigning/retiring would have been after their reassignments at the end of season 8, meaning there wouldn't even be two O'Neills at the SGC. If they got together earlier then something would have had to change in either or both of their careers.

But if you stick to canon they probably would have gotten together after season 8 and before Beachhead, after season ten/AoT and before SGA's fourth season, or post Continuum and before SGU; all of which wouldn't have given a lot of opportunities to squeeze in the mention of them being together, as Jack was hardly discussed in the former and in the latter Sam wasn't really discussed.

Also, if Sam (or maybe even both in one of Jack's brief visits at the SGC) would have shown up wearing a wedding ring without any explanation or someone going "Uh, Colonel Carter... Or should that be O'Neill now?" then there probably still would have been disappointment from the shippers, if not outrage at the lack of showing them getting together. In hindsight t's easy to say you would have been content with something so minor to indicate they're together but in reality it's most likely that, at that time, shippers and non-shippers would have been disappointed/upset at the sudden relationship change.

I much prefer to imagine how it went down myself. Perhaps that's because I write fanfic and thus can choose different moments and how they get together... Either way, I'm glad there aren't any canonical restrictions.

Oh and another thing; I'm pretty sure the lack of confirmation is one of the reasons why I'm still interested in the ship. Sam and Jack are the only ones I ship even though I watch/have watched far more TV shows/series than is good for someone and I can usually pinpoint the ones that should get together on-screen, but once they do all the fun is gone and their characters (and those around them) suddenly change and everything is handled badly.

[majorsal]

But the only time they could have gotten together without either one of them resigning/retiring would have been after their reassignments at the end of season 8, meaning there wouldn't even be two O'Neills at the SGC. If they got together earlier then something would have had to change in either or both of their careers.

But if you stick to canon they probably would have gotten together after season 8 and before Beachhead, after season ten/AoT and before SGA's fourth season, or post Continuum and before SGU; all of which wouldn't have given a lot of opportunities to squeeze in the mention of them being together, as Jack was hardly discussed in the former and in the latter Sam wasn't really discussed.

Also, if Sam (or maybe even both in one of Jack's brief visits at the SGC) would have shown up wearing a wedding ring without any explanation or someone going "Uh, Colonel Carter... Or should that be O'Neill now?" then there probably still would have been disappointment from the shippers, if not outrage at the lack of showing them getting together. In hindsight t's easy to say you would have been content with something so minor to indicate they're together but in reality it's most likely that, at that time, shippers and non-shippers would have been disappointed/upset at the sudden relationship change.

I much prefer to imagine how it went down myself. Perhaps that's because I write fanfic and thus can choose different moments and how they get together... Either way, I'm glad there aren't any canonical restrictions.

Oh and another thing; I'm pretty sure the lack of confirmation is one of the reasons why I'm still interested in the ship. Sam and Jack are the only ones I ship even though I watch/have watched far more TV shows/series than is good for someone and I can usually pinpoint the ones that should get together on-screen, but once they do all the fun is gone and their characters (and those around them) suddenly change and everything is handled badly.

there was a time when i wanted (and fully expected) a HUGE confirmation scene. i wouldn't have been happy or satisfied with anything else.

but time and disappointments brought my expectations down and down... till i could have been happy with someone just mentioning them being together.

even if i didn't swoon over whatever the confirmation was, i could still play around with the scenarios. but at least i'd know *for sure* that they ended up together.

the way the hints and teases were played on sg1 and sga, i'm pretty sure they got together. but that's just not good enough for me. not by a long shot.

(and i still hold out hope that mgm will bring stargate back in the future and give the s/j storyline the confirmation it deserves. even if it's only mentioned)

[AmberLM]

Hi Selene!

Yeah I agree, fems, they couldn't have done a resolution justice IMO. After the xfiles/csi/er/jag/star trek I just don't trust writers to do characters with long-standing UST justice. It's really infuriating and I would love nothing more than a scene (or ten!) well-written with Sam and Jack discussing starting a relationship legally and following through on said plans but TPTB IMO would have chickened out and just made it appear out of the blue (like Sara/Grissom in CSI) or give us little in the way of onscreen stuff (like xfiles Grrr!).

Having said that, should AT, RDA, Joseph Mallozzi and Martin Wood decide to take over the ship and be allowed to just run with it by the rest of TPTB it would make my year! (if wishes were horses, I'd also like to see a non-AU kiss too!)

[Ikorni]

there was a time when i wanted (and fully expected) a HUGE confirmation scene. i wouldn't have been happy or satisfied with anything else.

but time and disappointments brought my expectations down and down... till i could have been happy with someone just mentioning them being together.

even if i didn't swoon over whatever the confirmation was, i could still play around with the scenarios. but at least i'd know *for sure* that they ended up together.

the way the hints and teases were played on sg1 and sga, i'm pretty sure they got together. but that's just not good enough for me. not by a long shot.

(and i still hold out hope that mgm will bring stargate back in the future and give the s/j storyline the confirmation it deserves. even if it's only mentioned)

I hear you majorsal! This is a ship I felt was badly handled actually (doesn't change me being a shipper) and the fact that nothing was confirmed left me completely frustrated. The 7 years was quite frustrating (Season 7-8 being the worst) and even though it wasn't the Sam and Jack show, what happened wasn't good enough for me.

[trinity3]

LadyGalaxyJ, I don't believe we've "met" but hi, nice to meet you! Hi trinity! Great to be back! Nice to see Kliggy and Bev too *waves* hi guys!

Bagpuss kindly fixed my password for me so I'm officially me again!

As for valenship day I'm fine for whenever really. I notice there have been a few hints on s/j confirmation in the latter years of sg1 (I'm a little late to this party, I haven't seen much of seasons 9 and 10 at all and only saw "continuum" last week!) have I missed much big news?

**Waves**

there was a time when i wanted (and fully expected) a HUGE confirmation scene. i wouldn't have been happy or satisfied with anything else.

but time and disappointments brought my expectations down and down... till i could have been happy with someone just mentioning them being together.

even if i didn't swoon over whatever the confirmation was, i could still play around with the scenarios. but at least i'd know *for sure* that they ended up together.

the way the hints and teases were played on sg1 and sga, i'm pretty sure they got together. but that's just not good enough for me. not by a long shot.

(and i still hold out hope that mgm will bring stargate back in the future and give the s/j storyline the confirmation it deserves. even if it's only mentioned)

Agreed.

I think the writers did a good job, after all we're still here loving the ship that is Sam and Jack.

But, they had ample opportunity to resolve the ship subtly or otherwise and just didn't do it. Even after 2 movies cannon resolution still didn't happen. Oh we've had enough promises (remember Trio, the 'shall we say romantic scene' quote) but no cigar. I'll admit to being a bit peeved when I saw Daniel and Vala share an emotional scene (love them as I do) and Sam and Jack resolution still stuck in fanfic.

When I think of all the great fic resolutions out there, I know that these great writers could have done it if they really wanted to. Maybe it was just a matter of waiting until the absolute last minute which they didn't realize had actually come at the end of Continuum.

But hey, as was said, we've had subtle hints and tips to convince ourselves that Sam and Jack are together. So, while I haven't given up hope on the possibility of another movie (slim as it may be), I'll always love the show and appreciate the writers for what they gave us in Stargate and Sam and Jack.

Hi Selene!

Yeah I agree, fems, they couldn't have done a resolution justice IMO. After the xfiles/csi/er/jag/star trek I just don't trust writers to do characters with long-standing UST justice. It's really infuriating and I would love nothing more than a scene (or ten!) well-written with Sam and Jack discussing starting a relationship legally and following through on said plans but TPTB IMO would have chickened out and just made it appear out of the blue (like Sara/Grissom in CSI) or give us little in the way of onscreen stuff (like xfiles Grrr!).

Having said that, should AT, RDA, Joseph Mallozzi and Martin Wood decide to take over the ship and be allowed to just run with it by the rest of TPTB it would make my year! (if wishes were horses, I'd also like to see a non-AU kiss too!)

It would make the light year LOL!

[Everlovin]

Beautiful invitation, sig, and avi, Chemmy!

[majorsal]

here's a really good s/j fic!

http://sj-everyday.livejournal.com/1167141.html