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**Mandysg1** · 23 February 2006, 02:45 PM

Well that's better than the title I was given once.
The Royal Court's Sh*t Disturber

Originally posted by Tracy Jane

Stirrer, not Disturber.

Oops, but is there really a difference

(anyway here in Canada we say ____ disturber)

**Agent_Dark** · 23 February 2006, 02:51 PM

Originally posted by Dani76

Well, I have to admit, after seeing the spoiler pics for Crusade,

Spoiler:

But there is one important difference: Sam will be part of the season finale. And here is proof; check out the pics for Camelot on the stargate-project webpage. Granted, Sam is only in 2 out of 7, but I am sure that a lot of you will like pic #4.

Haha, Teal'c is using a Luger pistol!

It's like an old WW1/2 German pistol

I take it that pic of Sam is the

Spoiler:

**chocdoc** · 23 February 2006, 02:54 PM

Originally posted by Strix varia

We'll see how Camelot goes. There have been other episodes where the publicity pics were heavily skewed towards certain characters. Plus, those of us who aren't afraid of spoilers have known for a long time that it would be

Spoiler:

I am certainly not surprised by what they're showing.

I bet the ratings go back up

Spoiler:

But that has been my prediction all along if it goes to 11 seasons, so nothing new there, either.

It could just as easily be argued that the fall in the ratings is due to alot of the general viewing audience not buying Mitchell, missing RDA, viewing the Ori as boring, thinking the storylines are just boring, and/or missing any real team magic. They may be slowly losing viewship for any and all these reasons.

Actually, if anything, there hasn't been enough of Sam in the show to argue anything about Sam and the ratings. And Sam episodes in season 7 and 8 did really well in the ratings. The argument against blaming Sam besides that she really hasn't been in it that much this season compared to past seasons is--what about the other stars of the show!! So maybe MS, CJ, and the two BB's can't hold the audience. Maybe they should be replaced. Of course, not really, but you could just as well say we better replace Mitchell with Vala. Of course, that won't happen either.

Vala returns in the last two episodes. Looking at the trends, the last two episodes typically do very well in the ratings, just like the premiere. So it stands to reason that the ratings will go up whether Vala was on or not. Moebius I and II, for example, got a 2.3 and 2.4 repectively. Lost City part II got a 2.1. Cliffhangers get good ratings generally when you look at the trends.

I think TPTB will spin it any way they want it. I think the the bottom line is that they like to write for Vala---they've called her writer candy in interviews and CB plays her well.

IMHO, like Sky, if Sam leaves, the show won't make it. I think that is actually true in regard to Daniel as well. Some people think that Stargate SG-1 is like Law and Order. Just replace the actors. I actually don't think so. Yes, you can replace one of them maybe, but all four originals? I doubt it. AT and MS also have very strong fanbases. If they go off the show, I think that will make a BIG dent in the ratings. BB and CB have large fanbases too, but Stargate has always had a significantly larger audience that Farscape. But, admittedly, I could be wrong.

**chocdoc** · 23 February 2006, 02:55 PM

Originally posted by Agent_Dark

Haha, Teal'c is using a Luger pistol!

It's like an old WW1/2 German pistol

I take it that pic of Sam is the

Spoiler:

Very cool pictures!

**Agent_Dark** · 23 February 2006, 02:56 PM

And not to offend anyone or anything, but does it sometimes feel that this thread is 'Anti S9/S10 mk2'? Not that I have anything against people having those opinions, but I think those type of posts would probably be better off in the appropriate anti threads... It just kinda frustrates me to see so much of it here. Being Pro Sam doesn't mean you have to be anti new-stuff. But you'd be forgiven for thinking otherwise based on the last few pages...

**Mandysg1** · 23 February 2006, 03:06 PM

Originally posted by Agent_Dark

And not to offend anyone or anything, but does it sometimes feel that this thread is 'Anti S9/S10 mk2'? Not that I have anything against people having those opinions, but I think those type of posts would probably be better off in the appropriate anti threads... It just kinda frustrates me to see so much of it here. Being Pro Sam doesn't mean you have to be anti new-stuff. But you'd be forgiven for thinking otherwise based on the last few pages...

I think it's more about what they've done with the new stuff and how it has affected Sam's character. And I do wonder what is going to happen to Sam when Vala comes on the show.

Me personally I never liked PU, and found the character of Vala too obnoxious (oops that sounds negative doesn't it?) but it makes me think they want to replace Sam with her

**majorsal** · 23 February 2006, 03:24 PM

Originally posted by Strix varia

We'll see how Camelot goes. There have been other episodes where the publicity pics were heavily skewed towards certain characters. Plus, those of us who aren't afraid of spoilers have known for a long time that it would be

Spoiler:

I am certainly not surprised by what they're showing.

I bet the ratings go back up

Spoiler:

But that has been my prediction all along if it goes to 11 seasons, so nothing new there, either.

if they end up thinking this way, here's the flaw.

season 7 still had jack, but diminished. the other three mooks had more to do.

season 8 had even *less* jack, and the other three mooks had even *more* to do.

i LOVE jack/rda, but his 'supporting' actors carried the show. and to great ratings! which is why messing with the ingredients for season 9 wasn't a good idea. yes, bring in something fresh. no, don't take away the *good* thing that was *working*.

the best the ratings have done this season is -i believe- a 2.1. season 8 beat that. the ratings have been falling. season 8's second rose. if you equate sam (or any of the other BIG3) as part of the reason it rose, then how can you equate them being responsible for them falling?

poor writing is responsible. a serious lack in thinking things out is responsible.

the facts are, the ratings for the second half of season 8 were MUCH better than the ratings for s9's second half. so why is this? because even if the writing wasn't always great in season 8, we still had our beloved characters to embrace. it surpassed our disappointments in the writing department. that's hard to do this season because a- jack is missing, b- too many changes at once, c- the LEAD actor/character is lacking, and d- the writing is lacking most of the time.

so if the ratings go up if/when vala returns, it *still* won't surpass the impressive ratings at the end of season 8. and how will they explain *that*?

btw, has anyone seen the literal *nonexistent* enthusiasm concerning the new 'crusade' caps released? i think the fans are just so burnt out with this crap that they can't even muster the effort to say they don't want it.

sally

**majorsal** · 23 February 2006, 03:29 PM

Originally posted by minigeek

I'm pretty sure we'll end up with

Spoiler:

Instant "stripes" so to speak.

*snort* yep.

but, if that's all it takes to get a promotion... i'd think sam would be bent over and dragging herself down the hallway from all the medals on her uniform!

sally

**Agent_Dark** · 23 February 2006, 03:41 PM

Found an amusing little Sam/McKay fic

Antartic Lemons, by Asanno. It's not Sam/McKay ship, just their usual antagonistic bantering

**Strix varia** · 23 February 2006, 03:41 PM

Listen, we've been through this before, and I thought we'd come to an understanding of sorts that we weren't going to turn the SaGC thread into a Vala-bashing or a Vala-love fest forum. Vala is a lightning rod for opinions, and we have people who love her and people who hate her on this thread. Let's not turn the SaGC into a battle ground over another character.

I haven't helped that with my comments, I'm sure, but I intend to take my anti-rantings elsewhere from now on. May I implore others to do the same?

The Anti-Season 9 Thread:
http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=5708

And The Anti-Season 10 Thread:
http://forum.gateworld.net/showthread.php?t=20048

Go, rant, get it out of your systems!

**Mandysg1** · 23 February 2006, 04:00 PM

I'm feeling rather nostalgic, thinking of how our characters were seen:

Jack, a strong leader, respected, irreverent sense of humour and always kept Hammond on his toes.

Sam a brilliant scientist, brave and loyal soldier and 2nd in command and always smirking at O'Neill's jokes.

Teal'cthe strong silent jaffa, loyal to his friends and dependable

Daniel Unas bait?

http://img135.imageshack.us/img135/205/una4zu.jpg

Sorry Sky I couldn't resist

**majorsal** · 23 February 2006, 04:16 PM

Originally posted by minigeek

And yet one can only assume that Joe or someone like him WROTE that line for her character to say. Which begs a lot of questions, doesn't it? Contrary to what some kids would like to believe, it ain't a pack of script elves writing the episodes out there. These are the same guys who've brought us some great moments over the years. What the heck is goin' on in writer-town these days? Anyone's best guess is as good as mine.

i actually think it's writers' burn out. and it's very human. we do something long enough and start slacking off. whether i like it or not, it's human nature. that's why i think that at each break between seasons, the writers should watch their old work. kind of a refresher on what made the show so great to begin with.

btw, think of how many shows endings were lacking. did the show end because the writing got poor, or did the writing get poor because the show was going to end? meaning, which came first, the chicken or the egg?

i didn't like the endings of remington steel, star trek next gen, x-files, and xena (to mention a few). the 'magic' of these shows were leaving fast. so did the poor writing bring on the end? chicken or egg.

sally

**binkpmmc** · 23 February 2006, 04:33 PM

Originally posted by Skydiver

of course it does. he's the STAR!!!!

don't you remember that?????

the show MUST revolve around him

who here seriously believes that mitchell will

Spoiler:

in the s9 "cliffhanger" and I use that term very,very loosely here -- (some may wish it but it won't happen). IMO, this so-called cliff-hanger is just another bad play by TPTB - too much already with poor mary-sue Mitchell in peril, I think it has been almost every week (that's 17 episodes, aired so far, with maybe 1 or 2 that this joker hasn't been in some sort of "peril" plus this week he's in peril, as well as in Crusade,). Can you say - "beating a dead-horse" and "lacking imagination", where the heck is the creativity and new ideas these PTB "claim" to allegedly have? Let's get past this sorry, old story - it's tired and now borders on laughable. It is becoming a joke and, IMO, is "mockable".

**binkpmmc** · 23 February 2006, 04:43 PM

Originally posted by chocdoc

It could just as easily be argued that the fall in the ratings is due to alot of the general viewing audience not buying Mitchell, missing RDA, viewing the Ori as boring, thinking the storylines are just boring, and/or missing any real team magic. They may be slowly losing viewship for any and all these reasons.

Actually, if anything, there hasn't been enough of Sam in the show to argue anything about Sam and the ratings. And Sam episodes in season 7 and 8 did really well in the ratings. The argument against blaming Sam besides that she really hasn't been in it that much this season compared to past seasons is--what about the other stars of the show!! So maybe MS, CJ, and the two BB's can't hold the audience. Maybe they should be replaced. Of course, not really, but you could just as well say we better replace Mitchell with Vala. Of course, that won't happen either.

Vala returns in the last two episodes. Looking at the trends, the last two episodes typically do very well in the ratings, just like the premiere. So it stands to reason that the ratings will go up whether Vala was on or not. Moebius I and II, for example, got a 2.3 and 2.4 repectively. Lost City part II got a 2.1. Cliffhangers get good ratings generally when you look at the trends.

I think TPTB will spin it any way they want it. I think the the bottom line is that they like to write for Vala---they've called her writer candy in interviews and CB plays her well.

IMHO, like Sky, if Sam leaves, the show won't make it. I think that is actually true in regard to Daniel as well. Some people think that Stargate SG-1 is like Law and Order. Just replace the actors. I actually don't think so. Yes, you can replace one of them maybe, but all four originals? I doubt it. AT and MS also have very strong fanbases. If they go off the show, I think that will make a BIG dent in the ratings. BB and CB have large fanbases too, but Stargate has always had a significantly larger audience that Farscape. But, admittedly, I could be wrong.

I agree with chocdoc. TPTB have pimped and focused on mitchell as the "star" and the "lead" and the episodes have pushed him to the forefront while leaving very little in the way of actual substance for the BIG 3 so if the ratings are showing vulnerability and are failing and continue to fail the "blame" will rest completely on the shoulders of TPTB and a very, very poorly written and conceived "lead" character they saw as their golden boy and they put all their eggs in THAT basket. He is not bringing in the viewers at this point. The character is horrible, IMO and he has not earned his position up against the BIG 3 and he certainly does not deserve the position he has especially in light of the joke he is as written. To quote a headline "BB Leads SG1 into S10" so if he's leading and the ratings are failing and the viewers are disappearing then it stands to serve that he isn't really leading anyone anywhere - least of which will be a S11, all my opinion of course.

edited to add - and that's it - I'll stick to the AS9 and AS10 threads until I see some level of improvement in the writing overall and the treatment of the Carter character in particular.

**binkpmmc** · 23 February 2006, 04:48 PM

well in light of the 2 posts I put above this I will say this regarding the season 10 premiere:

apparently

Spoiler:

. My guess on this is that somehow they write in Carter using the

Spoiler:

and thus begins the bonding between Carter and v and maybe, just maybe TPTB can salvage some semblence of decent episodes with this type of storyline, especially with Daniel being absent for 4 episodes because of MS' contract.

This is my guess based on a few things Mallozzi said before he left one thing especially -- that Carter and v

Spoiler:

so this is my guess on how they start working together and forming some sort of relationship. I really am trying to be optimistic for Carter for S10 so I will share -- because of the uproar over how bad mitchell is written, the vulnerability the ratings are showing with their new "lead", the uproar regarding AT and Carter in late 2005 regardinng that whole SG1/SGA nonsense, the almost universal negativity, that is growing, with regard to mitchell's character in general, the dissatisfaction that mithcell is leading (and that is all over the place not just on this thread and not just at GW, even the folks at OS and SDJ are expressing extreme dislike of mitchell and his leadership qualities - many there do not like him at all), the fact that MS will not appear in 4 episodes at all, I hope that TPTB have re-evaluated their direction and they make Carter a larger presence in different capacities including the relationship aspect with v (I expect the co-leader thing to continue as I do not see them taking that away from mitchell but one can have that pie-in-the-sky hope that Carter be given back her rightful position as sole leader since she is the competent, experienced, dignified one). We'll see but I am trying to be a little optimistic in the face of all that is v&m but I am also fully prepared to be disappointed as that has become the norm for me with TPTB we are stuck with.

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