Gateworld Virtual Fleet 4.0 - Discussion thread

[Crazy Tom]

I can't say I'm in love with the concept of Ragnarok. It seems like another McGauffin-Big Dumb Object. And the technology inside is ancient, would we care if we found a vault detailing the technological accomplishment of the Old Kingdom? Because it really is that big a disparity.

I don't know if I want to continue with the Tka storyline, try as I might, I can't seem to find a way to reconcile Foothold with the 1900 arrival date. Everything about Foothold screams "new in town". I've even considered time travel, but...*sigh*

Their only up side is that they have a connection with the Shrin'yar and that they're pretty alien. From a practical perspective, the Tok'ra would actually be just as good as enemies for the Shrin'yar during the War of Assassins, and they've been pretty neglected as of late.

Maybe I can merge the two, the apparent endangered status of the Tok'Ra may work in my favor here...

[thekillman]

mind you old asgard tech would still be very powerful. as i said: it might hold more secrets than the Asgard really know.

And the technology inside is ancient, would we care if we found a vault detailing the technological accomplishment of the Old Kingdom?

archeological value at least.

as i said: what if the Jotnar's attempts to extract knowledge from the asgard while in storage blocked the technological knowledge from their minds: they very much remember what they did but they can't remember how to, say, build a beaming node. or a shield.

It seems like another McGauffin-Big Dumb Object.

sometimes a BDO can save your life. what do you think happens when a CME is gonna cause a global EMP? all our technology is gonna be useless, and pretty much nothing can prevent that. our methods of storage have such high data-density that we have no idea if the information will be stored for even one century.


why do you think Black Boxes use old-fashioned magnetic tape, in stead of something more modern, considering a USB stick can easily hold the same data, if not a dozen times more. hell an external hard disk like i have could fit inside with ease and store a hundred if not a thousand times more data.

yet we choose something old-fashioned.


technology loss occurs: in fact, certain blueprints for missiles are already lost, spacecraft designs are already lost, Nasa's even lost the ORIGINAL MOONLANDING TAPES.

lots of technology is being lost. Ragnarok Station is the asgard's means of survival: something which moves fast through space, so it's not some stationary object which is easily reached. should an entity like the Replicators attack, then not all would be lost.

the only problem is that the asgard protected it too well and the location of the device was lost, and thus it hasn't been updated for the past...10 000 years at least.

it's not some convenient object, i just can not believe that some advanced race won't build an armageddon-proof device so they can continue to exist even when a major event wipes most of them out.

because, you know, if an event wiped out 99% of humanity, we'd be practically in the stone age. some measures are already in place, like a genetic database for plant species. but we need more.

the Ragnarok Game might hold some "key" or "cheat" for a quick end, or perhaps the game doesn't have to be played. but only the Original Asgard would've know this.

[Experiment 442]

I spent the last hour or so on this and got a lot done

Spoiler:

[Lt. Col. Mcoy]

The Ragnarok Station sounds interesting, but shouldn't it be Gimle Station, since it is designed to survive Ragnarok?

I'm not sure if I like it in our universe, but the idea has possibilities at the very least.


Nice work on the gunship! But I'm not so sure about the missile pods right next to the cockpit.

You could also make it so that the thinner parts of the Scimitar supports actually retract during space flight, to make the ship more compact.

[bradly08]

I spent the last hour or so on this and got a lot done

Spoiler:

Looks great, but what's with the gas tanks behind the cockpit?

[blackluster]

mind you old asgard tech would still be very powerful. as i said: it might hold more secrets than the Asgard really know.

I dunno, something like this is easier to attribute to the Imperium of Man considering how that society is setup, but it's hard to swallow that the Asgard might have conceivably regressed since their means of information storage and even accessing the data of other races seems quite solid. The only thing they seemed to have lacked is the lateral thinking to explore outlandish development trees. They seem to have conducted their own advancement very carefully, so I can't imagine what they could gain from going backwards.

@E442: that is starting to look quite aggressive. I'm just wondering about the placement of the smaller missiles on the top of the forward wings. How would they look perhaps on the underside of the extensions holding the engine mountings?

[Crazy Tom]

I spent the last hour or so on this and got a lot done

Spoiler:

Hide those fuel tanks!:eek;

Really, putting some armour on top would be prudent.

I dunno, something like this is easier to attribute to the Imperium of Man considering how that society is setup, but it's hard to swallow that the Asgard might have conceivably regressed since their means of information storage and even accessing the data of other races seems quite solid. The only thing they seemed to have lacked is the lateral thinking to explore outlandish development trees. They seem to have conducted their own advancement very carefully, so I can't imagine what they could gain from going backwards.

@E442: that is starting to look quite aggressive. I'm just wondering about the placement of the smaller missiles on the top of the forward wings. How would they look perhaps on the underside of the extensions holding the engine mountings?

My thoughts exactly.

[thekillman]

but it's hard to swallow that the Asgard might have conceivably regressed

what do you mean, "regressed".

technology will be lost. it's impossible for a race, especially as advanced as the asgard, to document everything. they didn't even have their original genetic code, do you really think the asgard, ancients, hell even goauld or Tok'ra still have blueprints on everything?

They seem to have conducted their own advancement very carefully, so I can't imagine what they could gain from going backwards.

as i said: what if their knowledge of technology had actually been blocked because of the jotnar's attempts

[bradly08]

Hide those fuel tanks!:eek;

Really, putting some armour on top would be prudent.

Hopefully. What I imagine we are seeing right now is the bones and muscles of the craft, and the skin will be placed over after everything is done

[blackluster]

what do you mean, "regressed".

technology will be lost. it's impossible for a race, especially as advanced as the asgard, to document everything. they didn't even have their original genetic code, do you really think the asgard, ancients, hell even goauld or Tok'ra still have blueprints on everything?

Sure some stuff would be lost, but I doubt it is anything of technological consequence. If anything, such an endeavor would be a pursuit of culture, not scientific knowledge per say.

as i said: what if their knowledge of technology had actually been blocked because of the jotnar's attempts

I can't see how it matters. One would essentially be talking about a period that is ancient to them. They may gain some insight to their past but can one really motivate that a race like the Asgard who are advanced enough to oversee other races on a galactic scale are going to dig up something from their distant past that realistically tops what they went out with in Unending? Feel free to sell it, I personally don't buy it though.

[Lt. Col. Mcoy]

what do you mean, "regressed".

technology will be lost. it's impossible for a race, especially as advanced as the asgard, to document everything. they didn't even have their original genetic code, do you really think the asgard, ancients, hell even goauld or Tok'ra still have blueprints on everything?



as i said: what if their knowledge of technology had actually been blocked because of the jotnar's attempts

I think that the idea is reasonable from a "Could it happen?" standpoint, I'm just not sold on the "Should it happen?".

[bradly08]

I think that the idea is reasonable from a "Could it happen?" standpoint, I'm just not sold on the "Should it happen?".

Well IMO the idea needs refined

[thekillman]

Sure some stuff would be lost, but I doubt it is anything of technological consequence. If anything, such an endeavor would be a pursuit of culture, not scientific knowledge per say.

technological consequence, yes. impact on knowledge, no.

i can't see how it matters. One would essentially be talking about a period that is ancient to them. They may gain some insight to their past but can one really motivate that a race like the Asgard who are advanced enough to oversee other races on a galactic scale are going to dig up something from their distant past that realistically tops what they went out with in Unending? Feel free to sell it, I personally don't buy it though.

does it have to top that?





as i said:

what if the attempts of the Jotnar to extract knowledge from their minds actually buried or even erased the asgard's knowledge of their technology? it would be interesting IMO.

[Lt. Col. Mcoy]

as i said:

what if the attempts of the Jotnar to extract knowledge from their minds actually buried or even erased the asgard's knowledge of their technology? it would be interesting IMO.

I don't think this is what's being questioned. I think what's being questioned is whether technology that old would be valuable in this era. After all, evidence from the show indicates the Asgard were still using sleeper ships at that point.

The small bits of technology in the Thrudiem base would probably be more valuable than anything on that station. Now, that doesn't mean that there aren't other reasons to be curious about it; I'm just saying that technology could be more easily rebuilt/acquired by other means. And, it would be more advanced.

[Crazy Tom]