S5: Critique and Contemplations

[Linda06]

But but but to do that would require....imagination. Sorry, couldn't resist.

Thanks for all the replies to my question. And I think we proved the point that for the most part it depends on your perspective. But on the Ronon and McKeller points, we seem to all agree. Yet the writers just ignored us.

Now, I always was one to take a giant poke at the elephant in the room, so I have another question.

Shippers. Particularly the J/T shippers. I know you are all feeling particularly frustrated, betrayed and disappointed. My question is: would you rather have seen her go the way of Elizabeth and be killed off than see her end up with Kanaan?

I can be objective when I work at it and really thought in S4 and after seeing S&R that Kanaan was a dead man and John was about to become the baby daddy by default. I agree that the Kanaan character should have been developed a lot more but liked the parts we did see, particularly in BT. And non-shippers, how do you think the Teyla/John situation was handled?

Well as a JT shipper It's not that she was with Kanaan that was the biggest problem with me. It was the way it was done. Kinda like McKeller, it came completely out of left field, out of no where....A way to explain the pregnancy and they didn't care if it was believable, they just wanted a daddy for the baby. And that unfortunately went to the previously unseen, unmentioned, no personality Kanaan And with zero development to at least make it even slightly beileable. The dropped the ball bigtime here.

Also there was zero chemistry between them, the scenes they did have together they were like statues Now i'm not bashing the actor cause he can only work with what he's got, but maybe it would have been different if they had another actor that had chemistry with Teyla, I could never see Teyla falling for someone like Kanaan, he was too weak, too weedly. She had more chemistry with people like John, Ronon, Lorne and Carson...Heck even Halling. Now any of those I think I could have believed more than Kanaan the man that appears outta no where then goes back into the shadows till he's needed again.

heh, um...I so gotta stop rambling

I hope that made sense, it made sense in my mind

So what was the question again? Oh right, i'd have rather seen her killed off, that way I wouldn't have needed to watch SGA anymore

But I still don't know why they gave us hope with that scene in S&R with the romantic dinner just to do a complete 180 and screwe us over @mckay: Oh wait I do, they like to mess with our heads

[Skydiver]

from the pov of a non-shipper, i wish ALL the ships woulda never sailed.

no weir mooning over shep, no teyla mooning over shep, no shep mooning over teyla, no rodney and keller, no keller and ronon

NONE

This was supposed to be a scientific exploration of another galaxy not the Love Boat

Yes, i know to some fans, hey all the writers gotta do is have two characters talk to or look at each other and it'd declared a ship and people look for it. Can't control that and the interpersonal relationships are part of what make the show fun

that said, the writers of this show have zero skill and grace and tact when it comes to boy/girl stuff, so don't even try.

so to heck with all that ship stuff. stop spending your time on that and just make a good story. the fans will see whatever ships they want anyway

[bluealien]

I'll just quietly agree with all the points everyone has identified (except that I agree with Jel about the Weir popsicle - it was a tragic and character defining act for her to sacrifice herself for Atlantis, and Torri wasn't coming back so...).

I have to say for me as a Ronon fan(atic), one of the weakest aspects of S5 was the destruction of his character. Loping around after Keller like an oversized beagle, eating trays covered in nothing but meat with his bare hands, wildly shooting at anything that moves or doesn't move... they had actually built his character in small ways over the previous seasons, but certain writers seemed determined to turn back the clock.

Unfortunately I think they did that with all of them... the characters they concentrated on in season 5 were McKay and Keller... everyone else got sidelined.. so my problem with the entire season was shoving in Keller and the overuse of McKay.... I don't think there was time to shake things up...

The writers stuck with the predictable for everyone else... they all lost their zing IMO... Sheppard lost his spark and wit and to me that was purely down to the writing for him... Teyla became boring because the girl got nothing to do... and poor Ronon just seemed to tag along like a lost puppy...

Search and Rescue was the only exception IMO... this was the team I loved.. the bond was obvious.. McKay was funny but not obnoxious.. all the team got something to do and they acted like a team... who genuially cared about one another... but after S&R it slowing started to go down hill..

The Seed was just a bit too silly and I think the characters did the best they could... Broken Ties was a bit disjointed and again lacked what Reunion did for Ronon.. and I agree with Sky... the characters then started to become too predictable.... we needed some sort of shake up and John killing Keller in the Seed would have been perfect IMO.... how would this have effected his friendship with Rodney... how would the guilt have eaten him up...how would the team dynamic have been effected.... it could have been an interesting arc for season five.. instead of the love triangle...

[Cautious Explorer]

*on topic high five*

Several things there I agree with. The loss of zing being one, but I would include S4 as one of the zingless seasons.

I have a general question that hopefully is on topic. How much agreement is there on just what constitutes a "weak moment"? I'm thinking it depends on your perspective.

I'll go first.

Weak moments:
1. anything with McKeller
2. too much emphasis on McKay
3. too little Sheppard
4. devolution of Ronon
5. leaving Weir as a frozen popsicle

There are probably more but these just came off the top of my head.

1. Make that anything with Keller. It's not just her as part of McKeller that I dislike. I find the whole package of frightened, insecure little girl to be distasteful.
2. Way too much McKay.
3. Too little Sheppard, but it's not screen time alone. He was getting very few good storylines or character development and minimal interaction with characters that weren't McKay even before S5. The virtual elimination of his screen time was the final straw.
4. Devolution of Ronon's character along with his near disappearance from the show.
5. I would have preferred that Weir be transferred back to Earth for some kind of happy ending while an interesting and authoritative commander took her place. The now she's dead, now she isn't premise got pretty old and the new commanders weren't all that interesting.

I would add:
6. Turning Teyla into a domestic goddess. Where did the warrior and leader go? What about her dreams and hopes for Pegasus? Nope. Forget all that. She's a mother now and only wants to burp the baby and become domesticated.
7. Anything that requires the rewriting of SGA history: Michael saving Carson's DNA and holding his clone hostage for a year or so; the whole existence of Kanaan and his having 'the gift' too.; The disappearance of a queen dominated Wraith society in order to give more power to Todd.

Shippers. Particularly the J/T shippers. I know you are all feeling particularly frustrated, betrayed and disappointed. My question is: would you rather have seen her go the way of Elizabeth and be killed off than see her end up with Kanaan?

What's the difference, really? Teyla's spirit disappeared as soon as the pregnancy came along. In essence, the real Teyla died in S3 anyway.

But I suppose it's still better than being a floating popsicle. There's still hope that Teyla will realize that Kanaan isn't worth her time and that there's more to life than walking babies and discussing their sleep habits. We could get the old Teyla back someday.

I can be objective when I work at it and really thought in S4 and after seeing S&R that Kanaan was a dead man and John was about to become the baby daddy by default. I agree that the Kanaan character should have been developed a lot more but liked the parts we did see, particularly in BT. And non-shippers, how do you think the Teyla/John situation was handled?

I truly thought Kanaan would be treated as the plot device he was born to be and would disappear once he had served his purpose. He came out of nowhere, he wasn't a part of Teyla's life, she barely spoke of him or expressed any affection for him, and there was certainly never any passion between them (There must have been a lot of ruus wine around when that child was conceived )

I honestly don't see anything to like about the deadly dull Kanaan or the mind-numbing effect he seems to have had on Teyla. If there were any justice in this world no-personality Kanaan would run off with the equally lacking Keller and never be seen or heard of again.

No. She's definately better off with Kanaan than frozen in space The one good thing about showing so little of Kanaan and his interaction with Teyla is that at least we can pretend she is happy and with a man worthy of her respect and love. It just would have been nice if they'd shown a hint of that

Or better yet, pretend that Teyla has come to realize that her relationship with Kanaan is a mistake, that staying together because of the baby won't turn out well in the long run and she'd rather part as friends now than enemies later.

[Scary Kitty]

*on topic high five*

Several things there I agree with. The loss of zing being one, but I would include S4 as one of the zingless seasons.

I have a general question that hopefully is on topic. How much agreement is there on just what constitutes a "weak moment"? I'm thinking it depends on your perspective.

I'll go first.

Weak moments:
1. anything with McKeller
2. too much emphasis on McKay
3. too little Sheppard
4. devolution of Ronon
5. leaving Weir as a frozen popsicle

There are probably more but these just came off the top of my head.

I'd have to agree with all of those.

McKeller was sprung on us too suddenly, with virtually no slow and gradual build-up of subtle moments that could be taken as either friend-shippy or romantic-shippy that we got with certain other potential ships over the years. The writing for it was downright crude in some places, very sloppy and in-your-face.

Definitely too much emphasis on McKay. Again, too much in-your-face, too much emphasis on giving him the zany one-liners at the expense of other characters, which leads into...

Too little Sheppard. Hello, the guy is supposed to be the "hero" of the show! So what do they do? Diminish the importance of the ATA gene, which was Sheppard's meal ticket onto the expedition and his big thing in the first place, and turn him into a big, dumb grunt who files puddlejumpers and shoots stuff.

And speaking of big, dumb grunts: Ronon. I think we all agree how much of a disappointment that was.

Leaving Weir as a frozen popsicle. Oh, the rant I could unleash on this issue. But I'll sit on it until we get to discussing Ghost in the Machine.

Now, I always was one to take a giant poke at the elephant in the room, so I have another question.

Shippers. Particularly the J/T shippers. I know you are all feeling particularly frustrated, betrayed and disappointed. My question is: would you rather have seen her go the way of Elizabeth and be killed off than see her end up with Kanaan?

I can be objective when I work at it and really thought in S4 and after seeing S&R that Kanaan was a dead man and John was about to become the baby daddy by default. I agree that the Kanaan character should have been developed a lot more but liked the parts we did see, particularly in BT. And non-shippers, how do you think the Teyla/John situation was handled?

No, I wouldn't have wanted to see her go the way of Elizabeth. Pointlessly screwing over one character in such a ridiculous fashion was bad enough.

Personally, I liked the Teyla/Kanaan bits we did get. While it was woefully underdeveloped, it did show that Teyla had a real life beyond her team that her teammates weren't privy to. It was a day late and a dollar short, but at least we got something.

[fumblesmcstupid]

Kanan was in like what 5 or 6 scenes......not very much go on with to like or not like!


*clears throat*

Next episode please.......

[Linda06]

Kanan was in like what 5 or 6 scenes......not very much go on with to like or not like!


*clears throat*

Next episode please.......

ah but how amny of those scenes was he in that he wasn't bugboy

Lemme see...Broken ties....ummmmmm....Ok i'm stuck...HELP...What other times did we see him when he was normal again

Yeah ok, so what's the next ep again?

[Southern Red]

I'd have to agree with all of those.

McKeller was sprung on us too suddenly, with virtually no slow and gradual build-up of subtle moments that could be taken as either friend-shippy or romantic-shippy that we got with certain other potential ships over the years. The writing for it was downright crude in some places, very sloppy and in-your-face.

Definitely too much emphasis on McKay. Again, too much in-your-face, too much emphasis on giving him the zany one-liners at the expense of other characters, which leads into...

Too little Sheppard. Hello, the guy is supposed to be the "hero" of the show! So what do they do? Diminish the importance of the ATA gene, which was Sheppard's meal ticket onto the expedition and his big thing in the first place, and turn him into a big, dumb grunt who files puddlejumpers and shoots stuff.

And speaking of big, dumb grunts: Ronon. I think we all agree how much of a disappointment that was.

Leaving Weir as a frozen popsicle. Oh, the rant I could unleash on this issue. But I'll sit on it until we get to discussing Ghost in the Machine.



No, I wouldn't have wanted to see her go the way of Elizabeth. Pointlessly screwing over one character in such a ridiculous fashion was bad enough.

Personally, I liked the Teyla/Kanaan bits we did get. While it was woefully underdeveloped, it did show that Teyla had a real life beyond her team that her teammates weren't privy to. It was a day late and a dollar short, but at least we got something.

I think when they wrote the Teyla/Kanaan scenes in BT and when they had her talking about him on occasion they assumed that would be enough for the viewers of the show to understand that they were a couple raising their child together. If they had continued with domestic scenes in even a few more episodes, the non-shippers would have protested that it was overkill. In this case I am a bit sympathetic with the writers. According to everything JM has said, they consider this story done.

They also appear to consider Teyla's arc, which started in S1 and dominated the overall arc of the show wraithwise at times, to have been completed with the death of Michael. So naturally we'd see less of her. It's just a common way shows are done. But the truly unforgivable and puzzling choice to me is the marginalization of Sheppard. He virtually had no story in most of S5.

[Scary Kitty]

I think when they wrote the Teyla/Kanaan scenes in BT and when they had her talking about him on occasion they assumed that would be enough for the viewers of the show to understand that they were a couple raising their child together. If they had continued with domestic scenes in even a few more episodes, the non-shippers would have protested that it was overkill. In this case I am a bit sympathetic with the writers. According to everything JM has said, they consider this story done.

They also appear to consider Teyla's arc, which started in S1 and dominated the overall arc of the show wraithwise at times, to have been completed with the death of Michael. So naturally we'd see less of her. It's just a common way shows are done.

*nods* The writers were really stuck in a catch-22 situation with Teyla, the pregnancy storyline and the family life scenes. On the one hand, they had to come up with some sort of explanation for what was happening, but on the other hand, as you pointed out, they couldn't overdo it at the risk of turning off viewers. In retrospect, looking at how the chips did end up falling, they probably could've done a better job at balancing the two opposing needs, but, well, at least they tried, and I give them credit for that.

But the truly unforgivable and puzzling choice to me is the marginalization of Sheppard. He virtually had no story in most of S5.

And no reasonable explanation, either in-story or behind-the-scenes, for that marginalization. Very strange indeed.

[Southern Red]

*nods* The writers were really stuck in a catch-22 situation with Teyla, the pregnancy storyline and the family life scenes. On the one hand, they had to come up with some sort of explanation for what was happening, but on the other hand, as you pointed out, they couldn't overdo it at the risk of turning off viewers. In retrospect, looking at how the chips did end up falling, they probably could've done a better job at balancing the two opposing needs, but, well, at least they tried, and I give them credit for that.



And no reasonable explanation, either in-story or behind-the-scenes, for that marginalization. Very strange indeed.

Not that we're allowed to talk about anyway.

[Linda06]

I think when they wrote the Teyla/Kanaan scenes in BT and when they had her talking about him on occasion they assumed that would be enough for the viewers of the show to understand that they were a couple raising their child together. If they had continued with domestic scenes in even a few more episodes, the non-shippers would have protested that it was overkill. In this case I am a bit sympathetic with the writers. According to everything JM has said, they consider this story done.

They also appear to consider Teyla's arc, which started in S1 and dominated the overall arc of the show wraithwise at times, to have been completed with the death of Michael. So naturally we'd see less of her. It's just a common way shows are done. But the truly unforgivable and puzzling choice to me is the marginalization of Sheppard. He virtually had no story in most of S5.

Well they didn't seem to bother about the fans when they decided to bring in the dreded McKeller romance Of course that was between their two faves so it was ok in their minds

But if they were gonna write the pregnancy into the show then they have to write it in properly. Not have a complete unknown appear out of thin air that we've never heard of or seen, we found out Teyla was pregnant and we saw her heavily pregnant before we even caught glimpse of the so called boyfriend, and even then it wasn't the real Kanaan, it was hybrid Kanaan

If a relationship is done right it can add to the show (DS9 is a perfect example ) They don't have to go all love boat on us, but they do have to at least give it some development if they want it to be believable.

And Teyla had an arc all the way back to season 1 huh, must have missed that

[Southern Red]

Well they didn't seem to bother about the fans when they decided to bring in the dreded McKeller romance Of course that was between their two faves so it was ok in their minds

But if they were gonna write the pregnancy into the show then they have to write it in properly. Not have a complete unknown appear out of thin air that we've never heard of or seen, we found out Teyla was pregnant and we saw her heavily pregnant before we even caught glimpse of the so called boyfriend, and even then it wasn't the real Kanaan, it was hybrid Kanaan

If a relationship is done right it can add to the show (DS9 is a perfect example ) They don't have to go all love boat on us, but they do have to at least give it some development if they want it to be believable.

And Teyla had an arc all the way back to season 1 huh, must have missed that

Rising, Suspicion, The Gift and others. You know, the whole Wraith connection. She senses Wraith, flies space ships, etc. It's interwoven all through S1 and beyond. And yeah, I know they dropped it when convenient, but early on a lot of stories centered on her.

On the 'ship stuff. This is why it's best left out of the hands of these people. I don't see where they developed any ship well or even came close. The main 3 were mostly in the eyes of the shippers and the canon one was badly done. But again, I repeat, in their minds they introduced Kanaan, developed the relationship, solved the problem of his hybrid status, reunited the lovers and now they are living in domestic bliss on Atlantis. They told us she had known him for a very long time and that they had recently become close. Rachel was heavily pregnant but Teyla only found out in Missing right around the time that we learned about Kanaan. It might not make sense to you, but the boys who came up with it are really proud of their creation. And it's consistent with their "tell don't bother to show" philosophy, wrong though it may be.

[Cautious Explorer]

I think when they wrote the Teyla/Kanaan scenes in BT and when they had her talking about him on occasion they assumed that would be enough for the viewers of the show to understand that they were a couple raising their child together. If they had continued with domestic scenes in even a few more episodes, the non-shippers would have protested that it was overkill. In this case I am a bit sympathetic with the writers. According to everything JM has said, they consider this story done.

I have little sympathy for the writers. I can't imagine a less creative means of dealing with Teyla's pregnancy. A boyfriend out of nowhere who's not been referenced or seen before. A boyfriend who is introduced as a mutant bugman, does nothing to help himself, has no involvement with Teyla's life and serves only as a source to distance her from her team.

Surely there are ways to introduce a pregnancy that don't require rewriting the past (Oh I recall the sparkle in your eye when you talked about the man who never existed) or reducing Teyla to the little homemaker of Atlantis, toting her baby wherever she goes.

I think Kanaan was the result of a group of writers who'd long ago lost interest in Teyla and saw the invisible boyfriend as an expedient way to explain away her pregnancy with little to no effort and to provide a useful means of sidelining Teyla. 'Look, we gave her a happy ending with a baby she can gush over, an invisible boyfriend or something else that we haven't bothered to define and now we don't even need to bother writing any off-work interaction with her team. The guys will hang out together while Teyla's off doing mom things of course.'

They also appear to consider Teyla's arc, which started in S1 and dominated the overall arc of the show wraithwise at times, to have been completed with the death of Michael. So naturally we'd see less of her. It's just a common way shows are done. But the truly unforgivable and puzzling choice to me is the marginalization of Sheppard. He virtually had no story in most of S5.

Unfortunately, I think TPTB think that everyone's arc is done, except for McKay. So Michael, the crazy hybrid is dead and that ends Teyla's arc? Teyla's issues are with the Wraith, not just the psycho who thought her baby was magical. Teyla is (or was until S4/5) a part of Sheppard's team. She has a huge interest in any further arcs that affect Atlantis and her team. As a resident of Pegasus her arc of trying to better the lives of her people and all of Pegasus shouldn't actually come to end at all.

[Linda06]

Rising, Suspicion, The Gift and others. You know, the whole Wraith connection. She senses Wraith, flies space ships, etc. It's interwoven all through S1 and beyond. And yeah, I know they dropped it when convenient, but early on a lot of stories centered on her.

Sure we saw that on occasion, it's become, if the ep hasn't got wraith in it (which happened quite alot) then we don't have to use Teyla for anything meaningful She's only good for wraith eps, and even them it can sometimes be bad Ronon's only good for wraith and his people eps

On the 'ship stuff. This is why it's best left out of the hands of these people. I don't see where they developed any ship well or even came close. The main 3 were mostly in the eyes of the shippers and the canon one was badly done. But again, I repeat, in their minds they introduced Kanaan, developed the relationship, solved the problem of his hybrid status, reunited the lovers and now they are living in domestic bliss on Atlantis. They told us she had known him for a very long time and that they had recently become close. Rachel was heavily pregnant but Teyla only found out in Missing right around the time that we learned about Kanaan. It might not make sense to you, but the boys who came up with it are really proud of their creation. And it's consistent with their "tell don't bother to show" philosophy, wrong though it may be.

With these guys, i'd be questioning them about if they actually know anything about relationships cause the way they write them I have my doubts

Did no one tell them that introducing a love interest and developing it all off screen doesn't actually work for people that actually have half a brain

Boys, yes boys. Immature boys I hope for the sake of you guys that's actually gonna watch SGU that they DO NOT do romance of any kind on the show Stargate + romance = nail in the coffin

[maxbo]

from the pov of a non-shipper, i wish ALL the ships woulda never sailed.

no weir mooning over shep, no teyla mooning over shep, no shep mooning over teyla, no rodney and keller, no keller and ronon

NONE

This was supposed to be a scientific exploration of another galaxy not the Love Boat

Yes, i know to some fans, hey all the writers gotta do is have two characters talk to or look at each other and it'd declared a ship and people look for it. Can't control that and the interpersonal relationships are part of what make the show fun

that said, the writers of this show have zero skill and grace and tact when it comes to boy/girl stuff, so don't even try.

so to heck with all that ship stuff. stop spending your time on that and just make a good story. the fans will see whatever ships they want anyway

I also wish that Stargate's writers had never attempted to include ship, especially since they lack the talent to write ship well.

Unfortunately I think they did that with all of them... the characters they concentrated on in season 5 were McKay and Keller... everyone else got sidelined.. so my problem with the entire season was shoving in Keller and the overuse of McKay.... I don't think there was time to shake things up...

The writers stuck with the predictable for everyone else... they all lost their zing IMO... Sheppard lost his spark and wit and to me that was purely down to the writing for him... Teyla became boring because the girl got nothing to do... and poor Ronon just seemed to tag along like a lost puppy...

Search and Rescue was the only exception IMO... this was the team I loved.. the bond was obvious.. McKay was funny but not obnoxious.. all the team got something to do and they acted like a team... who genuially cared about one another... but after S&R it slowing started to go down hill..

The Seed was just a bit too silly and I think the characters did the best they could... Broken Ties was a bit disjointed and again lacked what Reunion did for Ronon.. and I agree with Sky... the characters then started to become too predictable.... we needed some sort of shake up and John killing Keller in the Seed would have been perfect IMO.... how would this have effected his friendship with Rodney... how would the guilt have eaten him up...how would the team dynamic have been effected.... it could have been an interesting arc for season five.. instead of the love triangle...

Yep, Keller and the overuse of Rodney ruined much of season 5 for me too, despite a strong beginning with S&R. I also agree that if they really wanted to shake things up, then having Sheppard kill Keller in The Seed would have been a good way to achieve that sense of danger they claimed was one of their reasons for killing Carson and Elizabeth.

7. Anything that requires the rewriting of SGA history: Michael saving Carson's DNA and holding his clone hostage for a year or so; the whole existence of Kanaan and his having 'the gift' too.; The disappearance of a queen dominated Wraith society in order to give more power to Todd.

I agree with everything in your "weakness" list, especially #7, because, IMO, "the rewriting of SGA history" is the source of much of the lazy writing that plagued SGA.

What's the difference, really? Teyla's spirit disappeared as soon as the pregnancy came along. In essence, the real Teyla died in S3 anyway.

Sadly, I have to agree with this because except for a few flashes of the real Teyla here and there (thanks mostly to Rachel), the writers tried to turn Teyla into a middle-class Earth-born soccer mom in Season 5.

But I suppose it's still better than being a floating popsicle. There's still hope that Teyla will realize that Kanaan isn't worth her time and that there's more to life than walking babies and discussing their sleep habits. We could get the old Teyla back someday.

Yeah, I wouldn't wish Elizabeth's fate on any character, not even Keller.

I truly thought Kanaan would be treated as the plot device he was born to be and would disappear once he had served his purpose. He came out of nowhere, he wasn't a part of Teyla's life, she barely spoke of him or expressed any affection for him, and there was certainly never any passion between them (There must have been a lot of ruus wine around when that child was conceived )

That's the best explanation I've heard so far for how two characters with no sexual chemistry managed to generate enough interest in each other to do the deed.

I honestly don't see anything to like about the deadly dull Kanaan or the mind-numbing effect he seems to have had on Teyla. If there were any justice in this world no-personality Kanaan would run off with the equally lacking Keller and never be seen or heard of again.

Kanaan and Keller running off together, never to be seen or heard of again? That works for me.

You know, I've always seen Kanaan and Keller as two sides of the same coin. Although Keller got a lot more screen time than Kanaan did, neither ever came across as real characters to me. Neither character had a well-defined personality and each only existed to serve the plot(s).

ah but how amny of those scenes was he in that he wasn't bugboy

Lemme see...Broken ties....ummmmmm....Ok i'm stuck...HELP...What other times did we see him when he was normal again

Yeah ok, so what's the next ep again?

Yeah, I really feel for the poor actor who was stuck with this character because the writers didn't give him much to work with.

I think when they wrote the Teyla/Kanaan scenes in BT and when they had her talking about him on occasion they assumed that would be enough for the viewers of the show to understand that they were a couple raising their child together. If they had continued with domestic scenes in even a few more episodes, the non-shippers would have protested that it was overkill. In this case I am a bit sympathetic with the writers. According to everything JM has said, they consider this story done.

For me, it wasn't about the writers adding more domestic scenes, it was about what they did, or didn't do, with what they did show. For instance, although we only saw Nancy once and there was no flirting, etc, between her and Sheppard, I can believe that they were a couple once. And, I feel the same way about Elizabeth and Mike and Carson and Cadmen. What did Nancy, Mike and Cadmen have that Kanaan lacked? Personality. They seemed 'real' to me.

Although Teyla and Kanaan's best scene was in BT, there was no sexual chemistry, no spark - nothing that peaked my interest in wanting to know more about their relationship because Kanaan never rose beyond a walking, talking plot device to me - the writers didn't try to make him real. If they were going to go with a relationship that lacked sexual chemistry, then why didn't they make Halling the father? Even though he and Teyla lacked sexual chemistry, at least they had a long-term relationship that was believable to me.

They also appear to consider Teyla's arc, which started in S1 and dominated the overall arc of the show wraithwise at times, to have been completed with the death of Michael. So naturally we'd see less of her. It's just a common way shows are done. But the truly unforgivable and puzzling choice to me is the marginalization of Sheppard. He virtually had no story in most of S5.

You think Teyla had an arc that dominated the show at times? How so?

Although Teyla was the only member who had Wraith DNA, as the seasons went on, she usually had less to do with the Wraith arc than any other character - except perhaps for Ronon (whose arc was also usually confined to his one episode per season). Except for Teyla's one episode per season, Wraith storylines were usually dominated by Rodney and Sheppard in seasons 2 & 3 and then Rodney, Keller, with a bit of Sheppard, Teyla and Ronon in Seasons 4-5.

As a result, by the end of the series, I was still waiting for Teyla's "arc" in addition to putting a light in the window for Ronon and Sheppard.