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    I spend most of my time here in the anti-threads and have pretty much given any hope of SGA being anything more than 'slightly entertaining'. I was pleasantly surprised to find out that the show could still make me care about the characters enough to move me to tears. "Sunday" was, without a doubt, my favourite SGA episode in a long time and among the very best of the series.

    There are two things that separate this episode from the standard SGA fare and really elevate "Sunday" to a whole new level. Obviously, the death of a regular character is something special and a chance for some great drama. On the other hand, killing off a popular character and doing it badly can be a good way to alienate a lot of fans (Lost with Eko would be my recent example).

    While I'm going to miss Beckett, I think the episode was a wonderful send-off for him. His characterization has been inconsistent in the series, but here he was shown as a kind and caring man who would risk his own life without hesitation if he could save another's. While some may feel he should've died in a more heroic matter, saving the galaxy or whatnot, I disagree. He did die as a hero, doing his job and saving another man's life which is what his work is of course all about. The relative mundaness of the situation and of his death just goes to show that the everyday life of the Atlantis expedition is very dangerous and anyone could potentially die. Of course, I realize that this is TV and the main characters can't be killed off in the vein of, say, George R.R. Martin, but it's nice to know that not everyone in the main credits is immortal.

    The second thing that made this episode great was that it was so character-focused. I can easily overlook all kinds of stupid plot holes if the writers allow the characters to feel, think and interact with each other believably. We often get bad characterization because the characters service the needs of the plot, but with little plot to speak of in this episode, the characters were allowed to shine. I'm not saying every episode should be balanced like this, but if TPTB were to focus more on the characters, SGA's future would look a lot brighter.

    The episode was not without any problems, of course. The way some characters were introduced felt pretty jarring as they've never been mentioned before but our main characters still know them. With better planning we could have at least found out about their existence earlier. Also, some relationships such as Rodney/Katie and Sheppard/Tayla were yanked out of stasis rather abruptly. I know I'm not the most avid SGA fan, but were we supposed to know that Rodney's still actually dating Katie? Furthermore, Mike's scenes with Weir weren't my favourites, but I was happy to see how she handled herself in the end.

    I just wish the writers continued treating their characters like this in the future, but I remain skeptical. In any case, I'm happy to give the episode a scientifically accurate grade of

    9/10
    "I would rather have a show that a hundred people need to see than a thousand people like to see." - Joss Whedon
    "It's strange to have a creation out there: A deeply mutated version of yourself, running loose and screwing everything up. I wonder if this is how parents feel." - Dexter

    Comment


      Originally posted by Starxgate View Post
      Sunday is 318


      Mhh.. your math is wrong.. sorry ...

      SUBMERSION is 318
      VENGEANCE is 319
      FIRST STRIKE is 320

      As I know Atlantis series are only 20 eps.. not 21...

      Admins should change episodes numbers the right way... there is no logic in Sunday being 314....
      Last edited by Loredana; 16 January 2007, 06:14 AM. Reason: Wanted to say something more...

      Comment


        Well I'm gonna post my initial thoughts before I go back and read through the thread.

        Okay. So. I cried my eyes out. I admit it.

        Much as I wish we didn't have to lose Carson from the show, I have to admit that this was an incredibly powerful and emotional episode. I think what made it so was not just losing such a well-loved character (and well-loved by the character in the show, not just by the fans) but also the way in which it happened and the way we saw the aftermath of that. We've list people before in SGA (Grodin springs to mind) but it has always been in the heat of battle, in the midst of life and death situations and there has been no time to stop and greive. In this situation.. with his death happening in the midst of a time of relative peace and relaxation, we saw the impact on Carson's friends and colleagues in painful detail. Almost too painful.

        If I have one criticism of this episode it is on that point... in some ways I feel it perhaps tried a little too hard to pull at the heartstrings.. the explosion happening in slow-mo and Carson being swallowed up by the flames, the funeral scene that seemed to run just a little too long with repeated close-ups of pained faces, and the end scene... I di find that scene just a little too schmaltzy for my tastes.

        Overall though, once I'd got done with the heartfelt sobbing, I did very much enjoy this episode. Aside from the obvious aspect of it, there is much to enjoy in terms of character interaction and lovely little character moments. It was great to see the characters outside of their normal interactions. I *loved* the Shep 'n' Ronon show! I loved Rodney with Katie - nice to see some continuity there and even reference to their shared history.. though she does seem a taf shy and wilting for a man like Rodney? But hey, maybe he likes not having to be an arrogant ogre around her, eh? I loved how in his first scene with her he seemed so comfortable, not awkward for once. Sure, things got awkward over lunch but only because they got into discussing icky relationship stuff and that's enough to freak any man out!

        The shippery hints were intesting. I'm guessing the Sheyla shippers are feeling pretty happy right now and I admit I kinda interpreted things that way (and I get the feeling it was kinda intended to lean that way) but they still left it open enough that those who don't feel that way can imagine what they want... I know there has been a lot of discussion of late (and I really don't want to get into that here) of how people are frustrated with that but I kinda like keeping it kinda open for everyone...

        And hey, I bet the Shep/Ronon slashers are feeling pretty happy right about now too! It's all in the interpretation folks...

        I also rarther liked seeing Weir be a little bit girly and giddy in this ep.. thinking in particular of her conversation with Teyla. Loved that. Loved seeing that they have a close friendship where they meet for lunch and where Weir can talk to Teyla about being asked out by a guy etc etc... and why shouldn't she be allowed to be a bit giddy now and then eh? You can't be "on duty" and super-serious 24/7.

        Oh and Beckett (may he rest in peace *sobs*) teasing her in the hallway and being the little gossip was just wonderful. Knowing where the ep was ultimately leading, I did find myself watching Beckett's moments in it with a heavy heart and a growing sense of tension and sadness... by the time it came to operate I was clasping my hands and muttering "Oh no. Carson........." now and then..

        All in all, much to enjoy about this ep and it's certainly one I will watch many times... well, up to a certain point anyway. I can only handle so much weeping.... *sniffles sadly*
        sigpic

        Comment


          Originally posted by Loredana View Post
          your math is wrong
          I was close

          Comment


            Originally posted by Loredana View Post
            I admit I didn't read all posts about this episode... sorry if the subject was brought already, but why is Sunday considered still episode 314 when in The Ark Becket is still alive...

            I see now that Sunday is really 317....
            3x14 is I think the production number. They filmed the episodes out of order. That's why GW got news of that epi befor ethe other ones. It was just not changed back to the airing order then.
            Age is an issue of mind over matter...if you don't mind it doesn't matter

            ...Bonkers. But Brilliant...

            Comment


              LoL, I love how many see the episode as a great send off for Beckett and many don't. It's so interesting seeing the different interpretations and viewpoints.

              Comment


                Originally posted by Alipeeps View Post
                Oh and Beckett (may he rest in peace *sobs*) teasing her in the hallway and being the little gossip was just wonderful. Knowing where the ep was ultimately leading, I did find myself watching Beckett's moments in it with a heavy heart and a growing sense of tension and sadness... by the time it came to operate I was clasping my hands and muttering "Oh no. Carson........." now and then..
                I was the same everytime he came on i was trying to remember everything about him, screaming at the screen for Rodney to go with him or someone. I know i'm sad but with shows like this, you get to know the characters like a best friend. It's the same as losing them in real life. I cried at Janet, I cried at Daniel and I cried at Carson and if i'm still watching my S4, i'll properly cry for someone else. I don't know why i watch TV anymore i'm too soft

                Sig made by Suekay.

                Comment


                  I absolutely LOVED this episode.

                  Not every episode can be ACTIONACTIONACTIONALIENSWRAITHGUNS, and I'm glad that they took the time out to produce an episode like this, with so many great character moments. Because honestly? If you don't care about the characters in a show, you're not going to care about what happens to them, and it ultimately makes a show unwatchable.

                  OMG Carson. I was literally in tears during the last bit. TEARS.

                  And I'm not upset at how Carson died-- yes, I would rather something happened with Michael and Carson being held hostage or something, but when it comes to character, it makes more sense that he'd go out saving someone.

                  FANTASTIC episode.
                  McKay : (incredibly high pitched) HEEEY! IT'S MISTER MOM! How are the kids??

                  Zelenka: Do not even SPEAK to me.


                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Cailliath View Post
                    LoL, I love how many see the episode as a great send off for Beckett and many don't. It's so interesting seeing the different interpretations and viewpoints.
                    Besides the fact I didn't want Carson to be send off it was a dignified last episode for him. And I was nibbling on my fingernails the whole time cause i knew what was going to happen but not when (and boo at that vFX. didn't need that, kthxbai)
                    Age is an issue of mind over matter...if you don't mind it doesn't matter

                    ...Bonkers. But Brilliant...

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by billy_red_ocean View Post
                      Besides the fact I didn't want Carson to be send off it was a dignified last episode for him. And I was nibbling on my fingernails the whole time cause i knew what was going to happen but not when (and boo at that vFX. didn't need that, kthxbai)
                      Me too. I actually hid behind my hands when he was walking down the corridors on his lonesome because I was just waiting on it exploding. If only he could have handed the tumour over then immediately sprinted back to the infimary or something...lol.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by Cailliath View Post
                        LoL, I love how many see the episode as a great send off for Beckett and many don't. It's so interesting seeing the different interpretations and viewpoints.
                        Dont get me wrong, it was a good solid dramatic episode. The was nothing exceptoinal about the storyline, some of the scenes were great fun and the dialogue wasn't always great. I noticed Weir's Eulogy for him was almost the partyline of 'People die' we'll be fed. It was pretty hard NOT to be moved simply from the acting, you could tell the ACTORS themselves were upset. As David put it, they were all loosing a friend as well.

                        I had VERY mixed feelings through because it was so off. The weird time jumping, the pacing, the fun stuff didn't mix with the dramatic as well as it could. Seperately they were both good but I found that butt-joining them because of the time jumps made his death a little flippant.

                        At the end of the day, the problem I have personally is it was ultimate pointless. As a stand alone episode, pretty darn good, one of the best this season to a degree. As an episode that lead to the death of an important MAIN character....utterly pointless. The way they killed him was almost...an after thought, a....oh I cant think of a way to end this episode...ah ha! Not caring or thinking about any far reaching consquences to either the series OR the fans.

                        And they couldn't even WAIT to introduce his replacement character (if not the actress who will play her next season...or maybe later in this one). That to me says they really couldn't give a damn about Carson or Paul. He was nice when he was a shiny new toy, but they got bored of him and cast him away.
                        Last edited by TJuk; 16 January 2007, 06:54 AM.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by Jenner8675309 View Post
                          original. so was Jack.
                          Originally posted by HyperCaz View Post
                          John married? ARGH what a fraking cliche.
                          Why on earth is it a cliché to have Sheppard havng been married? What, cos no-one else in the world (or even the world of TV) ever does that? If anything, I would find it odd for a guy Sheppard's age - and with good looks and charm - not to have had at least one serious relationship.

                          And having a marriage in his past is unoriginal because Jack was married once too? Are you serious? So no-one in the show can be married or have been married because it's unoriginal because characters in SG1 are or were married?

                          Originally posted by TJuk View Post
                          His death was pointless. A waste. It meant nothing in the grand scheme of things to the storyline. There was no grand story arc. No 'disappearence'. And to be honest, very little meaning for the very episode except in specific scenes. It was almost like an evil after-thought to decide to kill him. Haha I bet the fans will hate this. Martin Gero I know you are reading this thread, can you at least give us the courtesy of explaining WHY?
                          But isn't that the point? Death is meaningless. And every day people die for stupid reasons, in pointless ways, people that don't deserve to die. Death is sudden and ugly and it takes you when you are least expecting it. If anything, that makes Carson's loss all the more poignant, all the more painful. is death is the more dramatic for being contrasted again such a happy, innocent occasion. If he'd died doing something larger than life and heroic, in the midst of some mighty struggle, then the drama of his death would have been caught up in that struggle (see Peter Grodin for details). As it was, Carson died when he least expected it, he died doing his job, saving lives no matter what.

                          Dr Carson Beckett. RIP. *sobs quietly*
                          sigpic

                          Comment


                            If Carson comes back to life I will be very annoyed. Not the fact that because its Carson that died but because of the fact dying & coming back to life has always been Daniels thing. If Carson comes back to life they might as well just nick name Carson Daniel Jackson Junior. If Carson comes back to life they have officially RUN OUT OF IDEAS for Stargate Atlantis.

                            Comment


                              Originally posted by Alipeeps View Post
                              But isn't that the point? Death is meaningless. And every day people die for stupid reasons, in pointless ways, people that don't deserve to die. Death is sudden and ugly and it takes you when you are least expecting it. If anything, that makes Carson's loss all the more poignant, all the more painful. is death is the more dramatic for being contrasted again such a happy, innocent occasion. If he'd died doing something larger than life and heroic, in the midst of some mighty struggle, then the drama of his death would have been caught up in that struggle (see Peter Grodin for details). As it was, Carson died when he least expected it, he died doing his job, saving lives no matter what.

                              Dr Carson Beckett. RIP. *sobs quietly*
                              If I want meaningless, pointless death I'll watch Battlestar Galactica and or the evening news. In this particular case, all it does is point out the utter meaninglessness of killing off a great character who was an asset to the show both on screen and off. I don't watch SGA to be reminded how people die in real life; I watch SGA as a brief holiday from real life.
                              sigpic

                              "And those who were seen dancing were thought to be insane by those who could not hear the music."
                              ~~Friedrich Nietzsche

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by Starxgate View Post
                                If Carson comes back to life I will be very annoyed. Not the fact that because its Carson that died but because of the fact dying & coming back to life has always been Daniels thing. If Carson comes back to life they might as well just nick name Carson Daniel Jackson Junior. If Carson comes back to life they have officially RUN OUT OF IDEAS for Stargate Atlantis.
                                ...but how to manage in SciFi no one ever dies otherwise? /sarcasm
                                Age is an issue of mind over matter...if you don't mind it doesn't matter

                                ...Bonkers. But Brilliant...

                                Comment

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