How did The Wraith defeat the Lantians??

[Buba uognarf]

I know this post hasnt seen a reply in ages but i wanted to start it up again to see what else we have found out about stargate atlantis.

I still wonder how they defeated the Ancients if the ancients found them on a planet sleeping. I also want to find out that if the ancients kept destroying the wraiths ships more just kept coming so where do they build/grow them? and why have they stopped at 61 hive ships (if i am wrong i am sorry).

i still need questions answers.

by the time the Wraith numbers dropped the lanteans were already sieged in atlantis with the Wraith still building and coming...they simply couldn't win so they fled

[DougDoug]

I know this post hasnt seen a reply in ages but i wanted to start it up again to see what else we have found out about stargate atlantis.

I still wonder how they defeated the Ancients if the ancients found them on a planet sleeping. I also want to find out that if the ancients kept destroying the wraiths ships more just kept coming so where do they build/grow them? and why have they stopped at 61 hive ships (if i am wrong i am sorry).

i still need questions answers.

I also have a problem with the defeat of the ancients by the wraiths. It just seems unlikely that it is possible given the level of technology and knowledge they had. Many have said that it was overwhelming numbers by the wraiths, I don't like that theory.

I have seen Atlantis up to middle of season 3 and haven't seen anything the wraiths have that could defeat the ancients.

[lightbringer]

so far the best explination iv come up with seems to fit whats been said in the series roughly but with a few made up bit shoved in

first the ancient lady in rising said something like "we came to a galaxy (pegasus) that seemed completely lifeless" (ancinet sensors cnt see wraith that are sleeping, if the iratus bug sleeps in the same fashoin that would explain why the galaxy seemed empty) "here we seeded new life in our form and stargates so fledgling civilisations could tade etc" now its unknown how the ancients went about doing this, but my guess would be some sort of device detonated in the atmosphere that spread the requiredmaterials and genetic coding across the planet, maybe some of this found its way into a iratus bug egg or preborn embrio and caused a mutation. now i doubt the ancinets (seeing as they'd of seen it before in the milkyway) would be bothered about sticking around and watching the next million years of evolution so probably retruned to the milky way ( this taking place before rising btw) or just staying the city, anyway in the mean time they ancients send recon ships to check up on the developement and one or more of these ships detects something odd and lands on a world to investigate, they get ambushed by the wraith who take thier ship and learn from it. as it is a research ship it contains bio enginering data and the wraith over time learn from this to make their ships. a few more thousand years go by and atlantis (fleeing the milkyway for whatever reason) arrives in the pegasus galaxy. they start exploring around and meeting the local people and after awhile stumble across a wraith world where the wraith r still sleeping and accidently awake them. not realising what they are at first they leave them be for the time being, everythings ok for awhile untill the ancients notice more and more humans are disappearing, they investigate, work out its the wraith and its thier fault, they try to work out a truce (maybe they knew of a way to feed the wraith without killing people but the wraith didnt find it as tasty) and it fails so they go to war, but the wraith have had plenty of time to grow enough ships and reporduce enough times to out number the ancients

it is possible that if a wraith queen like a insect queen can give birth to countless children at once then the wraith would only need a short amount of time to quickly out number the anicnets
imo tho i dont think we've encountered the child bearing kind of wrath yet, i think the queens are responsible for running the hives but theres a high layer of wraith yet to encounter that control all the hives collectivly, obviously due to the civil war they might not have awoken yet or are losing control of the hives

[female Wraith]

I know the Wraith Overwhelmed them by numbers and defeated them. But the question is if the Wraith Evolved they must of been weak to begin with. The Lantians must of had many ships so how come the Wraith was able to build so many Hive ships, cruisers, darts without the Lantians doing much. They must have a shipyard somewhere? If i was a Lantian and the Wraith started to feed on humans i would send Warships to destroy the ships they are building and kill the wraith from orbit. So how did the Wraith build so many ships. It takes time to build ships so it the Lantians plenty of time to find the shipyards and destroy them. Will we find out what happened and will we find a wraith ship yard?

Spoiler:

did the asuarns help the Wraith build their ships

Very interesting topic

Well ...we know from the Atlantis hologram that the Wraith outnumbered the Lanteans. But is this the truth?? Only because of its number they defeated the Ancients??? LOL. It sounds like a joke. I seriously doubted.
Why do you think that the Hives and the cruisers have been built after the Lanteans met the Wraith? The woman from the hologram said that they met a terrible enemy. So it is close to mund that the Wraith already HAD a fleet from hives and cruisers. As for the number of the ships the Wraith possess we only know that they have at least 60.
Till now we only know a few worlds in the Wraith teritory. We don't know what are their cities or their society. The image of the Wraith is based on the encounters with their military ships and the distant outposts. And just because we only know one side of them they are definite as monsters. In the same way the Indians in America called the Europeans monsters and killers without knowing what is the culture of these people .

I think the Wraith were just in one of the hybernation periods when the Lanteans found them. So the war with the Lanteans is just another war the Wraith fight. And I wonder were the Lanteans the first enemy whom the Wraith were at war? Hmmm...

[[SGC_ReplicÅtors]]

they were seeding life across the pegasus and when they seeded life most of the seeded cilizations where primitive i mean they used that god machine to give ppl cammands and tell them what to do pretty miuch building societys as they seeded... me thinks they seeded way way to fast and didnt have enough ppl running those god machines to effectivily nuture them into a developing society maybe one of these societys got owned by the irattus bug evolved a little bit and maybe over ran the populatoins while the machine was still running so maybe the ancients where building a wriath society never knowing they where wriath...and a couple 1000 years go buy they now have the technology and resources to build ships and use the stargate to over run other worlds...thats my thoery explains why wraith is similair to ancient

[panseywannabe]

To go a step further lets say the bug mixes human DNA into itself and we get primitive wraiths on one world. What would the ancients do with them?

In progeny they don’t immediately destroy the replicators they watch them and call it an experiment first to see where it is going. It is possible that the Lantinas did the same with the infant wraith race as well. It is even possible that they helped them advance through the use of the god machine, trying to find a way they could coexist peacefully with humans.

It maybe the Wraith didn’t steal any tech, maybe they were given it freely. The ancients assure that the galaxy is safe as long as the Wraith are on only one planet, not thinking ahead to the point where they become space faring and there population explodes with there access to new food sources

[DougDoug]

There are a few other issues I have with the Lantiens. For one thing the time lines and chronology are confusing and contradictory. For such a seriously advanced race they spent a lot of time running from one galaxy to another. I also question their wisdom, a race that has been around for 5 million to 30 million years, they have got a lot of things wrong.

How can they say the pegasus galaxy was lifeless, does that mean there was not in the probably 10 million solar systems (conservative) a planet with any type of microbes, plants, insects anything? That is unlikely, unless they meant civilisations or sentient beings. Even microbes or insects evolve. Humans probably began as a microbe in the hot waters of early earth 500 million years ago.

If you look at wraith technology it is more organic based, where as the lantens was crystal based. So I think the wariths more likely developed their own technology, but is still not at the level of the lantiens. If we relate wars at that level it is technology that would determine outcomes rather the being out numbered (unless the lantiens were awfully stupid). I can't seem to get my head around the "fact" that they were defeated by all accounts an inferior enemy.

I think we need to look closely at wraith culture and society, which we don't know enough about to get more answers.

[Hack]

Short explanation: They seeded life to study and didn't need to analyse every planet because there were so many humans to study.

Long (very LONG) explanation: (This is also sorta a reply to this thread

The ancients in general are a fairly stagnant race. They are quite possibly hundreds of millions of years old (from their most primitive tribe-like state in the Ori galaxy) but atleast several million years old.

The "ancients" could be considered I guess a bloodline. But they are not a unified civilisation. We can tell this from the design of their technology but it's just an assumption. This is a likely explanation for why they are so technologically (and socially), each itteration of the ancients is the left-over of those who did not ascend. If you consider that the concept of ascension has been available to them since their conflict with the Ori, and we have seen technology used to accelerate human evolution in both the MW and Pegasus galaxies I think we can pretty safely assume that ancients have been capable of ascension for about as long as they've been moving around galaxies.

So think about it this way, your parents died teaching you everything they knew about ascension and all your brothers and sisters ascend. You bring your children up with the ideals of your parents and ciblings but you never acheive ascension yourself. You die, leaving your children the same as your ciblings in knowledge, but completely different because they were never around to influnce them.

A further reason reason they remain stagnant then is that they are so concerned with ascension. The reason to seed life is to study it, to study evolution over long periods of time to understand their own evolution better. It would be a slow process too, your best scientists ascend and leave you with where their research left off, but you might have no comprehension of it as they were so close to ascension that their notes may not even make any sense (Tao of McKay?).

So you have a civilisation who advance their technology for ONE purpose, ascension. So imagine that they arrive in pegasus, absolutely NO intelligent life (which takes a long time to evolve). They seed thousands of planets with human life. The wraith evolve over hundreds of thousands of years, they mix with human DNA, which gives them more intelligence and as we can see, it wouldn't take them too long to take human form given enouch chances (late season 3 with michael). They may even possibly have mixed with ancient DNA (perhaps after MILLIONS OF YEARS of evolving they have some fundamental things in their genetic memory?) who have a penchant for technology.

The ancient ships probably weren't even made for war but research. They probably didn't even notice the wraith, who spread quickly but had to sleep because of a lack of understanding of the gate network and interstellar travel meant they couldn't find too many planets with appropriate food to eat.

So while they did evolve from the ancients, ancients scientists who finally got around to the wraith homeworlds to research could have got captured and tortured for information (using DNA from ancients they may even have gained some pre-ascension superhuman abilities like their psychic abilities). Thus "waking" the wraith. They copy the ancients, build ships as similar as they can but with the resources they know how to use.

This also explains why wraith ships don't use shields, the ancients primary weapon the drones (which haven't been changed since before they left earth "millions of years ago"). negate shields.

This covers several bases:

• Why the ancients aren't heaps more advanced and seem to **** up with incredibly advanced technology.
• That the "predator" evolved AFTER the "prey".
• That they ancients could still have "woken" the wraith, even though they evolved slowly, because they were too preoccupied with ascension research and probably never thought intelligence would evolve so quickly.
• Why the ancients were so few in number (I mean, we humans seem to spread as quickly as a virus, don't see why they wouldn't), if they were so focused on ascension research that family probably wasn't top priority (Afterall, with living for such a long time they had plenty of time if their research was unsuccesful).

I had to infer a lot from the shows, but they pepper the shows with enough information that something like this is reasonable.

[Boxytheboxed]

I dont think the Wraith won. I think the Lantians left. The anchents knew how to make ZedPMs, so why didnt they make 10, and hook them up to atlantiis. I think the Lantians were waiting for the Wraith to give up, but they gave up. If the Anchents really wanted to, they could have made millions of drones, and hooked them up to extra ZedPMs(not the ones powering Atlantis) and fired them, killing all of the hives. But they were sissies, and did not want to

[Buba uognarf]

I dont think the Wraith won. I think the Lantians left. The anchents knew how to make ZedPMs, so why didnt they make 10, and hook them up to atlantiis. I think the Lantians were waiting for the Wraith to give up, but they gave up. If the Anchents really wanted to, they could have made millions of drones, and hooked them up to extra ZedPMs(not the ones powering Atlantis) and fired them, killing all of the hives. But they were sissies, and did not want to

utter rubbish!!!!!!!!!!! Z.P.M's do not grow on trees! neither do drones....they lost and entire galaxy to the Wraith and ran away to escape destruction they knew they couldn't win...don't be one of these people who think that the ancients were sissies it really ticks me off it's complete BS (no offense is meant to anyone) they eradicated the asurans created countless weapons in an attempt to beat the Wraith and they failed...

you say why didn't they build this an that, well when you're under siege you can't get the resources! they were unable to find what they needed to build the Z.P.M's and drones so they ran away to escape...

[TraGisK^]

we dont know if they really made Wraith, but seems to my those bugs feed on u to you become one of them.
meaby they learn all thats is to know from the person that gets feed on.
so feed on a lantians and get the informasjon u need build alot of ships.
Anyway Lantians(That really was the supior Race wouldnt fight many wars before Wraith.)
So They Woulndt be Ready For a War, not a miltary race like We Humans are.
So lantians was off guard, Wraiths Savage.

[andrewcool]

The Lantians had a policy of not interfering with the humans, and other species.
So therefore, they didn't interfere till it was too late.

[Lord Anubis]

nice interesting points i hope we do find out more in season 4. Like the wraith said

Spoiler:

who fed off sheppard

there is still alot that you do not know about the wraith. so hopefully we do find out or maybe the producers believe that they have covered it and we will not go back their. who knows?

[wise one]

Its easy the wraith said to the ancients that PIE...is exactly 3!(not 3.141.......)

and then they all exploded!!!

[ussrelativity]

Its easy the wraith said to the ancients that PIE...is exactly 3!(not 3.141.......)

and then they all exploded!!!

You must have gotten that off of a Simpsons episode.