Epiphany (212)

[xfkirsten]

I'm surprised there's not been much talk of place as a sanctuary from the Wraith.

I was actually thinking about that the other day. I mean, if it really comes down to a matter of survival, that's always an option for the people of Atlantis. It would have to be a last resort because of the one-way thing, I think (while McKay says he can shut it down from inside, I don't know that Weir would let him do so anyways). But I think that's definitely important to bear in mind!

[caty]

Well, it would be creepy if we weren't all so enamored of it. It's hard to be scared of the thing when your fingers are itching to muss it up.

And I think we'd better stop there and leave the rest to the thunkers.

Sadly, though, I honestly can't think of anything else to say about this episode.

...

Okay, I got it!

I spent a little time trying to figure out the spatial relationship between the cave, the village, and the possibly two fields that both reminded everyone of the one in "Duet." This was set off by Sheppard's offhand comment about having gone on a ten-mile(?) run and his later sprint to the team's rescue. Even factoring in cut time, it just seems... silly to think Sheppard ran more than a couple miles to get to his friends. And, what's more, the villagers apparently followed Sheppard---after having some sort of revelatory conversation or mind meld, I'm sure---at a stately walk.

So, working my retconning skills, I came up with the following points:

The key is to assume the field where Sheppard ran into Avrid is different from the one the rest of the team was crossing at the end. For clarity, the first is Field A, the second Field B. (Not very creative names, I know, but I'm tired.)

Now, the cave is between Field A and the village. Field B, on the other hand, is between the cave and the village.

(Note that when I say "between" I don't necessarily mean on a straight line. These places could also be located triangularly.)

When Sheppard left the cave to forage, he either went away from the village directly toward Field A, where he ran into Avrid, or circled gradually outward from the cave and happened to be in Field A when he ran into Avrid. He might have done either, but the latter has the benefit of being more military, IMO. However, if he did circle, Field A is closer, maybe a great deal closer, to the cave than the village; that ensures Sheppard wouldn't have run across the village while circling outward.

At any rate, with Field A on the far side of the cave away from the village, Teer's remark that Avrid carried Sheppard "halfway across the sanctuary" is plausible. As is Sheppard's ten-mile run. (Especially if he got lost for a stretch, lol.)

When the team left the cave to search for Sheppard and the Ancient power source, they went toward the village in the direction of Field B. If it's assumed the villagers walked the distance, Field B is fairly close to the village.

Ta-da! That was a lot of explanation for a simple concept, but I don't have the skill to draw it and post the image. And, as geeky and obsessive as it is, it's not off-topic! Yay!

Actually, he said 10-hour run... But otherwise, your explanation sounds like you know what you're talking about... Do you?

[Yeade]

Ah! A ten-hour run! Thanks for the correction. All I could remember was that, whatever he said, it was hard to match with his later rush to the team's rescue.

As for whether I know what I'm talking about or not... Honestly? No, not really.

I mean, all this was probably filmed on the same field, right? And somehow I don't think TPTB sat down and drew a map of where everything was situated, then filmed with that in mind.

So, really, I'm making stuff up, but that's what I do.

[watcher652]

What's actually more plausible is just that within the one field, you have the stronger time dilation effect closer to the village. So at the entrance to the cave, the field dilate time by a factor of about 250X. However, Ronan said it was only a couple of hours while Sheppard said something like 6 months (this would mean the dilation is 2200X). The theory that the field is stronger would easily justify this discrepancy as well as how Sheppard got to the rest of the team that fast.

Ooh, I thought of that, too! I'm glad I'm not the only one.

Funny how we try to make continuity and logic where there is none!

[Shep'sSocks]

I was actually thinking about that the other day. I mean, if it really comes down to a matter of survival, that's always an option for the people of Atlantis. It would have to be a last resort because of the one-way thing, I think (while McKay says he can shut it down from inside, I don't know that Weir would let him do so anyways). But I think that's definitely important to bear in mind!

Of course, it depends on whether the Wraith know about it and can do nothing. Recall that the Atlantis shield would only hold for so long because of the bombardment.

[prion]

Ah! A ten-hour run! Thanks for the correction. All I could remember was that, whatever he said, it was hard to match with his later rush to the team's rescue.

As for whether I know what I'm talking about or not... Honestly? No, not really.

I mean, all this was probably filmed on the same field, right? And somehow I don't think TPTB sat down and drew a map of where everything was situated, then filmed with that in mind.

I think he sorta said ten hour run as he was out there for ten hours, but running for that amoutn of time? Uh, no. Probably walked/ran and jogged for that time period, so figure five hours to the 'portal' and five back, and that would have meant that when the rest of the gang came to rescue them, the probably had trekked at least a few hours (suprised McKay wasn't kevetching loudly). Plus, he said he finally found his weapons (figure that would take a few minutes as he may not quite remember where the beast beat him up) and the weapons flew and the grass was tall... and then how much time did he spend puttering around the cave until he found the knapsack?

I swear, all the fields and trees look the same becuase they probably are.

I've watched the ep several times and even with the flaws (logic, not enough Shep backstory at least for me), I really do like it.

[ToasterOnFire]

Read this! Just the first paragraph should be enough to make anyone understand how Beckett's retrovirus isn't an impossibility, especially considering the advanced ancient resources on biology he has at his disposal.

Oh, I'm well aware of what a retrovirus is. Medical science is working on retroviral therapy today, but the success rate is much, MUCH lower than the 40% on Atlantis and the effect tends to wear off rather rapidly. I can fanwank that one away though, because indications are that retroviral therapy will be much more successful in the future.

It's the concept of removing bug DNA to turn wraith into humans that really baffles me. One would assume that the resulting RNA and proteins from bug and human DNA interact with each other rather than working completely separately. Therefore, removing the bug DNA would likely have a dangerous to deadly result rather than simply transforming the wraith into a human. (example: theory indicates that mitochondria used to be a different organism. Insert a retrovirus to destroy the DNA from that organism = no mitochondria = dead.)

[xfkirsten]

Of course, it depends on whether the Wraith know about it and can do nothing. Recall that the Atlantis shield would only hold for so long because of the bombardment.

True. I guess it depends on how long the shield would hold out on the power that they have. I got the impression that the Wraith did not know about it - or at least did not bother to try because of the shield (much like the planet in Childhood's End).

[mgbland]

Comparing "Epiphany" to "A Hundred Days," I hope Sheppard didn't sleep with the girl and leave her the way O'Neill did.

As you can see, I have to wait another month plus.

[ToasterOnFire]

Comparing "Epiphany" to "A Hundred Days," I hope Sheppard didn't sleep with the girl and leave her the way O'Neill did.

As you can see, I have to wait another month plus.

Hmmm...the way the scene cut after they kissed left that kind of open...

...can ascended beings have babies?

[Shep'sSocks]

True. I guess it depends on how long the shield would hold out on the power that they have. I got the impression that the Wraith did not know about it - or at least did not bother to try because of the shield (much like the planet in Childhood's End).

More likely the Childhood's End scenario though if they thought that people were taking refuge there they'd bombard it pretty damn quick.

[Shep'sSocks]

Hmmm...the way the scene cut after they kissed left that kind of open...

...can ascended beings have babies?

I find that faintly squickish.

[Easter Lily]

Hmmm...the way the scene cut after they kissed left that kind of open...

...can ascended beings have babies?

Beings of pure energy having offspring?! Ascendlets... or is it ascendings?
I very much doubt it, somehow...

[Shep'sSocks]

Ascendlings.

[SGalisa]

Originally posted by SGalisa:
would someone please describe what was going on with Shep's hands and body's reaction vs. his mind - that his physical and mental entities were experiencing some sort of time reaction shift?

Originally posted by Yeade:
Are you referring to when Sheppard first got sucked into the portal? As I understand it, the process hurt him because he crossed the threshold slowly, resisting and later being pulled back by Ronon and Teyla. This way, his body noticeably experienced the difference in time flow as opposed to the team quickly stepping through later.

yes, that is what I meant (*thank you*). People kept mentioning it, and, so, trying to imagine it without having the details before seeing it - is a bit of a challenge...

Originally posted by ToasterOnFire:
...can ascended beings have babies?

I personally prefer them to stay as they are -pure energy beings with the ability to look human and vice versa again... less complicated. Otherwise, the stories might end up similar to those biblical rumors that a certain group of angels were making babies with humans, and the resulting newborns got wiped out of existence.

might be better not going down that path... the Ori and Priors (of SG1) are plenty enough for the galaxies to deal with...