Instinct (207)

[TheGreatCatOfRe]

Not necessarily. She could have "ordered" him to go help, she could have asked him if he thought Shep was likely to survive and had him base his decision on that, she could have told him to make an exception in this case. I just think that leaving the door wide open like that is a dangerous move.



It has a LOT to do with it when the person is question is likely to haul off and shoot/attack someone because he doesn't like him or because he's tired of listening or simply because he felt like it.

I had a post somewhere about how Ronon is still re-adapting to life among other people. Found it:


And the rest of the post (to put it into context) can be found here.

Basically, what might be "acceptable behavior" when you're on your own isn't necessarily acceptable when you're part of a group and in my opinion, Ronon needs to re-learn all that stuff before his decision-making can be completely trusted. And until that time, ordering him to do (or not to do ) something is the best way to keep him in check. That's how I see it, anyway.



I'm not saying that every decision she makes is selfish or that she's never right to do what she does, but the "us vs. them" attitude I keep picking up on occasion bothers me. As I said, though, that's strictly my opinion.

Oy ok...I'm going to say this again. SG1, Shep even Weir has disobeyed orders, that is what they do, that is how they get the job done. In reality these people wouldn't be in these sensitive positions because they can't follow orders, but that is what this show is about...why would anyone expect these "aliens" to obey orders when Shep usually goes his own way! Again, how many medals has SG1 received thru the years after they have disobeyed orders, held senators at gunpoint etc etc...I mean come on!

[Steve_the_Wraith]

Personally I like how Teyla has her own agenda sometimes - Afterall shes more of an Ally then a member of the expedition.

Teyla isn't from the MW and has had to live her whole life under the shadow of the wraith. LfP was good because it shows that Teyla hasn't lost her identity as an Athosian. Sometimes in season 1 it was almost like she fitted in alittle too well becoming too much of an earthling.

[smushybird]

Her agenda might be of her own, but none at all selfish, she always care about other's well being

I like her and her moral values.

Sabre

Yes, she's finally becoming a complex and interesting character. It's good to see.

[PartyLikeIts1984]

Not to change the subject or anything, but someone earlier asked why the Wraith couldn't feed of of cows and why Elia couldn't have fed off of woodland creatures. I'm assuming it's because they are part human. I think it's safe to assume that they need something or are missing something from their human biology that they get when they feed.

Besides, if they could live off cows, why wouldn't they. Sadism aside, your average cow puts up a lot less fight than, say, Teyla.

BTW, that reminds me...when are we going to find out why Ronan was let go? I know I'm veering way off topic, but if I remember, the Wraith either couldn't or didn't feed off Ronan. Hrmmmm...

[ / rambling ]

[prion]

Not to change the subject or anything, but someone earlier asked why the Wraith couldn't feed of of cows and why Elia couldn't have fed off of woodland creatures. I'm assuming it's because they are part human. I think it's safe to assume that they need something or are missing something from their human biology that they get when they feed.

Besides, if they could live off cows, why wouldn't they. Sadism aside, your average cow puts up a lot less fight than, say, Teyla.

BTW, that reminds me...when are we going to find out why Ronan was let go? I know I'm veering way off topic, but if I remember, the Wraith either couldn't or didn't feed off Ronan. Hrmmmm...

[ / rambling ]

They established in a season one episode that Wraith are persnickedly. Humans or nothing. Sheppard tried feeding "steve" other live critters but he wouldn't touch them. I believe the Wraith are genetically geared to dine on humans.

If the Wraith could live off cows, well, then, we wouldn't have the show then

[smushybird]

right back at you! Honestly, if the life sciences were a cakewalk, would McKay have washed out of freshman biology?

Maybe dissecting kitties was too traumatic for him. Cats seem to be (along with, briefly, one dog) the only friends he's appeared to have in his entire life.

Yeah! Why not a cow? Why not suck the life energies out of a big juicy cow?

Maybe because the wraith are part human, only human energies are compatible with their needs.

[cybergaki]

[QUOTE=ShadowMaat]Personally, I'm beginning to suspect that Teyla doesn't really respect Atlantis authority, be it Shep, Weir, or anyone else. She "plays along" like a good little guest, but when push comes to shove, she's going to go with what SHE thinks is best, and damn all the consequences. Seeing Shep disobey orders may have been a factor, but I think the fact that she's a leader of her people reduced to secondary status plays just as big (if not bigger) a role in how she decides things.

The first thing I thought of when she said that was LfP and how she got all pissy about the people of that planet and basically forced Shep into trying to rescue them. HER agenda always comes first and Atlantis is just an afterthought.

The feeling I get from her, both in this ep and Trinity (and others) is basically, "They're a nice group of people, but they don't really understand us." Which may well be true, but it doesn't mean I have to like her attitude about it, particularly when she's telling a half-wild man with barely-controlled impulses that "sometimes it's OK to disobey orders." Those orders are sometimes the only thing that keep him in check, and leaving it up to his judgement to decide which orders to follow is, in my opinion, an incredibly bad idea. Maybe eventually it would be a topic to broach, but not while he's still re-adapting to "civilized" life.
QUOTE]

Hmm. Teyla as a rule seems almost preternaturally calm to me, a good quality for a diplomat and leader. Even in anger, she has a centered quality. Really. I am surprised she didn't give Ronon a knee where it really hurts after the incident in Trinity. Friends don't use unwitting friends to extract revenge. I agree with you on her comments to Ronon about obeying orders. Ronon needs orders. His own judgement isn't the best right now. I would be curious as to what Ronon was like as a raw recruit, and just what this Task Master relationship entailed. He appears to be settling down a bit, but he still took off running on his own when he spotted Elia, and then there was the biscuit incident.

I can't comment on the life sciences things. I am a grad student in primatology. Not biochemistry or physics. But I don't expect the science to be totally accurate. SGA's primary purpose is to entertain and it does that very well.

[.Ra.]

Very sad story. Reminded me of ancient Greek tragedies. No matter how you try, your fate's gonna get you. Good candidate for the most cruel Stargate episode.

[SGalisa]

McKay again, cutie pie. His scene with the boy reminded me of both Childhood's End and my someone I know and me. me, as the proverbial *why* kid. McKay's whole attitude responses sounded and looked like a splitting image of this other person. Short tempered sentences, and the classic "Why ME?!" look complete with an irritated "What?!!" (sounds just like a crow "what?! what?!") - guilty conscience. ...it was *too* funny, and so very accurate!

And shortly after with McKay's conversation with Sheppard about Ronon tracking 1 wraith in about 100 square miles of forest...

McKay: (snidely) "And exactly how is he gonna do that?!"
Ronon: (in the distance and helpful) "...helps to have good hearing."
Sheppard: (while grinning... Shep lightly bops Rodney up the side of his head without verbally saying "D'uh!"
...Ronon=good hunting guard, remember?)

Well, if anything, at least McKay learned to listen for strange sounds in the end. Beckett was oblivious, but McKay's senses were quite acute. Must be from being alone with Beckett - both so "overly confident" as McKay muttered. If not that, then Rodney's honing instincts kicked in from the Wraith factor.
========

Ronon looking like perfect camoflage in forest, while seeking out the 2nd wraith. He stood so perfectly still like a tree stump and true hunter, that the first time I saw this I didn't realize that was him, until the camera stopped with Sheppard and refocused onto Ronon...

And speaking of camera:
EXCELLENT use of *smooth* panning (camera) sequences in forest scenes!!
...how to get a point across in motion, without making this viewer dizzy.

========

It's amazing how easy it is to forget about the whole aging problem with the wraith feeding on humans... I forgot. I was more focused on that bug retro virus being contagious at the end, there.

Beckett called the *cling-on* bug that attached itself to Shep an "ewraithus bug" or "prewraithus bug"?

Having new anxiety fits over seeing Shep's (next ep) previews from that feeding session. Elia tried to feed on him, but not Teyla, which is why Teyla wasn't affected, too?

Beckett better find a cure ...FAST! (*whimpering sounds*!!)
and no dawdling.

Reminds me of the mad scientist syndrome, but unintentionally.

Originally posted by Shivan:
And the ending, what a cliffhanger.

suggestion: if Sci-Fi ever does a Season 2 SGA marathon, they should combine this episode with "Conversion" (back to back), because:

Spoiler:

the retro-virus is initially explained in this ep first, and is also where Shep gets injured (according to the next preview TV commercials). Well, some of us now know how he finally gets turned into a bug in the first place!

(double *eek!* and in increased angsty mode!!)

[Whistler84]

You have all made some good points...but IMO
Teyla knows John and she knows that he will risk his life to save others...
she saw that there was no reasoning with this girl and that Sheppard's life was in danger....So, what was she to do...Let Ronan follow the orders and let Sheppard die...of coarse not...She knew that his life was in danger and not hers...She knew that Ronan was his only chance of surviving from Ellia...She acted not like a military, but like a human being who cares about her team members and realizes when a decision has to be made in order to weigh what is best for every situation...That is what a leader does...there will always be exceptions to the rule...and you will always have to deal with the consequences...She obviously cared more about Shep's safety than following a direct order...In addition, since she has been in Atlantis, all she has seen is people breaking orders and accusing one another and everyone protecting their own interests...She has seeing it in McKay, she has seeing in with Weir, she has seen it with Bates...everyone in Atlantis has their own agenda...If she is following anyone's example, it is Sheppard who always follows the chain of command until the moment that he feels that he is right...but always doing it to save the lives of others and not of his own...Thererefore, I think Teyla did the right thing....and she had the right frame of mind and the right attitude...I would have done the same....Would anyone say they wouldn't have done the same if they were in her situation...Oh, yes Ronan, forget about Sheppard and stay here taking care of me....AHHHHHHHHH..... Again, JMO

My problem isn't so much that she told Dex to go after him, but how she did it. By all means, have Dex run after Sheppard. I don't want John to die anymore than the next fellow. But, Teyla simply didn't tell Dex to go after John, she gave him *explicit* permission to disobey-at-will in the future. Why couldn't she have simply said, "Well, I'm fine, thanks. You're free to go after Sheppard now." That wouldn't have counteracted John's command (of Dex staying with Teyla to make sure she's alright), and would have produced the same results of saving John's life.

But no, she chooses to impart a certain wisdom with it. A wisdom, I personally, don't agree with. "You can disobey orders when you want to." Yes, others in SGA have done it. And every time, I generally didn't like what happened because there was tension between all parties involved. Tension and mistrust in their situation can have devastating effects (Hello, 'Trinity' people!).

[FoolishPleasure]

Oh come on, she said those people were like family to her, don't you think you would get "all pissy" is your "commander" (who don't forget is the reason for the encreased amount of cullings) didn't want to help rescue your loved ones? HER Agenda seems to involve saving lives if you ask me in both "Letters from Pegasus" and "Instinct".

LFT has been argued to death. . .mostly in the episode thread, but that is the episode that killed any caring I had for Teyla, and I find Shadow "dead on" with her post - "everyone" is family to Teyla. Unfortunately, Teyla's attitude put not only the few she wanted to save in jeopardy, but all her own people back home, the Atlantis folks. . she put everyone in danger by forcing Sheppard to help.

I've only recently taken to liking Teyla a "bit" - but only due to her interactions with Ronon - they have a lot in common, they understand the enemy, they are both confused by "us". But telling Ronon that sometimes it is okay to disobey orders is dangerous. He is such an "unknown" and apt to fly off the handle so easily, that giving him "permission" to disobey may come back to bite her. It shows that even Teyla still doesn't have respect for Sheppard. It just isn't "okay" to disobey your CO just because YOU feel it is right to do so. Teyla may not be military, but she IS a leader, and a good leader would understand that concept.

[lily]

Great episode! I loved it. So sad, mostly... By the time it ended, I was in tears.

We had some fun, though. Like McKay getting annoyed at kids, and Sheppard smacking McKay. LOL. The later reminded me of another show (NCIS), where Gibbs always smacks Dinozzo in the head

I was surpised when I found out that Elia's father was 34. I guess now it seems obvious, but I didn't see it coming at that moment.

Loved the whole story.


I can't wait for "Conversion"!

[Easter Lily]

Personally I like how Teyla has her own agenda sometimes - Afterall shes more of an Ally then a member of the expedition.

Teyla isn't from the MW and has had to live her whole life under the shadow of the wraith. LfP was good because it shows that Teyla hasn't lost her identity as an Athosian. Sometimes in season 1 it was almost like she fitted in alittle too well becoming too much of an earthling.

But what is her identity as an Athosian? That is still the biggest problem I have with Teyla. Where is she getting all this ideology from?
After all this time, I still don't really know all that much about Athosians even though there's one that resides permanently in Atlantis. I agree wholeheartedly that she does fit in far too well into earth life... something that I've said more times than I care to count.
If, as others are arguing, that she is picking up bad habits from Sheppard, then it isn't especially Athosian trait is it?... to disobey orders, that is... Also I find her actions rather inconsistent (probably more the fault of the writing). In Suspicion, she tells Weir she understands why she had to do what she did as a leader in the entire fiasco but by the time, Letters comes along, she gets stroppy with Sheppard because he is following Weir's orders. Leaders know that sometimes they have to consider the bigger picture, like security issues, for the greater good. It's a terrible thing to have to play the numbers game but there's a lot at stake here. (Something that is explored superbly in BSG) I don't know if it is a particularly Athosian trait to have pity or sympathy... which she assumes Sheppard doesn't have just because he chooses to follow orders or see the big picture.
Teyla, IMO, is all over the shop... I don't understand her or where she's coming from. We are never given a real understanding of what drives her. She maybe a leader of her people but lately she isn't showing much understanding about the difficulties of leadership.
I agree with Whistler... I don't have a problem with Teyla trying to persuade Ronon to help Sheppard... but she could have used a different tact. She knows better than anyone that the guy is a loose cannon and she tells him in no uncertain terms that they can pick and choose which orders to follow?!! If that isn't asking for trouble, I don't know what is. As for her picking up bad habits from Sheppard... what does that say about her then... That she's easily led? That she has no mind of her own? I don't know what is worse, saying that Teyla is weak-minded and impressionable or that she's a closet loose cannon. Either way, it doesn't sound good, does it?

[kaz]

I didn't like this episode at all. It seemed...choppy, maybe? I guess it just didn't click. "Conversion" looks really interesting though.

I for 1 Agree I did not like the episode because it was flat, pure and simply flat.
The story could have been written a lot better and I'm sorry I don't see why we the fans should loose a potentially great ep so the writers can "set up" for another episode down the line. I have noticed it recently that although the actors are brilliant as always the stories have been progressively missing something.

That something is what we all watch it for and Instinct to me was sad in the respect that I kept waiting for that thing you get in Stargates, weather its a sparkle, a catch, just the bit that jumps out and grabs your attention.

Still was waiting as the credits rolled......................

[entil2001]

After the character development in the previous epsiode, the writers seem to have slipped into less-complicated territory this time around. At first, I thought it was just an example of measured pacing. The story seemed rather simple, so some stylistic progression was certainly in order. Unfortunately, it never really took hold, and the episode just never seemed to want to go anywhere. Most of the plot twists were highly predictable, and while the producers promised an in-depth look at the development of a young Wraith, it didn’t go very deeply into the topic.

Was anyone really surprised when Wraith Girl turned out to be feeding off her “father”, or when she admitted that she was using the other Wraith to cover her own killings? I know I wasn’t, because I saw it coming a mile away. It was also clear that nothing was going to save Wraith Girl, because that would require Beckett’s treatment to work perfectly and eliminate any sign of her Wraith heritage. Otherwise, the town would still tear her to pieces.

What this episode did feel like, in the end, was a thinly-veiled example of exposition. The writers would do this sort of thing all the time in the first season. Beckett’s treatment to eliminate Wraith DNA is central to the plot thread for Lt. Ford, but it also has larger implications. This episode establishes the fact that the treatment is still in development, and that it doesn’t work yet. More importantly, it actually seems to have accelerated the effect of the genetic imperatives of the Wraith DNA.

That, in turn, leads into what I assume was the entire point of the episode: making sure that Sheppard was “injected” with the Beckett Treatment Cocktail that was running around in Wraith Girl’s unstable biology. Without seeing spoilers or even the promo (which my TiVo cut off, damn it!), I can safely predict that this will lead to problems with Sheppard in the near future. From there, of course, I expect that Sheppard will get a better feel for Ford’s psychology and that Beckett’s ability to trace Sheppard’s reaction to the treatment will lead to a more successful version later in the season.

I just wish that there was more to the actual episode, and that it didn’t feel like one big exposition dump. Granted, there were some good points. Teyla was more than just another very pretty face for once, and her rapport with Wraith Girl was nice to see. I also feel like Ronon’s psychology is getting a bit easier to understand: he finds a certain comfort in following orders, as he gains a sense of the chain of command and its pure intentions. His bad-ass moment worked for me (my wife made a comment on how she likes his gun; take that as you will).

Jewel Staite did a great job as Wraith Girl, even if I wish we could have seem that gorgeous smile now and again. (I guess I’ll have to wait a few weeks for “Serenity”!) McKay was mostly in a support role this time, and that served to give the writers a chance to reveal his post-“Trinity” attitude. Sheppard also seemed to be recovering, because his sense of humor wasn’t entirely back in action.

Underneath the episode is a relatively safe discussion on nature vs. nurture and the Wraith. This time, nature wins, hands down. Ironically, as much as this should make the Wraith seem that much more dangerous and daunting an enemy, the revitalized “SG-1” has developed an enemy so much more disturbing that the Wraith look minor in comparison. It’s hard, sometimes, to remember how overwhelming they were during “The Siege”. Hopefully, the writers won’t wait long to remind us why the Wraith were so cool in the first place.