John Sheppard/Teyla Emmagan Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[CeeKay Sheppard]

i hope it made a small smile on your face(?)...

It certainly did!

of course CeeKay....

Thankies! *bounces off to go snurch*

[vaberella]

I just read what I wrote..and I am not sure if I am making any sense...I am sure VB...or Ritter will tell me if I am coherent or not!

But, here are my final thoughts..for now anyways, headache still here bothering me...

Spoiler:

I see this as the first time of both of them confessing that they do have very strong feelings for each other...it's not a declaration of undying love but it is certainly a beginning of what can and might happen...John is looking for Teyla's approval and acceptance..he is asking her and telling her that he wants them to be okay...he wants her to be okay with him...now, why would this bother him, concern him, worry him if it wasn't because he holds Teyla more dearly to his heart than he should....it's okay for him to want her to be okay with this, but the difference being is the fact that number one..of all the things happening at that time and all of the things that he has to do, he goes after her and chases her to make sure his point is made clearly to her and to hear her response...if this was just a question of him being concerned for her opinion, then it was certainly something that could have waited for him to say to her later on after things were said and done...afterall, he doesn't owe her any explanations, but the fact of the matter is, it is so important for him to let her know that this had to be okay with her...that he cannot wait to make sure that this is okay with her..and that she is okay..that they are okay..it reminds me again...of their conversation in Conversion...after the kiss..it is so important for him to have Teyla feel comfortable with him..their relationship is important to him...and he cares about what she thinks and how she feels about him......not only that, but think about this, he knows that this is a new Alliance is very dangerous....they are about to bring in the Wraith into Atlantis...anything could happen, so it's almost as if he wants things straightened withher before anything else..he is placing her more important at that moment, than even the things that he has to do...if anything goes wrong, at least he knows that Teyla and him are okay with one another... ...with each other..in my view, that is an expression of someone who clearly has more than just friendship in their mind and cares more for the person than led on to believe...he couldn't have possibly declare his undying love cause they are not at this point, yet...but certainly this is an act of love..a love that is so important to him that he puts everything on hold...even in the time when he needs to be concentrating on the events occurring in Atlantis..now, I am not saying that he is not doing his job and that it is interferring with his duties, it is not..clearly he proved throughout the rest of the episode that he is so in control of the situations, but if you also notice, for the rest of the episode, he seemed more at ease with the decision, and more ready to face the consequences, because Teyla is fine with it! Okay, so I had to throw that in there.... but seriously, does that make any sense?

Teyla's admission...for me is so very telling..more than she has ever said...again...she is such a soulfoul woman...she is so strong willed and assured of her actions and never questions when she needs to state her opinion, and yet for Sheppard she put all of her trust in him.....and clearly the way she said it, she was talking about Sheppard...she put her life, her beliefs, her own doubts and fears aside for Sheppard......she not only trusted him but acted upon and followed everything that he told her to do...clearly the reason why Sheppard kept such a close eye on her in Michael and we can safely even assume why when he wasn't around, Ronon was close by to her...all I can assume part of John's way of watching out for her...

Again, this is how I see it..and once my headache is gone, I can probably conjured up some more things....

Now, the whole,

Spoiler:

grandkids thing...again...I see this as a connection to everything else that he has said....John wants a family and sees marriage and kids in the works...so, again, the whole kirking thing..must be a passing thing..because someone who is planning for a family and kids wouldn't want to cheat on his wife...and I don't see Sheppard as the type...so, if he really wanted to continue with and was fond of the kirking for longer, he wouldn't be thinking of a future family...so, kirking right now, then is YES, a weakness..but I still think he is projecting his feelings for Teyla and second, the times of the kirking have all been because of either the women come to him or that he is after all, like Trippy and others have stated, single and doesn't need to feel any shame or guilt...

If we go back to Chilhood's End, he refers to the kid that was going to give in to the sacrifice, that he does want a family and children in the future..If I am not mistaken when he goes to the barricades in Underground, isn't he the one that asks McKay about the radiation and Mckay says something about if you want to have kids..or something to that effect...and then he mentions it again...but I can't remember when..but now in this episode he mentions grandkids...now you have to think about the context and the way he says it..he was referring to when the Queen said, it wasn't going to affect them in their lifetime, when they would run of out Wraith humans to feed and then would have to rely on feeding with humans again.....now I belive he is the one that brings it up in the first place...which tells me...that number one...as I've stated before and others here as well...John is not planning on going back to Earth even after all this is over..he has found a home in the Pegasus Galaxy...and he plans on remaining there...now, this is interesting because although he doesn't say it's with Teyla..you can't help but wonder who would he be so sure of that would stay in the Pegasus Galaxy..now if people think it's Weir..how can he be sure that Weir will be willing to stay in the Pegasus Galaxy? clearly she has gone back and forth to Earth and has family and connections there...and why would he be so sure that she would stay in this galaxy...? he doesn't..and so, he couldn't have been thinking that Weir is the grandmother of his grandkids...now, others say, Chaya...we don't know what the Ancients are capable of and as far as my knowledge he isn't communicating with Chaya at all since Sanctuary...they;ve made reference to the kids in Childhood's end which show that they go back there to check up on them, but you never hear of Chaya's planet been visited by him or anyone else...so it can't be Chaya..so there are only two other options, John is thinking of Teyla who for sure is remaining on the Pegasus Galaxy or he is counting on marrying some alien girl.....cause even if he is thinking of an Earthling in Atlantis, who's to say that she would agree to remain in Atlantis..? again, when he obviously doesn't have anyone in mind...so, I think it's pretty close to say that he was thinking of Teyla...
now, on the other hand, Weir's reaction...if lshe was thinking this was a reference to her..don't you think her reaction would have been more, like a woman in love whose just been revealed that the man she loves is thinking of their future together...I mean at the least, her expression could have been something in the nature of "AHHHHHHHHHHHHH" he does loves me..or something like a smirk on her face, or a sparkle in her eyes...something....ANYTHING..but instead we see a shock expression on her face...not so much for what he said, but also for when and who he said to....
Again, going back to references in other episodes, in Coup'DEtat..when Teyla and Ronon get back to speak with Weir and they are in her office with the pictures, when Teyla tells Weir that she should call of the people off planet to come back to Atlantis...right before Weir tells Teyla where John is and what he is doing, you see that Weir hesitates and gives Teyla this look of , she isn't going to like this...and lo and behold, you see Teyla's expression of worry and concern.....I didn't mention this before, cause I'm like this is just my shippy side, but going back to this scene with John admitting his grandkids...I can't help but think that Weir is certainly making a connection of here is John now making a declaration that he is planning on making the Pegasus Galaxy his permanent home...and not just to stay here until they defeat the Wraith...so, I think her look of shock is just her recognizing or confirming that John is thinking more of Atlantis than the others..that he has goals and plans that in Atlantis and Pegasus Galaxy that others like her may have not even thought of before...and that he clearly has a goal in mind, to defeat and remover the thread of the Wraith because he wants to form a family and of coarse in my view, that family includes Teyla as his wife! YIPPEE!

Okay, guys I'm sorry that I am rambling...I don't even know if this makes any sense and I am probably repeating what you guys have already written...I'm certain that you guys can summarize this in two sentences...just remember I'm a chatter....


Annie...excellent picfic...I've always said that Sanctuary, although full of non-J/T moments...also has some of the most scenes with them together the most in one entire episode...if you really think about it besides letter for Pegasus and suspcion...Sanctuary has some of the best moments of these two been so close together...and some of the best sights for them to...hehehehe..I've always said it's kind of an entire irony for the episode..maybe Sheppard trying to get Teyla to notice him...or something....

Okay, I"VE EDITED THIS....to sound more sensless.... Now, I do have more to write...

Wow CAmy your power of deduction is far better than mine..wow!! That was amazing and it makes sense, you ran around a few ciricles but made sense over all. Now I have a few eps to watch especially Coup D'Etat and of course you forgot to mention Intruder

Spoiler:

where you can clearly see that Weir stands aside and is sort of watching the interaction between Teyla and John.

I may come back and break it down with a bit more detail but I loved your interepretation and it makes perfect sense with what's going on now.

And you definitely explained the grandkid situation very well from Allies.

VB

[Jeyla4ever]

Wow CAmy your power of deduction is far better than mine..wow!! That was amazing and it makes sense, you ran around a few ciricles but made sense over all. Now I have a few eps to watch especially Coup D'Etat and of course you forgot to mention Intruder

Spoiler:

where you can clearly see that Weir stands aside and is sort of watching the interaction between Teyla and John.

I may come back and break it down with a bit more detail but I loved your interepretation and it makes perfect sense with what's going on now.

And you definitely explained the grandkid situation very well from Allies.

VB

THAT'S IT! I KILL MYSELF WRITING AND THAT IS ALL YOU'VE GOT?

Okay, so I have more....I keep going back to this, clearly this scene in Allies between John and Teyla

Spoiler:

is not essential in the episode besided the fact that it clearly states that John had was the one who convinced Teyla to go along with the entire Michael issue....so, why else add this scene there if not to show the development and the possibility of this ship in the Series....right?
I mean what is important about figuring out that Teyla trust John...there are many other ways to illustrate this...just like there were many other scenes that could have been included to show that Teyla wasn't for the idea of the retrovirus to begin with and that John actually talked her into it..if anything, this scene also confirms that the writers are still playing with the tension and like Rachel L. has stated, the underlying undertones of their unrequitted love for each other..

OH, Yeah, we are certainly seeing their connection...

Long live John and Teyla...hehehehehe

[vaberella]

Is it really a long post you want Camy? Give me about 30 minutes per post of yours and I'll give you what you want...be prepared for part 2s and part 3s...hahhahaha!!

Okay here I go ladies and gents...oh man my fingers are gonna hurt after this.

These long posts in response to Camy's deduction will be dedicated to all the lurkers who love our board...come in and join the fun I say!!

Long Live Sheyla
VB

[Jeyla4ever]

Oh, one more thing.I know I had something else, but it left my mind..it wil come to me later..but in the meantime....I mention this in the Teyla thread....
why wasn't Teyla in the

Spoiler:

Deddy? my feeling is she isn't needed in the Deddy and neither is Ronon..they wouldn't do anything there since they don't know how to work any of that stuff or fly anything...so, they are better off staying back..Ronon left to protect McKay but Teyla was left behind because she is safer in Atlantis, and she would be of better use in Atlantis should they have to fight any Wraith...personally, I think John just wants her to be in the safest place since he is the one that mainly positions the teams in places...

[Jeyla4ever]

OH, hon...I do love ya! I love that brain of yours too..I'm signing off for a bit..but I will be back..have to feed the troops supper....

[Annie Sheppard]

'CONFESSIONS'

Chapter 7

...on Atlantis...


...huh??...
...Teyla was owerhelmed by her feelings of happiness...and she didn't need to hide it...

TBC

'CONFESSIONS'

Chapter 8

...on Atlantis...
...gateroom...

...Teyla stood on the balcony and was waiting for John...

...and then he came...
...he was looking for her...

...when they met on the stairs...

...John what you said...was it just because you thought you will die??...

...Teyla i just became aware today that...
...that i don't want to hide our relationship...
...i want that anyone can see that i'm the happiest man in this galaxy cos i've got YOU...

...Teyla was speechless...
...they just looked at each other...

...and...
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e2...08hr_144_2.jpg
...in front of all the others...who weren't surprising...
...except of...

...cos he was the only one who wasn't initiated in the bug affair...he wanted to protest...

..but Weir just looked at him and said...do not even try to think about it...

TBC

[Annie Sheppard]

'CONFESSIONS'

Chapter 8

...when they met on the stairs...

...i want that anyone can see that i'm the happiest man in this galaxy cos i've got YOU...

...Teyla was speechless...
...they just looked at each other...

...and...
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e2...08hr_144_2.jpg
...in front of all the others...who weren't surprising...

TBC

'CONFESSIONS'

Chapter 9

...oh no that wasn't something new for them...
...they all were very gladden with John and Teyla...

TBC

[Jeyla4ever]

OH, ANNIE I'm so loving this picfic!

[vaberella]

I'm here hon...I don't know if I will be much for discussion..I have a huge headache..bad Friday day and it's still lurking..but anyways, I was on and then I had PM messages and then I had to read the six or so pages that you guys wrote and I'm still not quite done...so, I don't want to repeat too much of what you guys wrote..so if I do, please forgive me...On another note, jeepers..I'm going to have to start taking notes whenver I'm off this long cause now I don't remember who said what..so please, if I mis quote someone, again forgive me....

No problem..I know the feeling...there was a time that I actually came back after 3 hours to see that we jumped about 10 pages I don't know what you guys were posting..I was like forget this..I can't read all 10 pages..I'm only going as far as 3 and deal with the other 7 as they come up.

Okay, Allies...Overall, it was really good..I think there's only one thing I have to say about the entire episode...DUMB MOVE! OOOPS, sorry....Two words...

Oh man the dumb move happened back in Michael... and I say this *tongue in cheek* cause everyone knows who I blame for that disaster. At this point there was nothing they could do but choose between 'monstrous mistake' or 'darn awful mistake'--- Yeah, 'darn awful' was my choice mistake as well.

I think since Michael things started going downhill for them...kind of like a ripple effect...but another thing that I think we can discuss while we see the episodes again, is how we can now go back and tie things together and make many connections about the characters themselves and about some of their actions, discussions, arguments, etc...cause this episode certainly brought some clarity to some things...I think anyways....

I agree about the ripple affect, mine explaination was more like Domino which started from Michael and it was just started falling since that one bad move.

Spoiler:

Never bring the enemy home, especially when you CAN help it!

But I have to agree with you, and hence what I was saying so many posts back, it was like you needed to see Allies to really be able to make out the situation in 'Michael' they were wholly connected, but I understand the affect the writers were going for..I do felt that it was slightly misleading. Because there were many things I could use as defense in much of my arguments but they come from the person watching Allies to really make out my argument clearly.

And unlike some people I actually did like the way they did Michael in a way...because you knew the tone..you got that impression. From the moment I saw the ep, you can feel that everything was a bit odd. Why would they do this and why would they do that..and why is Teyla doing this or Shep acting this way..and it's not until ou get to Allies that you really get a safe grounding for much of the speculation that you felt coming from the 'Michael'.

Again it's a bad and good move on TPTB's part..many people got that affect they sensed that..but then there are people who didn't sense anything. Those that did looked at 'Allies' and were pretty much nodding their head in understanding, because they connected the dots that weren't connected in 'Michael' and a few of us did cringe when we saw the immoral situation they put themselves in... But again there are no morals in the time of war...the point is to survive and hopefully if you can win..or come out with something.

On another side note...I did enjoy the entire John and McKay interaction..sometimes I think it's a bit too much, but for this episode is was great..but I have to say, aside from our J/T moments and Teyla moments...I loved the moments between Ronon and McKay...it was great and so needed.....Ronon and McKay seemed to be more distant from each other and this episode clearly showed, and one of you mentioned this already, that Ronon does care about the people in Atlantis...even McKay!....Interesting enough how the Wraith

Spoiler:

picked up on the vibe of calling McKay Ronon's superior...I thought he was doing it to annoyed Ronon..the Wraith have so many human characteristics and this is just one great example...something that perhaps I had not noticed it before...usually the Wraith have been pretty non-comical or even robotic and emotionless..now we see that there are other more define human traits that we didn't know were there before, and I think this is why Teyla was able to feel compassion for Michael to some extent..

I loved that same affect as well. I really did enjoy the ending of this season finale..it wasn't personally as dynamic as I wanted. But it was good as it was.

Spoiler:

And it was long in waiting for Ronon and McKay to have some real time alone..we never got that..and 'The Tower' would have been a good time to do that, but they didn't. So I'm happy that they did this situation where theri definitely oging to be stuck with each other. Pat on the back for that. And I was happy with John/Mckay, personally I always liked their interaction so this was a good hoot for me. Kind of reminds me of this fanfic by a McWeir I read--where John and McKay are adopted brothers.

And when it comes to J/T... I mean that was like a culmination for us really. I mean we definitely got a bite on both ends so that was again another great thing to see. Especially for all those who saw their moments at other times...nothing is as prevalent and in your face as this moment where their BOTH in their RIGHT minds. I was bloody grateful for that. Most of arguments are easily brushed off, except in this moment where there is nothing undeniable. There is no possiblity John is taken by being, no chance he's looking into a camera and really speaking to Weir, there's no Ronon around..there's nothing but just John and Teyla..and we get what we had asked for and been wanting to see. Again where that bond is no longer suggestive or abstract, now it's in your face and it's done. End of story!

To go back to Ronon and McKay...this is just fabu...and hopefully Rodney can eat his words. And now we'll get some dynamic playing with everyone. Great...and you know what..because Teyla is on the base we might even see some Weir/Teyla interaction---and if they don't do that...we know their not planning on making Weir and Teyla 'friends' any time soon....they have too much of an in right now.

As for the Wraith...I've been speaking about them being far more human than given credit for, for a very long time. But in this ep...what I can't understand is why Ronon was on the ship with the Wraith. And I also saw how the Wraith related Ronon and McKay's relationship as one of his own and his superior.

See I'm rambling now....again, I just think this episode brought a lot of background clarification on some important questions, if anything I have even more questions now!

I can relate on so many levels..

Okay, John and Teyla...

Spoiler:

this may not be as significant but I picked up on my first viewing of the episode and for me that is big...I am not a detailed person...so I think it's worth mentioning and I don't think anyone has presented it yet...when John was in the meeting room the first time sitting next to Teyla,
1. He is very anxious...he knows that their actions with Michael is now showing the consequences...and you can tell cause he is very fidgety and he is curling up his fingers in a fist like form while moving his fingers open and shut...and then the camera shifts to Teyla and she starts doing the same thing! I just think it's cute that they are even doing the same body movements and expressing very similar gestures and moves....unknowingly...

Spoiler:

I completely agree..my sister was saying the exact same thing. She was looking at hand movements too because their very telling. Teyla hands were practically in fists the whole time..like she's trying to control herself and kind of grasping at some inkling of control. They did mimick one another, probably feeling each other's tension.

And John has always been fidgety, this goes right back to 'Michael' the man just couldn't stand still and just stare...he was very distracted and looked annoyed at the same time. I wonder if he was like that as a child..a time out would not do well for him. He'd just keep moving. And again your right they had very similar hand gestures..and at moments were eyeing each other, during the discussion. My sister also pointed out a level of complacency with the plan.

If you notice there reaches a point in the discussion when John leans forward and both his hands are wrapped together, Carson did it, and Caldwell did it. again the look tht we can't do anything more. McKay was too busy on his comp. As for Ronon he was lookign away and again we see Teyla putting her hands in fists and looking around and of course the look at the decision that was made by Weir..woah!!! That was the prize over everything..she's like we lost everything. And I believe you even see John looking at her at that moment.

I think it was probably seeing that looking and maybe watching her mannerisms---because didn't you notice he seemed to lean towards Teyla during the conversations...rather than sit in reasonable distance he was actually leaning into her space slightly and she was sort of tilt towards him. Hence the reason I wonder if something is going on we don't know about behind the scenes (as in the ep, not real life show).

Pt.1/2

[vaberella]

Spoiler:

2.. He is staring at her a lot...and he is very concerned for her..and when he runs after her...it just confirms that he is extremely worried about her...this was very comforting for me...since we've seen that Teyla has shown so many signs of having well, practically a break down in the last several episodes...and to see here and in Michael that he is very aware of her stress, just shows that he knows her so well and that he cares deeply for her enough to chase her and to assure her that not only is he watching her and aware of her struggle with the entire issue, but that it is important for him to know that she is okay with this...

Spoiler:

Yeah I agree with the staring..and the concern very apparent. I mean it's clear..she hates this situation and she's wary of them. You are so right on so many levels with this comment that I don't even really need to expound on it. but you know me..

Again he was great and Teyla was great. I had said this is definitely to me the shippiest ep of Season 2. And of course you can clearly see that John and Teyla have reached that point in their lives. And as I had told you before Camy...to see Teyla the way she was in past eps was important it's too show that she's connecting to the Atlantis crew on more a familial level, in season 1 she was far removed. Ford and McKay defended her yes, but John was looking out for her on everything. There was not a moment in season 1 that John did defend, protect and fight for her.

And again she was reserved. She never really got to see John in those moments...although I'm sure she was aware and she did the same for Atlantis in general. But now in Season 2 although to me they were shippy scenes, the moments of her sort of 'breakdown' could be easily referred to as her worry for the team. When we see this ep and especially 'The Hive', her first outward form of worry and affection for John-- we can again deduce that most of her worry and fretting was for John. And this episode again said that for all her strength I think she was worried about letting John in, but now she's come to accept him as part of her life. And the comment...almost as good as 'I love you'. Hahhaha!!

As for John he did what John always does in the case of Teyla...it was sweet and I loved that he wanted to reassure her, which was a good tone...and dare I say he was looking for a bit of reassurance from her himself. He wanted her to be alright because it would make it make it alright for him, perhaps? Maybe for his talk of being fine with it, and later on when the Wraith queen is feeding (we see he's not alright); he's not, and I think we even see that in the statement he makes to Caldwell along the lines of this coming back to haunt us. He's clearly struggling with this decision, but he does it, since again he has no other choice. I don't think Teyla gave him that reassurance in true Teyla fashion and I loved that about her and their relationship.

She clearly values him too much to lie to him. And she tried to say something soothing like 'is that the extent of their plan' but clearly he picked up on what she was saying. And she needed to remind him, to let him know that this is more than you or me..and that we're in a bad situation and please don't underestimate the enemy. I mean how much more of a loyal friend, companion, would-be lover or wife do you need?!

Spoiler:

3. Now, this whole phrase of his...I just want you to be okay with this...I think this is very telling...he isn't just saying to her that she wants to be in agreement with their actions toward the Wraith, but in my view, he is telling her that she wants her to be okay with his actions, with his part in all of this...he doesn't want her to feel any hate, or remorse, or rejection towards him...he is in fact the one heading all of this...and she knows it...He knows that Weir is also a big part of this, but he is not asking her for Weir, he is asking her about him and her...

So true, so true

Spoiler:

this is definitely more than I had read into it. But your right..he was doing that. I felt he was lookign for reassurance but also I think your right...he wants her to accept his role in it. Accept what he has to do. We saw this again in 'Suspicion' this was clearly evident although I must say I skipped over it. Even then he was looking at her as if he's sorry..but he as to do this and he doesn't want to. Again he does the same expression and same similar statements in 'Letters From Pegasus'; he doesn't want to let her down.

And he's battled his decisions and in some way how they affect her in many situations. I mean I just hoped that they gave us an idea in 'Lost Boys' or the 'The Hive'...but they didn't and that was again another opportunity. And I think after 'LFP' Teyla has come to terms with what his duties are and who he was. Remember she was upset with him, surprised by him, but in the end she was again narrowed of his role as an officer and his duty and what she wanted. But at the end you see her understanding that and I think this also a reason why in 'The Hive' she still heald his head in her lap...this could have been a sign from her that she new what he had to do and she stood by him on this...even if there was an unknown chance before hand, that they could have died.

That was an excellent assessment Camy!

Spoiler:

In other words, he doesn't want the recent events to jeopardize their relationship...whatever that may be in anyone's eyes...this is what I think is really his deeper meaning with his statement...and I think Teyla knew this before he even told her this and thus her statement...I chose to put my trust in you!...John knew this..even though he said "we convinced you" he knows and if he didn't know he knows now, that the only reason why she went along with the entire retrovirus experiment was because she trusted John...she trusted his judgements...she trusted in his actions..

Your very correct in your statements....read above.

Spoiler:

And I also think that he knew. He knew but also probably unsure of asking. His face was sort of questioning as his tone was questioning..he was sort of tiptoeing around with his choice of words which is very true. And yes Teyla knew, she smiled slightly at him to give him that piece of mind.

Spoiler:

Now, interesting enough and this is where I was saying that we can go back and refer things to other episodes...In CM..when Carson comfronted Teyla with the events occurring she said, I am aware and I trust that...blah, blah, blah..can't remember her exact words..but I remember that she mention "trust" and we said here that it was Sheppard she was referrring to...HELLO! were we right or not?

and were we not right in assuming that he is the one that goes after her and tells her everything that is happening...it's almost as if he needs to confide with her before he makes any moves..hmmm...that is much like what my husband does with me before he makes any decisions...hehehehehehe

I've never been married but that would be nice. Same thing with my parents as well. I do have to point out...she trusts John's motives and the things he does. But it's interesting to see that Teyla still does her own thing without needing John's approval...sorta like my mum and several other married women I know. It's like my dad once said, 'Everything I have is hers, and everything she has is hers!' hahaha!!

Spoiler:

But above all she still trusts John. And that's key...because she would stake her life in his hands like she did on several missions, 'Runner' comes to mind when John goes to get Carson. And of course unknowingly in 'Lost Boys' and 'The Hive'. I feel he does the same with her. Their partners after all...need I remind everyone of that scene in every banner from 'Instinct'?

Spoiler:

So, again, I think that, like someone else he wrote, John doesn't have to or need to go and ask Ronon or Teyla about what their feelings are of what is happening, yet he does...and it's safe to say that Weir and the others in Atlantis do see them as an integral part and do confide in them and in their opinions to some degree..as a perfect example when they looked for a response in Ronon as to whether they should do this or not....but you have to think that John does this type of thing with Teyla in private...it's as if he is consulting things with her and he cares enough about her opinion just as she cares about his...

Agreed. I have seen this as well.

Spoiler:

We also saw this in 'Lost Boys' after your comment above I'm starting to think that he discussed allowing them to take the drug, before going ahead with it. And we do see them talking about it in that scene at the dinner table. I mean their a unit remember back in 'Suspicion' when Teyla wasn't at the meeting John had a fit. And it's quite possible they discuss this stuff in public. I mean he went after the meeting to ask her her opinion not during the meeting. It's enough to say to me that he probably talked to her in private about doing this thing in 'Michael' as he did in 'Suspicion'. Sure it's a collective idea..but again I feel he felt it was his natural for him as her friend, team mate, and possibly more to ask her what she felt about it. Becase we know there was no way she really wanted part of this. She did it again for him, because she respects and values him.

Spoiler:

Overall, this was a very telling episode and I think for the first time we see how John and Teyla have finally admitted as close to any other scene in any other episode, how much they care, respect and worry about each other...Teyla clearly told John, I trust you completely and wholeheartdely...even to the point of going against everything that she believes in...and this is what the shippy part comes into play...Clearly she told him, I didn't do it because I agreed with it...I did it and went along with it, because I trust you completely and put my life on the line for you...for us! A couple does this all the time, even when things are against what they believe, they compromise and sacrafice their own feelings in order to please and make the one they love happy...and to show them that they are willing to listen and follow their lead! Teyla is accepting John as a leader and relying on his judgements to decide their fate...People if that isn't a sign of someone that loves the other person, I don't know what is...now, again...whether they go with this or not is another story..

I bloody well concur 1000x over!

CRAP...I HAVE LOT MORE TO WRITE BUT MY FINGERS HURT!

Your telling me?!

Pt.2/2

[Annie Sheppard]

'CONFESSIONS'

Epilogue

...on Atlantis...


...you know guys finally there's one good thing in the Wraith attack...

...*both*...what??...

...oh come on, don't pretend that you don't know what i'm talking about...

...huh??... no we don't know Rodney...may you explain it??...

...oh i mean of course John and Teyla...if the Wraith didn't come here, they would still hide their relationship...

... and you so happy cos you hit up on the idea with the bug??...

...ah this...yeah that was just a sign of my genius...
..i think i should make it as a kind of hobby...shipping pairs together...i'm pretty good in this stuff..

... hehehe...thats funny Rodney...

...Carson went away but Cadman was still staying with McKay...

...ok Rodney i think if we'll working together our chances would be bigger...
... working with you??...together??...
...oh come on...
... ok...and i think i know who will be our next pair...





...in the meantime...
...what did John and Teyla??...
...they made up for the lost time...
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e2..._208hr_140.jpg
http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e2..._208hr_144.jpg


THE END

[Annie Sheppard]

oh no...i must even laugh at my own work...hehehehe...the epilouge...that was so funny to make it...ok guys i did it..thats the end...i hope you all will like it...pretty long but who can get enough John and Teyla...
tomorrow i will post all the chapters together if i find out how to do it...

[vaberella]

I just read what I wrote..and I am not sure if I am making any sense...I am sure VB...or Ritter will tell me if I am coherent or not!

It makes perfect sense...you are a great deductionist if anything..wow!! There were definitely a few things you mentioned that never crossed my mind. So your making perfect and impressive sense.

But, here are my final thoughts..for now anyways, headache still here bothering me...

Spoiler:

I see this as the first time of both of them confessing that they do have very strong feelings for each other...it's not a declaration of undying love but it is certainly a beginning of what can and might happen...John is looking for Teyla's approval and acceptance..he is asking her and telling her that he wants them to be okay...he wants her to be okay with him...now, why would this bother him, concern him, worry him if it wasn't because he holds Teyla more dearly to his heart than he should...

Now this is a great question followed by statement. Now that was a question I didn't ask. These are the little things that are taken for granted when your happy that things are flowing your way.

Spoiler:

It's very true that he asked her input and why did he want it. I agree that it's because Teyla is close to his heart...and far more than a friend. If he was looking for reassurance that he was making the right decision then he would have went to McKay and asked his opinion, since he was in agreement with him...and pretty much everyone else was in compliance except for Teyla and Ronon seemed very supportive. Wraith is wraith to him after all. And to see that the person you hold closest is actually the one to be more adverse to the idea that would make me a bit antsy as well. And definitely explains why he wanted Teyla's input.

Spoiler:

it's okay for him to want her to be okay with this, but the difference being is the fact that number one..of all the things happening at that time and all of the things that he has to do, he goes after her and chases her to make sure his point is made clearly to her and to hear her response...if this was just a question of him being concerned for her opinion, then it was certainly something that could have waited for him to say to her later on after things were said and done...

This is very true..I mean all these little actions say much to our cause and what we're seeing and possibly what a lot of the other ships are avoiding or not wanting to see.

Spoiler:

I found it also peculiar that he ran after her. I mean that says so much that it's not even worth describing he ran AND called after her..wanting her opinion. He definitely more than values her insight. And probably more than he's willing on to let out right now.

Spoiler:

afterall, he doesn't owe her any explanations, but the fact of the matter is, it is so important for him to let her know that this had to be okay with her...that he cannot wait to make sure that this is okay with her..and that she is okay..that they are okay..it reminds me again...of their conversation in Conversion...after the kiss..it is so important for him to have Teyla feel comfortable with him..their relationship is important to him...and he cares about what she thinks and how she feels about him

Again another insightful comment,

Spoiler:

this brings me to compare it to his response to Weir in 'TLG'. He completely and blatantly ignored her..he found probably 'tetris' or solitaire on his palm to be far more interesting than even giving her the time of day with an apology. But then again he didn't have to give an apology she owed him one. But that's besides the point. What I'm saying is that he valued Teyla clearly in 'Conversion' he valued it so much he went to apologize to her and yet with Weir laying on the cot next to him..he didn't even GLANCE her way. He only looked at Caldwell or the palm. I would think that would say so much when you compare both situations. And that didn't even seem forced or in some way contrived.

It seemed natural of John in both counts---but it says how his feelings go in regards to both women.

Spoiler:

Not only that, but think about this, he knows that this is a new Alliance is very dangerous....they are about to bring in the Wraith into Atlantis...anything could happen, so it's almost as if he wants things straightened with her before anything else..he is placing her more important at that moment, than even the things that he has to do...if anything goes wrong, at least he knows that Teyla and him are okay with one another... ...with each other..in my view, that is an expression of someone who clearly has more than just friendship in their mind and cares more for the person than led on to believe...he couldn't have possibly declare his undying love cause they are not at this point, yet...but certainly this is an act of love...a love that is so important to him that he puts everything on hold...

I agree....and we saw this in Letters from Pegasus as well. He still made a decision which he never had to follow through with since it went against the plan because he didn't want someting to happen to her. And he knew where she was coming from and I feel respected that. Further more if you see the end they both come out sort of parroting the other. And I think to me it was in that episode that we that 'unique bond' we talk about solidified. If Allies can be said to be blatantly clear...for us that ep definitely was when it was solid compared to 'Rising' when the link was tentative and even some can say precarious in 'Suspicion'. In 'LFP' we now have warrior to warrior and conflicting feelings and thoughts. Now that's a relationship.

Spoiler:

Even in the time when he needs to be concentrating on the events occurring in Atlantis..now, I am not saying that he is not doing his job and that it is interferring with his duties, it is not..clearly he proved throughout the rest of the episode that he is so in control of the situations, but if you also notice, for the rest of the episode, he seemed more at ease with the decision, and more ready to face the consequences, because Teyla is fine with it! Okay, so I had to throw that in there.... but seriously, does that make any sense?

In a way,

Spoiler:

I have to say he's come to a resolution in his own mind. We know that Teyla is far from fine with the whole pact with a Wraith situation, but we also know he's not that fine. But what I do see is that he will carry it out. And let's go back to your first thoughts..where he asked because he wanted her to be fine with him and what he's doing. See, in that sense she is fine. She told him clearly and straight out, 'I trust you and value your opinion' and for that I agreed. And she has not backed out of her decision to trust him. And I think that was balming to him. And if anything he was able to go along...but also remember. That's not the end and be all...he is also a soldier and knows his duty. And he will do what he must, because he's supposed to.

And as I said when I mentioned 'LFP' he knows that Teyla understands this, and we see this again in 'Lost Boys' and 'The Hive'. He had clarification for this as he did in those 3 other moments. And I think that's what he needed and that was helpful, but not dependent..but it did hold a great deal because it was something he took the time out to ask her and call after her. So it was a good amount to ease his mind. And I felt she did her job, the best way she knows how and without prior knowledge of earthlings way of reading between the lines.

Spoiler:

Teyla's admission...for me is so very telling..more than she has ever said...again...she is such a soulfoul woman...she is so strong willed and assured of her actions and never questions when she needs to state her opinion, and yet for Sheppard she put all of her trust in him.....and clearly the way she said it, she was talking about Sheppard...she put her life, her beliefs, her own doubts and fears aside for Sheppard......she not only trusted him but acted upon and followed everything that he told her to do...clearly the reason why Sheppard kept such a close eye on her in Michael and we can safely even assume why when he wasn't around, Ronon was close by to her...all I can assume part of John's way of watching out for her...

Yup this was also my assumption.

Spoiler:

I mean it's rather clear..it didn't make sense to me in 'Michael' for John to be looking at the video camera while Teyla is showing Michael his room. There are about 2-4 guards outsides his room door, there are about several guards on alert around the camera room, not to mention the several angles of camera's around with guards watching those? What was his purpose? Clearly he had to be worried about someting. And probably about Teyla, that's definitely what I read in the whole thing. It's like he made a promist to her that he would look out for any problems personally and to me she was awwed and bit overwhelmed by what was going on.

Again, this is how I see it..and once my headache is gone, I can probably conjured up some more things....

Can't wait for that!


1/2
VB

[vaberella]

Now, the whole,

Spoiler:

grandkids thing...again...I see this as a connection to everything else that he has said....John wants a family and sees marriage and kids in the works...so, again, the whole kirking thing..must be a passing thing..because someone who is planning for a family and kids wouldn't want to cheat on his wife...and I don't see Sheppard as the type...so, if he really wanted to continue with and was fond of the kirking for longer, he wouldn't be thinking of a future family...so, kirking right now, then is YES, a weakness..but I still think he is projecting his feelings for Teyla and second, the times of the kirking have all been because of either the women come to him or that he is after all, like Trippy and others have stated, single and doesn't need to feel any shame or guilt...
If we go back to Chilhood's End, he refers to the kid that was going to give in to the sacrifice, that he does want a family and children in the future..If I am not mistaken when he goes to the barricades in Underground, isn't he the one that asks McKay about the radiation and Mckay says something about if you want to have kids..or something to that effect...and then he mentions it again...but I can't remember when..but now in this episode he mentions grandkids...now you have to think about the context and the way he says it..he was referring to when the Queen said, it wasn't going to affect them in their lifetime, when they would run of out Wraith humans to feed and then would have to rely on feeding with humans again.....now I belive he is the one that brings it up in the first place...which tells me...that number one...as I've stated before and others here as well...John is not planning on going back to Earth even after all this is over..he has found a home in the Pegasus Galaxy...and he plans on remaining there...now, this is interesting because although he doesn't say it's with Teyla..you can't help but wonder who would he be so sure of that would stay in the Pegasus Galaxy..

I agree with this..

Spoiler:

I have been wondering about who he had in mind. And of course as you mentioned in CE and I've mentioned as well, we know he clearly wants children. More than one it seems. So I'm trying to figure out who could that lucky lady be. And because he wants to stay in PG...I figured it's Teyla, naturally--for all her wanting to see Earth...I don't think she'd ever permanently leave her people, and John in Intruder stated that he missed it in PG and I'm figuring he's never gonna go back because he missed it more than even Earth.

Spoiler:

Now if people think it's Weir..how can he be sure that Weir will be willing to stay in the Pegasus Galaxy? clearly she has gone back and forth to Earth and has family and connections there...and why would he be so sure that she would stay in this galaxy...? he doesn't..and so, he couldn't have been thinking that Weir is the grandmother of his grandkids...

True true..he doesn't know about her feelings about staying permanently. And there's always a possibility she might want to go back to Earth for the long run..and what about her raising children in the PG world. That's a questionable state...I know many women in America and in the world would not want to raise their kids in certain high crime areas for their safety. What's to say

Spoiler:

Weir wouldn't want to raise their kids on Earth especially with the chance of the Wraith hurting them. Or just avoiding kids all together because of the threat of them.

Spoiler:

Now, others say, Chaya...we don't know what the Ancients are capable of and as far as my knowledge he isn't communicating with Chaya at all since Sanctuary...they;ve made reference to the kids in Childhood's end which show that they go back there to check up on them, but you never hear of Chaya's planet been visited by him or anyone else...so it can't be Chaya..

Now this is very true..and I asked it once, but I'll ask it again..can the ascended reproduce? Doubtful!

Spoiler:

so there are only two other options, John is thinking of Teyla who for sure is remaining on the Pegasus Galaxy or he is counting on marrying some alien girl.....cause even if he is thinking of an Earthling in Atlantis, who's to say that she would agree to remain in Atlantis..? again, when he obviously doesn't have anyone in mind...so, I think it's pretty close to say that he was thinking of Teyla...

No matter even if John takes Teyla to Earth she won't stay because she is the leader of her people and she wouldn't want to leave her people to another bloody galaxy.

Spoiler:

We know that Teyla values her leadership and her people too much. She probably would not be worried about having children even with the Wraith around because remember there are children within her group and going back to 'Rising' and 'Hide and Seek' Teyla mentions that they try to give the children a normal upbringing. We saw them happy and healthy and they had costumes. I mean these are well brought up and healthy children even while living in he shadow of the Wraith. Teyla would see no fear in raising her children in that environment and of course would find it better for them. She would love Earth because she's adventurous soul but would never want to move there. And if we can assume correctly that John is interested in permanently relocating to PG then we know that she would of course be the logical choice besides him finding another alien woman.

If anything we know it's not Chaya or Weir on top of his list.

Spoiler:

Now, on the other hand, Weir's reaction...if she was thinking this was a reference to her..don't you think her reaction would have been more, like a woman in love whose just been revealed that the man she loves is thinking of their future together...I mean at the least, her expression could have been something in the nature of "AHHHHHHHHHHHHH" he does loves me..or something like a smirk on her face, or a sparkle in her eyes...something....ANYTHING..but instead we see a shock expression on her face...not so much for what he said, but also for when and who he said to...

Now this statement deserves a round of applause. That's the exact thought running through my head.

Spoiler:

The woman was clearly shocked more than anything in the ep when Shep said what he said to the Wraith queen. There wasn't even a smile. She gaves us nothing but shock and an 'O-kay, let's move on look'.

Spoiler:

Again, going back to references in other episodes, in Coup'DEtat..when Teyla and Ronon get back to speak with Weir and they are in her office with the pictures, when Teyla tells Weir that she should call of the people off planet to come back to Atlantis...right before Weir tells Teyla where John is and what he is doing, you see that Weir hesitates and gives Teyla this look of , she isn't going to like this...and lo and behold, you see Teyla's expression of worry and concern.....I didn't mention this before, cause I'm like this is just my shippy side, but going back to this scene with John admitting his grandkids...I can't help but think that Weir is certainly making a connection of here is John now making a declaration that he is planning on making the Pegasus Galaxy his permanent home...and not just to stay here until they defeat the Wraith...so, I think her look of shock is just her recognizing or confirming that John is thinking more of Atlantis than the others..that he has goals and plans that in Atlantis and Pegasus Galaxy that others like her may have not even thought of before...and that he clearly has a goal in mind, to defeat and remover the thread of the Wraith because he wants to form a family and of coarse in my view, that family includes Teyla as his wife! YIPPEE!

I agree with this as I had said in my smaller post this goes back to

Spoiler:

Intruder, when John makes it back and sees Teyla there's this moment that Weir is actually looking between the two and their interaction and do we need to even mention the part as if they have this secret thing going on between the two and he has a few things to catch up on but he has so many things to tell her. It's a very dynamic relationship.

Okay, guys I'm sorry that I am rambling...I don't even know if this makes any sense and I am probably repeating what you guys have already written...I'm certain that you guys can summarize this in two sentences...just remember I'm a chatter.... [/spoiler]

Ditto, I wasn't born a gemini for no reason. I make my sign very proud.

Okay, I"VE EDITED THIS....to sound more sensless.... Now, I do have more to write...

May *insert diety* help us all.

2/2
VB and more to go...shame! AS I'll review soon..promise.