Rodney McKay/David Hewlett Thunk/Discussion/Appreciation

[Willow'sCat]

Didn't we just talk about a quote that said that David might be doing two (or maybe three when we take his own twitter into account) commentaries? Hmm.

I don't know, Joe has been wrong before but then MGM has also omitted comms before. Just seems really odd at the moment, unless something happened and David couldn't make it to the studio to do the comms. I mean why waste the actors time (and they don't even pay the actors to do them!) either include them all or don't do them. I certainly cannot believe he did a bad commentary and they decided not to include it...not possible!

I wish the show was more like Doctor Who (in so many ways!), they do the comms before the eps air and have them for dl, listen via the net shortly after the eps air. A much better and more modern way to do it if you ask me.

[Squonk]

Didn't we just talk about a quote that said that David might be doing two (or maybe three when we take his own twitter into account) commentaries? Hmm.

Bye, A.

Yeeeeeeees - tis very odd..........

I wish the show was more like Doctor Who (in so many ways!), they do the comms before the eps air and have them for dl, listen via the net shortly after the eps air. A much better and more modern way to do it if you ask me.

Now wouldn't that be great! And we'd probably get more of the actors taking part cos they wouldn't have to go in to do them during hiatus!

[Renenutet]

I actually like the cast doing the commentaries more then the technical people, like the lighting supervisor or the art director or something like that. I like how the set was that day talk as opposed to the technical nuance talk. I think on last season's DVD set I only watched one or two because there was an actor or the episode director. Also, I hate when it's just one person talking. They shouldn't do solo commentaries anymore.

[jetflair]

I hope this doesn't come as off-topic or an intrusion, but I was hoping to get some McKay background info from you guys I have seen all of Stargate Atlantis, but I'm just starting SG-1 and haven't reached his episodes in it yet.

I'm starting to write a friendship fic where Sheppard is teaching McKay to shoot shortly after his arrival in Atlantis. I'm wondering if, as far as you know, Rodney had ever fired a gun or had any kind of tactical training before coming to Atlantis? Had he had any real field expereince at all, or can I safely write him as a blank slate when it comes to that stuff?

[RodneyIsGodney]

I hope this doesn't come as off-topic or an intrusion, but I was hoping to get some McKay background info from you guys I have seen all of Stargate Atlantis, but I'm just starting SG-1 and haven't reached his episodes in it yet.

I'm starting to write a friendship fic where Sheppard is teaching McKay to shoot shortly after his arrival in Atlantis. I'm wondering if, as far as you know, Rodney had ever fired a gun or had any kind of tactical training before coming to Atlantis? Had he had any real field expereince at all, or can I safely write him as a blank slate when it comes to that stuff?

He was a lab rat basically. He worked at area 51 so no need for guns, tactical training or field experience. Blank slate is a go! You can tell in the early SGA eps that he doesn't really have confidence when shooting firing a weapon. Remember The Defiant One? He shot at the wraith but he wasn't really looking and his aim was off a bit,(he did hit the wraith tho) and he didn't know what to do when he ran out of bullets. Sheppard had to tell him to reload his gun. So, I'd say yes to a blank slate.

Rodney's SG-1 Eps...Spoilered just in case you don't wanna know.

Spoiler:

In order...
48 Hours
Redemption Pts 1 and 2
Mobius Pts 1 and 2
The Pegasus Project
The Road Not Taken

[GateEngineer17]

Over on the Thunk Thread, someone asked (post #26622, 04/01/08) about Rodney's background with guns. I posted a short reply over there, but I really wanted to write more about it, and I thought it was a little long to be on the Thunk thread, and more properly belonged over here - so . . . here it is!

Rodney's early field experience and experience with guns . . . (Spoilered for Length)

Spoiler:

The poster over on the Thunk thread wanted to know about Rodney's background in SG1/SGA in preparation for writing a "Shep teaches Rodney to shoot" fic. This is one of my favorite fic topics and for fun, I went back through all my pics of S1 episodes to see just what Rodney was carrying and when. I was surprised by the results. So I thought I'd share and blather on about it a bit . . .

The short answer to the Rodney pre-Atlantis field experience/gun training question is : No.

I don't believe there is anything in either SG1 or SGA to specifically suggest that Rodney ever had field (as in combat) experience or experience handling firearms. Now . . . nuclear weapons, on the other hand - THAT he'd had experience with, of course!

There are a number of things in Rodney's past that suggest he had a rather sheltered experience before Atlantis, being sort of a "kept" genius of the US Air Force (who apparently got first wind of him when the CIA came calling about that little 6th grade science project - the nuclear bomb!)

We do know that on SG1, scientists on teams (Daniel, Jonah, etc.) carried weapons in the field, and so presumably were taught to use them at some point. It would seem logical that at least the field team scientists on SGA would as well. Question is, when would this have occurred - before or after they embarked? None of the scientists were carrying when they went through the wormhole to Atlantis for the first time.

I think the most likely scenario is that everyone got some sort of basic weapons handling and shooting instruction, prior to embarking. This probably would have been done because of experiences with various enemies during 'gate travel in the Milky Way galaxy. They probably all got some basic medical/first aid training as well. It makes sense, because we know when they embarked, they knew it was likely a one-way journey, at least for a while.

In The Siege, we see lots of scientists being issued the Beretta 92FS sidearm from some sort of armory. This suggests that the expedition came with sidearms for everyone (or at least lots of spares) to hand out in emergencies (and The Siege certainly qualified!). We see Rodney, Chuck, Zelenka and others carrying in Atlantis during this time. To my knowledge, this is the only time we see scientists other than field team members (mainly Rodney) carrying in Atlantis. While it is also possible that all the extra guns were just spares for the Marines, and that it was just a "if they can hold a gun, give 'em one" moment in The Siege, I think the "basic training for everyone" explanation is more plausible.

In Rising, Weir tells Sheppard to put together a team for exploring - this suggests that field teams were not set up ahead of time. This also means that it was proabably not known which scientists would be on which teams, therefore meaning it was not known who would need any more advanced training beyond the initial pre-embarkation training, assuming there was any.

The first time we see Rodney out in the field (38 Minutes) he's carrying only the 92FS, while Ford, Teyla and Shep are each carrying P90's as well. In this ep, Sheppard is incapacitated, and has to be rescued by his team. I would thing this had to bother Sheppard a bit, and make him wonder about making sure his team was fully trained and experienced.

The next time we see Rodney go out in the field (Suspicion) he's carrying only the 92FS, and the Team is ambushed. When Rodney comes through the 'gate, his 92FS is holstered, and he takes a Wraith stunner blast full in the face just before the wormhole closes. In a second field trip, when the Team comes under fire again, Rodney is still only carrying only the 92FS and does not use it, but does help pull Shep to safety when Shep is Wraith-stunned. When the Team goes out later in that ep to test the "Teyla necklace homing beacon" theory, Rodney is carrying not only his 92FS, he's also got a P90 and a Taser, and he's the one John has standing at his side when they take on the Wraith. Rodney handles himself well, firing the P90 and Taser at Shep's side, and getting knocked down by the Wraith grenade shock wave right along with Shep.

So . . . for me, it is in Suspicion, somewhere between Rodney rubbing the numbness out of his feet on the conference room table and Wraith hunt on the planet, that Shep teaches Rodney how to handle additional weapons like the P90, the Taser and how to run like hell when he says so! Rodney is clearly uncomfortable with being out on a combat mission in this ep. While he may have now been coached by the best, he still lacks, dare we say, hands-on experience. In fact, he's wringing his hands as Ford and Shep discuss the plan on Atlantis. When Shep calls him on it, Rodney replies something like, "No, no, I'm part of this team, I'm going to do this." To which Shep replies something like, "Yes, you are."

For whatever reason, Shep decided he would get Rodney practical combat/weapons experience. On the planet in Suspicion, waiting with guns at the ready for the Wraith to arrive, Rodney is so uncharacteristically quiet that Shep asks him if he is okay. Shep keeps him close, presumably to keep him safe, but he seems to have clearly decided he wants Rodney competent with the available weaponry on what is a rather dangerous mission. He's also decided he wants Rodney with him, not safe back on Atlantis, or in a 'jumper, or wherever.

For the rest of S1, we only see Rodney carrying the P90 one other time - in Underground. Otherwise he's carrying just the 92FS, or it is an Atlantis-based episode where he's not carrying at all. This really surprised me, because I'm so used to seeing him with the P90 in the later seasons.

In two other S1 episodes, we see Rodney handling the 92FS competently. First, in Childhood's End, Rodney is terrified, facing down the young man with the bow and arrow. Yeah, its primitive, but more than capable of killing him, especially at that short range in the ZPM-shrine-thingy. Rodney shows great restraint, not giving in the to urge to pull the trigger and eliminate the threat, thus giving us the most amazing gun porn pictures of S1! He also doesn't shoot the little kids when they burst in on him - also showing ability to wait and assess his target before firing. I like to think maybe Sheppard practiced such scenarios with him at the Atlantis shooting range.

In The Defiant One, Rodney comes to Shep's rescue, standing his ground and emptying his gun into the SuperWraith to distract it from its attack on Shep. Some might argue Rodney wasn't competent because he asked Shep what to do when his gun was empty (Reload!), but I think the question can be viewed as being more about the situation in general, not about whether or not he needed to reload his gun. He'd just emptied some 15 rounds into the Wraith without hardly slowing it down at all. He was no doubt thinking ahead to the fact that dumping another 15 rounds probably wasn't going to do much either. Remember that Rodney at this point does not know that Ford is on the way with a 'jumper full of drones - only Shep knows that. When Shep yells, "McKay - Run!" Rodney does exactly that - he doesn't petulantly ask why or complain or whatever - it seems Shep has told him that when they're in combat, Rodney is to do as directed. These actions for me also point to some one-on-one training of Rodney by Shep (more fic-fodder!). It also shows that Rodney is smart enough to follow the directions of someone more experienced than him in a particular area of endeavour (of which there are only a few, of course! ).

Moving out of S1, we have another memorable (good or bad, depending on how you view it) gun scene in the S2 opener, The Siege Part 3. I am of course, talking about the high-as-a-kite, amphetamine-hopped Rodney facing down the two Wraith soldiers on the way to the ZPM room. Rodney drops the magazine on his 92FS while attempting to release the safety or to pull the trigger (extremely hard to do in real life - these controls are separated and feel very different from each other for a reason!!), thus leaving himself completely at the mercy of the Wraith. Fortunately Teyla comes to his rescue and efficiently dispatches the Wraith, commenting to Rodney afterward that, "I thought you were very brave." I'm with Teyla on this one. I excuse him for the amount of speed he had in his blood and the unimaginable stress he'd been under.

I've found that the writing on the show, particularly of Rodney, has been somewhat uneven on occasion (practicing my polite restraint here!). So, I think a fanfic writer has to watch the eps, decide on their own personal middle ground or cannon, and then stay consistent within a given fic they are writing.

Thoughts? Geek gun gushings?

[GateEngineer17]

I hope this doesn't come as off-topic or an intrusion, but I was hoping to get some McKay background info from you guys I have seen all of Stargate Atlantis, but I'm just starting SG-1 and haven't reached his episodes in it yet.

I'm starting to write a friendship fic where Sheppard is teaching McKay to shoot shortly after his arrival in Atlantis. I'm wondering if, as far as you know, Rodney had ever fired a gun or had any kind of tactical training before coming to Atlantis? Had he had any real field expereince at all, or can I safely write him as a blank slate when it comes to that stuff?

The short answer to the Rodney field experience/gun training question is: No.

I don't know of anything in either SG1 or SGA to specifically suggest that Rodney ever had field (as in combat) experience or experience handling firearms. Now . . . nuclear weapons, on the other hand - THAT he'd had experience with!

There are a number of things in Rodney's past that suggest he had a rather sheltered experience before Atlantis, being sort of a "kept" genius of the US Air Force (who apparently got first wind of him when the CIA came calling about that little 6th grade science project - the nuclear bomb!)

I'm very fond of the "Sheppard teaches McKay to shoot" motif in SGA fanfic. Your post made me want to go back and see when Rodney carried what firearms on SGA. That is probably more a topic for the "Dr. Rodney McKay/David Hewlett Discussion & Appreciation Thread" here on Gateworld. So - I've put one there (post 3212, 04/01/08), if you're interested!

Quite a few fics have been written about Shep teaching Rodney how to shoot - wonderful stuff all the way from G to XXX. But as most of us never get tired of reading the millions of possible variations on that theme, please let us know as soon as you are done your fic so we can read it!

[fumblesmcstupid]

I have watched all 80 episodes and I am impressed at how much Rodney has grown in the use of firearms.

In Vengeance he is looking at all the small spaces for Creepy bug guys.

and in All of Season 4 he has really came through as a team mate in backing up Sheppard in Harmony, using his P90 to cover John.

John and Ronon are Soldiers! Teyla had to learn to take care of herself as the leader of the Athosians. Rodney....is a geek sat on his ass for his adult life doing Sciency things.

So a lot of the time John,Teyla and Ronon protect him..not because he can't take care of himself, but he is still NEW to this ACTION HERO STUFF.

Let's assume that John has been in the airforce for 20 years give or take a year!

Ronon.....Soldier.....Runner 7 years so well you know what I mean!

Teyla like I said leader of her people!

So right there is about 40 years of EXPIERENCE. between the three of them!

They KNOW Rodney does his best!!

Ronon just moves him around like a rag doll
John YELLS at him in encouragement.
Teyla Never let's him second guess himself!

They have his back!

Spoiler:

I do however wish that Rodney was secretly taking stick lessons from Halling and then the three of them pick on him and he Hustles them into thinking that he can't do it and then knocks them all on thier KIESTERS!!

that would be cool!

my fingers hurt!

[watcher652]

I think the first time we see Rodney with a gun is in the flashback scene in Thirty Eight Minutes. See the thigh holster?




Suspicion caps.





SHEPPARD: You seem nervous.
McKAY: No. I'm a part of this team. I'm doing this.
SHEPPARD: Yes, you are. I just said you seemed nervous.
McKAY: Oh, really. I thought you said, “Rodney, you don't have to do this.”
SHEPPARD: Yes, you do.
McKAY: Damn right I'm doing this -- despite the fact the feeling hasn't completely returned to my extremities.






SHEPPARD: You still seem nervous.
McKAY: No, no. It's good, good. I'm all good. All good.










SHEPPARD: You OK?
McKAY: I'm fine. This is, this is fun for me.

[jetflair]

Wow, thanks for the great, in-depth reply! I'm a little sad to hear that my little fanfic idea is hardly an original concept....but dang it, I'm writing the thing anyway. It was inspired by a fic I read where on the heels of ejecting his magazine while facing the wraith, he leaves his gun lying on a table where it accidentally shoots Carson.

That story made me think about how green and timid with weapons and combat McKay was originally, and how over the season he's gradually toughened up and gained competence in combat situations. To me that speaks not only of someone learning from experience, but of good instruction. The fact that McKay pretty much always obeys Sheppard, especially when it comes to military situations, also tells me that Sheppard earned his respect in those matters.

I see that as a result not of Sheppard doing something like telling him he *must* obey orders (something I think McKay would take badly), but of McKay learning that these are valid and difficult skills that Sheppard is very good at. McKay had to learn to trust Sheppard enough to obey him, and for someone like McKay I think that comes not from something typical like Sheppard saving his life, but from realizing that Sheppard really is the master of his own niche.

There seems to be a gentleman's agreement that forms shortly after the team, where Shep leaves the science and tech stuff to Rodney, and Rodney leaves the tactical stuff and the running of operations to Shep. We never really see any conflict there, yet these seem to be two men primed to clash. Again my guess is that Sheppard earned McKay's respect on McKay's level. Why not during shooting lessons? I think it would be interesting writing McKay forced to learn something that is a physical skill, rather than something he can do out of sheer intellect.

Now I'm wondering if I should read the fics so I don't accidentally re-write one of them, or just forge ahead. I'm leaning towards forging ahead, but...... *sigh*

[iolanda]

Now I'm wondering if I should read the fics so I don't accidentally re-write one of them, or just forge ahead. I'm leaning towards forging ahead, but...... *sigh*

Honestly, I wouldn't do that. Now you have your idea made up in your mind and it is and stays yours. When you read a fic and find your idea already writte by someone else it would spoil yours. There are SO many FFs around, that its difficult to be genuine at all. Do your thing as you like it

[Mercury973]

Watcher- if I had some green, I would totally green you for those caps. =)

Still waiting for my McKay dolls to arrive. I should have ordered rush delivery. My Sheppard dolls are lonely

Pic bump:

[Ravenheart]

Pic spam just for the heck of it.

Spoiler:

[jetflair]

Honestly, I wouldn't do that. Now you have your idea made up in your mind and it is and stays yours. When you read a fic and find your idea already writte by someone else it would spoil yours. There are SO many FFs around, that its difficult to be genuine at all. Do your thing as you like it

Sounds like a plan Thank you At least that way, even if this is not an original idea, it won't be influenced by other stories.

Anyone here actually ever shot a P90? Any idea what they're like to shoot? I shot an AK-47 (not a typo for AK-74!) once, but that's about as close as I've gotten, and I don't know anyone who owns a P90 for me to play with in the name of fanfic research

[RodneyIsGodney]

Nice Pics Watcher652, Mercury973 and Ravenheart!
Damn, he looks good with a gun in his hand(s). And in hats!