Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Scary Kitty]

Good morning, Sparkies! Happy Smutty Tuesday!

And for my 3,300th post:

http://i1231.photobucket.com/albums/...talcoil_02.jpg

Why did we put Rodney in charge of the fireworks?

Because I knew he'd screw them up.

That seems rather stupid.

But it gave me a chance to touch you.

I take it back. Not stupid at all.

LOL! Cadman must've been back on Earth or something.

And congrats on 3,300 posts!

Imagine all the stories that could've been told ... and the countless ways I can think of for them to bring Elizabeth back ... *whimpers*

Oh well. SGA Rising for the win.

We'll do it better anyway.

Anyhow, I was whumping myself and rewatching parts of "Adrift" (I needed some screen caps) and I watched the part after McKay tells John he reactivated Elizabeth's nanites and John looks ready to punch him. This line, though:

I actually got goosebumps rewatching this. And it convinces me that there was an offscreen Sparky conversation that happened after TRW where Elizabeth talked about this with John. And the way that he was acting like/being treated like he was her next of kin? Proof is in the puddin', y'all.

Okay. That's my two cents for the night. Now I'm going to bed!

Darn right. And isn't it interesting that just after TRW comes Common Ground, where Elizabeth has to make that kind of decision about John when Kolya's threatening to kill him. Sure, Elizabeth had to make a similar decision back in Season 2's Coup d'Etat, but I found the timing of Common Ground to be particularly curious.

Re Misbegotten, that scene has always puzzled me. First, it was an add-on by a writer who both disliked Weir (and then later Joe personally) to show the passage of time. Second, the character motivations are all up the whop. He's either peacocking (displaying his feathers in a show of manhood to impress teh lady), expressing his distaste at the bureaucratic process, coming up there specifically to point out that he was on her side against Woolsey/IOA, or to show what a big softie Woolsey really was.

As for the "Sam" thing, that never sat well with me (John especially would never call her that). In fairness, when Sam said to Teyla in Kindred (?) to "call me Sam" I half expected Teyla to say "why?"

*snorts* Yeah, kinda like how Carter and Keller are all talking about grieving over Kate in Doppelganger, as if Carter even knew her all that well. WTF?

[Scary Kitty]

Oh yes. That argument, which breaks my heart and yet I find one of the strongest proofs of how close John was to Elizabeth. Well that, and this:

http://i260.photobucket.com/albums/i...drift_0332.jpg

*wibbles over the woobie*

On the Adrift line (again) I think it implied that no one knew Elizabeth better than John, and he took pride in that. His forceful exertion of it to Rodney emphasizes just how much it means to him to do what Elizabeth wants. What has to be taken into consideration for the 'haters' here is that the argument doesn't keen to 'what's best for the city'. John never says the city will be put in danger as the principle part of the argument. It's what Elizabeth would want for the city. That's what he's fighting about. And Rodney does care about Elizabeth more than almost anyone, but he is not as close to her as John.

It's an echo of what he mentions in Common Ground, and it reflects how he treats her throughout season 3. Notice there's really not a questioning of her authority anymore. They're pretty much a melded unit (except for that heinous example of all of them in Return, Part I) and other than doing the typical stuff that would irritate each other (getting drug-charmed by evil smarmy con artists/accidentally setting a planet at war with itself, etc) they're in sync. So much so that I still say it's interesting that in the 'getting to know you after three years episode', Sunday, they completely omitted John running across Elizabeth AT ALL. He should have had something to say about Bearded Mike, but...

It's also interesting in light of First Strike, where he agrees to go along with Ellis contrary to what Elizabeth wants. I don't wonder if some of his vehemence is the residual effect of the fact that he defied her to the partial consequence of the current situation, and he was feeling the weight of that, as John liked to do.

*high-fives on the Common Ground reference* Great minds think alike!

There's definitely a huge guilt factor in John post-FS. I've always imagined it as a hinge point in how he views their relationship, in maybe forcing him to acknowledge certain things he'd been trying to deny up until then.

[Southern Red]

On the Adrift line (again) I think it implied that no one knew Elizabeth better than John, and he took pride in that. His forceful exertion of it to Rodney emphasizes just how much it means to him to do what Elizabeth wants. What has to be taken into consideration for the 'haters' here is that the argument doesn't keen to 'what's best for the city'. John never says the city will be put in danger as the principle part of the argument. It's what Elizabeth would want for the city. That's what he's fighting about. And Rodney does care about Elizabeth more than almost anyone, but he is not as close to her as John.

It's an echo of what he mentions in Common Ground, and it reflects how he treats her throughout season 3. Notice there's really not a questioning of her authority anymore. They're pretty much a melded unit (except for that heinous example of all of them in Return, Part I) and other than doing the typical stuff that would irritate each other (getting drug-charmed by evil smarmy con artists/accidentally setting a planet at war with itself, etc) they're in sync. So much so that I still say it's interesting that in the 'getting to know you after three years episode', Sunday, they completely omitted John running across Elizabeth AT ALL. He should have had something to say about Bearded Mike, but...

It's also interesting in light of First Strike, where he agrees to go along with Ellis contrary to what Elizabeth wants. I don't wonder if some of his vehemence is the residual effect of the fact that he defied her to the partial consequence of the current situation, and he was feeling the weight of that, as John liked to do.

Sunday was just a mess and shows what Gero comes up with when he's left to his own devices. Drivel. The very idea of Mike was insulting to her character. In fact, Torri was not pleased that he was younger and went to them saying Elizabeth would never do that, but of course, she was overruled. I read that in the Stargate magazine just the other day from way back when.

CG was an excellent bit of accidental foreshadowing. We saw that Elizabeth was not so enthralled by John that she couldn't make the hard decisions. In no way was she ruled by her emotions in that one. And in Adrift/Lifeline we see the same is true of John. They obviously knew each other very well. In a rare bit of coherence, the writers showed us that.

I always thought John's reaction when she turned and walked away in FS showed a bit of guilt for going against her, and then later it was like he kept seeking her out hoping to learn she wasn't mad at him.

Good morning, Sparkies! Happy Smutty Tuesday!



LOL! Cadman must've been back on Earth or something.

And congrats on 3,300 posts!



We'll do it better anyway.



Darn right. And isn't it interesting that just after TRW comes Common Ground, where Elizabeth has to make that kind of decision about John when Kolya's threatening to kill him. Sure, Elizabeth had to make a similar decision back in Season 2's Coup d'Etat, but I found the timing of Common Ground to be particularly curious.



*snorts* Yeah, kinda like how Carter and Keller are all talking about grieving over Kate in Doppelganger, as if Carter even knew her all that well. WTF?

It makes you wonder, doesn't it? Why the emphasis on John and Elizabeth making the decision to sacrifice the other? What possible reason could there have been for that if no ship was intended? I guess they thought it was a leader to leader kind of thing.

*wibbles over the woobie*



*high-fives on the Common Ground reference* Great minds think alike!

There's definitely a huge guilt factor in John post-FS. I've always imagined it as a hinge point in how he views their relationship, in maybe forcing him to acknowledge certain things he'd been trying to deny up until then.

That could definitely be true. Then when he lost her, he may have let those feelings come forward and it was all downhill from there. John never went back to the happy-go-lucky guy from S1-3 who could joke even in the face of OMG, we're all gonna die. It was like a veil descended over him and shut out all the light.

[Anuna]

I'm alive, my apartment is in pieces, my sanity as well - ti's a good thing to come here finally and take a bath in awesome discussion! *hugs the thread*

[Southern Red]

I'm alive, my apartment is in pieces, my sanity as well - ti's a good thing to come here finally and take a bath in awesome discussion! *hugs the thread*

*hugs back* I hate having my house in disarray so I feel your pain. Mr. SR and I are talking about redoing our kitchen to bring it into the 21st century, but the very idea makes me weak in the knees. Our friends had no kitchen for a month and had to set up a little makeshift area in the basement with a coffee pot and a toaster oven. It was not pretty. And we won't even go into the expense.

[Anuna]

*hugs back* I hate having my house in disarray so I feel your pain. Mr. SR and I are talking about redoing our kitchen to bring it into the 21st century, but the very idea makes me weak in the knees. Our friends had no kitchen for a month and had to set up a little makeshift area in the basement with a coffee pot and a toaster oven. It was not pretty. And we won't even go into the expense.

I feel traumatized, I can't even make coffee and I can't tell you how annoying it is to have some guy walking around my living space, leaving dusty, dirty footprints all around the floor. Just - *pulls hair* *screams*

[Anuna]

Gonna run to my hiding place called Box of Dreams and escape the RL insanity. You guys up to more beta reading sometime this week? I think FH might be on vacation/travel, she mentioned something like that ...?

[Scary Kitty]

*hugs Anuna about the nasty crazy remodeling/repairs* It's never fun having your daily routine upended, even when it's for something that will ultimately be very useful. *more hugs*

Gonna run to my hiding place called Box of Dreams and escape the RL insanity. You guys up to more beta reading sometime this week? I think FH might be on vacation/travel, she mentioned something like that ...?

Heck yes, I'm up to some more beta reading! Bring it on whenever you're ready!

[Southern Red]

Gonna run to my hiding place called Box of Dreams and escape the RL insanity. You guys up to more beta reading sometime this week? I think FH might be on vacation/travel, she mentioned something like that ...?

Bring it on, baby.

[Anuna]

Bring it on, baby.

Expect it in a few days!! Wooo hooo! ready to deal with real trouble? MUAHAHAHHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHHA!!!!!

[Scary Kitty]

Expect it in a few days!! Wooo hooo! ready to deal with real trouble? MUAHAHAHHAHAHHAHHAHAHAHHA!!!!!

*rubs hands together and cackles in fiendish glee*

[Nolamom]

My husband is a nationally certified Kitchen and Bath designer. I know more about remodeling than I care to mention. (after being married 35 years...) yes, been there with the house torn to pieces, more than once! Living with no kitchen is a real picnic - literally! You wind up doing a whole lot of sandwiches and take out meals.

[Anuna]

*rubs hands together and cackles in fiendish glee*

You know what's coming up next, right? THAT part. You know which one, yes? And how much do you wanna bet it's going to be better than that thing we discussed not long ago? *ebil laughter*

[ShipperWriter]

You know what's coming up next, right? THAT part. You know which one, yes? And how much do you wanna bet it's going to be better than that thing we discussed not long ago? *ebil laughter*

*fangirl squee* Oh, you ebil people! Making me so excited!

[Madness reigns]

SW Love the Lizzie sig That's all I have to say.