Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[florence]

I think that is the *key* in the entire episode and what some are ignoring. The most important thing to come out of this entire episode was how it highlighted just how much Elizabeth loved John. She doesn't go that berserk for anyone else to that extent folks and you all know it. She was completely irrational at times and on edge the rest.

Why make her the other half of the focus and follow *her* reaction to John's predicament thru the entire ep? Why let Caldwell ask her the question? Like Mel said, Shep/Weir is the obvious chosen relationship to follow for the audience. Does it make any sense to you that they would toss him in with Teyla or any other woman in any long-term type of major relationship when they would be forced by the nature of it to take away from their chosen primary focus relationship? Unless they're about to *majorly* change gears and do a 180, there is no way it happens.

The

Spoiler:

mouth smashing from wraithjohn to teyla

was allowing that teenboy fantasy to be manifest a little for the stickfighting, bellybutton bearing contingent.

-B ; )

Very good post. I agree with everything you said... except about Elizabeth loving John. IMO they're not there yet. They cared about each other, that's sure. But I don't think they have already aknowledged their own feelings to themselves.

You know, with all this discussion about

Spoiler:

mouthsmashing (love that word ! ) from WraithJohn to Teyla

, I'm glad it was Teyla rather than Elizabeth. Don't yell at me ! Let me explain...

We see in the end that

Spoiler:

Shep is embarrassed by his behaviour and that he doesn't really know how to act with her now, and that Teyla looks relieved that things go back to normal because she's not seeing Shep in that way (that's how I see it and I'll stick to it ! )

Now, if it had been Elizabeth instead of Teyla... I think things would have been strained between her and John after... And I don't want to see them like that (been there, done that with Sam/Jack... )

[Rubicon]

Very good post. I agree with everything you said... except about Elizabeth loving John. IMO they're not there yet. They cared about each other, that's sure. But I don't think they have already aknowledged their own feelings to themselves.

ITA. Also, not seeing the Elizabeth-in-love. Yet. Neither of them knows what they're in. Yet.

Mwahahahah! Until its tooo late!

[Whistler84]

ITA. Also, not seeing the Elizabeth-in-love. Yet. Neither of them knows what they're in. Yet.

Mwahahahah! Until its tooo late!

Gotta agree. Not yet, but soon.

[Vixen]

You know, with all this discussion about

Spoiler:

mouthsmashing (love that word ! ) from WraithJohn to Teyla

, I'm glad it was Teyla rather than Elizabeth. Don't yell at me ! Let me explain...

Don't worry, we're also glad it wasn't Elizabeth there

[Rubicon]

with all this discussion about

Spoiler:

mouthsmashing (love that word ! ) from WraithJohn to Teyla

, I'm glad it was Teyla rather than Elizabeth. Don't yell at me !

LOL! Mr. Rubicon called it a Smash & Grab!

[Bama]

ITA. Also, not seeing the Elizabeth-in-love. Yet. Neither of them knows what they're in. Yet.

Mwahahahah! Until its tooo late!

Oh, Elizabeth doesn't *know* she's in love yet. I agree there gals. She'd deny it like crazy. I love that scene where

Spoiler:

Caldwell nails her down and calls her on those 'extra' feelings she has for john. Her entire body tenses up and she freezes a moment as if almost in fear of having to deal with the question. And then instead of just saying 'yes, we are' and leaving it at that, she feels she must justify it to his prying ass self.

WHY does she act like that? We can all 'read' women pretty well I think. What did that body language and hesitancy tell you guys? I know what it told me pretty dern plainly. ; )

She probably doesn't 'want' those feelings for john. She probably refuses to think about or dwell on her reactions to him. She certainly wouldn't acknowledge that they're anything more than friendship. She would never consciously *choose* him in a million years as a mate. BUT, the beauty of it is her defenseless feelings will eventually do the choosing for her.

-B

[Lexa Jayde]

Morning everyone

i am at school AGAIN.... oohh i hate it but i did just watch conversion again in 20 minutes so i ready for the day

[Vixen]

Spoiler:

I just wanted to mention how much I loved the scene in Elizabeth's office when John wanted to go on the mission. It was my favorite in this episode. But this moment:

"This is my life we're talking!"
"I know that."

Got to me. Not just the words that were so true but the emotions behind them and the tone of their voices. You could see and hear the frustration in John that he was helpless to do anything while others were deciding for him and his life, and her being very much aware of that and you could see how it pained Elizabeth to see him that way even though she was trying her best.

[Luz]

Very good post. I agree with everything you said... except about Elizabeth loving John. IMO they're not there yet. They cared about each other, that's sure. But I don't think they have already aknowledged their own feelings to themselves.

You know, with all this discussion about

Spoiler:

mouthsmashing (love that word ! ) from WraithJohn to Teyla

, I'm glad it was Teyla rather than Elizabeth. Don't yell at me ! Let me explain...

We see in the end that

Spoiler:

Shep is embarrassed by his behaviour and that he doesn't really know how to act with her now, and that Teyla looks relieved that things go back to normal because she's not seeing Shep in that way (that's how I see it and I'll stick to it ! )

Now, if it had been Elizabeth instead of Teyla... I think things would have been strained between her and John after... And I don't want to see them like that (been there, done that with Sam/Jack... )

I'm also glad it wasn't Weir, it's too soon for any sort of RST, on any ship. If the

Spoiler:

kiss

was tptb notion of taking a step towards cannon for Shep/Teyla (which i seriously doubt) i would be worried if i were a Shep/Teyla shipper. Some people are even comparing it to the broca divide, i would be even more worried and would in no way want my ship to follow Sam/Jack footsteps (or M/S for that matter, M/S is like the bible for don'ts on a ship). Is it my imagination or when tptb focus on a ship it can be considered close to doomed?. Which is why i would be pretty happy with them leaving Shep/Weir to their own devices, you know balcony talks, looks, and not mess with it.
From the

Spoiler:

kiss

i would dare saying they are still experimenting, they know what we want, and they know what Shep/Teyla shippers want, they know we are not asking for hard physical stuff, and are quite happy with a "friend's to lovers" slowly budding relationship. And they know Shep/Teyla shippers are more into physical stuff, like how he's attracted to her ever since the rising, and how their stick fights are the vertical expression of a horizontal wish

Spoiler:

which according to some Shep/Teyla shippers explanations was the reason why he kissed her in Conversion, he just couldn't take it anymore, and since his inhibitions were down he could satisfy his long held hearts (or other head's) desire

Sneeky dudes tptb are, they are playing with both of us, trying to satisfy the Shep/Teyla shippers with the physical stuff, but at the same time giving us our precious moments.

[Bama]

Ok...let me 'toss' something out at you guys...

Serious post alert. And. Random Bama thought #9,001 ...

What if...(and I SERIOUSLY think this may be what is about to shake down)...

Spoiler:

You guys know that the whole Ford storyline is coming up here at midseason and will most likely continue into the season finale eps. And we all know it's just a matter of time until Sheppard screws up again because he will REFUSE to lay down on Ford. We've already had foreshadowing in earlier eps this season that Caldwell will try and force shep's hand on this issue. He thinks Ford is a danger-Shep doesn't. They've already had the heated conversation about it. So, Shep screws up and gets his ass busted by mission control...we all KNOW it's coming. I think they're setting Caldwell up to be placed as the military commander over Atlantis in shep's place because of this and let shep remain only over his team as second in charge of miltary ops. Bet we'll see this 'stripping' of his title in the last ep this year too. Well...where does that leave us? Do we get a shaken and angry Shep who will take things out on the world including Elizabeth? Do we get a jealous as hell shep who sees his 'place' by Elizabeth's side being taken? Do we see him turning more to his teammates while this is going on? Turning to Teyla more? Do we see Teyla 'seeing' like she has before? "She is not the only one who suffers from that particular affliction." Do we see John leaning on her a while and forbid, trying to become closer because he's a little bit 'lost' without Elizabeth?

Guys, I may not have it exact and actually hope like heck that I don't but that's the vibe I'm gettin right now. TPTB is gonna tear shep and weir down before they 'build' them up again. What do you guys think? Am I totally off my rocker here or does anyone else see this coming like a freight train in the night?

Of course, the end result will be a hugely strengthened relationship upon what we already have but it will hurt like heck to watch at times I think. But, on the flip side, it may give us a chance to see some feelings raw and revealed that the status quo wouldn't allow us to.

Thoughts?

Geesh, I hope so.

-Bama ; )

[Bama]

I'm also glad it wasn't Weir, it's too soon for any sort of RST, on any ship. If the

Spoiler:

kiss

was tptb notion of taking a step towards cannon for Shep/Teyla (which i seriously doubt) i would be worried if i were a Shep/Teyla shipper. Some people are even comparing it to the broca divide, i would be even more worried and would in no way want my ship to follow Sam/Jack footsteps (or M/S for that matter, M/S is like the bible for don'ts on a ship). Is it my imagination or when tptb focus on a ship it can be considered close to doomed?. Which is why i would be pretty happy with them leaving Shep/Weir to their own devices, you know balcony talks, looks, and not mess with it.
From the

Spoiler:

kiss

i would dare saying they are still experimenting, they know what we want, and they know what Shep/Teyla shippers want, they know we are not asking for hard physical stuff, and are quite happy with a "friend's to lovers" slowly budding relationship. And they know Shep/Teyla shippers are more into physical stuff, like how he's attracted to her ever since the rising, and how their stick fights are the vertical expression of a horizontal wish

Spoiler:

which according to some Shep/Teyla shippers explanations was the reason why he kissed her in Conversion, he just couldn't take it anymore, and since his inhibitions were down he could satisfy his long held hearts (or other head's) desire

Sneeky dudes tptb are, they are playing with both of us, trying to satisfy the Shep/Teyla shippers with the physical stuff, but at the same time giving us our precious moments.

GREAT POST. You are 'dead on' imo. I think we'll get what we want with patience and perserverance but it won't always be pain free. ; ) TPTB know what the fans want and the huge majority of shippers are on this boat. Slow...slow...simmer...

Just want to get enough along for us to know they're growing toward each other and thinking more and more about 'all' with each other.

[SoulSpinder]

Of course, the end result will be a hugely strengthened relationship upon what we already have but it will hurt like heck to watch at times I think. But, on the flip side, it may give us a chance to see some feelings raw and revealed that the status quo wouldn't allow us to.

Thoughts?

Geesh, I hope so.

-Bama ; )

Those are very good...thoughtful....thoughts? oh dear. (anywho!) They actually sound extremely plausable. And I hate to say it, some of it probable. It's according as to how much they want Caldwell to be a part of the story line however...ON your speculation...

Spoiler:

Removing Sheppard from military command I think would lessen his role on the show quite a bit unless they focus specifically on missions from there on out. So the question would be: do they go more towards an SG-1 field instead of a more balanced base and mission side and replace who is currently considered thier lead actor, or do they simply find a way to let Caldwell have more power. For example, perhaps co-command? That would give Shep enough headaches.

[Bama]

Those are very good...thoughtful....thoughts? oh dear. (anywho!) They actually sound extremely plausable. And I hate to say it, some of it probable. It's according as to how much they want Caldwell to be a part of the story line however...ON your speculation...

Spoiler:

Removing Sheppard from military command I think would lessen his role on the show quite a bit unless they focus specifically on missions from there on out. So the question would be: do they go more towards an SG-1 field instead of a more balanced base and mission side and replace who is currently considered thier lead actor, or do they simply find a way to let Caldwell have more power. For example, perhaps co-command? That would give Shep enough headaches.

Think temporary. With a heavier focus on his missions leaving caldwell on homebase to butt heads with liz at times and even on some missions to butt heads with shep at times and a wrestle for control always. Breaking down and building up... I don't see a co-command if shep messes up like he's prone to. All the pointers edge to a liz/caldwell battle for control with Eliz. being the one caught in the middle between shep and his superior. it has potential for great stuff but also for some indigestion for us shippers at times. sigh...we are gluttons for punishment aren't we?

[Luz]

Think temporary. With a heavier focus on his missions leaving caldwell on homebase to butt heads with liz at times and even on some missions to butt heads with shep at times and a wrestle for control always. Breaking down and building up... I don't see a co-command if shep messes up like he's prone to. All the pointers edge to a liz/caldwell battle for control with Eliz. being the one caught in the middle between shep and his superior. it has potential for great stuff but also for some indigestion for us shippers at times. sigh...we are gluttons for punishment aren't we?

The potential for this storyline is huge, this would give us lots of emotional whumping for both Sheppard and Weir. And what you mentioned about how Sheppard could turn to Teyla (and here temporary is key like you said), oh, my this could give us maybe? jealous/ansty Weir. Angst, it's all about the angst, not so much about Sheppard losing his position at Atlantis definitely because i'm sure tptb would find a way to put him back on where he belongs, a little while of Sheppard having to take being a subordinate instead of Weir's 2IC is good for everyone characterwise, but it would be completely different to have Sheppard being bossed around by Col. Skinner indefinitely, it would get boring very quickly.
In short term i can imagine the tension between Shep/Col. Skinner, Col. Skinner/Weir, Shep/Weir, tension fest, angst fest, and angst has potential for comfort. Gosh, i'm salivating just thinking about all that could come out of this, and we are only speculating.

[Bama]

The potential for this storyline is huge, this would give us lots of emotional whumping for both Sheppard and Weir. And what you mentioned about how Sheppard could turn to Teyla (and here temporary is key like you said), oh, my this could give us maybe? jealous/ansty Weir. Angst, it's all about the angst, not so much about Sheppard losing his position at Atlantis definitely because i'm sure tptb would find a way to put him back on where he belongs, a little while of Sheppard having to take being a subordinate instead of Weir's 2IC is good for everyone characterwise, but it would be completely different to have Sheppard being bossed around by Col. Skinner indefinitely, it would get boring very quickly.
In short term i can imagine the tension between Shep/Col. Skinner, Col. Skinner/Weir, Shep/Weir, tension fest, angst fest, and angst has potential for comfort. Gosh, i'm salivating just thinking about all that could come out of this, and we are only speculating.

I'm thinkin jealous and angsty shep as well. ; ) THAT is what we need to see more of and this provides it. This storyline angle provides for plenty of ops for BOTH to see how much they need and want to be around each other. Caldwell already knows how Eliz. feels. Watch him USE that info now to torture them both. ; ) Angst ga-freakin-lore. ; )
Am I the only one that could actually see Teyla being the one to point out to Shep how much it is Eliz. that he is missing? She 'sees' beyond the 16 year old prostitute type wardrobe she dresses in.