Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Bama]

Bama ........exuberance and blab about our fave ship and show is always good and your take on it is IMHO spot on! I loved how John seemed so tuned in to what ELiz was going through. You need to have a special connection with someone to experience that. There is no doubt that our duo has that connection. I hope that when it comes to John`s epiphany that ELiz will be allowed to be there for him

Vixen...no luck yet with d/l of vid. Would love to see it

Whoo...yummy word play! I love that! ; )

Spoiler:

See, it is episodes like BIS that make me wonder if TPTB didn't really have John and Eliz. pegged to eventually form a pair bond/mating relationship from the beginning. However, I look at BIS and see that it was written by Binder and I have to think that perhaps it is *him* that sees the potential in the John/Eliz. pairing that the original writers of SGA could never see. By the last half of season one, all the 'canon' (I'm still getting used to that word) ship was seemingly dropped and forgotten. You just *never* see any lingering gazes or meaningful conversations between John and Tey about much of anything. That is why, like Mel so eloquently said yesterday, that any sort of intimate 'moment' we might get in Conversion could not possibly be taken seriously by either party. It simply would make *no* sense given the flow and ebb of the series to this particular point in time. It actually would have made better since in the first half dozen or so episodes but now? Hardly.

-B ; )

[Hatcheter]

Good thoughts on Before I Sleep, Bama. I think most of us were just floored by the episode, because none of us really expected it to be so good. Alternate universe/time travel stories tend to be weak, but this one certainly wasn't. And I think we have it to thank for Elizabeth's increased role this year. Suddenly everyone figured out that Torri Higginson owns this part.

I wasn't looking forward to that episode based on the info that was available on Gateworld before it aired. It sounded like filler among what was an exceptional run of episodes in the second half of the season. It turned out to be one of my favorites. Not only did we finally get a Weir-centric episode, but the story, the pacing, and the direction were all superb. (It also confirmed for me that I had had jumped aboard the right ship. )

And it was Carl Binder's first Atlantis script. I think that we see now that he is, in fact, the man.

Bama, I like your analysis, prticularly about Elizabeth's dedication and willingness to sacrifice for Atlantis, and maybe to build a life there at the same time. They're in a very difficult spot, which is part of what I find about the potential relationship so interesitng. Few couples have "horrible death" waiting just around every bend. Deciding to take a chance on a relationship would be courage in and of itself.

(You also gave me a little bit more to chew on for a vid idea that's been bouncing around in my head, about cost and sacrifice Atlantis has demanded.)

[SGLAB]

Whoo...yummy word play! I love that! ; )

Spoiler:

See, it is episodes like BIS that make me wonder if TPTB didn't really have John and Eliz. pegged to eventually form a pair bond/mating relationship from the beginning. However, I look at BIS and see that it was written by Binder and I have to think that perhaps it is *him* that sees the potential in the John/Eliz. pairing that the original writers of SGA could never see. By the last half of season one, all the 'canon' (I'm still getting used to that word) ship was seemingly dropped and forgotten. You just *never* see any lingering gazes or meaningful conversations between John and Tey about much of anything. That is why, like Mel so eloquently said yesterday, that any sort of intimate 'moment' we might get in Conversion could not possibly be taken seriously by either party. It simply would make *no* sense given the flow and ebb of the series to this particular point in time. It actually would have made better since in the first half dozen or so episodes but now? Hardly.

-B ; )

Let's hope that if they do have a cannon ship all tptb can agree on it.

Okay, enough of my cynicism. Have to remember 'Don't Panic.' And I finally understand where that line comes from.

BIS was a great ep. John just seemed to know when to say something to her to show support and when to step back and give her space.

[xkawaiix]

Whoo...yummy word play! I love that! ; )

Spoiler:

See, it is episodes like BIS that make me wonder if TPTB didn't really have John and Eliz. pegged to eventually form a pair bond/mating relationship from the beginning. However, I look at BIS and see that it was written by Binder and I have to think that perhaps it is *him* that sees the potential in the John/Eliz. pairing that the original writers of SGA could never see. By the last half of season one, all the 'canon' (I'm still getting used to that word) ship was seemingly dropped and forgotten. You just *never* see any lingering gazes or meaningful conversations between John and Tey about much of anything. That is why, like Mel so eloquently said yesterday, that any sort of intimate 'moment' we might get in Conversion could not possibly be taken seriously by either party. It simply would make *no* sense given the flow and ebb of the series to this particular point in time. It actually would have made better since in the first half dozen or so episodes but now? Hardly.

-B ; )

Spoiler:

What I like about the John/Liz ship is that you see the little glances, conversations, arm touch, and the lovely balcony scenes. They share the little things that, to me, just aren't happening with John and Teyla. I wonder why encourage John/Teyla when it seems that there's more John/Liz?

And about the kiss in Conversion... what then? The kiss doesn't make much sense because John and Teyla don't really seem to be that close. Remeber in LFP? "Too much I fear." That to me told me that Teyla was backing off, standing down, and telling herself that she couldn't have all that she wants with John. And I don't mean this to let down the John/Teyla shippers, just looking at both ships and stating my oppinion so, not harm intended.

Oh does it seem that the John/Liz ship is just natural with Torri and Joe or is it scripted or both?

[Melyanna]

BIS was a great ep. John just seemed to know when to say something to her to show support and when to step back and give her space.

That was another interesting facet of the episode. It's not just about Elizabeth, it's about her relationship with "her boys" as well. One thing that fascinated me about it was that John didn't seem overly interested in what old Elizabeth had to say, not like McKay was. He wanted to know that their Elizabeth was doing all right, hence the rather beautiful scene at the end.

I do think that Carl Binder is interested in how these two play off each other, whether romantically or otherwise. I find it interesting that they gave him the two (arguably) most difficult scripts to write last season. As I said before, there's an inherent weakness in alternate reality stories (I should know, I wrote one ), and then gave him the clip show too. Poor guy. But he did both of them beautifully. Letters from Pegasus turned out to be one of my favorite episodes of the season. At the very least, he seems interested in Elizabeth as a leader.

Anyway, I wasn't getting the casting sides at the time, so I don't know exactly what they contained, but GW's spoiler write-up for that episode wasn't very encouraging. Just goes to show that things aren't always as they seem.

(You also gave me a little bit more to chew on for a vid idea that's been bouncing around in my head, about cost and sacrifice Atlantis has demanded.)

It's an interesting subject, isn't it? One of my latest things ficwise is the city personified. (What can I say, I never really outgrew fairy tales. And 2001 is one of my favorite movies. I love evil computers. ) I did a vid a few months ago that really got under my skin, and it was kind of along those lines, except it set up the city as a seductress. Interesting thing to think about.

[Hatcheter]

I did a vid a few months ago that really got under my skin, and it was kind of along those lines, except it set up the city as a seductress. Interesting thing to think about.

"Angel", right? It's part of the inspiration for my current idea, though the musical choice is rather different. Of course, I've got a bunch of half-finished vids already, so who knows if this one will ever get done.

[xkawaiix]

I did a vid a few months ago that really got under my skin, and it was kind of along those lines, except it set up the city as a seductress. Interesting thing to think about.

Can I get the link?

[Melyanna]

"Angel", right? It's part of the inspiration for my current idea, though the musical choice is rather different. Of course, I've got a bunch of half-finished vids already, so who knows if this one will ever get done.

Yup, it was "Angel". Probably my favorite vid project so far, even though I've done a few that were better in a technical sense.

And kawaii, you can find it on my vid page. It's the third one on the page.

[xkawaiix]

Yup, it was "Angel". Probably my favorite vid project so far, even though I've done a few that were better in a technical sense.

And kawaii, you can find it on my vid page. It's the third one on the page.

Yay great vid!

[*AtlantisFan*]

Mel, just watched you video ("Angel"), I loved it great job

[Vixen]

:clapping: Lovely video!!! :more clapping:

Thanks kawaii!

[Bama]

Wow...Mel...awesome video! That looks like it took a heck of a lot of work. Incredible job! more!

Guys, I was thinkin earlier today (while I was supposed to be concentrating on paperwork) ; )...that John's initial reaction to both Tey and Eliz. shouldn't be really too surprising. Perhaps, as Shep/Weir shippers, we haven't looked at the thing from John's side enough. Here's this guy-seemingly footloose and fancy free-tossed into the fire by his own high-rolling hand and for he finds himself, maybe for the first time in his life, with a woman for a boss and himself much in control of his own destiny. His initial reaction to Eliz. would not have been the same if he'd say, met her in a bar where they were both on the make or say, on another planet where she was dressed scantily and giving you interested looks.

That Siege 3 moment between them was, I truly believe the first time he really looked at her with the 'eyes' of a man looking at a woman. She wasn't his usual idea, I'm quite sure, of a woman he'd generally go 'looking' for. Tey was more along the lines-physically speaking only- of what he was used to looking for in a female companion and he of course, might react initially according to that self sense of 'normalcy'.

My grandmother always used to say that a man wouldn't dare think about tumbling a lady if she acted like a proper one (as she was trying to fortify my moral code ; ). I think Eliz. initially came across to John as 'too much' of a lady to be considered 'sexy' in his eyes. Perhaps, she came across to the SGA audience initially that way as well to begin with thus causing some of that early resistance to her character.

Now, Elizabeth seems to get sexier to me with every passing episode and I would have to think, since that 'moment', to John as well. His behavior toward her with the little flirtations we've all noticed seem to indicate that too. Now, the barrier has been 'broken', partially by time and learned trust and friendship and of course, that proximity breech in S3. The proverbial 'floodgate' is now 'open' as well as John's eyes.

May he see his way clearly to Elizabeth's heart one day and may he be open to allowing her 'ladyship' into his own.

-Bama ; )

[Vixen]

It's incredible all the different analysis that came out of that one hug scene. How many times have you all watched it anyway?

[Bama]

His initial reaction to Eliz. would not have been the same if he'd say, met her in a bar where they were both on the make or say, on another planet where she was dressed scantily and giving you interested looks.

She wasn't his usual idea, I'm quite sure, of a woman he'd generally go 'looking' for. Tey was more along the lines-physically speaking only- of what he was used to looking for in a female companion and he of course, might react initially according to that self sense of 'normalcy'.

-Bama ; )

Guys, I never agreed with myself on a message board but I must on this. I wrote this *before* I watched an ep 'accidently' tonight after I watched 'Hot Zone'. Why, oh why did one of you not WARN me for goodness sakes about that horrific, stupid excuse for an episode called 'Sanctuary'?

Egads!

What goobersmooch wrote that?

Spoiler:

John acting like he had a penis for a brain and by watching him you'd think he'd never seen a female before. I could handle him putting Teyla across a table anyday over that dribble I just watched. Egads! John doing his best 'Kirk' imitation was more than stomach revolting-it was just beyond stupid. And there was Teyla totally out of character imo, acting like his personal Viagra pill and Elizabeth suddenly doesn't have a brain or independent thought in her head?!? And all the sudden, nobody seems to think anything Super scientist Rodney has to say is of any merit? Uh, HELLO?

And what was with that ending out of a bad Outer Limits episode? "This is Cool"? Oh yeah, I could so buy he'd made some big spiritual, emotional connection to that walking supermodel. (insert incredible amounts of sarcasm here) Egads!

There was nothing redeeming AT ALL about that episode that I can see. Please, someone point it out to me if I'm missing something. I'd like to discuss the 'hot zone' incident but right now, I have got to have a strong drink.

Out.

-Bama ; (

[SapphireJewelledQueen]

.... and Australia finally gets Prometheus Unbound on TV tonight.......

FINALLY! I was so angry that they didn't show it.

Hope so, this will be my first convention.

Just wondering...Is anyone here going to the Sydney one? I think they both JF and TH will be on together, because its only one day...omg, i cant believe we're going to be in the same room as them....

Right, anyone got any suggestions for questions? Throw them at me!!