Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Vixen]

By the way, I love your screen name!

Thanks!

I think it's possible to show the development of a friendship between the two without devoting a lot of time to it. Like, for instance, they could start trading books, and do it kind of discreetly. Sheppard gets back from visiting Earth and hands Elizabeth The Hunt for Red October. Or, how about The Killer Angels ? She glances at it quickly, then tucks it under her arm and goes about her business. It's so not in-your-face, but tells the audience they are doing something to learn more about each others likes and dislikes. God knows, we would all pick up on this kind of thing *very* quickly. And, the writers could have a lot of fun coming up with different books for the characters to read.

I like that idea!

[xkawaiix]

I just got this from the Maj. Sheppard Thunk Thread (thanks to Elinor):

Here's another bit of Joe's interview from the TV Zone special...

Spoiler:

When it comes to working on Atlantis, JF is happy to do anything asked of him - except where sticks are involved. "Initially, they wanted my character to be a superhero-type guy who was able to easily pick up all sorts of skills, including fighting techniques, however, I think we all agreed that when push comes to shove, Sheppard would prefer to shoot the bad guy a la Harrison Ford in Raiders of the Lost Ark as opposed to brandishing a sword or whatever. Well, Teyla has these fighting sticks that she likes to use, and in Conversion, she and Sheppard are forced to have this big stick fight. We rehearsed it and it wasn't a pretty sight..laughs JF....I was like 'I can't do this. I'm not good at sticks. Can't I just shoot her?' It's Teyla though, and I can't do that. So I had to go through that whole learning process, which for me was a huge challenge. We had fun though, and there's a little surprise at the end of the scene that I think the fans will like.

Anybody else fearing what I'm fearing?

dammit!!!! Wow, well this isn't good for our thread.

Hmm, but we'll recover!

I hope...

Man, and I always thought that the kiss that they were talking about was the one with

Spoiler:

Rodney and McKay!!!!

They talked about it on the Sci Fi Friday special. *sigh* oh well, I guess since we get a hug, the Sheyla's get a kiss. But then again Shep's not in his right mind right???

[Major Fischer]

Anybody else fearing what I'm fearing?

Honestly? I think that passage has absolutely nothing to dow with ship at all. It's talking about stunts and teamwork.

[astronomicalchick]

I just got this from the Maj. Sheppard Thunk Thread (thanks to Elinor):

Here's another bit of Joe's interview from the TV Zone special...

Spoiler:

When it comes to working on Atlantis, JF is happy to do anything asked of him - except where sticks are involved. "Initially, they wanted my character to be a superhero-type guy who was able to easily pick up all sorts of skills, including fighting techniques, however, I think we all agreed that when push comes to shove, Sheppard would prefer to shoot the bad guy a la Harrison Ford in Raiders of the Lost Ark as opposed to brandishing a sword or whatever. Well, Teyla has these fighting sticks that she likes to use, and in Conversion, she and Sheppard are forced to have this big stick fight. We rehearsed it and it wasn't a pretty sight..laughs JF....I was like 'I can't do this. I'm not good at sticks. Can't I just shoot her?' It's Teyla though, and I can't do that. So I had to go through that whole learning process, which for me was a huge challenge. We had fun though, and there's a little surprise at the end of the scene that I think the fans will like.

Anybody else fearing what I'm fearing?

Spoiler:

yeah, I think we're going to have to brace ourselves for that one.

But on the bright side, it sounds like it happens when he's not his usual self, and he's being all bestial. She is a lovely woman, so obviously when he's fighting her, he gets all violent and bestial.. and sorry Sheyla fans, it's not romantic for a man to beat a woman and kiss her in anger... no.

Now, hugging after being nearly dead. Now you're talking.

Keep ya kiss.

[Major_Moomin]

Hey everybody!

Wow..I go away for two days and i've missed like, 6 pages of posts!

Spoilers for Seige pt 3..


Just saw the full clip of the

Spoiler:

Hug scene...Have to say it was soo cool! I cant wait until it airs here!

But was it me or..

Spoiler:

Did he look at her lips just before he says "Where are we?"

Just been on another thread where Martin Gero has made a clarification on a subject...(Can't remember what) and he quoted...

Spoiler:

p.s. sometimes a hug is just a hug. Sheppard put his life on the line to save Weir and the entire city…heck, I’D give him a hug the next time I saw him too.

WHAT IS HE SAYING!!!..Dont hurt my shippy heart!

[manybleemsago]

Classes taught by the United States Army, but still very useful ones. The same things you are objecting to are bad leadership qualities in anyone, IMO, not just women. Personally I think the 38 Minutes speech was of the same genre as the "reproductive organs" speech Sam deliveres in the SG1 pilot. Writers fundamentally not understanding characters.

I honestly do think the developement has been deliberate. If you start looking at Weir in say, Suspicion, and than look at her in Poisoning the Well, Home, Hot Zone, Before I Sleep, The Siege II and than The Siege III you can see a straight line progression of her learning curve. She doesn't make the same mistake twice, but she makes new mistakes. It has a lot more support to it than I felt Sam's developement as a leader has had. I'm hoping AT's comments in the behind the scenes specials indicate a change in that.

I was going to include in my post a mention about my favorite male manager. He had a lot of the same qualities my favorite woman manager had. Iows, he *got* it.

I'll have to go back and rewatch the episodes to see what you're saying. Can't wait till the DVD's come out...

[xkawaiix]

Honestly? I think that passage has absolutely nothing to dow with ship at all. It's talking about stunts and teamwork.

I hope. Well, guess we're gonna have to wait till September when the epi shows to find out.

[astronomicalchick]

You have your own way, I have mine.

This doesn't reflect poorly on the whatever community, it reflects dedication and appreciation, which I doubt you will understand.

OOOH!!! A Trolll!!!!!

We haven't had one of those for a while!

And it's one that speaks the obvious!!! You're not telling me anything I don't already know!

Welcome, little Troll.

[manybleemsago]

Hey everybody!

Wow..I go away for two days and i've missed like, 6 pages of posts!

Spoilers for Seige pt 3..


Just saw the full clip of the

Spoiler:

Hug scene...Have to say it was soo cool! I cant wait until it airs here!

But was it me or..

Spoiler:

Did he look at her lips just before he says "Where are we?"

Just been on another thread where Martin Gero has made a clarification on a subject...(Can't remember what) and he quoted...

Spoiler:

p.s. sometimes a hug is just a hug. Sheppard put his life on the line to save Weir and the entire city…heck, I’D give him a hug the next time I saw him too.

WHAT IS HE SAYING!!!..Dont hurt my shippy heart!

Well, he does have to minimize the event for the benefit of the fans who don't share an interest in Weir/Shep. My advice is to pay no attention to the man behind the curtain...he's just blowing smoke.

I'll be back later guys. My youngest son wants to use the computer.

[Athenaktt]

Just been on another thread where Martin Gero has made a clarification on a subject...(Can't remember what) and he quoted...

Spoiler:

p.s. sometimes a hug is just a hug. Sheppard put his life on the line to save Weir and the entire city…heck, I’D give him a hug the next time I saw him too.

WHAT IS HE SAYING!!!..Dont hurt my shippy heart!

Well...if

Spoiler:

a hug is just a hug, then a kiss is just kiss. Those are just actions...verbs. When taken out of context, they can mean anything. You can hate someone and still kiss them, doesn't mean you love them.

You can love someone, and argue with them, and it doesn't mean you hate them because you are fighting.

Until the episode airs, I'm not going to worry. Remember "Don't Panic."

[xkawaiix]

Hey everybody!

Wow..I go away for two days and i've missed like, 6 pages of posts!

Spoilers for Seige pt 3..


Just saw the full clip of the

Spoiler:

Hug scene...Have to say it was soo cool! I cant wait until it airs here!

But was it me or..

Spoiler:

Did he look at her lips just before he says "Where are we?"

Just been on another thread where Martin Gero has made a clarification on a subject...(Can't remember what) and he quoted...

Spoiler:

p.s. sometimes a hug is just a hug. Sheppard put his life on the line to save Weir and the entire city…heck, I’D give him a hug the next time I saw him too.

WHAT IS HE SAYING!!!..Dont hurt my shippy heart!

Yeah, that hug was awesome right! and he did

Spoiler:

lick his lips

dunno why though.

There's a quote here Martin said

Spoiler:

'Sheppard put his life on the line to save Weir...' and that doesn't explain how she was acting right after she found out that he was still alive.

Well, I *could* have misinterrpreted (spelling?) what the writers were doing with that scene. Then that makes Martin a party pooper!

J/K

[Kazan]

Hi all
Welcome to all the new people I missed joining in and many congrats to everyone on reaching the 5000 mark!

I've been lurking around and reading all the thoughts and comments on Siege III. I think everyone said pretty much all the things I was thinking. I loved the episode and whilst yes, I was very happy by the Elizabeth / John moments, it was more the way it was done and the standard of the writing, plot and performances that I was particularly pleased to see. I think I mentioned before that I like the fact that the unexpected but somehow much more believable side of Weir that was shown was really something that encourages me that we are in for a fascinating and interesting season with lots of character development. I'm really looking forward to her interaction both personally and as a leader with Sheppard in S2.
On the subject of the growing character development etc, I think a number of people have commented on noticing the change in Weir and with the previous posts regarding the development of her leaderships skills, I thought the following was of some interest.
There was a Martin Gero Interview/Extra on the last DVD release which was about the writing and his look back over S1. At one point he commented..

“The actors at a certain point start to help steer where those characters are going to go. You know, you start writing to their cadence, you start writing to what their particular best sense of humour is, and also what they can do physically or what they can’t do physically. So the cast plays a big role and I think the breakout performances this year have come from people really…um.the writers, the directors and the actors all kinda finally locking up and seeing what direction to take it”

He had preceeded this by talking about how nervous and unsure everyone was for the first 10 episodes which were filmed before the premiere. He said that due to the great reception and ratings, everyone went into the second half of the season with a real confidence boost and sense of settling into the characters/plots/situations etc and that he felt that really showed.
For me, I think that was extremely noticeable with TH and I think we'll see more of her starting to grow the character.

Interstingly, on the DVD there was also a look ahead interview to S2 with Brad Wright and Rob Cooper where they talked about the cast and the dynamics too.

Brad Wright
“We couldn’t be happier with the cast. There’s a great dynamic between Sheppard and McKay that I was hoping for that I think those guys have just fallen into”

Rob Cooper on the cast
“It was tough because we had a very short window in which to find all these people and you really hope that they gel and there is a chemistry and the real X factor so to speak, was whether that cast would be as, you know, engaging and we think that it was a tremendous success. You know Joe Flanigan, certainly David Hewlett is absolutely wonderful actor, and Torri is every bit what we had hoped for as the strong, female leader of Atlantis, and Rachel Luttrell is we think quite a discovery. I know shes had a career before Atlantis but we think this is her real opportunity to break out.”

I'm of course hoping that the TH/JF chemistry continues to shine through!
I suspect somehow though that there will be plenty of toying and teasing with lots of different combinations during S2!

Oh wow, I've really rambled on - sorry - back to the land of lurkdom!

[Melyanna]

I just got this from the Maj. Sheppard Thunk Thread (thanks to Elinor):

Here's another bit of Joe's interview from the TV Zone special...

Spoiler:

When it comes to working on Atlantis, JF is happy to do anything asked of him - except where sticks are involved. "Initially, they wanted my character to be a superhero-type guy who was able to easily pick up all sorts of skills, including fighting techniques, however, I think we all agreed that when push comes to shove, Sheppard would prefer to shoot the bad guy a la Harrison Ford in Raiders of the Lost Ark as opposed to brandishing a sword or whatever. Well, Teyla has these fighting sticks that she likes to use, and in Conversion, she and Sheppard are forced to have this big stick fight. We rehearsed it and it wasn't a pretty sight..laughs JF....I was like 'I can't do this. I'm not good at sticks. Can't I just shoot her?' It's Teyla though, and I can't do that. So I had to go through that whole learning process, which for me was a huge challenge. We had fun though, and there's a little surprise at the end of the scene that I think the fans will like.

Anybody else fearing what I'm fearing?

Meh.

Spoiler:

We've also got information that John's turning rather primal in Conversion, so I'm assuming it's a result of that. And if it's early in the episode, he might recoil in horror. It doesn't confirm that they're going with Shep/Teyla. If anything, it just means they're dealing with the early hints from last season. There's also been information that they're playing with Shep/Teyla, Ronon/Teyla, and Shep/Weir this season.

As for "can't shoot Teyla," I think that's JF realizing that he can't be Indiana Jones because it's a teammate, not some guy with a sword.

And as I've said several times before in various places, I've read sides for episodes after Conversion, and nothing indicates that he and Teyla are together. Most of the signs read that they aren't. After all, Sheppard's randomly flirting with women in later episodes. The big emotional moments in the stories still focus on Sheppard and Weir, and that's how it should be.

Someone asked about music in the episode, and I don't think anyone addressed it, so I will now. The music in both The Eye (stairwell scene and gate room scene) and Siege II was from the old credits music, but not the familiar main melody. I think it's actually a variation of the build to the main melody, in a modulating chord progression. In The Eye, it was in the strings in both scenes; in Siege II, it was in the French horns. (Always a good choice. )

The music in that particular scene in Siege III, however, was the main melody of the title theme. It starts with some chord progressions in the strings, then a French horn picks up the first few notes of the main melody, then repeated by a clarinet. Then the strings come in with the whole melody, but the arrangement is different. More minor chords in the orchestration.

So yes, that's my music geek analysis of the scoring. The music is gorgeous in all three of those episodes, and the melodic nature of the scoring in these scenes is very, very different from the percussive sound we're getting through most of the three.

[astronomicalchick]

Hey everybody!

Wow..I go away for two days and i've missed like, 6 pages of posts!

Spoilers for Seige pt 3..


Just saw the full clip of the

Spoiler:

Hug scene...Have to say it was soo cool! I cant wait until it airs here!

But was it me or..

Spoiler:

Did he look at her lips just before he says "Where are we?"

Just been on another thread where Martin Gero has made a clarification on a subject...(Can't remember what) and he quoted...

Spoiler:

p.s. sometimes a hug is just a hug. Sheppard put his life on the line to save Weir and the entire city…heck, I’D give him a hug the next time I saw him too.

WHAT IS HE SAYING!!!..Dont hurt my shippy heart!

Aw come on. You're telling me that Martin Gero doesn't know how that might have gone down? Yeah, so

Spoiler:

a hug is just a hug, but in Stargate history folk put their life on the line so many times and hugs don't happen. Plus why put it in the eppy if it isn't there to tell us something about their relationship? Otherwise it makes no sense for it to be there. Did we see Rodney hug Shep? No. Did we see Teyla hug Shep (and that's supposed to be truwuvomg).

What the writers are going to do, I think, is play about with all the emotional attachments but nothing will ever get resolved, now that suits me, because I want to watch a good tv show and if I get good UST I'm happy (see I'm even agreeing with our little Troll here) and I can project away and play in fandom. So we'll get lots of this kind of stuff, including a Sheyla kiss in Conversion, but there will be scope to explain it away (Shep wasn't in his right mind and Teyla was overwhelmed by his manly, manliness and couldn't help herself *rolls eyes* (I really must dig out those old Mills and Boons)). That's how I think they'll play it. And we'll be really lucky because Weir and Sheppard are really good together and we'll hopefully get a lot more scenes we can play with...

[xkawaiix]

Oh wow, I've really rambled on - sorry - back to the land of lurkdom!

Hi Kazan!

Wow, a real mouth-full. Good thing you typed it all out now or else you might have taken an entire page! lol, not really funny

Okay anyway, send me a postcard and come back soon!