Elizabeth Weir/John Sheppard Appreciation/Ship/Discussion Thread

[Blower'sGate]

Lifeline

Spoiler:

The reason I love this so much is because John and Elizabeth are either side of the screen, Rodney's stood between (talking, iirc), there's so much else going on... and yet it's still all about John and Elizabeth. A thousand words are expressed in one not-so-little look. Very powerful, imo.

Lifeline.

Spoiler:

Exactly. Also, I think he's about to trust her completely, blindly even though she's been taken over by nanites. Hence why Rodney feels so offended. Actually it's so powerful that I think this was meant as some kind of goodbye. There's a rush of emotion between the two of them, especially John. But they don't and won't have the time to say goodbye so at this precise moment there's still hope she'll come back to Atlantis safely with them. I think deep down he wishes he could go back in time and do things differently. This is probably why he's about to trust her wholeheartedly and blindly. I'm not saying he's following orders but more like he's willing to do so bc he cares so much. Also, he's searching in her eyes something, the look only Elizabeth could give him.

[SallyLizzie]

Lifeline.

Spoiler:

Exactly. Also, I think he's about to trust her completely, blindly even though she's been taken over by nanites. Hence why Rodney feels so offended. Actually it's so powerful that I think this was meant as some kind of goodbye. There's a rush of emotion between the two of them, especially John. But they don't and won't have the time to say goodbye so at this precise moment there's still hope she'll come back to Atlantis safely with them. I think deep down he wishes he could go back in time and do things differently. This is probably why he's about to trust her wholeheartedly and blindly. I'm not saying he's following orders but more like he's willing to do so bc he cares so much. Also, he's searching in her eyes something, the look only Elizabeth could give him.

Lifeline

Spoiler:

I wouldn't say he trusted her blindly, but I do think he trusted her a lot more than he would anyone else in her position. He had enough faith in her to bring her in on the mission, although they really didn't have much choice if they wanted to edge on succeeding.

I think John knew it would end with him ordering the kill switch to be activated, and rather than leave her in a cell in Atlantis until they could "fix her" properly, he took advantage of the opportunity to let Elizabeth help her people one last time.

I really didn't like Rodney in Adrift or Lifeline. I thought he was selfish and extra whiny, to the point of being a brat. I didn't really like his line in the PJ either -- "What, you trust her but not me?" If it was her as in Elizabeth, then I would have liked it bc there would have been a sense of ease, like everything was normal. Except it felt like by 'trusting her' he meant bc of the replicater part of her, and that to him she was an outcast (which I know isn't how Rodney would ever feel about Elizabeth. I guess that's why it irks me)

But it did give us another scene where Rodney sees that "thing" that exists between John and Elizabeth

[Blower'sGate]

Lifeline

Spoiler:

I wouldn't say he trusted her blindly, but I do think he trusted her a lot more than he would anyone else in her position. He had enough faith in her to bring her in on the mission, although they really didn't have much choice if they wanted to edge on succeeding.

I think John knew it would end with him ordering the kill switch to be activated, and rather than leave her in a cell in Atlantis until they could "fix her" properly, he took advantage of the opportunity to let Elizabeth help her people one last time.

I really didn't like Rodney in Adrift or Lifeline. I thought he was selfish and extra whiny, to the point of being a brat. I didn't really like his line in the PJ either -- "What, you trust her but not me?" If it was her as in Elizabeth, then I would have liked it bc there would have been a sense of ease, like everything was normal. Except it felt like by 'trusting her' he meant bc of the replicater part of her, and that to him she was an outcast (which I know isn't how Rodney would ever feel about Elizabeth. I guess that's why it irks me)

But it did give us another scene where Rodney sees that "thing" that exists between John and Elizabeth

Lifeline

Spoiler:

True.

As for Rodney, well I'll have to agree with you on that. I felt it was a OOC. He's the one who made the call to use the nanites to save her in the first place. He was being selfish bc even John asked him not to do it.

[borgprincess]

Adrift:

Spoiler:

Yeah, I like how McKay's always confirming Sparky, he's the one appealing to Shep by using Weir as a defense ['she'd do the same for you', as though by invoking her name, he can win the argument- not true, but a nice tactic all the same], he's the one that said 'Elizabeth will listen to you' all the way back in Trinity, which I liked...and I think I might have mentioned this already, but I was so gleeful when Keller was saying, in response to Weir being half-Rep for the rest of her life, 'Oh, Sheppard's not going to like that'. It was such a shippy thing, imo, despite the gravity of the situation.

Adrift

Spoiler:

I don't see Sparky as being a relationship based in tragedy. The only tragedy I can recall is Common Ground and this. The norm of their relationship is fun and flirty, imo. There's only two pairings in Stargate that I would say had a tragic relationship, and that was Daniel/Sha're and Daniel/Sarah.

My reply:

Spoiler:

Oh, no, I didn't mean to say that they *were* a relationship based in tragedy- the exact opposite. I loved the little banter and flirty vibe and how they looked at each other. I *wanted* that, which is why the Weir leaving/Shep angsting after her kills me because I didn't want their relationship to turn that dark and sad.

Adrift/Lifeline

Spoiler:

There was hope for Ford. Ford was still human, he just had Wraith enzyme in his blood and ended up addicted to it. If they had been able to wean him off it, he would have returned back to his normal self, possibly needing regulated injections to keep his system working.

Elizabeth was already practically dead. John knew that activating the nanites would cause a security threat, and that after what happened in TRW, Elizabeth wouldn't want it. Ordering Rodney not to do it was the most humane action, imo.

Bottom line: Rodney shouldn't have activated them. However, it did give Elizabeth opportunity to confirm what John knew: that it shouldn't have been done and that when the time came, she wanted him to use the kill switch. It was a direct order from Elizabeth and I'm glad John stuck to it. Had he put the lives of his team and the survival of the city at great risk just to save the life of one person - letting personal get in the way of professional - then I would have lost all respect for the character and it would have completely ruined it for me.

My reply:

Spoiler:

No, I get your point, I was just...still in pain over it all. I think I'm still in the denial stage of grieving, ugh. Anyway, I'm like this with all my shows- I preferred X-files in the first few seasons, before the conspiracy became HUGE and all-encompassing, I wanted just Mulder and Scully investigating paranormal phenomena. Here, I freaked out that all of a sudden, all these changes were happening and I can see that it is totally different than before. My main view was that Elizabeth wouldn't kill Shep in Conversion, when he was a risk to the city, which I now see is a rather lame argument because- Shep against city? Not as big a problem as replicator army against city.

Adrift/general S4

Spoiler:

That's a difference between you and I. I still think it could end happy; there's no reason to say it won't or can't. However, I'm not all that bothered if it doesn't. Aslong as I get Sparky when it's opportune, I'm happy. There's lots of other stuff I love about the show that it's not going to bother me not having Elizabeth round all the time (granted, if I were a PTB, I would have kept repliLizzie around instead of adding Larin, in addition to Sam and Keller).

I like my shows dark. To me, that makes it more juicy and realistic. I like not having security. Knowing that the everything's going to be okay and the good guys will always win is boring and tedious, imo; there's no tension, no suspence. If I knew that the characters were going to be fine all the time then I wouldn't care what was happening/what they were going through.

My reply:

Spoiler:

I know that RL throws curveballs at you and the whole make lemons out of lemonade. But I agree, that's where we differ. I want it happy in the end, and I don't find it boring if I know that it'll end well for everyone, because they can do all the tense angsty stuff in the middle and then resolve it and make soft sentimental types like me happy. They've been doing it for three seasons, so changing the MO like this really weirds me out. And I mean, did you think eps like Lost Boys and The Hive/Allies/NML, etc. were boring and tension-free just because we figured that Shep would survive and return to her? I didn't, and it was a safe environment in which to show how she was affected by the team going missing [and Shep in particular, I love how she's always 'did you find him'/'where is he?'/'is he okay?' and Shep's always the first one one her mind, lol] without actually putting her in the position of losing him. Does that make sense? I could see her going through hell thinking all these things could have happened to him, and I could really understand and empathize, but the happy ending made it all better for me. I'm one of those people that like a formula to things, and I don't find it boring because there are a million permutations that make a million *more* possible within that basic framework. It's all right if we disagree over the way it should all be resolved, anyway, since we agree on the pairing, at least. Which is the most important thing. XP

And I totally agree, I think it's strange logic to get rid of one female character because she isn't working, even though the way they've contrived to get rid of her lends itself to some awesome storylines, but instead of taking advantage of it, they go bring in few new women who are the diluted versions of her awesomeness. TPTB say that Carter works because she's had so much development and they can use that to better the show, but surely Weir's three seasons of development trumps the Keller and Larin newbies? No? It's a little inconsistent, imo.

[SallyLizzie]

They've been doing it for three seasons, so changing the MO like this really weirds me out. And I mean, did you think eps like Lost Boys and The Hive/Allies/NML, etc. were boring and tension-free just because we figured that Shep would survive and return to her?

Actually, yes. Honestly, the only things I remember about the eps you mentioned is that, in Allies, the Wraith Queen had some awesome tattoos. See how little I remember...? That's how much I enjoyed them.

Regarding your last comment: All I'll say is I can understand why TPTB have gone with certain decisions, even if I wouldn't have been my personal choice, but as it's not really on-topic here, I'm not going into it.

[atlantis_babe34]

Am I the only one in here that can never find this thread?... i mean i looked everywhere then i jumped to conclusions going "OMG they have remvoed it my world has ended!!!".. i tell you its the smiley face!!...


and im the only one that hasn't watched it?

[Anjirika]

You know, one of my favourite moments is in er Misbegotton and the whole 'are you defending my honour line' Elizabeth says it in such a playful way that John doesn't know what to do---exactly like the hug.

And now, I'm off to bed. G'night!

[borgprincess]

I love that moment too! It's awesome that he doesn't even deny that he was defending her honor, he just changed the subject because he couldn't LIE to her about it. *glees*

Am I the only one in here that can never find this thread?... i mean i looked everywhere then i jumped to conclusions going "OMG they have remvoed it my world has ended!!!".. i tell you its the smiley face!!...

Ha, I know what you're going through, so to prevent any future heart attacks at the thought of this thread being deleted because I can't find it anywhere, I just subscribed to it. Very handy.

And more lyrics, because everything I listen to seems to relate to Sparky these days:
Sarah Blasko

For You

I’ve learnt a lot about you
In turn much about me too
I travelled across the sea
I wept for you

Emotions run deep
Between us friend
The time will come
For us again

We’re tired, we’re tired now
This ship almost ran a ground
We’ll lie and rest now
I’ll dream of you

Emotions run deep
between good friends
But I do believe
In us again

I’ve heard, I’ve heard it said
That love, real love has no end
A cup overflowing now
I will believe, I must believe

[Anuna]

Some of you guys wanted Austin!verse sparky. Here is a new story: http://daisycm83.livejournal.com/104340.html

Good morning everyone. Yes subscription is quite handy option

[borgprincess]

okay, time to get some more sparky fun going....

What is your favorite sparky eye!sex moment?

Ah, missed this the first time round, good question, though!

Spoiler:

Not necessarily my favorite, but since I was going through Siege again, I noticed how they can't take their eyes off each other, even in briefings. I love the smirks on her face!

And morning, Anuna- do you think you could pm me the link to your vid? I've tried finding it here, but there are about ten new pages since I was last here, and I can't find it...

[sspader]

Spoiler for Lifeline.

Spoiler:

It bothers me that Landry, Carter...ETC has all but considered her DEAD. PISS. OFF. I'd like to think that the core team will have emotional ramifications from this. Not necessarily of what they could have done...but too much too late. Nice acting from Rachel...when she was cleaning out her desk. BTW. Really really nice acting from Joe. I love his angst...and the scenery in the last scene. You can just feel that, he wanted to see her out there when he walked onto the balcony. *sigh*

[borgprincess]

Spoiler for Lifeline.

Spoiler:

It bothers me that Landry, Carter...ETC has all but considered her DEAD. PISS. OFF. I'd like to think that the core team will have emotional ramifications from this. Not necessarily of what they could have done...but too much too late. Nice acting from Rachel...when she was cleaning out her desk. BTW. Really really nice acting from Joe. I love his angst...and the scenery in the last scene. You can just feel that, he wanted to see her out there when he walked onto the balcony. *sigh*

My reply:

Spoiler:

I love the balcony scenes with Shep and Weir...damn Carter for intruding on sacred ground. XP

Still, I do like that her presence at least prompted him to say how he intended to find Elizabeth. It makes it so personal.

I remember when Ford went missing, Elizabeth was being encouraging and saying they'd dial the address he went to, and Shep's being negative, going 'He'll have moved on by now, he could be anywhere' and she goes, 'You'll find him', if I recall correctly. Now it's almost like symmetry, where this time he's the one going 'I'll find her'. If it's at all possible, he'll do it.

Btw, guys, after all the emotional heaviness of Adrift/Lifeline, how do you think he's going to react when she pops up again?

[SazZat]

and im the only one that hasn't watched it?

I haven't watched it yet. I'm holding out for it's Sky showing I promiced to my cousin that we would watch it together.
The files are sitting on my desktop though, looking very tempting.
I'm just sort of drifting around until it airs and then I'll probably come in here and write an essay on it...or maybe just squee alot...or maybe cry

[borgprincess]

I wanted to cry when I read that fic that's floating around here somewhere...damn, lost track of that too. *slaps self* I MEANT to copy it and take it home so I could angst some more, but nooo...I think it was Anuna's fic? Anyone? On Shep's pov from Lifeline, and it just killed me. I didn't fully read it because I'm at uni and don't want to be a blubbering mess, but it made me realize how excessively emotional I get. *sighs*

[sspader]

I haven't been graced by this story yet....can anybody provide a link??

Pwease???? I'd want to feel some Shep-Angst..