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**leelakin** · 10 January 2007, 03:45 AM

Originally posted by Irish Eyes View Post

I was really happy to read Ken C.'s message that Liz would be prominent in that episode. With no spoilers to speak of except the general theme, it sounded like a "team" ep and anymore that's code for "Liz lite." So there are definite possibilities there...

Me too! But half a second later, I read his line saying that she would 'realize it's better to stay nice and cozy on Atlantis', which literally made me go GRAAAARRRGH!!1 *lol*
I don't really like how he sees her ... you know, having to stay on Atlantis because that's "cozier" anyway. As if she wasn't capable to cope with offworld missions like the rest of the team. ): She's a NEGOTIATOR for pete's sake!

Originally posted by Irish Eyes View Post

And now we are getting the episode Sunday where

Spoiler:

My bets are on Ronon! In the long run, anyway. *lol* Might just be my wishful thinking, though.

**Eljoshe** · 10 January 2007, 03:53 AM

My first post in this thread, but you mentioned my fav. soapbox topic, the writing for the female characters in Sci. fi. I love Stargate Atlantis, but I have to agree on the boy's club comment - I just don't think these boys know women all that well. Forget guest stars, we need a guest writer (but can we make him permanent?) - my vote Joss Whedon (I worship him) he knows how to write female characters.
I'm sure he'd get the whole Shep, Weir, Teyla torment sorted out in no time, as well as many other things - especially more screen time for the women of Atlantis.

**atlantis_babe34** · 10 January 2007, 03:58 AM

Welcome ElJoshe

oooh that could be a god idea.. sparkyness to ensure!

**Southern Red** · 10 January 2007, 04:19 AM

Originally posted by leelakin View Post

Me too! But half a second later, I read his line saying that she would 'realize it's better to stay nice and cozy on Atlantis', which literally made me go GRAAAARRRGH!!1 *lol*
I don't really like how he sees her ... you know, having to stay on Atlantis because that's "cozier" anyway. As if she wasn't capable to cope with offworld missions like the rest of the team. ): She's a NEGOTIATOR for pete's sake!

My bets are on Ronon! In the long run, anyway. *lol* Might just be my wishful thinking, though.

I think it was Ken's comments about Liz that threw me over the line into frustration and wanting to kick something. *watches Ken run away* I don't like his idea of her either, and since he's new you know that he was told what to think about her. So, that makes it the official line of TPTB. Not to mention the fact that in every interview and con both JF and TH have made essentially the same statements. So, are we flogging a dead horse? Once again they are misinterpreting the way things actually appear in the finished product. I do not see Elizabeth in any way shape or form as Gen. fracking, or frelling if you prefer, Hammond. Her negotiation and translation skills should be used more. She should be actively involved in off world negotiations after the team has gone to a planet and initiated contact, which could easily be done off screen. If they would explore Atlantis like the stupid show led us to believe they would do, she would be actively involved in that too. Her legions of fans want her to do more, but they stubbornly insist on keeping her as a figurehead and increasingly this season as a mother figure who just lectures the boys when they get in trouble. Pah! P***** me off!

Originally posted by Eljoshe View Post

My first post in this thread, but you mentioned my fav. soapbox topic, the writing for the female characters in Sci. fi. I love Stargate Atlantis, but I have to agree on the boy's club comment - I just don't think these boys know women all that well. Forget guest stars, we need a guest writer (but can we make him permanent?) - my vote Joss Whedon (I worship him) he knows how to write female characters.
I'm sure he'd get the whole Shep, Weir, Teyla torment sorted out in no time, as well as many other things - especially more screen time for the women of Atlantis.

Welcome Eljoshe and well said. I too worship at the feet of Joss Whedon. I had a conversation just last night with my grown son who is still incredulous that Firefly was canceled. In our family that will always be the SciFi show to define all SciFi shows. And BTW, the John/Teyla relationship is more and more reminding me of Zoe/Mal. I loved the way they cared so deeply about each other, but romance just had never crossed their minds. That would work so well in SGA, and we could all relax and enjoy the Sparky.

**Yvi** · 10 January 2007, 04:36 AM

hey guys

also got something to hold up the flag of sparky ;-)
it's my first and til now only vid, but nevertheless i hope it's not too bad to put you in a sparky mood.

http://www.cliphost24.com/061215012824.wmv.html

ah, well, and: loved that "probably" vid...well done athena! *pats*

bye
yvi

**Blower'sGate** · 10 January 2007, 05:27 AM

Originally posted by Athenaktt View Post

Hey, that's my vid! I've never put any of my vids on Youtube, but I guess other people have uploaded them. It's so odd to see it on Youtube though.

ETA: Glad you guys like it though.

The first time I saw the vid it was on your website, sorry I didn't give you credits for it sooner, seriously that's my all time fav sparky vid! And now at least your aware that somebody put it on yt ^^

**leelakin** · 10 January 2007, 05:30 AM

Originally posted by Southern Red View Post

I think it was Ken's comments about Liz that threw me over the line into frustration and wanting to kick something. *watches Ken run away* I don't like his idea of her either, and since he's new you know that he was told what to think about her. So, that makes it the official line of TPTB. Not to mention the fact that in every interview and con both JF and TH have made essentially the same statements. So, are we flogging a dead horse? Once again they are misinterpreting the way things actually appear in the finished product. I do not see Elizabeth in any way shape or form as Gen. fracking, or frelling if you prefer, Hammond. Her negotiation and translation skills should be used more. She should be actively involved in off world negotiations after the team has gone to a planet and initiated contact, which could easily be done off screen. If they would explore Atlantis like the stupid show led us to believe they would do, she would be actively involved in that too. Her legions of fans want her to do more, but they stubbornly insist on keeping her as a figurehead and increasingly this season as a mother figure who just lectures the boys when they get in trouble. Pah! P***** me off!

Agreed! Zomg.
I won't believe the "dead horse" thing just yet *lol*, in fact, indirect (through the actors) official statements are evil.

But yeah, I agree.
I actually just posted in the The Ark episode thread about it and I'm quite nervous. I wonder if anyone is even of my (and your! phew *lol*) opinion. Did it sound too harsh? O_O Eh, but it's how I see it, anyway. I didn't use curse words!

**Chailyn** · 10 January 2007, 06:14 AM

pokes head in

Good morning, Sparky shippers. I noticed a lot of unhappy people this morning. :gives hugs:

I'm not a shipper (been burned way too many times), but I don't think you guys should wave the white flag just yet.

Coming from a non-shipper, even I can see the the chemistry between JF and TH. (Of course, I also see the chemistry between JF and DH, although that probably has even less of a chance.

)For me, JF and TH bounce off each other very well and I think their scenes together really bring out each other's characters nicely. So, I like the Weir/Sheppard moments, even if I only see it as a strong respect and friendship. If I was forced to watch a ship unfold, I would be most comfortable with this one. That being said, I do think the writers originally wanted to go Sheyla, but I'm just not seeing the chemistry. If, and I say IF, that's where they're going then someone needs to lock JF and RL into a closet and force them to find some inspiration.

Originally posted by Southern Red View Post

I do not see Elizabeth in any way shape or form as Gen. fracking, or frelling if you prefer, Hammond. Her negotiation and translation skills should be used more. She should be actively involved in off world negotiations after the team has gone to a planet and initiated contact, which could easily be done off screen.

I agree. To me, I really thought her background would lead her to be a Daniel type character, which was why I was so interested in her. They had really given themselves a strong/important female lead. (Really two strong female leads, counting Teyla's original purpose. Look at what they did to poor Teyla!) Then...they kinda turned Weir into a Mom who sees her kids off to the school bus and reminds them not to forget their lunches. Gah! What is the point of hiring someone with a linguistic/international relations background if all the job requires is a business management degree?

Anyway, I'm hitting a tangent. Perk up, people! I think we can all say with complete and utter assurance that TPTB doesn't have a clue what they're doing from one season to the next. Think those happy thoughts.

:slips out of shipper thread before being sucked in:

**Southern Red** · 10 January 2007, 07:02 AM

Originally posted by leelakin View Post

Agreed! Zomg.
I won't believe the "dead horse" thing just yet *lol*, in fact, indirect (through the actors) official statements are evil.

But yeah, I agree.
I actually just posted in the The Ark episode thread about it and I'm quite nervous. I wonder if anyone is even of my (and your! phew *lol*) opinion. Did it sound too harsh? O_O Eh, but it's how I see it, anyway. I didn't use curse words!

I read your post over there and since I can't green you, I'll reply here. Way to go! Not too harsh at all. When I see it, I'll also post there. My skin has gotten a little thicker lately. You'll notice that from ep thread to ep thread the same people make some of the same general statements and argue with the same other people. You can almost predict what some of them will say about a given episode. I've been the target of comments that, let's just say, drip with sarcasm and disdain for shippers, but I figure my opinion counts equally and I can make statements that come across like they're carved in stone as well as the next guy.

It's an old debater's trick to make statements that appear to be general knowledge and say them like noone could possibly disagree. Now me, I love to poke sacred cows with a big 'ol pointy stick.

Originally posted by Chailyn View Post

pokes head in

Good morning, Sparky shippers. I noticed a lot of unhappy people this morning. :gives hugs:

I'm not a shipper (been burned way too many times), but I don't think you guys should wave the white flag just yet.

Coming from a non-shipper, even I can see the the chemistry between JF and TH. (Of course, I also see the chemistry between JF and DH, although that probably has even less of a chance.

)For me, JF and TH bounce off each other very well and I think their scenes together really bring out each other's characters nicely. So, I like the Weir/Sheppard moments, even if I only see it as a strong respect and friendship. If I was forced to watch a ship unfold, I would be most comfortable with this one. That being said, I do think the writers originally wanted to go Sheyla, but I'm just not seeing the chemistry. If, and I say IF, that's where they're going then someone needs to lock JF and RL into a closet and force them to find some inspiration.

I agree. To me, I really thought her background would lead her to be a Daniel type character, which was why I was so interested in her. They had really given themselves a strong/important female lead. (Really two strong female leads, counting Teyla's original purpose. Look at what they did to poor Teyla!) Then...they kinda turned Weir into a Mom who sees her kids off to the school bus and reminds them not to forget their lunches. Gah! What is the point of hiring someone with a linguistic/international relations background if all the job requires is a business management degree?

Anyway, I'm hitting a tangent. Perk up, people! I think we can all say with complete and utter assurance that TPTB doesn't have a clue what they're doing from one season to the next. Think those happy thoughts.

:slips out of shipper thread before being sucked in:

Now you come back here because you make a lot of sense. You're a Sparky shipper. You just dont know it. Kinda like John and Elizabeth are married and don't know it. LOL And I wonder if Daniel had come to Atlantis and been put in charge if he'd be waving everybody else through the wormhole. I think not. I think the whole idea of her spending all her time reading reports and attending meetings is exaggerated. How many teams are there, and how many missions do they go on? Not a lot. And not one per day for each team. She can quickly scan the individual reports, and the meetings never seem to last long. Why did they give her all these skills if they don't plan to use them?

**Athenaktt** · 10 January 2007, 08:01 AM

Originally posted by Blower'sGate View Post

The first time I saw the vid it was on your website, sorry I didn't give you credits for it sooner, seriously that's my all time fav sparky vid! And now at least your aware that somebody put it on yt ^^

That's okay Blower's Gate as long as the credits I add at the end of my vids stay on the vid, I really don't mind. My pet peeve is when people claim something as their own, but i haven't had that happen to me yet. So I'm not worried. I'm really glad you guys like it. Right now I have another vid in mind which may be a follow up to "Probably" since we have more Sparky scene now than we had back in Season 1 and 2.

Chailyn - Hi! Nice to see you here! You sound a lot like a friend of mine who is a Sheppard/McKay fan, but she also admits she sees Sheppard/Weir because JF and TH have such great chemistry on screen. It's always nice to hear that from non-shippers, but it proves we're not the only ones seeing what is presented to us on screen when John andn Elizabeth are on screen together.

As for writing Elizabeth's character well, I think Carl Binder has the greatest grasp in Elizabeth's character. I like how he tends to try and incorporate Elizabeth into episodes even if they are "off-world" or "team" episodes. I think it helps that Binder is one of the few writers that remembers that Elizabeth is a diplomat and linguist aside from being the "Hammond" figure and she is part of the "team". If it wasn't for Elizabeth, Sheppard would have been sent back to Earth a long time ago, or never even have set foot on Atlantis in the first place.

EDIT: Hi to new posters! (I can't remember who it was. Sorry!) Hi!

**FoolishPleasure** · 10 January 2007, 08:09 AM

Originally posted by Southern Red View Post

I think it was Ken's comments about Liz that threw me over the line into frustration and wanting to kick something. *watches Ken run away* I don't like his idea of her either, and since he's new you know that he was told what to think about her.

I didn't like what Ken said either, so I have voiced my opinion on that matter. That fact that KC has now come in to "explain" two different episodes doesn't say much about this writing staff, IMO.

**Lizabeth** · 10 January 2007, 08:11 AM

Everybody's talking about how Elizabeth should do more. I agree. I say after any ep with her offworld or in any major role at all we should all flood the episode thread and say how awesome it is to see her being used like she ought to be. I always thought that the fact that Elizabeth was so different Hammond was one of the major things that made SGA so great and unique. It changed the dynamics from the SGC.

Spoiler:

**Athenaktt** · 10 January 2007, 08:27 AM

Originally posted by Lizabeth View Post

Everybody's talking about how Elizabeth should do more. I agree. I say after any ep with her offworld or in any major role at all we should all flood the episode thread and say how awesome it is to see her being used like she ought to be. I always thought that the fact that Elizabeth was so different Hammond was one of the major things that made SGA so great and unique. It changed the dynamics from the SGC.

Spoiler:

"Sunday"

Spoiler:

**Blower'sGate** · 10 January 2007, 08:34 AM

Originally posted by FoolishPleasure View Post

I didn't like what Ken said either, so I have voiced my opinion on that matter. That fact that KC has now come in to "explain" two different episodes doesn't say much about this writing staff, IMO.

He compared her to Landry....

That's okay Blower's Gate as long as the credits I add at the end of my vids stay on the vid, I really don't mind. My pet peeve is when people claim something as their own, but i haven't had that happen to me yet. So I'm not worried. I'm really glad you guys like it. Right now I have another vid in mind which may be a follow up to "Probably" since we have more Sparky scene now than we had back in Season 1 and 2.

YAY !!!!! after lisa loeb who is it gonna be ? Hm probably....?

**Athenaktt** · 10 January 2007, 08:48 AM

Originally posted by Blower'sGate View Post

YAY !!!!! after lisa loeb who is it gonna be ? Hm probably....?

Well, if you really want to know, it didn't occur to me until I wrote the short fluff fic "Something to Talk About". After I figured out the title to that fic, I realized at this stage of Sparky, that song "Something to Talk About" by Bonnie Raitt(sp?) would be perfect.

Hopefully, I'll be able to work on it is a long weekend for me.

It's so hard to make room for fun stuff when I still have school. Ugh.

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