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**Erised** · 11 March 2006, 07:12 AM

Originally posted by astronomicalchick

So true, they do, and no offence to them if they have fun with it.

Just to add to the confusion, I've read (somewhere) that the reason why Sheppard "kirks" so much is him trying to convince himself that he isn't gay. So really, that just goes to prove that point about slashing.

Personally, I think that the PTB put Sheppard with every chick because they over-identify with him, he is what they'd love to be.

hehe WORD! They write him like they themselves want or wanted to be.. it's a teenager's fantasy *lol*

Originally posted by Luz

And why can't we have a Weir Teyla friendship?, are they so ridiculous they think that because of Sparky and sheyla they can't be friends, the conflict of having to fight for a guy?. One think is what happens in fanon, ships are fanon, and i would say that most of us as shippers wouldn't like to see those two beautiful, strong smart ladies being at odd for one guy.

Because they are GIRLS and girls are not as important as boys. Girls' stories don't matter. They can just stay in their little B plotlines while the boys get all the goodies. Boys get all the girls and comic interaction. Girls of Atlantis can stay by themselves. One in her office, another with her athosian friends. That is what audience want because we can clearly see the result of a fine job we [TPTB] did by 1.5 rating we got of Coup after everyone saw how awesome Tower was.
[/sarcasm]

**Bama** · 11 March 2006, 07:18 AM

Originally posted by Luz

If you call one conversation between Sheppard and Teyla out of twenty episodes worrying... if he worried any less about her and what she thinks... uhm i don't know what to say because she's almost a nonentity in his life as it is.

Luz, my comment was meant tongue- in -cheek thus the

. I wasn't in the least overly 'worried' about it and as I said I actually liked it in the context just fine.

Actually i would love it if tptb finally went past this stubborn tag they put on Teyla, you know that "would have been Sheppard's romantic interest" tag, and tried to at least build a friendship between these two. Stop wasting time throwing the odd sheyla anvils, they're not fooling anyone, and have them at least being friends.

I agree totally!!! The odd anvils...that's a good way to put them. They just come off as weak here and there because there's been none-nada build-up or real relationship -even friendship - built between the two.

unfortunately tptb can't think of Teyla and Sheppard without that tag creeping in, which ruins it all, and the byproduct is that they waste time on a hopeless red erring and it turns out into being nothing, not romantic, not frienshippy, nothing.

I think you've got it tagged better than anywhere I've seen. That is exactly the problem with the two of them. They can't 'get past' the idea of what they were 'supposed to be' to let them be the best they can be for each other as teammates and even friends.

And why can't we have a Weir Teyla friendship?, are they so ridiculous they think that because of Sparky and sheyla they can't be friends, the conflict of having to fight for a guy?

I was a little hopeful after seeing Elizabeth look to Teyla a time or two

Spoiler:

However, I think it boils down to the fact that they're not 100 percent sure what they want to do with Teyla still to this point. I think they've flirted with the idea of a romantic triangle but honestly that is so pathetic and would be an absolute bust with fans across the board I think. Teyla needs to build her own niche and like you, I've seen some good signs with Ronon and that storyline this year and it could be expanded on exponentally in the future.

**Bama** · 11 March 2006, 07:23 AM

Originally posted by stubadingdong

Spoiler:

Join the club. I can't 'get' it either. It was definitely an odd reaction on her part. I took it as surprised but then, that doesn't even seem to describe it quite adequately. I don't know. Maybe it was just a look of 'huh?' given that it seemed a little out of context coming from John's mouth given who they were talking to? I just wondered why give an Elizabeth reaction shot there at all unless they wanted us to specifically notice it. ???

Odd.

**Melyanna** · 11 March 2006, 07:24 AM

I'm not sure they came across as gullible, just out of options.

Spoiler:

Originally posted by Erised

Spoiler:

Pushing it down our throats? That's a little reactionary.

Spoiler:

I thought it was an excellent scene, and highlighted the cultural differences to a degree that TPTB never really had before on the show. Everyone knew it was a bad situation, but it probably would have made John feel better if everyone had been ignoring the elephant in the room. This is what I had to say about it a while back when the episode first aired:

I think the biggest problem with Teyla's argument is a matter of cultural differences. The line "They are Wraith" was perfectly in character for her, but it's the kind of argument that would fall flat for many in Western society these days. The top two people in Atlantis are Americans, and, well, in this country, someone's race or ethnicity or what have you is not a good enough reason to accuse a person of intending to commit a crime.

I know that the two aren't analogous. The characters know that the two aren't analogous. But if you'll recall, Elizabeth had trouble setting aside the Geneva Convention because it was something ingrained in her. The fact that the Wraith aren't human didn't automatically flip a switch for her, and I wouldn't be surprised if the same kind of thing were true here of both Elizabeth and John. They know it's not the same, but it's still hard to resist hearing "They're black" or "They're poor" or "They're uneducated" or a hundred other prejudices when confronted with Teyla's argument, and recoiling from it. Teyla probably would have been a lot more convincing if she'd pointed out that the Wraith have killed millions in their history, and will kill millions more. But to her, saying "They're Wraith" says that. That's not as ingrained to the others.

As it is, Teyla and Ronon had both confirmed that they had never heard of Wraith acting like this, so it's likely that the others thought that Teyla and Ronon don't know everything about the Wraith. And I'd say that's a correct assessment. I don't think Teyla or Ronon had ever thought of the Wraith as anything but a collective entity of evil monsters. It's harder to say that they're driven purely by instinct when you know that they have politics of their own and some level of society and technology.

**Elinor** · 11 March 2006, 07:42 AM

Originally posted by Bama

I just think it might be more than interesting to see John not be the man on the full end of her attention for once. His -even subtle- reaction to a male showing her attention and her showing another male some back might be worth the price of admission.

Yep...I would LOVE to see that!

I'm imagining the many expressions Shep would have crossing his face right now!! One would be 'What the hell'?!! Expression #104!!

**gwenhwyfar** · 11 March 2006, 07:57 AM

I loved Allies! I thought it was a very good story.
I too did not think that

Spoiler:

As for what we had disculled at legnth when the episode aired in Canada

Spoiler:

And sadly I did not see anything remotely Shippy in the

Spoiler:

**xkawaiix** · 11 March 2006, 08:02 AM

Originally posted by gwenhwyfar

And sadly I did not see anything remotely Shippy in the

Spoiler:

**Bama** · 11 March 2006, 08:03 AM

Originally posted by Luz

Do they really think this red erring thing they got going on will work?, sure let's have them not talking for ten episodes in a row and suddenly show them together people will really go for this ship, LOL. .

One more quick thought on your excellent ones Luz.

Tptb have a reputation amongst some s/j shippers of trying 'revisionist' history at times and also just simply 'forgetting' what they've done before. I guess if I have a 'worry' at all it would be them applying such to SGA and her ships. I don't want to see them 'backtracking' or trying to re-write in one or two episodes what they've written in the last thirty-five.

If I have trouble getting 'past' something that nags at me it's just one thing-Tptb are all MEN. And as such in my viewing experience at times, male writers sometimes don't see how emotion and groundwork for relationships can't be just 'taken back' for convenience or suddenly 'shifted' on a whim for storyline's sake. What's totally illogical to me may be perfectly logical and sane to a man who is more interested in tinkering than he is in consistency and beauty. Promise-my last 'random' thought for a while...
I've really got a zillion things to take care of.
Dang income taxes. Think I could deduct my Sparky obsession?

Maybe I could call it 'therapy' or something and the U.S. government would allow me a deduction for it?

**Melyanna** · 11 March 2006, 08:11 AM

Originally posted by xkawaiix

Spoiler:

I think it's kind of like the balcony scene at the end of The Tower – not so much shippy for its content as for its presence. There was no reason in the flow of the scene to show Elizabeth's reaction, so the fact that they did (which was slightly jarring, and might have contributed to the oddness that so many people felt from the shot) speaks to me as significant in some way. The same was true of a lot of the editing in Siege III and Intruder. They chose to highlight Sheppard and Weir in those episodes.

**gwenhwyfar** · 11 March 2006, 08:12 AM

Originally posted by xkawaiix

Spoiler:

More than likley. Sometimes really subtle gets past me.

Maybe we should hand out Shipper Glasses for the episodes without blatent Sparky!

**xkawaiix** · 11 March 2006, 08:15 AM

Originally posted by Melyanna

I think it's kind of like the balcony scene at the end of The Tower – not so much shippy for its content as for its presence. There was no reason in the flow of the scene to show Elizabeth's reaction, so the fact that they did (which was slightly jarring, and might have contributed to the oddness that so many people felt from the shot) speaks to me as significant in some way. The same was true of a lot of the editing in Siege III and Intruder. They chose to highlight Sheppard and Weir in those episodes.

Very true, they could have just as easily replace some of those scenes with Sheyla. But like you said, they chose to highlight Shep and Weir.

**Southern Red** · 11 March 2006, 08:32 AM

Originally posted by xkawaiix

Spoiler:

ITA with the last part. I didn't see much shippy in the whole episode.

Spoiler:

I'm not sure what I think about where they are going with the ships. Sometimes I think they have a spreadsheet with all the possible ships listed, and each time they write an episode the writers put a check in the appropriate column. We get a wink and a nod to both women, and now it looks like the slashers get their turn. Insulting to all of us on all counts. I enjoy the humor of this show, but this kind of wishy washiness is only going to make everybody unhappy. If it takes those special glasses to see a connection between two people, it's not there. Just give us good stories with action, excitement and character development. Don't try to force something that isn't there.

Originally posted by Bama

.
Dang income taxes. Think I could deduct my Sparky obsession?

Maybe I could call it 'therapy' or something and the U.S. government would allow me a deduction for it?

They could make it Sparky Obsessive Syndrome and we could get disability.

**Bama** · 11 March 2006, 08:33 AM

Originally posted by Melyanna

I think it's kind of like the balcony scene at the end of The Tower – not so much shippy for its content as for its presence. There was no reason in the flow of the scene to show Elizabeth's reaction, so the fact that they did (which was slightly jarring, and might have contributed to the oddness that so many people felt from the shot) speaks to me as significant in some way. The same was true of a lot of the editing in Siege III and Intruder. They chose to highlight Sheppard and Weir in those episodes.

Do you people realize how difficult it is to apply mascara and post at the same time?! Stop doing this to me!

That is a very good observation and exactly what I felt when viewing it and cannot get past. John has about a dozen 'throw away' lines an episode that we don't get reaction shots on. Why do we get one on this line related to his future generations? Why in the world bother to show Elizabeth's reaction shot if it was just a total toss away line not meant to be specifically noticed and noted by the audience?

Maybe it's one of those weird editing mistakes but with 42 mins and odd seconds of airtime in a packed episode, you'd have to think they chose what to put in and leave out very, very carefully.

BTW, as I am simply quickly responding, this post doesn't not count as a 'random thought post' therefore, my promise above is not applicable.

Originally posted by Southern Red

They could make it Sparky Obsessive Syndrome and we could get disability.

Now there's an idea! *grin*

**Athenaktt** · 11 March 2006, 08:39 AM

Originally posted by xkawaiix

Very true, they could have just as easily replace some of those scenes with Sheyla. But like you said, they chose to highlight Shep and Weir.

But it does make sense they highlight Sheppard and Weir during these situations. The are to main leaders of Atlantis. And it helps that they both have such a wonderful connectionw with each other.

**gwenhwyfar** · 11 March 2006, 08:41 AM

Originally posted by Bama

Do you people realize how difficult it is to apply masacara and post at the same time?! Stop doing this to me!

About as difficult as it is to eat and post at the same time when everybody is in a naughty mood?

SouthernRed: Sparky Obsessive Syndrome! I like that! Got a symptoms list?

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