Would alien invaders really need to be that advanced?

[343_Guilty_Spark]

but why would they bother coming to our planet its nearly ran dry of natural resources and we are slowly killing it. the only rason they would come here is if we were a threat to them directly

[jds1982]

but why would they bother coming to our planet its nearly ran dry of natural resources and we are slowly killing it. the only rason they would come here is if we were a threat to them directly

They might not be aware of the predicament our planet is in, and their planet might also be in the same situation, or worse. Expansion and preservation of their species seems like reason enough to seek out habitable worlds.

[343_Guilty_Spark]

good point. but when they got here they would ne able to see for themselves that this planet is going that way aswell.

[jds1982]

good point. but when they got here they would ne able to see for themselves that this planet is going that way aswell.

Yeah, but I'd doubt they'd just turn around.

[docballen]

No, alien invaders would not have to be advanced at all.

I'm remembering the movie "The Andromeda Strain". A disease was brought to earth by a returning sattelite and did a lot of damage before the doctors and scientists found a way to fight it. This alien invader was a germ.

[343_Guilty_Spark]

Yeah, but I'd doubt they'd just turn around.

Good point why waste the time to come here just to go back.

No, alien invaders would not have to be advanced at all.

I'm remembering the movie "The Andromeda Strain". A disease was brought to earth by a returning sattelite and did a lot of damage before the doctors and scientists found a way to fight it. This alien invader was a germ.

AH but if an alien race did comehere they may not be immune to things we are. for you see no man lives or dies in vain

[the fifth man]

Yeah, but I'd doubt they'd just turn around.

Quite true. I highly doubt we would be lucky enough for them to be like - "This planet really sucks, let's just turn this puppy around and go on home."

[343_Guilty_Spark]

good point they wouldn waste the fuel they would stop and find out what they can about us

[the fifth man]

good point they wouldn waste the fuel they would stop and find out what they can about us

That and, what they can take from us.

[Ouroboros]

If they could get their ship up to 10% of light speed, which is theoretically possible with an Orion type ship, they could be here in 50 years. That is well within a human lifespan, and who knows what type of lifespan they would have. If it was a generation ship, their children would be the one to attack us, if they had sleeper technology, it wouldn't even be a problem. I'm pretty sure at 10% the speed of light significant relatavistic effects come into play, but I don't know what to what degree.

Or if they were a species that subscribed to the theory of "get them before they get us" they could just build a fleet of several thousand nuclear (or worse) missiles and send those on the 50 year trip.

Sounds like a pretty good story!

That being said, what do you imagine our hypothetical, non-super advanced aliens would be like?

Funny you should mention it as a story. I've actually read about the idea of a reletivistic missile scenario for first contact in an essay some years ago.

Basically the idea was that when one species with reletivistic engine technolgoy discovers another one in a similar advanced state they're then faced with a troublesome choice.

-Try to get the other civs attention/make peaceful contact
-Fire a relativistic missile at their planet and kill them all before they do it to you first

The dillema this hypothetical civilization would face is mainly one of trust. What are those other guys like? By giving up the chance to "shoot first" with a largely undetectable and unstoppable relativistic missile the civilization could instead be handing the other society that option, dooming itself in the process. By making their pressence known instead of attacking first, they essentially paint a bullseye on themselves with nothing but trust in the kindness of strangers, who likely do not even percieve reality the same way they do, standing between their species and extinction. With the stakes that high the choice between shooting first and calling yourself to their attention while hopeing they'll be friendly is a lot harder than it would initially seem.

[jds1982]

You could possibly do both, launch the first contact mission first, and the missile several months or years later. I imagine the missile would be faster (no crew and all to worry about acceleration, it could also be smaller) so it could arrive quickly after the first contact ship. If the other species is peaceful make the missile divert or self destruct. If their jerks leave the missile on course, and hopefully that species won't have enough time to build their own weapon before they are hopefully destroyed by the missile. Anyone know what kind of damage something traveling at 10% light speed would do to a planet? I imagine it would be significant.

[AvatarIII]

Anyone know what kind of damage something traveling at 10% light speed would do to a planet? I imagine it would be significant.

10% of the speed of light only gives a lorentz factor of 1.005, so time would run .5% out of sync and the ship would be .5% heavier, which isn't a lot.

so i guess it isn't that significant

[jds1982]

so i guess it isn't that significant

I don't know if the Lorentz factor of an object is that relevant to how much damage the object will do when striking a planet, but considering the fact that 10% of light speed is almost 7 times faster than the fastest meteors travel (1116000/ mph compared to 160,000/ mph) I imagine that an object going that fast would pack tremendous kinetic energy, and depending on how large it was could easily be an extinction level event.

[tauriprivatesoldier]

An alien race dosn't have to be very advanced to conquer earth. Examples are the triffids, the bodysnatchers (1978 remake version), the intelligent ant-like insects from herbinating eggs brought back from a Mars Probe Mission in "The Sand Kings" in the first epidsode of the twilight zone.

[Darkstar 2.0]

In a convenient galaxy, the process would probably a little something like this:

1] An alien species notices a comparable alien species, they attack each other.

2] Eventualy the war rages on for so long that the reasons they fought for are gone and non extistant.

3] The leaders of these two planets make a truce, to avoid loss of life they soon realise that the both cannot fight each other without killing both sides.

4] They form an aliiance, over many years the two societies grow and learn from each other, maybe more wars break out and are resolved, myabe not.

5] The two species are more of less one, they are a partnership, trade and commerce are extended between both species.

6] Later in time they discover a new alien civilisation,the cycle may proceed from number 1 again and follows the same with the two being replaced by 3.

7] You begin to form a multi-species federation/empire/solidarity what ever you wanna call it, over years of this a galactic wide civilisation of many races and species may form.

8] Two other species in the galaxy do the same away from other aliens and so become one, these allies fight other allies under the banner of a single name empire what ever and many become 1 and all join together in the end.

The only exception of this, is if this empire would wish to destroy a species non alligned with anybody, my point is that you can't do it alone for ever, but from the wars and meeting all could join together and their values change perhaps to exploration or just stay the same as war.

just food for thought