Torchwood Episode Discussion (Spoilers for all eps aired in the UK)

[Willow'sCat]

On Doctor Who and guns, well weapons. K-9 killed, well he was defending but he still took a life with a weapon. I think it was an alien but still. Also Leela had a big knife, she never used it on screen but she wanted to.

[Admiral Mappalazarou]

spoiler for 104

Spoiler:

Cybermen yay!

[Chaka's_Mum]

Random question on the guns: Wouldn't Gwen have learned how to use a gun as part of her police training? Do cops in the UK not routinely carry guns? (Cops in the US do.) My understanding is that the UK has stricter gun control laws than the US does.

As ShadowMaat and Scarimor have said - the Police in the UK do not carry guns and aren't trained to use them unless they are specifically joining an armed unit - which (I think, but don't quote me on this!) means they have to make a formal application and receive a recommendation by a senior officer to prove they are doing it for the right reasons (i.e. it's not 'wannabe Miami Vice' syndrome) - they have to have been in the service for quite some time, too before they can even think about applying. I think they also have to undergo a full evaluation to make sure they are psychologically up to the job, too; not to mention all the continual refresher training they need to go through just to keep their gun certificates - every six months, I think it is. Depending on how long it's been since she passed out of training college, the chances are that Gwen has never even seen a gun while on duty, much less handled one. Cardiff doesn't currently have a gun problem - at least, not a notable one. I shouldn't be surprised if a lot of the young morons who seem to need accessories to look grown up are tooled up with blades; but they haven't graduated to ballistics yet. Thank God.

But then, given how she handled that knife once she'd confiscated it from Bad Eddie, perhaps that's just as well Gwen was never trained to use a gun...

Tosh definitely reminded me of Willow, but she also reminded me of Oracle from Birds of Prey - the person back at the base who has all the information at her fingertips and directs the people in the field. Both Willow and Oracle were well developed in their respective shows, so hopefully the same will be true of Tosh.

Agree. I'm getting a bit bored with all the Gwen and Owen stuff. Come on - there are more people in the team; lets see them in action! And that includes the Junior Bank Manager/Ianto.

As for a Jack/Gwen ship, I don't like the idea. Jack will shag anything with a pulse, but he doesn't seem the type for a long-term relationship, and if he just shags her and walks away - well, there's a reason that it's unwise to date coworkers. But I am wondering if Gwen and her boyfriend might break up. Lots of couples break up or get divorced when one partner has a highly demanding job, and Gwen's boyfriend already seems unhappy with her demanding job at Torchwood.

I can see that coming too - there's only so many times that Rhys (I think that's his name!) is going to put up with being stood up all the time like this and have the 'I've got to work late but can't tell you what I'm doing' excuse over and over again. Highly demanding or not, he's being kept in the dark about the late nights. Sooner or later he's going to wonder just what it is that's keeping Gwen out so late; put two and two together and make five (or possibly four if this Gwen/Jack nonsense keeps up).

I probably sound like a stuck record, but I'm going to say it anyway:
Enough with the Ship already!!!

[scarimor]

I probably sound like a stuck record, but I'm going to say it anyway:
Enough with the Ship already!!!

I'll join you in that groove.

[The Signal]

So Gwen and Owen are weak? Maybe, I just thought Jack touched it, and Tosh must have examined it and they didn't set it off.

It only seemed to work in certain situations (under the bridge etc).

As for the guns, our police don't carry guns because its much harder to buy them here than it is in the UK. I've seen armed police in an airport though, (and they certainly aren't packing hand guns, so it's damn intimidating I can tell you), so I was impressed that RTD did do some sort of training for Gwen, as it would have been unrealistic for her to just automatically know her way around guns.

[Othere]

Random question on the guns: Wouldn't Gwen have learned how to use a gun as part of her police training? Do cops in the UK not routinely carry guns? (Cops in the US do.) My understanding is that the UK has stricter gun control laws than the US does.

The police force in the uk do not carry guns and nor do they wish to. There is an armed unit within the force and there is a strict process in order to be accepted.

According to the bbc (and this info is a little out of date): In 2001-02, there were some 22,300 firearms offences, a rise of almost a third on the previous year. The number of people killed by firearms was 23.

We flew to Paris on the morning of the alleged planned terror attacks this year and there were armed police even at Coventry International Shed.

Gun crime is actually affecting the applications of prospective students to universities in the Midlands. A lot of the recent gun-related crime has happened in cities like Birmingham and Nottingham. However irregular it actually is, it is being perceived by undergrads as a place that isn't as safe to in even if it isn't really the case.

As for the gun training, I thought it was all a little ghetto style gun in one hand, arms length etc...and then the Lara-Croft-two-guns thing...thats when I turned off and went to bed

[Othere]

It only seemed to work in certain situations (under the bridge etc).

As for the guns, our police don't carry guns because its much harder to buy them here than it is in the UK. I've armed police in an airport though, (and they certainly aren't packing hand guns, so it's damn intimidating I can tell you), so I was impressed that RTD did do some sort of training for Gwen, as it would have been unrealistic for her to just automatically know her way around guns.

I dont know that it is so much that police can't afford to buy it - they would have a source like the military have to supply them with the necessary equipment.

[The Signal]

I dont know that it is so much that police can't afford to buy it - they would have a source like the military have to supply them with the necessary equipment.

I meant the its harder for the general public Because its harder to get guns, theres less need for armed police. Sorry I wasnt clear

[CatGoddess]

I meant the its harder for the general public Because its harder to get guns, theres less need for armed police. Sorry I wasnt clear

Okay, I think I understand the gun situation a little better now.

It's relatively easy to get a gun in the US. I could probably walk into a store tomorrow and buy one. You have to pass a criminal background check and maybe go through a waiting period, a psychological evaluation, and/or some training (the rules vary state by state).

I myself do not own a gun and never will. Very few civilians in the US carry firearms, with the possible exception of hunting weapons. It's ill advised. A home intruder or other attacker could easily turn your firearm against you. Also, children can get into trouble with their parents' guns; look at Jack O'Neill's son in the Stargate universe.

The right to bear arms is constitutionally protected (2nd Amendment - Bill of Rights).

So, the cops must be armed. Police in the US routinely carry handguns, even in quiet suburban areas such as where I live. I work in Lower Manhattan, and there are always police officers with machine guns (!) in the area of the New York Stock Exchange. Armed officers ride the subways.

But I understand better now, why firearms training would not be part of Gwen's routine police training.

*packs bags and moves to the UK*

[ShadowMaat]

I wanted to learn how to use a gun, just... in case? My dad was going to give me lessons but we never quite got around to it. *sigh* I still think it'd be handy to know, though. One of those "never use in a million years" skills that comes in handy on that millionth time.

[Shep'sSocks]

Most of the stuff I've read on policing in the UK notes that in general, the police themselves do not want to be armed outside of the specialist units. In Australia, the police are routinely armed but we also have strict gun controls.

[scarimor]

What do people make of the way that gun training scene played out? At the beginning, it looked to me like it was a quite serious matter, in that he was teaching Gwen to respect a firearm. By the end, it looked to me like they were playing.

[scarimor]

I don't think it's a matter of pushing buttons, I think the device more or less activates itself. Although I could be wrong. The first time it looked like Gwen might have pushed a button, but the other times... *shrug*

They did talk about pushing a button after the first time it activated. Why she pushed it, or whether it activated itself when a ghostly emotion was around, or whether it drew the holder to activate it when a ghostly emotion was around - it seemed like that was being withheld. I get the impression that deliberate ambiguity is something of a theme for the series: e.g. how far did Owen get when he used the alien pheremones, is Gwen comfortable with weapons (guns - yes? knives - no?).

[BC - 303]

London police carry guns, but then again there is a constant terror alert here.
I've seen them, normally two police men walking around, each with a pistol, one normally with a sub machine gun, MP-5 perhaps.
It is scary and a recent addition.

[Shep'sSocks]

London police carry guns, but then again there is a constant terror alert here.
I've seen them, normally two police men walking around, each with a pistol, one normally with a sub machine gun, MP-5 perhaps.
It is scary and a recent addition.

Are you referring to the City of London police or The Met? I don't think either are armed as a matter of course but armed officers have been deployed in various areas. Not all carry weapons.