Sympathy for the Devil (501)

[Colonel Rebel]

I enjoyed this episode. I'm glad Castiel is okay. And it was good to see Meg again. The guy playing Lucifer is a good actor. I'm pretty excited about where the show is headed this season. The tension between the brothers is good for now, but I hope it doesn't last too long.

[LizzieAnne]

Loved the ep and so much was packed into it.

Maybe Lucifer saved Dean and Sam as he wanted Sam saved for his later plans and Dean just got swept up with him. Although Cas did imply that he knew who it was and Zach was afraid. That seems to suggest that it was God.

I imagine Kripke will have an interesting take on Lucifer, God and their relationship. You can be sure that it’s not going to be the conventional wisdom.

I love Meg returning again. As for Bobby being possessed…when Meg possessed Sam she showed how powerful she’d become…breaking out of the devil’s trap..so perhaps she’s become even more powerful especially now that Lucifer’s walking free.

I agree that there’s probably a scene with the blood glyph somewhere on the cutting room floor to explain that. I had to watch it again to make sure I hadn’t missed a bit.

The scene with Becky was hilarious. I’m saying no more.

Feeling slightly uneasy with Dean behaving the way he is.

[marielabbott]

I also wonder how Bobby became possessed. I can't think of a reason why he wouldn't have a tattoo like the boys, especially after what happened with his wife. They should have had a line at least to address that, I think. But are the tattoos like the devil's traps, can they be rendered non-functioning if the symbol is broken? Tattoos are only skin deep, so if Bobby was ganged up on, and a slice was made...it's a horrible thought, but it occurred to me that might be an explanation as to how it happened. Off-screen. And also why Cas engraved his protective symbol on the boys' ribs.

I wasn't a fan of the fan girl, but otherwise I really liked the episode. Lucifer was very scary, using psychological manipulation to get what he wanted. I'm glad God hasn't left the building, but unsure of how the portrayal will be. Sam is repentant--rightly so, he's got a lot to answer for--and it will be interesting to see how they repair the relationship between him and Dean.

[LoneStar1836]

I like the idea that God will have a hand at the end of this story arc, but I agree with you that the 'all powerful' angle has a certain danger to it. But I trust the writers not to pull the 'mysterious last minute save' card too often. They are too creative to have to resort to this whenever the boys get into a really tight spot. I think it was a good ploy this time because it was totally unexpected, and it added to the mystery.

As for the implications, this may very well be a red herring. It's a little too obvious, if you know what I mean...

That is a concern of mine, but I'll trust that tptb won't use that as a crutch.

And as far as the red herring...I hate those. Which is why I'm not 100% sold that it was God, but I'll lean with that interpretation until told otherwise by the show.

I never really thought about the character of the vessel an angel picks. I mean, his soul and emotions will be totally erased by the angel when he/she takes over. The way Castiel just walked past Jimmy's daughter who was in obvious distress in The Rapture showed that quite clearly.

Exactly (though they aren't totally erased...more like put in cold storage for the duration), but we as the viewer have an idea who Nick was before Lucifer took advantage of him. So it plays into how we see him now even though Nick is no longer in control. That's probably part of the reason they gave us the backstory with Castiel in The Rapture last season. Anyway I can't really see that being a factor in swaying Sam and Dean's feelings about Lucifer, but it does play with how the viewers see him.

I also wonder how Bobby became possessed. I can't think of a reason why he wouldn't have a tattoo like the boys, especially after what happened with his wife. They should have had a line at least to address that, I think. But are the tattoos like the devil's traps, can they be rendered non-functioning if the symbol is broken? Tattoos are only skin deep, so if Bobby was ganged up on, and a slice was made...it's a horrible thought, but it occurred to me that might be an explanation as to how it happened. Off-screen. And also why Cas engraved his protective symbol on the boys' ribs.

Great speculation there. I like it. So if the writers never touch on the why, I can just go with that.

[MB.Eddie]

Great start to the season

[the fifth man]

Great start to the season

Very true, although a little understated IMO.

[starg8fans]

I also wonder how Bobby became possessed. I can't think of a reason why he wouldn't have a tattoo like the boys, especially after what happened with his wife. They should have had a line at least to address that, I think. But are the tattoos like the devil's traps, can they be rendered non-functioning if the symbol is broken? Tattoos are only skin deep, so if Bobby was ganged up on, and a slice was made...it's a horrible thought, but it occurred to me that might be an explanation as to how it happened. Off-screen. And also why Cas engraved his protective symbol on the boys' ribs.

Great speculation there. I like it. So if the writers never touch on the why, I can just go with that.

I was thinking along the same lines. These skin-deep charms can be destroyed, remember how Bobby lifted the binding charm Meg put on Sam by putting a burn across it in Born under a Bad Sign?

That is a concern of mine, but I'll trust that tptb won't use that as a crutch.

And as far as the red herring...I hate those. Which is why I'm not 100% sold that it was God, but I'll lean with that interpretation until told otherwise by the show.

One thing the writers are really good at is surprising us with unexpected twists. I've lost track of how many times I did not see something coming. So whatever it is they have in store for the God story arc, I'm pretty sure it will be beyond our wildest speculations.

Exactly (though they aren't totally erased...more like put in cold storage for the duration), but we as the viewer have an idea who Nick was before Lucifer took advantage of him. So it plays into how we see him now even though Nick is no longer in control. That's probably part of the reason they gave us the backstory with Castiel in The Rapture last season. Anyway I can't really see that being a factor in swaying Sam and Dean's feelings about Lucifer, but it does play with how the viewers see him.

You're right, it is nice to get a feeling for the vessels' real lives. Jimmy was totally different from how I pictured him based on his clothes and Cas' description of a 'devout man'. I hadn't pegged him as a family man, for once. So with Nick the writers approach it the other way round, by having us meet him before he's taken over.

Did Nick's dead wife remember anybody else of Tessa? Not just the looks, but also the way she spoke.

[Lord Kira]

I really enjoyed this episode. Especially Bobby. When he disowned Sam, I should have known that something wasn't right. But it made for an amazing scene played perfectly by Jim and Jared. As with the Bobby and Sam scene at the end.

It sucks about Bobby's legs, though. I can't believe he's paralyzed! I think his hunting career is pretty much done.

I liked what they did with Mark and Lucifer. With the tragedy that happened to Mark's wife and baby, I can understand why he would want be angry at God. Hell, many of us have felt the same way when we lose someone we love. So it was perfectly understandable why would allow Lucifer to enter his body.

I loved this little scene between the two of them:

Lucifer: "My name is Lucifer."
Nick (very skeptical): "Sure. Naturally. Um - could you do me a favor there, Satan, and remind me to quit drinking before I go to bed."

[spork67]

Did Nick's dead wife remember anybody else of Tessa? Not just the looks, but also the way she spoke.

The way she spoke to Nick reminded me instantly of the way Tessa spoke to Dean in "In My Time of Dying". I thought it was a brilliant touch. I also couldn't shake how much Nick (and maybe its because they look similar) made me think of Michael (Kenmore) while I was watching his scenes.

[starg8fans]

The way she spoke to Nick reminded me instantly of the way Tessa spoke to Dean in "In My Time of Dying". I thought it was a brilliant touch. I also couldn't shake how much Nick (and maybe its because they look similar) made me think of Michael (Kenmore) while I was watching his scenes.

That's it! I was wondering who he reminded me of... Well spotted, Spork.

She reminded me even more of Tessa in Death takes a holiday, when she was talking to the boy who didn't want to leave his mother. Didn't she also wear a white dress in that scene?

[spork67]

That's it! I was wondering who he reminded me of... Well spotted, Spork.

She reminded me even more of Tessa in Death takes a holiday, when she was talking to the boy who didn't want to leave his mother. Didn't she also wear a white dress in that scene?

I'm not sure about the dress, but you're right about "Death Takes a Holiday". Every time I think of Tessa though, "In My Time of Dying" is the first thing that pops into my head.

And yeah, there were a lot of moments in there, especially in that last scene between Nick and Lucifer that really made me think of Michael... which is funny because before Mark Pellegrino was cast as Lucifer a friend of mine and I said that Connor Trinneer should do it!

[starg8fans]

I'm not sure about the dress, but you're right about "Death Takes a Holiday". Every time I think of Tessa though, "In My Time of Dying" is the first thing that pops into my head.

And yeah, there were a lot of moments in there, especially in that last scene between Nick and Lucifer that really made me think of Michael... which is funny because before Mark Pellegrino was cast as Lucifer a friend of mine and I said that Connor Trinneer should do it!

I really like Tessa's character, so I was glad they brought her back.

I've never seen Mark P. in 'action', but from what I've seen you're right, there is a certain resemblance to Connor. Anyway, as far as I know this is a totally new look for the devil. In any other portrayal I've ever seen he was always dark haired.

[the fifth man]

I really like Tessa's character, so I was glad they brought her back.

I've never seen Mark P. in 'action', but from what I've seen you're right, there is a certain resemblance to Connor. Anyway, as far as I know this is a totally new look for the devil. In any other portrayal I've ever seen he was always dark haired.

In this portrayal of Lucifer, I don't think the hair color will be the only difference. Should be really interesting stuff.

[starg8fans]

In this portrayal of Lucifer, I don't think the hair color will be the only difference. Should be really interesting stuff.

Absolutely. The writers have such a wonderfully skewed way of dealing with cliches and preconceived notions. Whatever their take on something, you know it's gonna be different - just think of the Very Supernatural Christmas. Even though Zachariah said it's "Apocalypse Now" - and I thought that was funny too, kinda expected the 'Ride of the Valkyrie' to start up any moment - this Armageddon will be like nothing that's ever been done before.

[Arative]

I've had a few days to think of this now and I read through the thread and people are making a big deal of Dean not sacrificing himself for Sam. That got me thinking of the last scene between Dean and Sam, how basically Dean doesn't trust Sam any more. Do you think possibly that's the reason he wouldn't sacrifice himself for Sam? In past seasons, Dean would have done it without thinking but after the events of last season, now he won't.