Star Trek Nemesis: Love it or hate it?

[Phantom Limb]

actually thinking about this again and i don't know if anyone has already said this, but it's all well and good what with it being the last TNG film and all to kill a character, but it was completely meaningless, it was rendered devoid of any emotion or resolution to data's character because he isn't dead! bloody B4 is still around with all his memory and probably personality.
in short the film had no balls, haha.
it didnt even have the nerve to kill a character in the actually dead sort of way not in a botched rehash of Spocks death in Wrath of kahn, Spock transfers his mind to McCoy, Data transfers his mind to B4, Spock dies in supreme sacrifice, Data dies in.... well they didn't even put that across in any logically understandable manner, its a type of radiation no one has ever heard of in trek before and its made up of wibbly green lights that kind of revolve around each other, hey that looks cool, look at the pretty lights. whoooooooo, no don't touch, the special effect will kill you!.
what if i shoot at it? that'll work it did for Kirk.
oh o.k. just don't forget if you do this it doesnt matter because we have another one so......

and christ on a bike an evil Picard!!

[markaudette]

The ONLY thing I did not like about Nemesis was Patrick Stewart's performance. It was the most insipid, most uninspiring on-screen spectacle I have ever seen. It was so bad you could have substituted him for a log and you would have gotten the same performance.

His acting in this movie was just terrible. I don't know what he was trying to achieve. BUt whatever it was, he didn't do it.

The movie just suffers from being beaten too forcebly into the mold created by Star Trek II: The Wrath of Kahn. The Scimitar = the Genesis device. Data's and B4's data link = Spock's and McCoy's "Remeber" scene.

Not showing the Titan was a big WTF moment.

But everything else was candy.

[Daniel Jackson]

actually thinking about this again and i don't know if anyone has already said this, but it's all well and good what with it being the last TNG film and all to kill a character, but it was completely meaningless, it was rendered devoid of any emotion or resolution to data's character because he isn't dead! bloody B4 is still around with all his memory and probably personality.

I was fine with killing off a major character since it was to be the last film (Berman had to beg Paramount to do one more TNG film). Data's death lacking emotional impact has nothing to do with B4. The death scene was just poorly executed. He fired his phaser at a green thing, and then the ship exploded. That's fine for a TV episode, but I expected more from a 2-hour feature film with a theatrical release.

Data's memory lives on through B4, but Data is dead. B4 will not become Data.

it didnt even have the nerve to kill a character in the actually dead sort of way not in a botched rehash of Spocks death in Wrath of kahn, Spock transfers his mind to McCoy, Data transfers his mind to B4, Spock dies in supreme sacrifice, Data dies in.... well they didn't even put that across in any logically understandable manner, its a type of radiation no one has ever heard of in trek before and its made up of wibbly green lights that kind of revolve around each other, hey that looks cool, look at the pretty lights. whoooooooo, no don't touch, the special effect will kill you!.
what if i shoot at it? that'll work it did for Kirk.
oh o.k. just don't forget if you do this it doesnt matter because we have another one so......

In The Wrath of Khan, Spock had to sacrifice himself so the Enterprise could go to warp and escape the Genesis wave. Unfortunately, this ment he would be irradiated to death. Ouch. At least he and Kirk got to say goodbye. I don't think the Katra thing was added until The Search for Spock, though.

Data didn't transfer his mind to B4, just his memories. Memories do not equate your complete being. If I knew everything you did, would I be you? No, I'd be me, only with your memories. If ST11 were a TNG movie with Brent Spiner playing B4, B4 would still be B4, only acting like Data occasionally. B4 will never become Data. Data uploaded memories, not all of his programming which is hardwired into his android skull.

Data's death would have had greater impact if they added...

Data telling LaForge he plans to fly a shuttlecraft over to the Schimitar, beam up Picard, beam downa torpedoe, and then fly away at full impulse. Geordi comments that it would take too long to power up a shuttlecraft. Data informs Geordi that he's going to leap out of the mangled hull and drift straight towards the Schimitar.

Why didn't Data just fly over in a shuttle? Come on...

Proceed with the movie until Data beams Picard away and says, "Goodbye," to the empty space where Picard stood. As Data swings around towards the radiation thing, bombard the audience with a montage of Data clips from TNG. Show the radiation thing slowly exploding, Data being thrown against the wall, his android skin incinerating and peeling away to reveal his android self beneath, show the circuits melt away to reveal a metal skeleton, show the metal skeleton shatter as the wall behind him liquifies, then end the slow motion and show the exterior of the Schimitar with a series of small explossions blasting through the hull followed by one, final explossion. The audience would follow the debris as it crashes into the Enterprise, damaging it further. Counselor Troi asks why they're still alive, and Geordi explains that the radiation was dispersed in all directions. By the time it reached the Enterprise, it was too dilluted to pass through the hull.

Now Data's death has emotional impact. Now the audience is happy to see B4.

and ***** on a bike an evil Picard!!

The original idea was for Shinzon to be Picard's long lost son. That would have been a much better story, or better yet... use Sela! At least movie goers would be familiar with Denis Crosby. She's not a movie star, but she's done enough movies for people to be aware of her thanks to a few popular horror movies.

[Aussie_Fan]

The original idea was for Shinzon to be Picard's long lost son. That would have been a much better story, or better yet... use Sela! At least movie goers would be familiar with Denis Crosby. She's not a movie star, but she's done enough movies for people to be aware of her thanks to a few popular horror movies.

Oh thank goodness they changed it! That would have been a bit to soap opera-ish for me.

[Daniel Jackson]

I guess a clone is more sci-fi than an illegitimate son...