Deep Space 9 Superior

[Linda06]

Its not about quanity its about their presence and their actions. I think the Female Changeling was the most evil villian on DS9 and she was only around for 15 episodes and over half those episodes were in S7.

Well for them to be in so few eps but end up so memorable they sure must have been so damn good

[Descent]

Its not about quanity its about their presence and their actions. I think the Female Changeling was the most evil villian on DS9 and she was only around for 15 episodes and over half those episodes were in S7.

Very true. She wasn't in a single episode of Season 5. Can you believe it? Guess it says a lot about the characters when they're only in a handful of episodes and leave such a big impression on you.

[Giantevilhead]

The Founders were great villains. The Dominion has the power to crush everyone with brute force but they know how to use sabotage and trickery. They may not like the solids but they know how solids think and they're masters of psychological warfare. It's ironic that the Dominion War may have actually saved the Alpha Quadrant since rampant paranoia caused by the Dominion and infiltration by the Founders was already causing the various factions in the Quadrant to turn against each other.

[nx01a]

In all honesty, if the Dominion had just sent a huge fleet into the Alpha Quadrant at the end of season 2, every power would have been helpless before the might of their weapons and the Dominion would rule the Alpha Quadrant now. They schemed too much and didn't use brute force when it was most vital. The Founders care nothing for the Jem'Hadar [or Vorta], and having them die by the millions wouldn't make them bat a liquid eyelash.
One aspect of the Dominion I thought would have been nice to see would have been a Gamma Quadrant underground rebellion. there had to be some people working to undermine them before the Fed et al showed up. Of course, if not, that's just more testament to the power of the Dominion in crushing rebellion.

[Giantevilhead]

Except that the Dominion couldn't have sent an invasion at the end of season 2. DS9 could have destroyed the wormhole. It wasn't until "In Purgatory's Shadow" when the Founder impersonating Bashir stabilized the wormhole that the Dominion was able to send large forces into the Alpha Quadrant.

It also takes time to mobilize an attack force. Ships can't travel more than a few thousand times the speed of light at warp 9. It's unlikely that the Dominion has enough ships within a few hundred light year radius of the wormhole to take on the entire Alpha Quadrant. Not to mention the fact that the Dominion has to reposition its forces within the Gamma Quadrant to keep control of their territory.

There were races that rebelled against the Dominion and they were all crushed.

[Rac80]

Hey brother Weyoun is in the house, always good to see you my friend. Great call on the "Female Changeling". Salome Jens, like Louise Fletcher was with the Winn character, was off the charts good with her portrayal of the Female Changeling. She kind of gets forgotten in the mix of truly great villains and characters from DS9, but I have her ranked as one of my very favorite characters from the entire series.
lol I'm so free I love my wife but darn if we don't need our alone time from each other. Fortunetly she feels the same way so we have managed to stay a happy couple for 10 years now. Plus I know she is out of town and won't read this.

I'm sorry about the cruddy weather.

LOL that is why hubby and I have seperate home offices...keeps the marriage healthy!
the funny thing is snookie (our daughter) and I can share an office easily!

Good morning Lady Linda. Sorry about your lousy weather. No such complaints here - I'm sitting in my office at work looking out at the Golden Gate Bridge on perfect day. The air is so clear you can see the Farallon Islands on the horizon. Plus I just scored some fresh Abalone which I traded some live crab for. I know what I'm having for dinner tonight, yummm!.

some days this thread makes me hungry! or just long for days buy the ocean, buying cheap(er) seafood than I can buy in Indiana. My better-half though knows how to keep me happy here-- I need lobster 3 or 4 times a year. When it goes on sale (which is rarely) I buy it or sometimes --just cause! always fresh and live. I cook those babies and then oh man are they good! and they are low in calories because I am a purist...never eat seafood in butter, I love the taste of lobster, crab, scallops, etc....

[nx01a]

The whole 'collapse the wormhole' thing wasn't considered until 'The Search pt 2', I believe. They never had a reason to consider destroying it before, did they?
Instead of all the work on that quite clever plan to get Eris into the DS9 main cast , the Founders should have spent that time amassing a fleet in that nebula near the wormhole and then hit the Alpha Quadrant one time. Remember that the Dominion had 2 years to infiltrate every power in the Alpha Quadrant. They should have also been getting an invasion fleet ready. They had plenty of time to either their forces, build a fleet specially to take the Aphla Quadrant and unleash the Quickening across the Quadrant a la the Drakh plague.

[Descent]

The whole 'collapse the wormhole' thing wasn't considered until 'The Search pt 2', I believe. They never had a reason to consider destroying it before, did they?
Instead of all the work on that quite clever plan to get Eris into the DS9 main cast , the Founders should have spent that time amassing a fleet in that nebula near the wormhole and then hit the Alpha Quadrant one time. Remember that the Dominion had 2 years to infiltrate every power in the Alpha Quadrant. They should have also been getting an invasion fleet ready. They had plenty of time to either reposition their forces, build a fleet specially to take the Aphla Quadrant and unleash the Quickening across the Quadrant a la the Drakh plague.

Well for one, they knew (?) that Odo was out there and they wanted him to find them. They weren't 100% sure of what they were dealing with yet. Probably wanted to find out more about the Alpha Quadrant before launching a full-scale assault.

And I don't think they would've succeeded. The Klingons, the Romulans and the Federation would've ganged up on them. I don't care how powerful their fleet is. That's why they tricked the Klingons (Martok) into going to war with eachother and trying to get Earth all paranoid about them. Weaken us up before they go in for the kill.

I don't think there was anything wrong with what they did up to that point. Their first big mistake came when they lost the station and had to fall back.

Granted, I haven't actually watched much of the series in some time, but I think I got everything straight here.

[Giantevilhead]

The whole 'collapse the wormhole' thing wasn't considered until 'The Search pt 2', I believe. They never had a reason to consider destroying it before, did they?
Instead of all the work on that quite clever plan to get Eris into the DS9 main cast , the Founders should have spent that time amassing a fleet in that nebula near the wormhole and then hit the Alpha Quadrant one time. Remember that the Dominion had 2 years to infiltrate every power in the Alpha Quadrant. They should have also been getting an invasion fleet ready. They had plenty of time to either their forces, build a fleet specially to take the Aphla Quadrant and unleash the Quickening across the Quadrant a la the Drakh plague.

Just because the Founders don't care about the Jem'Hadar and the Vorta doesn't mean they have infinite resources. War is still a last resort because it is far more costly than negotiations and sabotage. The Dominion don't want to completely wipe out the solids, they want to control the solids. They only commit genocide when they believe it is necessary.

[nx01a]

They had enough info on the AQ to successfully impersonate Klingons, Romulans, Breen, Terrans... They could have thrown us into disarray and then swooped in and taken over Earth, Vulcan, Romulus, Cardassia... 3 fighters took out a Galaxy. 3! The fleet the Dominion had in 'Sacrifice of Angels' could have taken the AQ.
I'm not arguing that they shouldn't have used deception and espionage, but they should have started the military campaign earlier.

[Descent]

They had enough info on the AQ to successfully impersonate Klingons, Romulans, Breen, Terrans... They could have thrown us into disarray and then swooped in and taken over Earth, Vulcan, Romulus, Cardassia...

They knew all that by the end of Season 2? I thought they only knew about the Federation, the Klingons and maybe the Ferengi at that point. Right? I think you overestimate their chances against the entire fleets of the Federation, Klingon Empire, Cardassia and the Romulans. That's why they did what they did, really.

3 fighters took out a Galaxy. 3!

But if I remember correctly, we had that problem figured out rather quickly.

I'm not arguing that they shouldn't have used deception and espionage, but they should have started the military campaign earlier.

But why bother when you have the Klingons at eachother's throats? If they attacked so soon, they would've been ganged up on, like I said. Beat your enemy down a little bit.

[Giantevilhead]

As mentioned before, ships can only travel a few thousand times the speed of light at above warp 9. The Federation is 8,000 light years across. It would take months Dominion to conquer the home worlds of the most powerful Alpha Quadrant races and years to send forces all over the Alpha Quadrant.

[jelgate]

If the Dominion had invaded in at the end of S2 they would have most likely dealt with the Federation, Klingions, Romulans, and Cardassians. The Dominion War shows us that the Dominion was pretty much at stalemate when it was just the Federation, Klingons, and Romulans. And I imagine the moment the Dominion marched an armada in, DS9 would block or try to collapse the wormhole. And that would be the problem in the Dominion attacked in S2. They would have no territory (in contrast to the real Dominion who had Cardassia for territory). just one big supply line from the Gamma Quadrant. And history shows the longer the supply line the more risk a person takes. A long supply increases the possibility for an enemy attack. The Dominion are powerful granted but they are not invincible. If the Alpha Quadrant species had mobolized and cut off their supply aka the Bajoran wormhole the Dominion would have lost

[nx01a]

I assume that the Founders wouldn't reveal their presence in 'The Jem'Hadar' if they didn't already have their operatives in place in the major powers of the Alpha Quadrant.

I know that just opening cans of whup on an entire Quadrant might not make the most sense... but a mix of subterfuge by their high-placed agents combined with thousands of ships streaming through the wormhole without notice [taking DS9 and Bajor as their beach-head] and warp 9-ing it to the key Federation worlds would have given us Wolf 359/2nd battle of Chin'toka level disasters for the major powers. The Federation firepower and shields were no match for the Dominion at the beginning, and I doubt the Romulans, Klingons, Gorn, etc. would have done much better. It would have been bloody and a great loss of life, but Earth, etc. would be in ruins and subdued.

Of course, I could also be wrong and just dreaming about the massive space battles I could have gotten...

[Giantevilhead]

But even at warp 9, it would still take days if not weeks for the Dominion to reach the homeworlds of the major Alpha Quadrant powers. Unless the Founders can somehow shut down all communications within the Alpha Quadrant for that much time, it's unlikely that the Dominion forces can reach those worlds without being destroyed. There's also the problem of cloaked Klingon and Romulan ships. Although the Dominion can detect cloaked ships, they can only do it at short range. That will make it much harder for the Dominion to attack the Klingons and Romulans. It will also mean the Klingons and Romulans can sneak a fleet to Bajor and destroy the wormhole.