Deep Space 9 Superior

[the Fifth Race]

I really like DS9. It has a realyl different feel from the ship-based shows, and I like how there are so many characters.

I totally agree SG-1ssm!, the wide variety of truly wonderful and memorable characters from DS9 is one of the main reasons that made the show great. You hit the nail on the head.

Hope to see more of you posting on this thread SG-1ssm.

[Starbase]

DS9 season V episode discussion

Blaze of Glory was my favorite episode from season V!. I always enjoyed the few Eddington episodes we got earlier but this episode was especially excellent!. Sisko gambles big-time with basically letting Eddington go so he would help him find the phony missiles sent by the last of the Maquis. The back and forth banter between Sisko and Eddington was priceless, one minute you are on Sisko's side the next it's Eddington. I was again saddened by the ending (Eddington dies in a "blaze of glory"). I wonder if Sisko let the last of the surviving Maquis refugees (including Eddington's wife) he rescued go?.

I wouldn't rank this as my favorite season V episode but I will say it is the best Eddington/Maquis episode they did. I also really enjoyed the back and forth banter between Sisko and Eddington brother Fifth as well. That last scene from the episode where Dax is consoling Sisko about Eddington and a whole bunch of Maquis civilians getting killed by the JemHa'dar said a lot about what I was thinking. Sisko did feel guilty about pursuing the Maquis and Eddington so vigorously with a blind eye he forgot about compassion and right from wrong. By Eddington sacrificing his own life to save Sisko and the reamaining Maquis made Sisko realize the error of his ways, Sisko's quote to Dax .... "I wish I would have done things differently"

Empok Nor was a very dark and sinister episode that creeped the heck out of me!. The Garak and O'Brien dynamic in this episode was edgy and quite confrontational. I am not sure if I liked this episode or not, it was brilliantly written and quite spooky, definetly well written.

This was a very creepy episode and the story arc they had with O'Brien's past involvement as a soldier killing Cardassian soldiers in a Starfleet battle irked Garak to no end, that angle kind of came out of left field. Garak and O'Brien were both brilliant in this very dark episode.

[the Fifth Race]

I wouldn't rank Blaze of Glory as my favorite season V episode but I will say it is the best Eddington/Maquis episode they did. I also really enjoyed the back and forth banter between Sisko and Eddington brother Fifth as well. That last scene from the episode where Dax is consoling Sisko about Eddington and a whole bunch of Maquis civilians getting killed by the JemHa'dar said a lot about what I was thinking. Sisko did feel guilty about pursuing the Maquis and Eddington so vigorously with a blind eye he forgot about compassion and right from wrong. By Eddington sacrificing his own life to save Sisko and the remaining Maquis made Sisko realize the error of his ways, Sisko's quote to Dax .... "I wish I would have done things differently".

Good call brother Base, that last scene with Sisko and Dax was very telling and nice way to wrap up the whole "obsessed Sisko with the Maquis arc". Sisko started to realize that his emotions were getting in the way of his morals with the way he dealt with Eddington and the Maquis. I think a lot of it had to do with Eddington and his utter dedication to his cause and people, Sisko started to realize that anyone willing to sacrifice everything (including a budding Starfleet career) gave him pause to think, am I doing the right thing?. Another turning point for Sisko was when he realized that the Maquis never actually sent those missiles that were reported coupled with the lengths that Eddington would go to to save his wife and fellow Maquis. You could see Sisko coming around throughout this great episode.

[Oranos]

This show is awesome. Not only did it have great characters but an abudance of them. It had great stand alones and arc episodes. And I could go on and on but I think I'll just stop there.

[Starbase]

This show is awesome. Not only did it have great characters but an abudance of them. It had great stand alones and arc episodes. And I could go on and on but I think I'll just stop there.

Agreed, agreed and agreed!

Not only did DS9 have an abundance of great characters it spread the storylines around and used enough great stand alone episodes that all the characters got a chance to shine and make there mark. They also had the benefit of truly great writing and great actors, DS9 is indeed special.

[kmiller1610]

Empok Nor was a real sit up and take notice episode for me. Garak's role as wise devil suddenly turns to actual devil through the drugs and O'Brien gets to show off his cunning and engineering skills in a combat situation. It's one of the stand alone episodes that's pretty unusual: not comedic, not relational, very dramatic and original. The event is referred to later as Nog is not quite sure about Garak after that. This was one of my favorite season V eps.

[the Fifth Race]

Empok Nor was a real sit up and take notice episode for me. Garak's role as wise devil suddenly turns to actual devil through the drugs and O'Brien gets to show off his cunning and engineering skills in a combat situation. It's one of the stand alone episodes that's pretty unusual: not comedic, not relational, very dramatic and original. The event is referred to later as Nog is not quite sure about Garak after that. This was one of my favorite season V eps.

The whole legend of Empok Nor was talked about in a few episodes before and as it turned out the real thing was scarier than imagined. I was annoyed by Garak in this episode, at least in the beginning, he was confrontational, whiny and out of line dealing with O'Brien, again DS9 goes deep into the physce of a particular race (Cardassians in this case) and gives a lot of insight into make makes them tick.

Nog was great in this episode, he still wants to prove himself among his peers, especially O'Brien. He showed bravery and smarts, even O'Brien was impressed.

[Starbase]

It's one of the stand alone episodes that's pretty unusual: not comedic, not relational, very dramatic and original. The event is referred to later as Nog is not quite sure about Garak after that. This was one of my favorite season V eps.

Agreed!, as far as stand alones go this is a doozy, I also agree as a stand alone its rather original just like the episode Children of Time was that we just discussed.

Nog was great in this episode

I do not care much for the Nog character but he was like you said "great in this episode". Nog and Jake both stepped it up in season V and both played important parts.

[the Fifth Race]

DS9 season V episode discussion...
Episode # 25

In the Cards
As the Dominion threat to the Alpha Quadrant intensifies, Jake notices Sisko growing increasingly depressed. Hearing that Quark plans to auction off a collection of antiquities that includes a vintage Willie Mays baseball card, he decides obtaining the card for his father is the perfect way to life his spirits. Jake persuades Nog to use his life savings to bid on the collection, but a man named Dr. Giger outbids them, taking the card and crushing Jake's hopes.
Jake and Nog approach Dr. Giger with an offer to buy the card, but he refuses. However, after researching their backgrounds Giger offers to trade them the card for various pieces of equipment and medical supplies. Upon Nog's insistence, Giger reveals he needs the items to develop a machine that will deliver eternal life by "entertaining" cells — preventing them from dying of boredom. Jake's determination to get the card leads them to agree to Giger's terms.

Meanwhile, Kai Winn meets with Dominion representative Weyoun on the station to discuss the Dominion's wish to sign a non-aggression treaty with Bajor. Sisko feels strongly that this would be an unwise move and convinces Winn to stall the proceedings. Later, Jake and Nog return to Giger's quarters with the last of the items he requested, only to find that Giger and his equipment are gone.

After learning that Odo has no record of Giger being on the station, Jake and Nog spot Kai Winn on the Promenade, talking with a man who bid against them at the auction. Jake assumes they kidnapped Giger and confronts the Kai. This lands him and Nog in Sisko's office where, determined to keep the baseball card is secret, Jake tells his father they were drunk. Sisko confines them to quarters, but on their way they are suddenly transported to a Jem'Hadar interrogation room.

Jake and Nog explain their quest to obtain the baseball card from Giger, who is being held captive, but Weyoun believes they are plotting against him. Desperate, Jake makes up a story about working for Starfleet Intelligence. The tale is so preposterous Weyoun decides he believes the first story. In fact, he is actually interested in Giger's work! Weyoun lets the boys take the baseball card, which, as Jake predicted, succeeds in improving his father's mood.

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In the Cards was a rather fun episode, he had Weyoun being paranoid that Jake and Nog are planning something with Dr. Giger, we had Kai Winn seeking Sisko's opinion on Bajor signing a non-proliferation pact with the Dominion and we had Jake and Nog doing everything possible to obtain a rare Willie Mays rookie baseball card to give Sisko as surprise gift. A lot of silliness going on while things are getting serious with the Dominion. I liked this episode, again Nog and Jake were fantastic and in true Ferengi fashion they manage to pull off getting the card. One of the last scenes where Weyoun is trying out Dr. Gigers cell boredom youth machine was quite funny.

[kmiller1610]

This was not an episode to drop in on without understanding the whole hierarchy of the Dominion. The Vorta did not fit any definition of bad guy I had ever seen and when he gave Jake the card back, I just did not understand it. (I had not watched DS9 in years and I was starting up again with season 5, which I had never seen.)

After working through season 6, the Vorta's actions finally made sense. As the ulitmate middle man, the Vorta also serves as a kind of public relations liaison on behalf of the founders. It's a sort of "We will conquer you, but that doesn't mean we can't be nice.." affect.

About the closest thing I can think of in Sci Fi is that bozo who appears on all the screens in the Computer Game Half Life 2, speaking to the masses and trying to calm them down while their cities are in ruin and all their liberties have been revoked.

[the Fifth Race]

This was not an episode to drop in on without understanding the whole hierarchy of the Dominion. The Vorta did not fit any definition of bad guy I had ever seen and when he gave Jake the card back, I just did not understand it. (I had not watched DS9 in years and I was starting up again with season 5, which I had never seen.)

After working through season 6, the Vorta's actions finally made sense. As the ultimate middle man, the Vorta also serves as a kind of public relations liaison on behalf of the founders. It's a sort of "We will conquer you, but that doesn't mean we can't be nice.." affect.

The Vorta and Weyoun in particular wielded an iron fist with a velvet glove. The come off as smooth and endearing while doing as they please. I believe Weyoun gave Jake and Nog the card because a) Jake didn't lie when asked about why he was dealing with Dr. Giger....b) Because he wanted to appear to be a nice guy knowing full well that Jake is Sisko's son. Weyoun is always working an angle appearing to be humble and conciliatory while never settling for anything less than what he wants, it's really brilliant writing!.

I am going to watch the last episode of season V and start on season VI today, if I remember right the last episode of season V and the first 2 episodes of season VI are one storyline. I will put episode discussion for those 3 episode tomorrow.

You are dead-on right kmiller about how the Vorta's (Weyoun) actions and demeanor start to make more sense as you go through seasons VI & VII. There is a definite method to his sly behavior. Whoever came up with the Vorta gets major kudos from muah.

[Missster.Freeman]

About the closest thing I can think of in Sci Fi is that bozo who appears on all the screens in the Computer Game Half Life 2, speaking to the masses and trying to calm them down while their cities are in ruin and all their liberties have been revoked.

The bozo you're referring to is Dr Breen, and he truly was a bozo. Breen was the ultimate sell-out, a traitor. He was the one that signed the 'treaty' between Earth and The Combine and became the puppet ruler of Earth.

I would say Weyoun differs slightly from Dr Breen in the sense that Weyoun didn't sell out his own species. He was already on the side of the Dominion when they invaded the Alpha Quadrant. However, you are correct, the Vorta were puppets and the apologists of the Dominion.

[the Fifth Race]

I would say Weyoun differs slightly from Dr Breen in the sense that Weyoun didn't sell out his own species. He was already on the side of the Dominion when they invaded the Alpha Quadrant. However, you are correct, the Vorta were puppets and the apologists of the Dominion.

The Vorta were puppets of the Dominion but really didn't have a choice as to what they Dominion made them brother MF. Remember the Vorta were a tree dwelling monkey type creature that couldn't speak and had limited abilities when the Founders snatched them up from there home-world and genetically enhanced them. They were made to have no gender or desire for sex, there eye sight is poor while there hearing is excellent. Plus they were enhanced to speak and understand language and of course, do the bidding of there God's, the Founders.

[Starbase]

In the Cards was a rather fun episode, he had Weyoun being paranoid that Jake and Nog are planning something with Dr. Giger, we had Kai Winn seeking Sisko's opinion on Bajor signing a non-proliferation pact with the Dominion and we had Jake and Nog doing everything possible to obtain a rare Willie Mays rookie baseball card to give Sisko as surprise gift. A lot of silliness going on while things are getting serious with the Dominion. I liked this episode, again Nog and Jake were fantastic and in true Ferengi fashion they manage to pull off getting the card. One of the last scenes where Weyoun is trying out Dr. Gigers cell boredom youth machine was quite funny.

This was a great Jake and Nog buddy episode, those two did grow up (physically and acting wise) right before our eyes during season V. Nog used his abilities as a Ferengi by practicing the 'rules of acquistion' to help Jake get the card after there bid at the auction failed. Dr. Giger who bought the card among other items in the lot was good comedic relief and working Weyoun into the comedic calamity was brilliant. Weyoun really started to show his personality in this fun episode.

[the Fifth Race]

DS9 season V episode discussion....
Episode # 26 (last episode of the season 5)

Call to Arms
When Starfleet Command notifies Sisko that he must stop further Dominion reinforcements from reaching Cardassia, he decides to mine the entrance to the wormhole — a move that will likely lead to war.
Dax, Rom, and O'Brien hatch a plan to fill the wormhole entrance with self-replicating mines, but the entire minefield must be in place before it can be activated. This means the plan is likely to be detected, and the Defiant attacked, before the minefield is ready. When Sisko reveals that Starfleet cannot send reinforcements, the crew realizes the station may be lost. Shortly after Dax and O'Brien set off to deploy the minefield, Weyoun, the Dominion representative, arrives with a warning that they will take over the station unless Sisko removes the mines.

Refusing to back down, Sisko alerts the crew to the Dominion's impending attack. He asks General Martok to patrol the border and informs Kira he will endorse the non-aggression pact the Dominion proposed to Bajor, hopefully ensuring the planet's survival. After hurriedly marrying Rom and Leeta, Sisko is notified by Martok that the Dominion force should arrive within the hour.

The station is evacuated while Sisko, his officers, and a few others remain behind. As the battle begins, they fight the Jem'Hadar from the station while Martok and his troops protect the Defiant, allowing Dax and O'Brien time to finish the minefield. With the Dominion continuing to bear down, Sisko orders all remaining Starfleet personnel to evacuate.

Sisko addresses Kira, Odo, Quark, Rom, Morn, and the few others who will remain behind, promising to fight until he can return to the station. He also reveals that while they were keeping the Dominion occupied, the rest of the Federation fleet was destroying Dominion shipyards in Cardassian space. Preparing for a rendezvous with a Federation task force and a final battle with the Dominion, Sisko joins his crew and departs in the Defiant. Unfortunately he must leave without Jake, who secretly arranged to remain behind and report on the imminent events. Back on DS9, Kira, Odo, and their remaining comrades disable the station before surrendering their home to Gul Dukat and the Dominion.

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Call to Arms is a great episode!, it is part I to a III part episode where Sisko vows to comeback after himself and Starfleet had to abandon DS9 because of the Cardassians and Dominion flexing there muscles. The scene with Weyoun confronting Sisko about the mining of the wormhole was fantastic and gripping. Sisko was pissed and Weyoun was equally as perturbed when it was understood that neither of them was backing down. Weyoun and Sisko to a lesser degree acted semi-cordial when Weyoun offered his phony proposal to limit the Dominion traffic through the wormhole to non-military transports. Weyoun #5 (there clones) started to show his true colors in this episode and its not that I liked his character, its just that he portrays it so beautifully!, just like most of the characters on DS9.