Deep Space 9 Superior

[Cold Fuzz]

Happy Holidays everyone (even our non US citizens). Gobble Gobble.

I'm getting ready for a big day of Football wooohooo and cooking ughhhh. My 9-1 49ers are in Baltimore for a great match-up against the Ravens tonight. I got my dinner planned out so we all eat before the game kick-off at 5:30pm I also plan on watching some more Star Trek: Fan Collection DVD Box Set episodes after the game.

Anyone have anything interesting planned tonight?

Hope everything's well with you and the Bay Area boys Brother Fifth.

My brother's visiting until next Tuesday so I'll be preoccupied for a bit. Lots of food already, like roasted salmon with dill weed and garlic. Really good stuff, especially garlic mashed potatoes.

[USS Defiant]

That game had so much ref favortism. I'm used to Detriot doing terrible but the refs called every tiny little thing

Agreed! That called back touchdown by the Niners was ridiculous! The Niners would have been up by 10 pts and the whole game would have been different. The way the refs have taken over games because of these new fangled NFL rules is shameful, it makes me not even want to watch it anymore.

Hope everything's well with you and the Bay Area boys Brother Fifth.

My brother's visiting until next Tuesday so I'll be preoccupied for a bit. Lots of food already, like roasted salmon with dill weed and garlic. Really good stuff, especially garlic mashed potatoes.

Yumm!! sounds awesome brother CF (God I love Salmon). Brother Fifth always brings my wife and I some local caught live Dungeness Crab for Thanksgiving. But like every year, the fisherman and wholesalers can't agree on a price so the whiny azz fisherman are striking over 25 cents a lb. This year its extra bad because all the fisherman on the West Coast (including Ore. Wash.) are honoring the strike, and it's always usually settled by Thanksgiving. So nothing but frozen crab, which brother Fifth doesn't deal with. I wouldn't buy or want frozen anyway.

[Saquist]

Happy Holidays everyone (even our non US citizens). Gobble Gobble.

I'm getting ready for a big day of Football wooohooo and cooking ughhhh. My 9-1 49ers are in Baltimore for a great match-up against the Ravens tonight. I got my dinner planned out so we all eat before the game kick-off at 5:30pm I also plan on watching some more Star Trek: Fan Collection DVD Box Set episodes after the game.

Anyone have anything interesting planned tonight?

Harbrawl Bowel was great. I'm disappointed that the Niners lost...alot of errors took points off the board.

[the Fifth Race]

Hope everything's well with you and the Bay Area boys Brother Fifth.

Hey brother Fuzz, always great to see you on the superior thread my friend. we had a great holiday, I ate way to much lol.

Harbrawl Bowel was great. I'm disappointed that the Niners lost...alot of errors took points off the board.

It was an interesting referee influenced game (great defense all around), but good game none the less. Both teams are very good, but like brother Weyoun said, these new safer rules meant to protect the players are ruining the game.

[rien]

Destiny is one of my favourite episodes. I love the two Cardassian scientists Ulani and Gilora their so friendly and genuine in their excitement and enthusiasm in working with the Bajorans and Federation and helping cement the newfound peace. Also through their interactions with the DS9 crew we get some more insights into Cardassian culture/society. Like how male Cardassians aren’t very technically minded which is why females dominate the sciences or that amongst cardassians overt irritation is a signal of attraction. Maybe someone should have mentioned that to Kira cause with the overt irritation she constantly displays towards Dukat its no wonder he keeps coming onto her
I just love that misunderstanding with O’Brien and Gilora. O’Brien is so cute in how freaked out he is by this woman who has up til now done nothing but argue with him or dismiss him suddenly coming onto him and accusing him of leading her on. Then when they finally figure out theres been a cultural misunderstanding he goes and inadvertently insults her. Is it bad of me to think that if Keiko weren’t around then O’Brien and Gilora would have made a cute couple? I also love that scene on the bridge of the defiant when Dejar is outed as the saboteur and a member of the obsidian order. The actresses that play Ulani and Gilora manage to be quite expressive despite the prosthetics and I love that you can see in their faces that they know immediately what has happened. In particular the look that Ulani shoots Dejar when O’Brien is blaming himself for a basic mistake that even a rookie wouldn’t have made. Its an effective contrast to Dejar who always seems so calm and controlled in everything she does that you begin to wonder if she has any thoughts and emotions of her own?

Of course the focus of the episode isn’t the Cardassian scientists but commander Sisko and Kira and its really the first time we get to see the internal conflict that both characters go through because of Sisko’s dual role as both the Bajoran emissary and a Starfleet officer. Kira wants to keep her personal and work lives separate, hiding how she really feels about Sisko and pretending that she sees him as nothing more than her commanding officer for fear of losing his respect, but finds it increasingly hard to do so as the episode progresses simply because she is a very spiritual person. Sisko is the opposite he isn’t religious or from a spiritual society and is clearly uncomfortable with being the emissary, something he has tried to ignore up til now. There is an interesting scene with Dax and Sisko in his office where he is freaking out over all the prophecies he has found concerning the emissary and Dax just asks him ‘If you never heard these prophecies what would you do?’
By the end of the episode Sisko is no longer made uncomfortable by his role as emissary and is even asking vedek Yarka for more information about Bajoran spiritual stuff which is a nice contrast to earlier in the episode where he was so determined to ignore it all.

Prophet Motive isnt one of my fave episodes, i usually tend to avoid it during rewatches. I dont think its particularly bad but i dont think its particularly good either. It is interesting how the prophets devolved Zek in order to make him nicer and less materialistic. As Quark once pointed out Humans used to be a lot like the Ferengi in their materialistic society but they ‘evolved’ into a society that places little value upon material things, which makes sense when you can replicate pretty much anything, and instead of chasing after profit seek to better themselves. So its kinda amusing that Ferengi culture/society evolved the opposite way starting off as nice guys willing to help anyone and later developing into a society of greedy con-merchants willing to do anything in order to obtain profit. I like that scene at the end where Quark says he is impressed that Rom was able to embezzle money from the nagus. I was also impressed not only that Rom embezzled money from the nagus but that he told Quark about it but then Rom is a nice guy.
Also I think the guy that plays Maihar’du is one of the best things about any episode that involves the nagus. He never talks and has all that prosthetic make-up obscuring his face but he manages to convey so much. Other episodes he’s usually just there in the background but in Prophet Motive he gets to play a larger role and that must have been nice for the actor who plays him

Imho Visionary counts as a perfect episode. We have a solid sci fi concept with O’Brien jumping back and forth and trying to solve a mystery and prevent the bad things he sees happening in the future, like his own death or the stations destruction, from happening. The whole exposure to radiation part is a bit clichéd but I feel that the rest of the story is just so good that that small plot contrivance can easily be overlooked. At the very least how the radiation affects O’Brien is set up early on in the episode, remains consistent throughout and the consequences of prolonged radiation exposure, O’Brien’s eventual death, is not avoided by some convenient plotdevice or hyposparay unlike other star trek episodes where the affects and uses of radiation change as the plot requires and are easily cured.
Particular highlights include the (second) bar fight scene where past O’Brien materialises and punches out a Klingon. I like how the two O’Brien’s share the same smug smile before past O’Brien vanishes once again. Also that scene where O’Brien discovers his future self has died, Alexander Siddig is quite good in this scene managing to convey sorrow at having lost a friend mixed with a strong dose of hope that past O’Brien will appear and be able to prevent his death from happening. Then there that scene towards the end with O’Brien in pyjamas! I love how the two O’Brien’s just accept one another and get along perfectly fine rather than the usual cliche of someone instantly disliking their alternate self.
I also love how Odo is portrayed in this episode as even though its an O’Brien story Odo still gets to show off his awesome detective skills. Particularly that exchange with Sisko where he starts explaining in great detail the exact process of how he figured something out. Is it just me or does Odo take great pleasure in rambling off a list of how many people he had to go through to discover something? This seems to become a recurring habit of his. And its great how he always investigates Quark even when its obvious that Quark had nothing to do with it

[Starbase]

Destiny is one of my favourite episodes...

Spoiler:

I love the two Cardassian scientists Ulani and Gilora their so friendly and genuine in their excitement and enthusiasm in working with the Bajorans and Federation and helping cement the newfound peace. Also through their interactions with the DS9 crew we get some more insights into Cardassian culture/society. Like how male Cardassians aren’t very technically minded which is why females dominate the sciences or that amongst cardassians overt irritation is a signal of attraction. Maybe someone should have mentioned that to Kira cause with the overt irritation she constantly displays towards Dukat its no wonder he keeps coming onto her
I just love that misunderstanding with O’Brien and Gilora. O’Brien is so cute in how freaked out he is by this woman who has up til now done nothing but argue with him or dismiss him suddenly coming onto him and accusing him of leading her on. Then when they finally figure out theres been a cultural misunderstanding he goes and inadvertently insults her. Is it bad of me to think that if Keiko weren’t around then O’Brien and Gilora would have made a cute couple? I also love that scene on the bridge of the defiant when Dejar is outed as the saboteur and a member of the obsidian order. The actresses that play Ulani and Gilora manage to be quite expressive despite the prosthetics and I love that you can see in their faces that they know immediately what has happened. In particular the look that Ulani shoots Dejar when O’Brien is blaming himself for a basic mistake that even a rookie wouldn’t have made. Its an effective contrast to Dejar who always seems so calm and controlled in everything she does that you begin to wonder if she has any thoughts and emotions of her own?

Of course the focus of the episode isn’t the Cardassian scientists but commander Sisko and Kira and its really the first time we get to see the internal conflict that both characters go through because of Sisko’s dual role as both the Bajoran emissary and a Starfleet officer. Kira wants to keep her personal and work lives separate, hiding how she really feels about Sisko and pretending that she sees him as nothing more than her commanding officer for fear of losing his respect, but finds it increasingly hard to do so as the episode progresses simply because she is a very spiritual person. Sisko is the opposite he isn’t religious or from a spiritual society and is clearly uncomfortable with being the emissary, something he has tried to ignore up til now. There is an interesting scene with Dax and Sisko in his office where he is freaking out over all the prophecies he has found concerning the emissary and Dax just asks him ‘If you never heard these prophecies what would you do?’
By the end of the episode Sisko is no longer made uncomfortable by his role as emissary and is even asking vedek Yarka for more information about Bajoran spiritual stuff which is a nice contrast to earlier in the episode where he was so determined to ignore it all.

/\/\ Well said rien /\/\ I am also a big fan of the episode Destiny - It's a credit to the writers that despite the literally hundreds of stories on TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY & ENT, they can still come up with compelling, original ideas. "Destiny" is such a story, with a very clever script and very interesting dialogue, exhibiting some effective philosophical content alongside the best of "In the Hands of the Prophets."

The episode's story structure is quite effective. As the narrative unfolds, every act culminates with some sort of unexpected surprise that makes the prophecy seem that much closer to coming true. Just when it appears Sisko is clear from any more problems, something comes up - For example, initially, there are only two Cardassians heading up the project, not three. Then there's the announcement that a third Cardassian will be joining the project. Kira's apprehension starts up, but neither she nor Sisko can see what could possibly go wrong because of this coincidence.

Then there's the appearance of a comet-is it the sword of stars? Kira's apprehension jumps up three notches. The comet has a course that puts it near the wormhole entrance, but not close enough to interfere with the project, let alone cause any disaster. Kira makes a passing remark about the prophecy within earshot of the Cardassians, prompting Sisko to request a private discussion with his first officer. The comment has no place on the bridge of the Defiant, he tells her. She agrees, but she also believes the prophecy is coming true based on the number of "coincidences." Grear stuff!.

[jelgate]

I love how the prophecy did come true but our interpertation was off.

[rien]

I like how the very last scene is vedek Yarka telling Sisko about a another prophecy where the emissary will face a fiery trial and be forced to choose...

I always wanted to hear the rest of that prophecy or wondered if it could have applied to his fight with Dukat in the fire caves since it was a fiery trial and he was forced to choose but i guess we'll never know for sure.

[nx01a]

I loved that scene, too. So open ended and open to interpretation, much like the prophecies themselves.

Now, to celebrate my triumphant return to Gateworld...

What connection does this person have with DS9? No Memory Alpha or Google, yeah!

[SaberBlade]

I loved that scene, too. So open ended and open to interpretation, much like the prophecies themselves.

Now, to celebrate my triumphant return to Gateworld...

What connection does this person have with DS9? No Memory Alpha or Google, yeah!

You shouldn't have used a screenshot with the name. Only one person In Trek I know to have the name Hana and that would be Molly O'Brien's actress.

[USS Defiant]

I love how the prophecy did come true but our interpertation was off.

that was neat, although the interpretation on the surface was off, it did leave it open enough that maybe way it did end up playing out, was the original true path.

[nx01a]

You shouldn't have used a screenshot with the name. Only one person In Trek I know to have the name Hana and that would be Molly O'Brien's actress.

I came across it and figured I'd share.

[the Fifth Race]

I am also a big fan of the episode Destiny -

Spoiler:

It's a credit to the writers that despite the literally hundreds of stories on TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY & ENT, they can still come up with compelling, original ideas. "Destiny" is such a story, with a very clever script and very interesting dialogue, exhibiting some effective philosophical content alongside the best of "In the Hands of the Prophets."

The episode's story structure is quite effective. As the narrative unfolds, every act culminates with some sort of unexpected surprise that makes the prophecy seem that much closer to coming true. Just when it appears Sisko is clear from any more problems, something comes up - For example, initially, there are only two Cardassians heading up the project, not three. Then there's the announcement that a third Cardassian will be joining the project. Kira's apprehension starts up, but neither she nor Sisko can see what could possibly go wrong because of this coincidence.

Then there's the appearance of a comet-is it the sword of stars? Kira's apprehension jumps up three notches. The comet has a course that puts it near the wormhole entrance, but not close enough to interfere with the project, let alone cause any disaster. Kira makes a passing remark about the prophecy within earshot of the Cardassians, prompting Sisko to request a private discussion with his first officer. The comment has no place on the bridge of the Defiant, he tells her. She agrees, but she also believes the prophecy is coming true based on the number of "coincidences." Great stuff!.

Well said brother Starbase - The heart of "Destiny"' is a crossing of Kira's faith and her duty. Kira reveals to Sisko her ongoing difficulty to see him as simply her commanding officer and not the religious icon he has become in Bajoran lore. At the same time, Sisko is put in the difficult position of being part of the prophecy. He's never been comfortable with the label of Emissary, and this episode is really the first to deeply look at how Sisko feels about it.

The effectiveness of Destiny practically rides on whether the conclusion can live up to the rest of it. A contrived, last-minute solution to completely disprove the prophecy could have seriously sabotaged this show. Fortunately, the writers know how to finish a good story with a good ending, and they offer a satisfying conclusion that doesn't sell the episode short in any way.

However, Sisko realizes he can't call the project off based on a retranslated prophecy that could be interpreted to mean any number of things.

[USS Defiant]

Prophet Motive isnt one of my fave episodes, i usually tend to avoid it during rewatches. I dont think its particularly bad but i dont think its particularly good either. It is interesting how the prophets devolved Zek in order to make him nicer and less materialistic. As Quark once pointed out Humans used to be a lot like the Ferengi in their materialistic society but they ‘evolved’ into a society that places little value upon material things, which makes sense when you can replicate pretty much anything, and instead of chasing after profit seek to better themselves. So its kinda amusing that Ferengi culture/society evolved the opposite way starting off as nice guys willing to help anyone and later developing into a society of greedy con-merchants willing to do anything in order to obtain profit. I like that scene at the end where Quark says he is impressed that Rom was able to embezzle money from the nagus. I was also impressed not only that Rom embezzled money from the nagus but that he told Quark about it but then Rom is a nice guy.
Also I think the guy that plays Maihar’du is one of the best things about any episode that involves the nagus. He never talks and has all that prosthetic make-up obscuring his face but he manages to convey so much. Other episodes he’s usually just there in the background but in Prophet Motive he gets to play a larger role and that must have been nice for the actor who plays him

This episode doesn't work for every reason "The House of Quark" did. In that installment, at least Quark had Grilka and the other Klingons to play off his dialogue, and at least he did something somewhat impulsive and selfless while remaining true to his character. Here, Quark is cardboardedly transparent.

[jelgate]

Isn't Quark always transparent?


I couldn't resist