Next Tuesday (208)

[wine_buyer]

Hi All

Just finished reading all of the posts and once again you all have beaten me to the punch. note to self: gotta stop having wild parties on Saturdays so I can post in good time. Anyway, here are my rambling (in no particular order) thoughts:

Helen in a wetsuit: a very good thing.
Will sticking his lower jaw out every 2 seconds a very annoying thing.
References to Titanic:a squee thing for me.
Will and Helen alternating between arguing and working together to solve a problem: one of my favorite things.
Although I would just as happily watch Helen and (insert name here) alternate between arguing and working together to solve a problem. The point being, it's about seeing the more emotional side of Helen battling with the more reserved part Helen that is ultimately more enjoyable for me, and these things usually happen when she is in a one-on-one "things are careening out of control" interaction with another character.
References to Ashley: always a good thing. You never get over the death of a loved one and seeing Ashley referenced throughout the season ads a level of realism to the show. (and probably pokes TPTB a bit)

As for the ending, I am thinking they will "hang a lantern on it" in the next episode or maybe they won't reference it at all if it's true that the eps will be shown out of order. They may just leave us to assume that the May-Day call went through.

[jelgate]

I agree. Have an episode where that focuses on Helen/Henry or Helen/Big Guy or even Helen/Kate interaction. To that extent I thought Helen had much stronger friendship with Henry and the big guy than with Will. So how come she let them go and didn't insist they were there for "next tuesday"? For that matter how come neither Henry, nor the big guy realized that Ashley's birthday is coming up and chose to go "surfing" instead of staying home and taking care of Helen if needed.
On a side note am I the only one projecting Teal'c over the big guy?

I would like one focusing on Henry and Bigfoot. Their seems to be a deep friendship between those two.

[kes]

A clip with 4 mistakes from this ep:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fmziu3JhzA

[Rocky89]

Will...wet suit...feeling faint...THUD!!!!

Yes, yes we do. Especially when he is all wet and his clothes cling to him and... *strays*

What was I saying... lol!!

To be honest, I was so-- and I mean SO focused on Helen that I kept forgetting Will was there.

I got such a Jack sparrow feel When Helen said, "Ello Beastie" It was so great me and my friend were laughing so hard.

I didn't get it until I read my posts. I've never seen PotC so I didn't know where that was from. Loved the way Helen said it though.

Fantastic... but I am mad at them for the cliffhanger.

I don't blame Helen for not wanting to be alone, although messing around with Will like that was a little beneath her. That said, she gets this mulligan given the givens. I'm sure she hoped he would figure Ashley's birthday out for himself.

Now that you pointed it out...lol! But I really liked the fact that they did put in Ashley birthday and how it was affecting Helen.

b/c i'd remained pretty spoiler free, that was a lovely thing to hear from helen. i'm VERY glad ashley hasn't been wiped out of existence in helen's heart and mind (like i've seen stargate do).

I loved that Ashley was mentioned. In a way I wanted them to talk more about her, but I Helen is so reserved--so of course she wouldn't mention the birthday before--that it probably wouldn't have been in character. And I think Will's learning not to push too much.

I don't blame Helen either, and I'm not bad either. I think it's safe to say Helen always knew she'd outlive Ashley, but she probably didn't think it'd happen so soon. She's behaving like any mother would after losing her only child, actually Helen didn't lose her, she was taken away from her. And it's natural that Helen didn't want to spent Ashley's birthday alone, and by her forcing Will to stay, means she trusts him enough to want to spent the day with. I think it's because Will also recently lost someone, so he knows how much it hurts.

And sexy when he is bad... lol!! I think she has a thing for the bad boys and John is the worst.

But i loved when they were treading water and helen makes the joke, "There is plenty of Fish in the Sea."

I was like that is so wrong... lol!! But funny!!

Yeah that joke made me smile.

I was wondering what PotC was... now I know.

I missed most of the ep, was at a very lame work Christmas party. Well, lame for me. Others had a blast. I hate loud crowds and louder music

The DVR seems to skip when I try to watch a recorded show, so I saw the 2nd showing live for the last 20 minutes. I need to remember to record the midweek show in low def. It plays better.

I'll enjoy trying to catch all the references.

suse

Ouch, sounds like you had it rough. Me, I make it my mission to stay home Friday nights and watch my show. Everyting/anything else will just have to wait.

Hee, that was a great reference.

I also liked the callback to Pavor Nocturnus with Will's 'Bring on the Hail Mary' and Helen's reaction to that.

I don't remember that, when does he say that to her?

I really liked the episode. I think I've liked all the Helen & Will episodes, actually. We learned a bit about both of them, had some adventure and I actually kind of liked the way it ended. We didn't really need to see the ultimate rescue. Good to see Helen relaxed with a friend even if by videophone--Olaf, hmm.

Favorite line: "They're both in Germany, Will." Just the way Helen/AT said it was great!

Molly Brown having saved Helen was a bit obvious, but I still liked it for the historical reference.

I loved that line too, you could tell she was trying to hide something. And despite who/what this Olaf looks like, it was good seeing her chill with a friend.

i 've always thought helen being on the titanic was a gimme

and yeah, i did wonder how come she didn't think 'let's use these nice big cables and climb out

i know climbing the cables wouldn't have been fun or easy....but when it's that or treading water until you drown????

True, they could have done that, but to quote Jack O'Neill, "Yes. But you’ve been ignoring the dramatic element of... suspense."

Wet Helen bossing around, flying a helicopter, throwing knives, and cracking jokes.... Me likes!

Hell yes, and yes to all the other things you said.

Fun episode. I loved the Helen/Will interaction. They are really good friends but there are still so many things they need to learn about each other (especially Will about Helen).

I love the call back to Ashley, and the fact that she isn't forgotten from the show.

Really enjoyed the Titanic part too. Umm.... Olaf... just.... NO.... seriously.

I'm glad we got to see a little more into their personal side, and they both have this feeling of loneliness they can't shake.

Really enjoyed the action and the give and play between Helen and Will. I had read a blurb saying that this ep showcased how friends could be at each others necks sometimes and be so dysfunctional, but still remain and even grow closer through it. I saw this, but I think I expected more. Oh don't get me wrong, there definitely was tension, but not the level I guess I was expecting.

I did love the moment when Will revealed how lonely he was since Clara's death (and the reason for the internet meet up with Sigrid). Helen's answer was very matter-of-fact (Helen: Goes with the territory I'm afraid.), but I sensed a underlying layer of her own loneliness as well. I know it's been said before here, but to live that long and to see so many people she has loved pass away... It makes me more appreciate the strength of Helen when something like this might normally make one very bitter, I believe.

Lots and lots of brilliant lines in this one too that just made me laugh.

Loved the 'ello beastie' moment when 'squidley' reared out of the water.

Will: What is it with you and flying anyway?
Helen: Two crashes in 158 years? That's not bad.
Will: They only invented flying 110 years ago so...

Will: You just blew the whole thing... It's..gone! Your crazy you know that? Your absolutely, certifiably insane.
Helen: That was pretty cool.
Will: Cool? Yeah! That was like James Bond Die Hard cool.

With this last one, I loved the smug look on Helen's face. Think that made me laugh as much as the exchange between the two.

Also, I loved the fact that even though it took such a horrible shared experience to get it out of her, sharing with Will the real reason why she didnt want him going to Iceland for the conference was very touching. Kudos for Ashely not being forgotten too.

I agree with pretty much everything you said. I'm glad Helen and Will were pushed into telling each other their motives for what they were trying to do in the ep, it gave them a chance to bond closer. and I love those lines you posted.

So Helen was on board the Titanic, and if she had to be hauled out of the water, probably not as a first class passenger, but more likely as a second class passenger. Most of the first class passengers survived without much contact with the actual water.
Atlantic water is freezing, especially the place where the Titanic went under. This water must have felt like tropic sea water in comparison. A walk in the park...

Can we have some flashbacks to the Titanic please?

I think she was 1st class. She has the money. I was thinking more like she refused to get on a boat or was helping the 3rd class passengers.

But a better question:
Was she alone?

I to think Helen was definitely when of those first class passengers, besides that she's so classy , I'd imagine she'd be rich enough to afford to be in first class with the other people. I wonder if she had company on the ship.

I'm not really surprised she was on the Titanic, I mean we see a paper about it in the opening credits, but I always thought it was to showcase the Mermaid, I never connected it to her actually being on the ship. When I look at the opening credits now, I think maybe she's one of those people being rescued in the paper-

Spoiler:

[Rocky89]

Re episode airing order :

Spoiler:

Ep 10 is Haunted and Ep 11 is Sleepers. Syfy will be airing them out of order, Sleepers first then Haunted, and ITV4 in the UK will not.

Hmm. That's cool.

Well, seeing as Helen said that she hadn't seen Olaf in decades...

Maybe she wasn't telling Will the truth about that.

I liked this episode, nice character bits. Though as much as I like the two hander episodes for their great characterisations I do wish that the show had a bigger budget so we could get a deeper look at other characters and not just Magnus & Will.

I'd like to a Helen and Henry episode.

I'm willing to fund a 20 ep Season 3 but I just need to win the lottery first
*wanders off to buy a jackpot lottery ticket*

You'd better win, and if you do, don't go off and say you didn't so you can keep the money for yourself.

As far as the Helen being saved by Molly Brown. According to wikipedia(which obviously isn't 100% reliable) Molly brown's lifeboat did go back in search of survivors. If that is the case then she could have rescued Magnus.

I also looked up Molly Brown and read the same thing, she went back to try and help those survivors. I'll never watch the movie Titanic again, I'll think of Helen every time. But I'd love to see some flashback to her on the ship.

Will: ''WHAT IS IT ABOUT ME THAT THESE THINGS SEEM TO HATE!!''

CLASSIC Will line!

Edit: Will SyFy be taking a break with this too? Or is 02x09 still airing next week?

Poor Will, it does seem like they hate him. And yes, a new episode will be on next week. I can't wait to see how they got out, talk about a cliffhanger.

http://www.syfy.com/sanctuary/index.php (Beware of spoilers)

A clip with 4 mistakes from this ep:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1fmziu3JhzA

Yeah I saw that.

[Skydiver]

sillytrivia about the titanic

i have a book that was published in 1912, and it had lists of survivors and the dead

the first cabin survivors were 3 pages, the second cabin 2, and the third class and crew 'is omitted to the impossibility of obtaining the correct names of many' ( in other words, no one knows who they were and no one really cared, they were just immigrants, poor and workers'

the list of the dead for first cabin is almost 2 pages, the second cabin, almost 3 pages....steerage and crew omitted to the same reasons as above

no one was ever officially blamed despite Bruce Ismay being heard urging for speed, despite multiple warnings of ice. there was never a general 'all hands' warning - getting into the life rafts was spread via word of mouth.

1176 or slightly more could have been saved - that was the lifeboat capacity, only 706 were. the californian was only 19 miles away but never answered the titanic's calls. if they had hundreds more might have survived

amongst the stuff lost was 3500 bags of mail and the carpathia lost 10,000 dollars in lost time and having to reprovision after her errand of mercy

it is because of htis tragedy that ALL liners MUST not only have enough life boats to go around, but also MUST have mandatory life boat drills

[Falcon Horus]

When I look at the opening credits now, I think maybe she's one of those people being rescued in the paper-

Spoiler:

http://i1005.photobucket.com/albums/...nap-225846.png

In a romantized version... maybe...but there was nothing romantic about the sinking or the dying of so many people.

May I be the one to set the record straight for all you non-believers -

Margaret Tobin Brown (aka the infamous Unsinkable Molly Brown) who was never called Molly in the first place:

From the Encyclopedia Titanica:

After the ship struck the iceberg, Margaret helped load others into lifeboats and eventually was forced to board lifeboat six. She and the other women in lifeboat six worked together to row, keep spirits up, and dispel the gloom that was broadcast by the emotional and unstable Robert Hichens.

So in short - no, the part where Helen says being hauled aboard a liferaft by Molly Brown is pure and utter fiction. And thus I can take this as fiction just the way Jack and Tesla have been used as reference characters and twisted to be used for the purpose of the show, retaining their historical value but still fit within the storyline.


Sidenote: Did I mention that I'm a Titanic-geek?

[jckfan55]

Re: Titanic--I don't care about the historical correctness of the Molly Brown rescue. This isn't a docudrama.
What I did like was that it clearly is still something painful for Helen to remember. TPTB didn't try to make it some big adventure.

Re: Helen not wanting Will to leave for Ashley's birthday but letting the others go. Knowing Magnus and the others, they probably thought they'd give her some space. And she wouldn't have been able to say "I want you around b/c I'm having a hard time."
Will, on the other hand, imho, she could order to stay and wouldn't have to admit why.Being in control emotionally is very important to her.



Re: 2 person episodes/stand alones--I like stand alone episodes in the mix. And I don't mind a couple of Magnus/Will eps (even though Will isn't my favorite character--though I tend to like him better with Helen). I liked that having them trapped meant we got some time to reveal a few things about Helen. Not a lot of time for that in most monster hunts.
But I agree with those who say it would be nice to have Helen & Henry have more time together. Though I don't know if Henry would challenge Magnus the way Will seems willing to.
just my 2 cents

[wine_buyer]

When I look at the opening credits now, I think maybe she's one of those people being rescued in the paper-

Spoiler:

http://i1005.photobucket.com/albums/...nap-225846.png

Possible Titanic scenario. Keeping in mind that this is a compromise in regards to historical fact (but then most of Sanctuary is a compromise in regards to historical fact ).

If you look at the picture you can see a mermaids tail. A couple of possibilities arise.

1. Helen was on the Titanic to pick up a Mermaid (perhaps the one at the Sanctuary now) and as a result was not necessarily in first class but some other location on the ship. The ship sinks. The mermaid, being a very good and very fast swimmer, rescues Helen and swimming very quickly, catches up with Molly Brown's lifeboat and then Molly pulls Helen out of the water.

2. Or perhaps Helen was in 1st class but missed her chance at the lifeboats (probably too busy helping others) and ends up in the water. The mermaid who seems to have some sort of psychic or telepathic abilities in her communications with humans realizes that Helen should be saved and does so as described above.

It's the only way I can reconcile history with what Helen said in this ep and she does have a mermaid. So maybe?

[Skydiver]

I think that there's no way for there to have been corroboration of helen's story. The names of survivors is relatively well known (although, if you saw the movie Titanic, it really was that easy to become someone else, photo id's didn't even exist, and i don't think social security numbers did either, you were who you said you were)

I do kinda think that it is an example of the name dropping going a bit too far. Helen could have just said 'i was one of very few that came out of the water...alive' and leave molly out of it.

or have her say it, and will go 'wait a minute, i saw the movie and...' and she interrupts 'changing your identity was frightfully easy back then' and it's over

One thing that does tweak me a bit, the more i think about it, in Eulogy, helen is chafing because big guy is 'guarding' her,

HELEN
Stop doting on me. It makes my teeth itch.

BIGGIE
Mine too. Now, eat.

would she REALLY want will around? or would she want to sulk on her own? I'd almost see her wanting to push him away and get him out of town rather than keeping him close.

I know it works for the story, it just doesn't seem to work with how helen has been in the past

[Skydiver]

or...history is often written the way people WANT it to be written. so if helen was 'saved' by some 'angel of the deep' the traumatized and shocked members of the boat could have been sworn to secrecy. as long as they all told the same story, whatever the told became the 'truth'

[wine_buyer]

or...history is often written the way people WANT it to be written. so if helen was 'saved' by some 'angel of the deep' the traumatized and shocked members of the boat could have been sworn to secrecy. as long as they all told the same story, whatever the told became the 'truth'

Or they may not have seen the 'angel of the deep'. It was very dark and the mermaid could have swam with Helen up to a point and then let Helen swim a short distance to the boat by herself. As for the mermaid ending up at the Sanctuary, Helen could have gone back for her at another time thus negating any need for anyone else to see the mermaid. I'm suddenly struck by how I am trying to make sense of history (Helen's not the Titanic's ) that hasn't actually happened in reality. I gotta get out more.

[Skydiver]

or it could have been some other sort of abnormal. the rest of the mer folk live in the bermuda triangle - or did before Requiem

i can't imagine many creatures liking the frigid waters of the north atlantic

but IF she was ferrying an abnormal, anything could have helped her. not to mention her own longevity giving her a heads up in surviving hypothermia. In water that cold, you freeze to death and die in less than half an hour, possibly as little as 15 minutes

[Eternal Density]

Fun episode, and very good CGI work!

the part where Helen says being hauled aboard a liferaft by Molly Brown is pure and utter fiction.

And the part where Helen actually exists. But I see that your point is that anyone saying they were 'hauled aboard a liferaft by Molly Brown' would be pure and utter fiction, regardless of whether they'd been injected with vampire blood.

[wine_buyer]

or it could have been some other sort of abnormal. the rest of the mer folk live in the bermuda triangle - or did before Requiem

i can't imagine many creatures liking the frigid waters of the north atlantic

but IF she was ferrying an abnormal, anything could have helped her. not to mention her own longevity giving her a heads up in surviving hypothermia. In water that cold, you freeze to death and die in less than half an hour, possibly as little as 15 minutes

Very good point. If that is a mermaids tale in the Titanic drawing then they have a little continuity issue going on unless the mer folk can live in any climate but prefer warmer ones.