Restructuring Sanctuary Folder - Open Discussion

[Skydiver]

I do think the one thing that comment has to do with the restructuring is that it goes to the underlying tension that's in this folder. People that do or don't speak up. People that blindly support others, people that blindly go against others.

some of this can go into the tensions and issues behind why the folder is organized the way it is.

those that post news seem to be frustrated with an abundance of gushing. Those that just want to gush seem to feel put down or cut off by those that don't. Some seem afraid to speak up and discuss because of the air of 'thou must not go against the group think'.

No folder is perfect. And they all have their own 'flavor' so to speak. Some here seem to feel that a few are dictating how everything is to be placed for the many.

Is that accurate? Is there a 'many' that want things to change? (And if so, how so)
or is it just a few that don't like things and the 'many' are fine with how things are?

That's what we're aiming for.

I know Sally brought it up first, but she's not the first to express concerns about things in this folder. Do those that have concerns have feelings that a majority share? Or is it just a handful of people speaking out that just represent a handful?

maybe what we need to do is just have a poll.....do you want the sanctuary folder restructured? and then go from there.

[majorsal]

the poll sounds like a good idea.

[ann_sgcfan]

Poll sounds great.

[RealmOfX]

Can the people who are having problems finding threads explain how it is a problem please?

This is a very small forum and I don't understand why anyone would be having difficulty but that may only be because I have to be very organised to access the forum due to my visual impairment and so I use my control panel and subscribe to threads and use folders a lot.

I guess that also raises the question of should we even be considering altering the structure of the forum with sub folders when we all have the ability to tailor how we see the forum through the control panel.

[Skydiver]

One thing to interject, not everyone views the forum through subscribed threads and their control panel. Many of them, me for example, just view threads. we don't subscribe or anything like that.

The only reason I view my control panel is to check on visitor messages and PM's.

[fems]

I received this from a person that didn't want to post under their name.

Gee, how old are we and how more anonymous can you get on an internet forum? I have to agree with the others that I don't really see how this has anything to do with the restructuring of the forum.

You don't have to read all the threads if you don't like something and you can ignore posts you don't like. Or you can react to them and (politely) say they have lost their perspective and are way OTT. It's a forum, it exists so people can share their views and discuss things.

Personally I haven't really seen that much hostility around here... then again, some people have certainly proven they are very sensitive and will take every comment they view as bad as a personal insult. So what? That's life; some people don't give a crap about what others think, others are very open-minded, some love a debate, others don't mind debating but will hold on to their own opinion, there are those who put their fave person/actor/actress on a pedestal and woe betide the one who badmouths them and there's a small percentage that will cry themselves to sleep in a fetal position in their bed at night because someone was mean to them today. And there are probably people in between. Live and let live, people.

If you disagree with someone you can say so, no one's going to wait for you at the gates after school to beat the crap out of you because you voiced an opinion. By sharing views you can get a totally different experience from some of the show/actors and even if you don't feel that way, you can always politely agree to disagree. You don't want people to attack you for your opinion, so respect someone else's opinion too. Everyone's entitled to their own opinion. If you want to discuss something or disagree with someone you can share your arguments in a polite manner, without superfluous use of exclamation marks and without attacking the person themselves. If you think they are delusional, you can say that to your computer screen but you don't actually have to post it. Just because you think someone has an awful opinion, it's still their opinion to keep. A good discussion doesn't include personal attacks, as a matter of fact they only make it look like you don't have any real arguments and have to resort to 'dirty tricks'.

Thunk threads are there to gush over the characters and the title implies it, so if you don't want to gush, you have to enter at your own risk. Shipping threads are there for people's favorite pairings, love triangles, love rectangles, love pentagons and love hexagons, no matter how delusional you personally think people are for even suggesting such a shipping.

You can mention the possible suggestion of shipping in the episodes threads without going overboard and then start posting like a maniac in your favorite shipping thread without bothering the non-shippers. If you don't ship, don't go near the threads and just laugh/cry every time you see the thread pop up.

Can the people who are having problems finding threads explain how it is a problem please?

This is a very small forum and I don't understand why anyone would be having difficulty but that may only be because I have to be very organised to access the forum due to my visual impairment and so I use my control panel and subscribe to threads and use folders a lot.

I guess that also raises the question of should we even be considering altering the structure of the forum with sub folders when we all have the ability to tailor how we see the forum through the control panel.

I have lots of threads I subscribe to but the confusing thing is that there are several threads (here) that post the same information, yet you can only discuss in some of those threads. By having more than one thread for announcements, spoilers and discussions you can lose track of where something was posted when you want to discuss it in one of the several discussion threads. So you'll have to go back and check the several threads again to find the post you were looking for, check whether or not you may post there and if not you have to find the appropriate discussion again.

[Skydiver]

I do see cross posting 18 ways from sunday. It's calmed down a bit, but for a while there seemed to be a contest 'who can post news first' with some even getting upset if they weren't first. And then a person putting something in 5 different threads, but yes, you can only reply in certain ones. Hence the modding for us to have to delete or move posts from the 'wrong' threads.

Its organized to the point that it's stifling.

On the other hand, I totally see the need for some organization. I think, to me, the level of control and ownership and 'must be my way' can be just as off putting as anything else.

[RealmOfX]

So there are several different issues here, rather than one "should we restructure the forum" question. Why not make it simple and deal with each smaller issue? Break it up in manageable chunks like :

People putting the same thing in multiple threads is an issue for the mods and easily dealt with.

JanSam proposed a simple solution for the two split announcement/discussion threads, is there any reason why it wouldn't suit people on both sides of the argument? People that only want to read the news/spoilers can do so and people that want to discuss a post can be in the right thread and with the post quoted in 2 easy clicks.

As for having more than one news type thread, I think that might have been a hangover from the Stargate forum structure. Is there a reason to have them separate? We certainly do not have the same volume of posts as the Stargate forum, so probably not.

Some people would like sub folders for the forum

etc

[RealmOfX]

The one area of all this discussion that I'm really interested in is with the two split announcement/discussion threads. I'm still 100% for keeping that arrangement for two reasons, one is simply a personal preference to just read or post the news or spoilers without having to wade through a lot of other posts.

The other is that I'm visually impaired now and so I can't just skim through threads like I used to nor does my screen reader, which I often use, make it an enjoyable experience to have people on my ignore list (especially if they post a lot).

Out of the solutions proposed so far JanSam's suits me best and I think it is workable for both camps, but I'm totally biased here so is there anything about that proposal that is not workable for those that want the threads merged? And can we make a workaround for any raised problem?

[JanSam]

I have lots of threads I subscribe to but the confusing thing is that there are several threads (here) that post the same information, yet you can only discuss in some of those threads. By having more than one thread for announcements, spoilers and discussions you can lose track of where something was posted when you want to discuss it in one of the several discussion threads. So you'll have to go back and check the several threads again to find the post you were looking for, check whether or not you may post there and if not you have to find the appropriate discussion again.

I also use the subscription option; but the problem is once you have looked at that thread it is no longer under the My Controls until another post is added to the thread. So if I look at the discussion thread before the announcements thread.....no easy link available.

I do see cross posting 18 ways from sunday. It's calmed down a bit, but for a while there seemed to be a contest 'who can post news first' with some even getting upset if they weren't first. And then a person putting something in 5 different threads, but yes, you can only reply in certain ones.

Its organized to the point that it's stifling.

Yes THIS. I'm ok with the discussion and announcements being broken up but I'd be in favor of not separating more than that. I do find the posting the same information in several threads annoying.

The one area of all this discussion that I'm really interested in is with the two split announcement/discussion threads. I'm still 100% for keeping that arrangement for two reasons, one is simply a personal preference to just read or post the news or spoilers without having to wade through a lot of other posts.

The other is that I'm visually impaired now and so I can't just skim through threads like I used to nor does my screen reader, which I often use, make it an enjoyable experience to have people on my ignore list (especially if they post a lot).

Out of the solutions proposed so far JanSam's suits me best and I think it is workable for both camps, but I'm totally biased here so is there anything about that proposal that is not workable for those that want the threads merged? And can we make a workaround for any raised problem?

Rox, I honestly didn't know you could use the multiquote and then go to another thread so thanks for that info. And I'll admit some it is laziness and sometimes I'm just short on time so the linking to discussions would be awesome to me .

I can think of one other option {raises personal shield because I know RoX's organized mind won't like it} do away with the announcement thread totally and just post each new item separately. Since each new item would be the subject heading for the thread it should be easy to find new information and the discussion about it would be contained under the announcement in the same thread.

[Skydiver]

There are a lot of things to consider.

We have rox and her limitations on browsing that we should consider. And I'd say this about anyone. We can't accommodate every single persons wishes, however I do think we at least be aware.

Second we bear in mind the mix if organized vs enthusiastic. ( please bear with me, I'm typing not on a computer so punctuation is a bit rocky)

Third we bear in mind different users in different countries that get the show days, weeks, months apart so we remain conscious of spoilers.

What if we have a season four folder. We have one news and announcements thread, then a general pre airing thread for general spoilers. Then a specific pre airing for each episode. Te general pre airing thread is spoiler tagged, the episode specific ones and announcement are spoiler tag free zones.

Perhaps I talk to darren to put the character stuff in a folder of it's own to reduce the clutter.

We try to find a way to coexist and accommodate as many as possible. Keeping some order but not so regimented and regulated.

Ideas?

[ann_sgcfan]

We try to find a way to coexist and accommodate as many as possible. Keeping some order but not so regimented and regulated.

Great idea, because right now it's too regulated. I have to giggle that the one place (a forum) people should be allowed to go and chit chat about whatever aspect they want too is so regimented that there are more don'ts than dos. I follow two other shows on different sites and I can read news/ read others opinion/ and consider a reply in far less time than it takes here.

Season 4 folder sounds great. I don't know about the individual episode spoiler threads, that might be too many folders and may spread the people out too thin. The last couple of days I've noticed an average of 35 visitors to the sanctuary part of the forum. I would think narrowing down the number of threads and group more people together would help get discussions going. Granted with people watching different seasons it may be a bit tricky, but it might be doable.

Most news are spoilers. Maybe allow the season 4 folder with (1) The only News thread and (1) Discussion thread spoilers don't have to be in a spoiler tag. This at least groups them together.

In other words
Episode Folder - like we have now unlocked as the episode is released. - NO spoiler tags needed unless it's a future episode.
Season 4 folder - With the only News Thread and a Discussion thread - NO spoiler tags needed.
General folder - (1) discussion thread (can include anything not considered a spoiler - pics/tweets/any season discussion/chit chat- including actor appearances), (#) character/ship threads, (#) game threads, (1) fan fiction thread - YES spoilers tags needed.
Again I think for discussion purposes you try to group people together.

Those that don't want spoilers for season 4 - do you read the news sections? What part of the forum do you frequent the most?

[ann_sgcfan]

3 MOST VIEWED THREADS
Sanctuary Discussion (spoilers for the most recent episode) 429,164 views

Nikola Tesla/ Jonathon Young Thunk/ Discussion/ Appreciation 371,569

Sanctuary – Reviews & Articles # Announcements ONLY# Spoilers s1-4 168,534


3 MOST REPLIED THREADS

Nikola Tesla/ Jonathon Young Thunk/ Discussion/ Appreciation 20,871

Sanctuary Discussion (spoilers for the most recent episode) 13,392

Nikola Tesla/ Helen Magnus Shipper Thread 12,602


SEASON SPECIFIC THREADS

Season 4 Spoiler Discussion Thread has 12,032 views and only 308 replies (last post Sept 14, 2011)

Season 4 spoilers ##Announcements ONLY## 7,137 views and 60 replies

Season Four Sneak Peak 243 Views and 3 Replies


Season 3 spoiler Discussion Thread has 35,050 views and 930 replies (last post August 2, 2011)

Season 3 spoilers announcement only thread 23,704 view and 173 replies (last post June 14, 2011)

Season 3 rumors, speculation and pondering thread has 11,410 views and only 207 replies. (last post Aug. 29, 2010)

Season 2 spoiler thread has 36,341 views and 831 replies (last post January 18, 2010)

Season 2 Hopes/Fears/ Predictions !! Contains spoilers for s1 and s2 had 25,307 views and 405 replies. (last post January 9, 2010)


It appears people use the general discussion thread more than any other thread (except for Tesla fans ), which requires you to use spoilers. MAYBE you just have the one discussion thread and use spoiler tags. You have one announcement/news/tweets all grouped together thread. And you put them in their own folder together eliminating the hide & seek factor and you bring some of those 35 visitors to the same area of the forum to you know promote discussions. LOL Tesla fans don't seem to be having any problems with discussions, and they only have two threads. It seems to be working for them.

[RealmOfX]

I also use the subscription option; but the problem is once you have looked at that thread it is no longer under the My Controls until another post is added to the thread. So if I look at the discussion thread before the announcements thread.....no easy link available.

If you set up folders you can always find them whether there are new posts or not. *checks my control panel* I have 5 folders and that lets me get to any thread I want quickly.

Yes THIS. I'm ok with the discussion and announcements being broken up but I'd be in favor of not separating more than that. I do find the posting the same information in several threads annoying.

Well we're not supposed to make duplicate posts so isn't that a moderation issue?

Rox, I honestly didn't know you could use the multiquote and then go to another thread so thanks for that info. And I'll admit some it is laziness and sometimes I'm just short on time so the linking to discussions would be awesome to me .

Yeah, I used to use it a fair bit. There are only a few people that post news and/or spoilers regularly so it shouldn't be too hard to get us to add a link to the discussion threads. Also if this is the method we choose to adopt is there really any need to make other folders etc because the problem of easy access for discussion is solved.

I can think of one other option {raises personal shield because I know RoX's organized mind won't like it} do away with the announcement thread totally and just post each new item separately. Since each new item would be the subject heading for the thread it should be easy to find new information and the discussion about it would be contained under the announcement in the same thread.

Actually that one wouldn't bother me too much but I can see it really annoying other people because the News type threads would be flooding the forum.

[planet_tv]

I do like the idea of the of the Characters & Relationships folder that has been suggested. I think if a folder like that and, for example, the folder I suggested happened then you could better look at what's left to see how many remaining threads there are and if more need to put in a folder of their own like a general discussion folder or whatever would be needed.

As for the announcement threads I like them they way they are only for the fact that there are a minimal amount to subscribe to and I do agree with the suggestion to put a note mentioning that the news as always is to be discussed in such and such thread. What about limiting the note per page so that maybe 50%, every other post, of the posts per page, assuming that 20 is the default, have the note. If 20 is the default then 10 posts would have the note and if some, for example, have it set to 40 then there would be 20 posts with the note or 100 there would 50 posts per page with the note. If it's better to have it with each post that's fine but I would suggest the note be a generic note, like for example, The news is always to be discussed in [insert thread(s) name with link(s)], If you wish to discuss this please do so in [insert thread(s) name with link(s)] or something similar. That way the note can just be copied and pasted.