The Unicorn and the Wasp (3007/407)

[SGalisa]

What made me roll my eyes bit was again the reference to the Doctor and Donna being an odd couple. :rolls eyes: What is this constant "we are not a couple thing" - I think it is supposed to be a running joke but it is annoying.

And the seemingly mandatory "we're not a couple" scenes have to stop. Now.

I heard a theory that it is secretly one of the arc words

It better not be. If Donna falls for the Doctor I will be very disappointed. First Rose than Martha, Dr Who is sci-fi, not a damn soap opera.

The Kiss-Why can't RTD leave shipping out of one flipping season? I definitely am looking forward to a new writer. I don't mind romance, but three in three years: ick. I realize that Donna and the Doctor aren't quite at the same level as Rose or Martha, but I don't want to see it go there. Can the man just be friends with anyone of the opposite sex?

(this is just an observation from 40 plus years of DOCTOR WHO, in its *entirety* out there -- we're in a new decade with less *restrictions* on filming morals, so I think --maybe moreso with the newer DW viewers-- the audiences will have to get used to this, or just don't watch. It's that simple -- and below is the reasoning behind the *why*..)

I've been a rather *dedicated* viewer to DOCTOR WHO now for about 25 years. I've seen all of the available eps ever shown in the USA. So, I'm going to state this from a CLASSIC DW perspective--

All those years the Doctor ran around the universe in the TARDIS with his *CLASSIC* episode companions, we always wondered if any "hanky-panky" ever went on during those flights of fancy.. I mean, it was never shown, yet possibly implied DEEP between the lines. We've seen the TARDIS with an in-ground, possibly *heated* swimming pool -- during the Leela eps (Sontarans vs the Time Lords in "The Invasion of TIME" episode).

ahem! and considering the super skimpy outfit that the DW designers poured Leela into, NO hanky-panky ever went on at all between her and the Doctor..?? (He may be a Time Lord, but he's still a guy! As much as I believe even the most romantically eternal vampire still has *feelings,* I also believe that is true with the Doctor or *any* of the other Time Lords.

When the 8th Doctor actually got kissed by someone, we *knew* it might be the ultimate turning point for the entire series. More of that was going to become expected, much to our chargrin for even considering going down *that* particular path, or likings or protesting.


When Doctor # 9 showed up with Rose, the romantic level was certainly going to be a new thing for the DOCTOR -- for *CLASSIC* whovian viewers, at least TPTB are showing more "realism" in their stories than the LACK thereof.. One main reason why I think TORCHWOOD was created, was to APPEASE any of those "sex-starved" viewers to satiate their minds with the obvious that was forever *thought* was a built-in TABOO in the regular DW series (not spin-offs), and it probably *was* a TABOO, because of decisions made years prior to avoid that route for as long as possible.

Unfortunately, the outcry became sooooooooooooo overwhelming, that TORCHWOOD became produced to keep the lusting viewers get their overfill of such experiences. Are they necessary? of course not. Is this going to end up being the trend? Only TIME can tell that.

I don't think TPTB will be able to keep BOTH sides of the fence happy no matter what they decide to ultimately do or keep on doing. *sigh*

--------------------

..anyway, I thought the *detox* scene was utterly hilarious! I enjoyed // loved reading about it before I saw it-- and when I saw it, it was fairly close to what I imagined the interaction between everyone involved, especially the Doctor..

Special mention to:

Spoiler:

DOCTOR
Donna...

DONNA
Okay, we could split the copyright.

DOCTOR
No. Something's inhibiting my enzymes. ARGH! (in agony) I've been poisoned!

DONNA
What do we do? What do we do?!

She crouches beside the Doctor, trying to find a way to help, while Agatha smells his drink.
AGATHA
Bitter almonds! It's cyanide! Sparkling cyanide!

The Doctor runs out of the room, stumbling. Donna and Agatha follow him.

***
They burst into the kitchen. The Doctor staggers to Davenport and grabs him.

DOCTOR
Ginger beer!

DAVENPORT (offended)I beg your pardon?

DOCTOR
I need ginger beer!

He struggles to a the kitchen shelf, sweeping off stuff while he searches for ginger beer.
MRS HART
The gentleman's gone mad!

The Doctor founds the bottle and drinks of it, then pours the rest on his head.
AGATHA
I'm an expert in poisons, Doctor. There's no cure! It's fatal!

He spits out the rest of the ginger beer.
DOCTOR
Not for me! I can stimulate the inhibited enzymes into reversal... Protein! I need protein!

He leans on the worktop, panting in agony, while Donna and Agatha search the kitchen supplies.
DONNA
Walnuts?

DOCTOR
Brilliant!

She hands him a jar of walnuts and he gobbles it down. Mouth full, he can only gesture to Donna, shaking his hand up and down.
DONNA
I can't understand you! How many words?

He shows up one finger.
DONNA
One! One word!

He keeps shaking his hand while Donna is guessing what he means.
DONNA
Shake, milk shake, milk? Milk? No, not milk? Hm, shake shake shake... Cocktail shaker! What do you want, a Harvey Wallbanger?

He finally manages to swallow the walnuts.
DOCTOR
Harvey Wallbanger?!

DONNA
Well, I don't know!

DOCTOR
How is Harvey Wallbanger one word?!

AGATHA
What do you need, Doctor?!

DOCTOR
Salt, I was miming salt! Salt! I need something salty!

DONNA
What about this?

She shows him a brown bag.
DOCTOR
What is it?

DONNA
Salt!

DOCTOR
That's too salty!

DONNA
Oh, that's too salty!

Agatha hands him a jar.
AGATHA
What about this?!

He opens the jar and gobbles the contents.
DONNA
What's that?

AGATHA
Anchovies!

The Doctor gestures again.
DONNA
What is it? What else? It's a song? Mammy? I don't know, Camptown Races?

DOCTOR
Camptown Races?

DONNA
All right then, Towering Inferno!

DOCTOR
It's a shock! Look! Shock! I need a shock!

DONNA
Right then. Big shock, coming up!

She grabs him and kisses him. She lets him go, and the Doctor breathes out a cloud of grey smoke. Donna, Agatha and the kitchen staff stare at him, shocked.
DOCTOR
Detox! (he wipes his mouth) I must do that more often!

Donna gives him a nasty look.
DOCTOR
I mean, the, the detox.

AGATHA (in disbelief)
Doctor, you are impossible! Who are you?

I have been loving the way Donna hasn't fallen hopelessly in love with him like everyone else seems to, but when I saw this....hopefully they don't take it any further. I'm sure she could have found some other way to give him a shock.

Possibly, but I doubt if electricuting the Doctor would have had AS MUCH of an impact (or been as *humorously* taken) with those viewers who *believe* there is something romantic between Donna and the Doctor. Afterall, she did say she'd like to see HIM (the Doctor) try what Jenny did in the last ep, so it was more expected that might be the route Donna *might* take, than zapping the Doctor into a live electrical circuit.

Plus, I think it made the scene more complicated for the Doctor with Donna kissing him, and then hearing the awkward moment in his voice, for excusing thoughts he's tried to keep quiet about for eons of time..

[Alipeeps]

The Kiss-Why can't RTD leave shipping out of one flipping season? I definitely am looking forward to a new writer. I don't mind romance, but three in three years: ick. I realize that Donna and the Doctor aren't quite at the same level as Rose or Martha, but I don't want to see it go there. Can the man just be friends with anyone of the opposite sex?

I totally agree, it got old real fast. I have been loving the way Donna hasn't fallen hopelessly in love with him like everyone else seems to, but when I saw this....hopefully they don't take it any further. I'm sure she could have found some other way to give him a shock.

But there wasn't any shipping. The kiss was specifically to shock him (and what else could she have done, in the limited time available?) and the fact that it DID shock him is evidence enough that he hadn't been thinking about Donna in such a way. And she is still adamant that she is not remotely interested in him in that way. A kiss doesn't always instantly mean shippiness or that the characters are falling for each other. It was meant to be funny (kinda like Jackie grabbing hold of the Doctor and kissing him (and he trying to squirm free) at the beginning of Army of Ghosts) and it kinda was.

[MasySyma]

But there wasn't any shipping. The kiss was specifically to shock him (and what else could she have done, in the limited time available?) and the fact that it DID shock him is evidence enough that he hadn't been thinking about Donna in such a way. And she is still adamant that she is not remotely interested in him in that way. A kiss doesn't always instantly mean shippiness or that the characters are falling for each other. It was meant to be funny (kinda like Jackie grabbing hold of the Doctor and kissing him (and he trying to squirm free) at the beginning of Army of Ghosts) and it kinda was.

I agree with you about two of the above points: 1. The kiss in Army of Ghosts was funny, and 2. The Doctor was shocked by the kiss in The Unicorn and the Wasp.

However,

The look on Donna's face could imply that the kiss planted a seed in her head. It was also the type of kiss that was problematic. The kiss in Army of Ghosts is cute because it is the type of kiss relatives give to trapped and struggling nephews and nieces world wide. We can all relate. Donna didn't give him that kind of kiss. She chose a longer, more intimate kiss. A quick touch on the lips would have floored the guy, but she gave him the same type of kiss that he gave Martha last year. Last year, it meant Martha fell for the Doctor. Donna could have headbutted him; smacked him, which he is always surprised by; or chosen another blow to a body part. Instead, she chose a kiss.

I would also agree that sometimes a kiss is just a kiss, but Donna has also made remarks about staying with the Doctor forever, similar to Rose. Then, she like Rose or Martha may be starting to fall for the Doctor.

I'll admit that many of us may be reading to much into the scene, but I, for one, don't trust RTD anymore where the Doctor's love life is concerned. That timelord has kissed nearly every woman in the Tardis since the New Series began.

Now, if I were in the Tardis, I would want the tradition to continue, but the companion/Doctor love is getting a bit old from a viewing standpoint.

[ShadowMaat]

I'm not worried about Donna falling for the Doctor, necessarily, but I don't see why nearly every Companion seems to be contractually required to kiss the Doctor. Rose, Jack, Martha, Donna, and at least one other, too, coming up at some point in the unseen future. I just don't think it's necessary.

[P-90_177]

I'm not worried about Donna falling for the Doctor, necessarily, but I don't see why nearly every Companion seems to be contractually required to kiss the Doctor. Rose, Jack, Martha, Donna, and at least one other, too, coming up at some point in the unseen future. I just don't think it's necessary.

I think it's just the 10th doctor at the moment. When he regenerates that may be put to a close. lol.

[ShadowMaat]

Rose and Jack both kissed Nine.

[Tracker]

Rose and Jack both kissed Nine.

Actually, if Jack didn't kiss the Doctor (no matter what regen) I'd be worried about him. I mean, this is the guy for whom saying "Hello" is a pick-up line.

[ShadowMaat]

I think Jack is the only one who's kissed the Doctor just to kiss him. Rose got kissed to suck out the time vortex, Martha got kissed for the DNA thing and Donna kissed him to give him a shock.

[P-90_177]

I think Jack is the only one who's kissed the Doctor just to kiss him. Rose got kissed to suck out the time vortex, Martha got kissed for the DNA thing and Donna kissed him to give him a shock.

Well don't forget astrid (granted she was only in one episode) She kissed him just to kiss him......

[ShadowMaat]

But technically she never made it to Companion status. She might have if she'd lived, but she didn't.

[Alipeeps]

I agree with you about two of the above points: 1. The kiss in Army of Ghosts was funny, and 2. The Doctor was shocked by the kiss in The Unicorn and the Wasp.

However,

The look on Donna's face could imply that the kiss planted a seed in her head. It was also the type of kiss that was problematic. The kiss in Army of Ghosts is cute because it is the type of kiss relatives give to trapped and struggling nephews and nieces world wide. We can all relate. Donna didn't give him that kind of kiss. She chose a longer, more intimate kiss. A quick touch on the lips would have floored the guy, but she gave him the same type of kiss that he gave Martha last year. Last year, it meant Martha fell for the Doctor. Donna could have headbutted him; smacked him, which he is always surprised by; or chosen another blow to a body part. Instead, she chose a kiss.

I would also agree that sometimes a kiss is just a kiss, but Donna has also made remarks about staying with the Doctor forever, similar to Rose. Then, she like Rose or Martha may be starting to fall for the Doctor.

I'll admit that many of us may be reading to much into the scene, but I, for one, don't trust RTD anymore where the Doctor's love life is concerned. That timelord has kissed nearly every woman in the Tardis since the New Series began.

Now, if I were in the Tardis, I would want the tradition to continue, but the companion/Doctor love is getting a bit old from a viewing standpoint.

Well maybe I'm viewing things with the benefit of hindsight, from having seen up to episode 10 now and still no sign of Donna/Doctor shippiness. RTD, DT and CT have been adamant since before the season aired that Donna wasn't going to be interested in the Doctor in that way and that's not the kind of vibe they're going for and the show has been true to that so far.

I'm not worried about Donna falling for the Doctor, necessarily, but I don't see why nearly every Companion seems to be contractually required to kiss the Doctor. Rose, Jack, Martha, Donna, and at least one other, too, coming up at some point in the unseen future. I just don't think it's necessary.

Hey, gotta give the DT fangirls *something* to squeee and fantasize about!

[nx01a]

The kiss was problematic because of the look of not-quite-shock on HER face afterwards, as well as her conversation with Dame Agatha about how there's always someone else, about how she lost her almost-husband but then she found the Doctor... It all had me a bit scared. Luckily, those fears have been laid to rest

Spoiler:

by events in the 2 parter

.

[gateship15]

that kiss was fantastic and the effects were awsome

[GusF]

^Also, the episode was written with the approval and agreement of the Christie family and her estate etc - so the writers were hardly gonna trash her character, were they?

True but they put her on too high a pedestal for my liking. I mean, she's hardly Shakespeare, is she? If I was writing this episode, I'd have tried to get a good feel for her as a person (meaning both the good and the bad) rather than going about it completely uncritically like a fanboy. The series' portrayals of Dickens and Queen Victoria were far better in my opinion for this very reason, particularly the former. Unlike her, they actually seemed to be real people. And Gareth Roberts himself did a much better job of humanising Shakespeare.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to bash Agatha Christie herself. My problem is with this episode's treatment of her. She was undoubtedly a talented writer but, that said, I could name a good 20 or 30 other writers from Britain alone whom I would consider better than her.

[gateship15]

i kind of agree they should have kept her more human in this episode. but i have never read her book or any other books or shows about her books to know what the fuss is about