The Covid19 thread

[Gatefan1976]

Can you put your conspiracy theories away please SG?

[Skydiver]

I think the one thing slowing me down from all this purchase in the app stuff is....well their app gets hacked or their corporate database gets compromised and my data stolen, their mistake becomes my mess to clean up. Yeah, legally I may have only so much liability, but I still have to make the phone calls and cancel cards and all that..

If companies want me to totally trust their apps and give them my credit card number then there needs to be some responsibility from them for having my data. I need to know I’ll get more than a year’s free credit monitoring or some other such token.

In today’s ‘business friendly’ environment, consumers are treated like disposable resources, and the same with our data. They love to collect it, use it, sell it, the same with our payment info....well they need to be responsible for it and be held accountable for what they do with it.

That happens I will embrace paying in apps, until then I’ll stay old fashioned where I have at least a little bit of control.

[Annoyed]

I think the one thing slowing me down from all this purchase in the app stuff is....well their app gets hacked or their corporate database gets compromised and my data stolen, their mistake becomes my mess to clean up. Yeah, legally I may have only so much liability, but I still have to make the phone calls and cancel cards and all that..

That whole identity theft thing is back asswards.

Suppose you're running a little store that you sell widgets from.
Now, I come in and ask to buy 35 widgets, but I'll pay for them next week. (credit).
At the very least, you are going to exercise due diligence; verify my identity, photo ID at the counter, etc. If some other yutz walks into your store and tries to verify with my picture, etc, you're going to bounce the guy so hard he lands twice. If you don't do your due diligence and don't check ID, whose fault is that? It's certainly not mine, as I was not there, making the transaction.

In a real world transaction, that's on the merchant.
But in the world of online, if some crook presents an innocent person's card fraudulently, the innocent person is on the hood because the merchant failed to perform due diligence and verify ID properly.

Kinda backwards with that.

[Skydiver]

Most places do not verify identity. I want to buy groceries, I check out and swipe a card.....may or may not even be mine.

ANd when we’re talking about databases behind accessed, my credit info can be stolen and used and I wouldn’t even know about it. Retailers in apps are not - as far as I know - accountable for the security of the info they’re gathering. They may not even have to tell me that my data’s been accessed or compromised.

But, for me even beyond that, let’s say in app pay is secure and safe....I don’t know if I’ll use it because I’ve been in one too many places where I see the online/app orders made and sitting there....for many to several minutes, one time I saw it sit there for over 15 minutes until someone picked it up. Unless there was a salad in there I would have been a pit peeved to shell out the money for take out only to get old and cold food.

Now my quirks aside, what about the homeless? Or kids? Or rural areas with limited cell service? I’ve been driving on the interstate and hit areas with no data. The rural US - which is about 80% of it, may or may not have good coverage for in app pay.

So a lot of infrastructure needs to be put into place before anyone can go cashless

[Gatefan1976]

Most places do not verify identity. I want to buy groceries, I check out and swipe a card.....may or may not even be mine.

Pretty much.
BUT you have every right to question any purchase on your card to track down fraud.

ANd when we’re talking about databases behind accessed, my credit info can be stolen and used and I wouldn’t even know about it. Retailers in apps are not - as far as I know - accountable for the security of the info they’re gathering. They may not even have to tell me that my data’s been accessed or compromised.

No, the grocery store cannot do that for you, but your bank certainly should. That's their financial "duty of care" so if anyone gets identity or card theft, get in contact with your bank as soon as you are aware of it. All the store can do is provide footage to the bank of whoever used the card, and then it becomes a police matter. If your bank does not provide this, change banks and engage in the time honoured American practice of suing the crap out of them. NEVER be afraid to take on the "big guys", especially in civil law, the standards are far, far different than they are in criminal law.

But, for me even beyond that, let’s say in app pay is secure and safe....I don’t know if I’ll use it because I’ve been in one too many places where I see the online/app orders made and sitting there....for many to several minutes, one time I saw it sit there for over 15 minutes until someone picked it up. Unless there was a salad in there I would have been a pit peeved to shell out the money for take out only to get old and cold food.

Are you talking online food orders?
If so I'd be equally annoyed, but with our "click and collect" system, if there are any cold items pretty much the whole order goes into our walk in fridges to keep it fresh.

Now my quirks aside, what about the homeless? Or kids? Or rural areas with limited cell service? I’ve been driving on the interstate and hit areas with no data. The rural US - which is about 80% of it, may or may not have good coverage for in app pay.

Umm, I'm SURE everyone knows how I feel about the US infrastructure, or lack therof, so I'll leave that alone

So a lot of infrastructure needs to be put into place before anyone can go cashless

Indeed it does.
It would create jobs as well, jobs you desperately need right now.

[magi877]

It's just going to take time Jel, people are slowly realising that hoarding is just stupid and really, a waste of money. We have had plenty of documented fights over TP and really, it's just sad. Tonight we got 8 pallets of 20 pack 3 ply TP, 4 of them went out (so people can get some tomorrow we held the rest back) and it's all gone by 7pm. Pasta, we got a pallet, all gone already.
People just need to understand that you only need those 2 weeks of supply, 3 if you are really uncertain and that's it. We will do our part, the GP need to understand theirs and stop acting like selfish pricks.

FEAR THE WIPING DEAD

https://twitter.com/i/status/1239998599666294787

[magi877]

Some research coming in on rates of infection and higher death rates depending on air quality

https://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/hs...9-death-rates/

Lombardy,Italy has some of the worst air quality in Europe and have high death rates while Germany has had similar infection rates as italy but with far fewer deaths.. they have some of the best air quality in Europe
https://www.forbes.com/sites/emanuel.../#78ca3cc858fd

and NYC? forget it! the city health dept has long posted online that in the nest of times, the NYC air is a health hazard

Health Department estimates show that each year,
PM2.5 pollution in New York City causes more than
3,000 deaths, 2,000 hospital admissions for lung
and heart conditions, and approximately 6,000
emergency department visits for asthma in
children and adults.

https://www1.nyc.gov/assets/doh/down...ity-impact.pdf

[SGalisa]

Can you put your conspiracy theories away please SG?

So which part is *conspiracy* now?
I *KNOW* what I heard regarding paper to electronic money systems from the Federal level (which will eventually link/network into the international levels). It was enough to make me feel nervous about cashing a check for "cash" and seeing where the paper money trails had the most damaged USA dollars (gas stations are the worst... cashiers at registers also like handing out money like it was found at the bottom of some sewer). Eventually, the news will catch up when the time to make the announcements are ready to do so.

Even (some of) our health system now requires a "hand" scanner check in before we can visit our doctor. That's been operational now for about 2 years. Sort of freaked me out when I had to "sign in" to the computer system's appointment book with my (right) hand...

Yeah, right... whatever. Calmly remind myself, this isn't the AC time era yet.

BTW, here is an article on one of many sources regarding the COVID-19 virus vaccine/tracking tattoo...
Bill Gates would like to use this tattoo version as a form of *tracking* people who health-wise have been cleared of having the COVID-19 virus, in order for them to return to work or not. The information was noted in other articles... can be googled or bing'd. FAST-Tracking this nationwide (in the USA) won't start for approximately 18 months. Trial periods begin in September (2020?).

"Research Roundup: Another Promising COVID-19 Vaccine and More"
Published: Apr 17, 2020, By Mark Terry
(posted to biospace.com)

. . .
According to the World Health Organization, there are 70 vaccines being developed worldwide for COVID-19, with three already in human clinical trials.
. . .
It's a process similar to that used in seasonal flu shots. They also leveraged a new technique to deliver the drug, called a microneedle array, to increase the potency of the vaccine. The fingertip-sized patch has 400 tiny needles that deliver the spike protein pieces into the skin. It goes on like a Band-Aid. The needles are built from sugars and the antigens, and they just dissolve.

"We developed this to build on the original scratch method used to deliver the smallpox vaccine to the skin, but as a high-tech version that is more efficient and reproducible patient to patient," said Louis Falo, co-senior author and professor and chair of dermatology at Pitt's School of Medicine and UPMC. "And it's actually pretty painless—it feels kind of like Velcro."
. . .

Sorry guys/gals. I don't think so. This chicky would prefer getting a sugar cube "VACCINE" just like the polio one, instead. At least, the polio vaccine was a real vaccine... no tracking ID needed. Just a record of receiving it.

I was a pin-cushion for more than 15 years... and, actually, Velcro DOES HURT --a whole lot more than just a tiny pin-prick. The velcro in my back brace had punctured my thumbs enough times with bleeding and pain (and the beginnings of an infection) for more than 2 days before applying antibiotic ointment/etc., that's when I finally figured out where the sores were coming from (and why... fumble fingers!), I cringed every time I had to wear that blasted thing.

[SGalisa]

Most places do not verify identity. I want to buy groceries, I check out and swipe a card.....may or may not even be mine.

ANd when we’re talking about databases behind accessed, my credit info can be stolen and used and I wouldn’t even know about it. Retailers in apps are not - as far as I know - accountable for the security of the info they’re gathering. They may not even have to tell me that my data’s been accessed or compromised.
. . .
So a lot of infrastructure needs to be put into place before anyone can go cashless

Like I mentioned, I would expect a lot of hiccups along the way, before the whole money system gets straightened out to a more secure level. Even a microchip implanted in the body won't guarantee the data from being hacked. There will probably still be some sort of security or PIN info to enter, or surcharges to pay out for credit, but instead of using plastic with a number on it, your "chip" will require being re-programmed... as just another inconvenience and hassle of being alive at the time this stuff goes fully operational.

Currently, in the USA, we have to answer YES/NO questions and amount desired to confirm purchases, and still click on the stupid answer, so the system isn't totally *touchless* yet. Not even sure if it ever will be, unless voice commands are used, but that could be difficult in a busy supermarket surrounding with registers less than 6 feet apart.

Ever since Bill Gates stepped down from the board of directors at Microsoft to pursue more "philanthropic" areas (his words), he has the technical backing to have his *tracking vaccine* be transformed into an electronic, microchipping platform. It's not impossible, because such systems have already been in research for years to make this possible. Verichip is one of those biotech places which has already tested this *chip* thing out in human test subjects. The biggest setback in going worldwide is networking. Once the computers are all built to hold such information and once a chip can be shrunk small enough for injection with billions or zillions of terrabytes of info into it, then the rest of the processing is easy.

(NO... I don't want another needle! Already got a scar where the chip is supposed to be implanted... which makes me wonder how and *when* it got there...! or if it already wandered out of my body, like a splinter travels...)

AND... since there are people on this planet now who want to go "cashless", expect the efforts to be stepped up once a good portion of the planet is on board with such an idea.

[Womble]

Be *careful* what you wish for/seek. It may end up happening in ways that you will realize are NOT desirable.
Thus, enter the "chip" or *mark of the beast* (economy portion). As dreamy as it may seem to have a totally "cashless" system where ALL of your ID data, plus health and wealth banking and buying/selling items are all embedded into that single object --being labelled a "microchip", some people cannot tolerate any foreign object inside their body. There are other versions already created that are bio-engineered using one's own DNA, to prevent rejection from the "chip", but still... even this type of system, as convenient as it might sound to the general population(s), is not 100% wise. It will still have its pitfalls... nevermind, the entire gov't *mark of the beast* aspects...
There is such a system already being established. Not sure how far along it is, but it is very, VERY close to completion.

I can live with and tolerate having to use a plastic card to buy my groceries, etc., but I cannot tolerate any "microchip" / tattoo thingy injected into my body. I get serious rashes and infections from anything that my skin (internal and external) comes in contact with and rejects. Even dust or clothing fibers that dig into my skin causes a serious allergic reaction.

Anything requiring implanted chips or tattoos isn't going to catch on, not least because the tech will need to be upgraded every 3-4 years to keep up with latest developments. Those ideas are good as proof of concept but not for mass adoption. It's like Google Glass - when it was all the rage, I predicted that smart glasses would have a restricted niche application at best while wearable tech would be big, and I was right - eyeglasses on your face are much less convenient than a bracelet or watch on your wrist.

Since we're already attached to our phones, those make the most common-sense entry point for any new identity verification mechanism in the short term, but biometric recognition will overtake them within the next decade. You don't need to be microchipped if the camera at the door to your workplace identifies your face, the smart lock on your front door recognizes you by the DNA in the skin of your finger, and the scanners in public transport identify you by your gait and cross-reference with the database of valid bus passes.

Actually, I think the COVID-19 virus situation has suddenly FAST-TRACKED this entire movement over to going completely cashless. Most banking and business systems are already in place, they just need to be networked. It started with the Bar Code, but has since progressed to combining ALL sorts of transactions with each other and interconnected with businesses of ALL types. That includes the accounting processes within how each business operates. One, gigantic networking system.

On in-country level, there will be integration of systems. On international level, there will be divergence. If you've been watching how most countries of the world approached Covid-19, it's mostly every nation for itself. Hard physical bordered between European countries are making a comeback, systems of international cooperation like the WHO are distrusted and their recommendation mostly not heeded, assistance requests between countries which usually readily ally with each other get declined. It seems to not make sense because the outbreak is worldwide and obviously one cannot defeat a global pandemic in a single country, but these are the facts on the ground. So a unified worldwide digital payment system, an equivalent of SWIFT for common people, will not be brought closer by Covid-19 but rather delayed by it.

[Skydiver]

Air quality would make sense in that COVID is a respiratory disease thus those with any sort of lung damage would be more susceptible to the more serious aspects of the disease.

[magi877]

Air quality would make sense in that COVID is a respiratory disease thus those with any sort of lung damage would be more susceptible to the more serious aspects of the disease.

yes... living in a city with bad air quality is a "preexisting respiratory condition" even if it doesn't normally cause that person issues like asthma, etc

ask any long time city dweller who moved to the country side how they began to feel after a month or so in the breathing dept.

sure, pop density has a lot to do with too of course

[magi877]

may turn out to be nothing, but good to see it is being researched...

India says that they MAY be having lower mortality from covid19 due to the mandatory TB vaccine the entire population receives

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020...w-coronavirus#

https://theprint.in/health/countries...deaths/394377/

[jelgate]

I'm skeptical. This sounds like the same insanity that the anti-malaria drug protects from coronavirus

[Annoyed]

yes... living in a city with bad air quality is a "preexisting respiratory condition" even if it doesn't normally cause that person issues like asthma, etc

ask any long time city dweller who moved to the country side how they began to feel after a month or so in the breathing dept.

sure, pop density has a lot to do with too of course

That is probably the more important factor, by far. Q: Why does a specific area have poor air quality? A: Too many people in too small an area,

An urban area has far more risk of spreading disease than a rural area simply because you do have too many people in too small an area, living on top of each other, wallowing in each other's poisons. Single family homes are exceedingly rare in densely overpopulated areas. All those people crammed into apartments are not only sharing common areas, parking, laundry facilities and such but they are also sharing the air they breathe with the other residents of that building. How many apt. units are truly isolated from other units?

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