The Political Discussion Thread

[LtColCarter]

Are you jesting, or just dumb?

Ummm...don't think you really needed to ask that.

[jelgate]

Ummm...don't think you really needed to ask that.

i have come to appreciate GF's term of of how he is embracing ignorance

[aretood2]

As I recall, Calculus and Trig were both taught in the high school I attended. Computer classes are available in high school & younger today.

And as I said to jelgate, even if it is a more complex world, why is anyone entitled to a free ride?

The Democrats just want to buy votes by racing to give more taxpayer dollars away. The taxpayers whose money they want to give away had to pay for their schooling, what makes the current crop of children worthy of a free ride?

If it's good enough for Canadian, Israeli, European, Korean, and Japanese children...why not us? Beyond that...because it behooves us as a nation to have a highly educated and a highly skilled population. In fact I'd call it a matter of national security.

[mad_gater]

On one hand I can see the "we shouldn't be giving everybody free rides" but on the other hand I think that education, due to its providing necessary skills in acquiring gainful employment, should be accessible by everyone. I only disagree with putting the education of the public at large in the hands of the government, since government can, and has in the past, turned their government-run public schools into government indoctrination/brainwashing camps. If memory serves education of the public at large was done by church-run parochial schools in the past, many of which would charge tuition fees based on a sliding scale of income. Perhaps we should return to that.

[Annoyed]

On one hand I can see the "we shouldn't be giving everybody free rides" but on the other hand I think that education, due to its providing necessary skills in acquiring gainful employment, should be accessible by everyone. I only disagree with putting the education of the public at large in the hands of the government, since government can, and has in the past, turned their government-run public schools into government indoctrination/brainwashing camps. If memory serves education of the public at large was done by church-run parochial schools in the past, many of which would charge tuition fees based on a sliding scale of income. Perhaps we should return to that.

I agree the cost of education has skyrocketed far higher than it should be, pricing many folks out of the market on their own resources.

But govt. has created that problem, too, along with the indoctrination issues you refer too. The govt. offers loans, grants and who knows what other forms of financial assistance, and the management of the educational industry knows this. Therefore, they are free to raise their prices as much as they want, knowing their customers can get the money from uncle sam.

If the govt. didn't provide this bottomless pit of money, they couldn't raise their prices as they have. If they get too greedy, students can't afford them, and they go out of business. Market forces would reign in tuition levels, and it would be affordable for far more people.

In either case, there is no excuse for the government to pick up the tab for education completely, or to forgive student loans. That is an outright slap in the face to those that have already struggled to pay off their loans. Why should the snotnosed brats of today be any different than their elders ? Sorry, collective whining isn't a marketable skill. (Or shouldn't be, anyway)

Additionally, "Free college for everyone" will just open the flow of govt. money available to the education industry even wider. Guess what will happen to the tuition rates, which will now be paid for by the taxpayers?

[Chaka-Z0]

You do realize the youth seeking to acquire education are working for you right? Everybody who gets a degree ultimately works for you, and carry the likes of you, since they will pay in a few years 3 times the amount of taxes you would pay in a lifetime. Think for a second, how many countries actually offer superior studies free of charge? Why are they doing that? To lose money?

But you can't see beyond your nose, and also quite hilarious that you mention indoctrination, yourself being a MAGA. You are so far down the indoctrination hole you're actually praising gestapo agents kidnapping migrants. One look at the man's face should tell you he's guilty af.

[Annoyed]

You do realize the youth seeking to acquire education are working for you right? Everybody who gets a degree ultimately works for you, and carry the likes of you, since they will pay in a few years 3 times the amount of taxes you would pay in a lifetime. Think for a second, how many countries actually offer superior studies free of charge? Why are they doing that? To lose money?

But you can't see beyond your nose, and also quite hilarious that you mention indoctrination, yourself being a MAGA. You are so far down the indoctrination hole you're actually praising gestapo agents kidnapping migrants. One look at the man's face should tell you he's guilty af.

And my generation and the one after that paid for their predecessors. It's the same situation. The only difference is that the current crop of snotnose children want to have theirs paid for.

[mad_gater]

You do realize the youth seeking to acquire education are working for you right? Everybody who gets a degree ultimately works for you, and carry the likes of you, since they will pay in a few years 3 times the amount of taxes you would pay in a lifetime. Think for a second, how many countries actually offer superior studies free of charge? Why are they doing that? To lose money?

But you can't see beyond your nose, and also quite hilarious that you mention indoctrination, yourself being a MAGA. You are so far down the indoctrination hole you're actually praising gestapo agents kidnapping migrants. One look at the man's face should tell you he's guilty af.

and the ever-growing burden of taxation due to out-of-control government spending on people who whine for a living and don't do one lick of honest work a day in their lives despite being able-bodied doesn't concern you?

like I said.....in the past the TRULY indigent could be educated for little or no cost based on a sliding scale of a person's income or would charge perhaps a low flat percentage of a person's net income (which would still result in truly indigent paying less as X percent of a net income, which is gross income minus household expenses, of say $5000, is less than X percent of $20,000) but enabling able-bodied people who simply refuse to do some honest work and want everything paid for and handed to them on a silver platter is flat-out wrong

[Chaka-Z0]

And my generation and the one after that paid for their predecessors. It's the same situation. The only difference is that the current crop of snotnose children want to have theirs paid for.

All the generations prior to yours, even my parent's to a certain degree, did not need any kind of formal acknowledgment of studies. Just drop in, say you got experience and boom you're hired. Don't even try to deny that.

You were born in what will probably be the apex of the US economy, post-WW2. Baby boomers caused the 2008 recession, that's not even arguable. So basically what you ''paid'' for is a debt, you buried us 6 feet under and you say you did your part and that the cost should be delegated to us. You sh*t on our heads, both economically and environmentally, and ask my generation to clean it up, how about no?

Students go to school 5 days a week, work the weekends, nights, and still are unable to pay back their loans for years some for over a decade. Hell I lived like a beggar for at least 6 years of my life, from start to finish. How about you STFU with your regular hours at work, generous pensions and recognize you need to do your part to support society like you were supportedhanded on a silver platter back then?

[Gatefan1976]

All the generations prior to yours, even my parent's to a certain degree, did not need any kind of formal acknowledgment of studies. Just drop in, say you got experience and boom you're hired. Don't even try to deny that.

I -think- I fall in to your parents generation, and I will say that what you are saying is not entirely true here for that generation. Contacts helped, as it has in every generation, even yours. What's different is your generation has to deal with an "open book" where everything you say and do has been essentially "put out there", and it's easy to find.
That's the real difference.

You were born in what will probably be the apex of the US economy, post-WW2. Baby boomers caused the 2008 recession, that's not even arguable.

Hmmm...………
Greed caused the 2008 recession, and that's not unique to a generation.

So basically what you ''paid'' for is a debt, you buried us 6 feet under and you say you did your part and that the cost should be delegated to us. You sh*t on our heads, both economically and environmentally, and ask my generation to clean it up, how about no?

We don't HAVE a choice at this point, it's either do it, or suffer. We cannot pass the buck as they did.

Students go to school 5 days a week, work the weekends, nights, and still are unable to pay back their loans for years some for over a decade. Hell I lived like a beggar for at least 6 years of my life, from start to finish. How about you STFU with your regular hours at work, generous pensions and recognize you need to do your part to support society like you were supportedhanded on a silver platter back then?

They weren't "handed" it, it was the conditions their parents and grandparents fought and died for, and realised that helping their kids was the right thing to do.
They have forgotten that, and that's the real problem.

[Gatefan1976]

And my generation and the one after that paid for their predecessors. It's the same situation. The only difference is that the current crop of snotnose children want to have theirs paid for.

Total Bull-****e.

[Annoyed]

All the generations prior to yours, even my parent's to a certain degree, did not need any kind of formal acknowledgment of studies. Just drop in, say you got experience and boom you're hired. Don't even try to deny that.

You were born in what will probably be the apex of the US economy, post-WW2. Baby boomers caused the 2008 recession, that's not even arguable. So basically what you ''paid'' for is a debt, you buried us 6 feet under and you say you did your part and that the cost should be delegated to us. You sh*t on our heads, both economically and environmentally, and ask my generation to clean it up, how about no?

Students go to school 5 days a week, work the weekends, nights, and still are unable to pay back their loans for years some for over a decade. Hell I lived like a beggar for at least 6 years of my life, from start to finish. How about you STFU with your regular hours at work, generous pensions and recognize you need to do your part to support society like you were supportedhanded on a silver platter back then?

But what exactly caused it?
The auto industry fell on its face because both management and the unions were stupid. The unions were extraordinarily greedy with their demands, and management was stupid enough to sign off on it instead of telling them to go to he**. By rights, GM & Chrysler should have been allowed to go bankrupt, someone would have bought the smoking remains and ran it better, possibly rebuilding them to their former glory. But that would have pissed the unions off, so we couldn't have that, could we?

As far as the banking industry, that was in large part due to actions taken by Slick Willie's administration ( or possibly the peanut farmer, it has been a while now); forcing the banks to make loans to people who otherwise would not have qualified because they were poor credit risks. That goes back to the same theme. Giving people shiznit they have not earned.

[Gatefan1976]

and the ever-growing burden of taxation due to out-of-control government spending on people who whine for a living and don't do one lick of honest work a day in their lives despite being able-bodied doesn't concern you?

When you spend more on out of control military spending at a rate almost 7 times the amount?
Yeah, the one buck you spend on helping people is an imposition, but the 7 is a necessity.
Grow up.

like I said.....in the past the TRULY indigent could be educated for little or no cost based on a sliding scale of a person's income or would charge perhaps a low flat percentage of a person's net income (which would still result in truly indigent paying less as X percent of a net income,

Why does this not exist anymore?
Why do you have rising levels of TRULY indigent?

which is gross income minus household expenses, of say $5000, is less than X percent of $20,000)

What is your time scale here?

but enabling able-bodied people who simply refuse to do some honest work and want everything paid for and handed to them on a silver platter is flat-out wrong

Talk to your fellow Americans
Despite what people like annoyed like to say, the left does not embrace moochers, it's a load of crap.
You want a gun, prove you need a semi-auto, or just have a pistol for home defence.
You want to refuse work that's avaliable, then why should the government support you?

This is the middle ground, and it holds ALL accountable, it also recognizes the limitations of people. The hard right would have YOU, and I mean this in the first person -YOU- have no right to have the job you do, it's a entry level job, so you have no right to have children, because you cannot pay for them, and you are not an entry level employee. Pushing carts is for kids, not a 30 year old person, but I'll pay you like a teen, and suck it up or I will replace you.
Is that what you want?

[Gatefan1976]

But what exactly caused it?

Policy decisions from baby boomers who pushed wealth acquisition over their kids.

The auto industry fell on its face because both management and the unions were stupid.

True

The unions were extraordinarily greedy with their demands, and management was stupid enough to sign off on it instead of telling them to go to he**.

Lies.

By rights, GM & Chrysler should have been allowed to go bankrupt, someone would have bought the smoking remains and ran it better, possibly rebuilding them to their former glory. But that would have pissed the unions off, so we couldn't have that, could we?

Damn, that's so ignorant as to be laughable.

As far as the banking industry, that was in large part due to actions taken by Slick Willie's administration ( or possibly the peanut farmer, it has been a while now)

Like hell it was, try learning something rather than being a political sycophant.

forcing the banks to make loans to people who otherwise would not have qualified because they were poor credit risks. That goes back to the same theme. Giving people shiznit they have not earned.

Banks did not need any forcing to get their result, they just offered a "doomed to fail" product because of "money".

[Annoyed]

Talk to your fellow Americans
Despite what people like annoyed like to say, the left does not embrace moochers, it's a load of crap.

That is NOT a load of crap. Why don't you learn something about the places you talk about such as The People's Republic of NY, where the liberals and the left have ruled the roost for DECADES. Giving shiznit away is their primary tactic to win votes.