Religious Beliefs

[s09119]

Why? Is it because of the actions of many professing Christians? Would Jesus Christ disgust you?

I've no problem with Jesus. It's his "Father" I take issue with, myself. Any being whose very existence is impossible to prove damning people who refuse to believe something, literally, unbelievable is not worth the worship of anyone, IMO.

[Ltcolshepjumper]

I've no problem with Jesus. It's his "Father" I take issue with, myself. Any being whose very existence is impossible to prove damning people who refuse to believe something, literally, unbelievable is not worth the worship of anyone, IMO.

Then you clearly have no grasp on this vital part of Christianity. you can't say you don't take issue with Jesus and yet take issue with God, because they do not contradict each other. And, if you look at it from that perspective, of course you would consider it to be damning people who refuse to believe. However, this is the way it should be viewed- God, and Jesus Christ, have given us this invitation to join them in heaven. However, when one chooses not to accept the invitation, they must face the alternative, an eternity without him. their choice. That's if one believes in a heaven to begin with. As far as the genocide, things truly were different then. I'm not saying they contradict, it's just that the requirements for righteousness and holiness were much higher because the requirement had not been met by the sacrificial death of Jesus Christ. He paid the requirement for our sin. Now, we do not have to live in the day where continual sacrifices (known then as blood sacrifices) were required for the cleansing from sin. Now, when we accept Him, our sins are forgotten, and we are covered by His blood (not literally, but in the since that His death atones for our sins, and covers our sins).

Under the Jewish Old Covenant, mankind, having become corrupted (for lack of a better term) by sin, had to pay for their sins by some sort of blood sacrifice, meaning the death of a person or animal. for the Jews, they were required to sacrifice a spotless lamb. during that time, many of the nations around them worshipped other gods. But not only that, they made it a priority to attack the Israelites. If attacked, they would have to defend themselves (God was their ultimate helper). However, if they tolerated and associated with those around them, their hearts would turn away from God toward the other gods. Although the command to go and kill all of their enemies (men, women, children) seemed harsh, the standard was set much higher. that isn't to say that they weren't allowed to serve the hebrew God. It was that the knowledge of the Hebrew God had already reached many of these nations. as well, He held the same standard within the Israelite nation as He did with their enemies. Also, this primarily occurred before the Israelites had a king. they needed to know that they could not tolerate any other religion. (you may say we don't believe this now, but it's because these modern nations are secular, and we are now given the full choice to accept or decline as a result of the death and resurrection of Jesus christ). After Jesus christ came, God established the New Covenant, which allowed us the ability to be able to restore the relationship with God. Now, the Old covenant, occurring before Jesus Christ, was merely a forshadow, and temporary provision set in place in order to account for the lack of a permanent universal sacrifice. With the New Covenant, we recieve the freedom to choose eternal life, with God, or to choose eternal separation from God, which is spiritual death. Just as physical death is simply the absence of physical life, spiritual death is eternal absence from God, who is the source of life. In fact, He is true Life.

[jenks]

Then you clearly have no grasp on this vital part of Christianity. you can't say you don't take issue with Jesus and yet take issue with God, because they do not contradict each other. And, if you look at it from that perspective, of course you would consider it to be damning people who refuse to believe. However, this is the way it should be viewed- God, and Jesus Christ, have given us this invitation to join them in heaven. However, when one chooses not to accept the invitation, they must face the alternative, an eternity without him. their choice. That's if one believes in a heaven to begin with.

You're trying to argue that it's our own fault if we end up in hell, when it's god who created the whole situation. The whole ultimatum has been forced upon us by him.

Look at it this way: If someone takes a hostage, and threatens to kill them if the police don't give him one million dollars, then he kills the hostage because the police refuse, is it his fault the hostage is dead or the police's? Because your argument effectively puts the blame on the police.

As far as the genocide, things truly were different then. I'm not saying they contradict, it's just that the requirements for righteousness and holiness were much higher because the requirement had not been met by the sacrificial death of Jesus Christ.

Who's requirement? Oh yeah, again, the sick ******* that created the situation.

He paid the requirement for our sin. Now, we do not have to live in the day where continual sacrifices (known then as blood sacrifices) were required for the cleansing from sin.

Why should there ever have been such a time?

Now, when we accept Him, our sins are forgotten, and we are covered by His blood (not literally, but in the since that His death atones for our sins, and covers our sins).

Under the Jewish Old Covenant, mankind, having become corrupted (for lack of a better term) by sin, had to pay for their sins by some sort of blood sacrifice, meaning the death of a person or animal.

Why?

for the Jews, they were required to sacrifice a spotless lamb. during that time, many of the nations around them worshipped other gods. But not only that, they made it a priority to attack the Israelites. If attacked, they would have to defend themselves (God was their ultimate helper). However, if they tolerated and associated with those around them, their hearts would turn away from God toward the other gods. Although the command to go and kill all of their enemies (men, women, children) seemed harsh, the standard was set much higher. that isn't to say that they weren't allowed to serve the hebrew God. It was that the knowledge of the Hebrew God had already reached many of these nations. as well, He held the same standard within the Israelite nation as He did with their enemies. Also, this primarily occurred before the Israelites had a king. they needed to know that they could not tolerate any other religion. (you may say we don't believe this now, but it's because these modern nations are secular, and we are now given the full choice to accept or decline as a result of the death and resurrection of Jesus christ). After Jesus christ came, God established the New Covenant, which allowed us the ability to be able to restore the relationship with God. Now, the Old covenant, occurring before Jesus Christ, was merely a forshadow, and temporary provision set in place in order to account for the lack of a permanent universal sacrifice. With the New Covenant, we recieve the freedom to choose eternal life, with God, or to choose eternal separation from God, which is spiritual death. Just as physical death is simply the absence of physical life, spiritual death is eternal absence from God, who is the source of life. In fact, He is true Life.

Translation: Choose to worship god and live like he wants you to, or suffer eternal pain and suffering. If god were real, he would be the most disgusting piece of **** in existence. Hitler and Stalin would not be able to hold a candle to him.

Another point, say you're in heaven, but you were friend with atheists on Earth, how could you possibly be happy in heaven knowing that they're in hell?

[shipper hannah]

Uh, probability tells us life shouldn't exist anywhere at all.
The vast majority of starts don't produce heavy elements.
The vast majority of those that do are unstable.
The vast majority of those likely don't have planets.
The existence of abiogenesis is observably as impossible as a computer comming together by throwing all the elemts into a sentrifuge.

carbon is the fourth most abundant element in the universe.
carbon compounds are common in the universe.
many scientists now accept that the likelihood of life originating over billions of years is high as life originating very quickly on earth at least once.
your statement that the majority of stars that produce the heavier elements are unstable is irrelevant since the stars have to die for these elements to be used anyway.
remember, there billions of stars in our galaxy, and billions of galaxies in our universe.
to me it seems far more unlikely that life has not evolved on even one other star.

[Ltcolshepjumper]

You're trying to argue that it's our own fault if we end up in hell, when it's god who created the whole situation. The whole ultimatum has been forced upon us by him.
Look at it this way: If someone takes a hostage, and threatens to kill them if the police don't give him one million dollars, then he kills the hostage because the police refuse, is it his fault the hostage is dead or the police's? Because your argument effectively puts the blame on the police.


Who's requirement? Oh yeah, again, the sick ******* that created the situation.



Why should there ever have been such a time?



Why?



Translation: Choose to worship god and live like he wants you to, or suffer eternal pain and suffering. If god were real, he would be the most disgusting piece of **** in existence. Hitler and Stalin would not be able to hold a candle to him.

Another point, say you're in heaven, but you were friend with atheists on Earth, how could you possibly be happy in heaven knowing that they're in hell?

Yes it is your fault if you end up in hell. But not entirely. If I never told you why I believe what I believe, and you did go to hell, the responsibility would be on me. But, since I, and many others no doubt, have shared Christianity with you, it is on you now. You have heard, now you must make the decision. And, God never forces you to choose Him the way some Jihadist would. He gives you a choice. If He wanted to force you, He could just as easily make your life here on earth miserable. But He does not do that. He allows you to live the way you choose. But, the downside is, you cannot get into Heaven, His dwelling place, without following His way. I don't think that's an unreasonable requirement. After all, if you don't believe in Him, why would you want to go there anyway? Why would He want you there? the Old Covenant existed because mankind chose to disobey Him, bringing sin into the world. Also, just for the record, sin will inevitably bring pain and suffering. Its unavoidable. As I mentioned earlier, which you obviously skipped over or did not understand, With God there is eternal life. The "punishment" is merely a consequence of not choosing God. With God there is eternal life, peace, light, and happiness. Without God, there is death, pain, darkness, and suffering. I don't see how that is hard to understand. Look at it this way:
You are in front of a house. Inside is light, warmth, and shelter. But, you choose not to enter the house, because it is not your "style". As a result, you do not get that warmth, light, or shelter. Is the owner of the house to blame?

Also, no, I would not be happy if my atheist friend was going to Hell. But that is why I'm typing this post, isn't it? While I am defending my faith, I am also trying to reach out and convince whoever reads this thread that God is real, and that He is not this disgusting being who merely wants to rob humankind of his enjoyment, peace, and freedom. He wants the best for everyone. The problem is, most people don't know what is best for them. They go off their feelings and desires, rather than their true needs.
And, to be honest, I have no idea what heaven will be like. But what I do know is that it will be a place where their will be no more tears, no more pain, no more suffering, no more sin, no more illness, no more trials and temptations. Hell, on the other hand, will be just the opposite of Heaven. With that said, I can only guess as to how the issue (having friends in Hell) may be resolved. And it isn't pleasant. I have the slightest feeling that when I do get to heaven, I will literally forget all of those who are in Hell. I may be wrong, but, since God Himself can forget our sins, when we are filled with the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ, and we will be just like Him, it makes sense that we will forget all those who do not enter heaven.

[Ltcolshepjumper]

carbon is the fourth most abundant element in the universe.
carbon compounds are common in the universe.
many scientists now accept that the likelihood of life originating over billions of years is high as life originating very quickly on earth at least once.
your statement that the majority of stars that produce the heavier elements are unstable is irrelevant since the stars have to die for these elements to be used anyway.
remember, there billions of stars in our galaxy, and billions of galaxies in our universe.
to me it seems far more unlikely that life has not evolved on even one other star.

It may be possible for life to form on other planets; that is, other planets may have all the necessary ingredients and prerequisites for Life to begin, but it doesn't mean life has actually evolved on those planets. My reasoning-
I believe that it requires the hand of a divine being to combine all of those ingredients into living organisms.

[Vampyr]

*Sigh.* I promised myself I wasn't going to get involved in this, but my conscience dictates I say something.

Why is it that we HAVE to believe in God to go to heaven exactly? There are plenty of people who don't believe in God or in version XYZ of God and still live by ethics that the Bible says they should live by. Is God going to send them to hell just because these people happened not to believe in your particular version of the truth? If He's going to send a good percentage of His children to hell just for that, I don't think I'd want to give my love and support to such a petty deity.

I'm sorry, that's just my point of view, and I don't mind if you believe something different. If you don't like it; too bad.

[jenks]

Yes it is your fault if you end up in hell. But not entirely. If I never told you why I believe what I believe, and you did go to hell, the responsibility would be on me. But, since I, and many others no doubt, have shared Christianity with you, it is on you now. You have heard, now you must make the decision. And, God never forces you to choose Him the way some Jihadist would.

He's forced the choice on me, he's given me no alternative but to chose him or hell.

He gives you a choice. If He wanted to force you, He could just as easily make your life here on earth miserable. But He does not do that. He allows you to live the way you choose.

You make it sound like the choice is a gift, but it's not, it's a curse.

But, the downside is, you cannot get into Heaven, His dwelling place, without following His way. I don't think that's an unreasonable requirement.

I do, the notion of it is disgusting.

After all, if you don't believe in Him, why would you want to go there anyway?

Well if I did believe in him I would want to go there wouldn't I, if the only alternative was hell.

Why would He want you there? the Old Covenant existed because mankind chose to disobey Him, bringing sin into the world. Also, just for the record, sin will inevitably bring pain and suffering.

By the Bible's definition? No it won't.

Its unavoidable. As I mentioned earlier, which you obviously skipped over or did not understand, With God there is eternal life. The "punishment" is merely a consequence of not choosing God.

Why should I be punished for not doing what a book tells me to? Why should I be punished for not doing something I don't believe in?

With God there is eternal life, peace, light, and happiness. Without God, there is death, pain, darkness, and suffering. I don't see how that is hard to understand. Look at it this way:
You are in front of a house. Inside is light, warmth, and shelter. But, you choose not to enter the house, because it is not your "style". As a result, you do not get that warmth, light, or shelter. Is the owner of the house to blame?

That's not the same situation though is it? Why is it so hard for you to understand that if what you believe is true, it was your god that created the choice! He created hell so that anyone who didn't accept him would suffer for an eternity. Now ask yourself, what sort of sick, self centered, egotistical scum bag would do such a thing? Can't you see how evil that is?

Also, no, I would not be happy if my atheist friend was going to Hell.

So then how can heaven exist?

But that is why I'm typing this post, isn't it? While I am defending my faith, I am also trying to reach out and convince whoever reads this thread that God is real,

He's not.

and that He is not this disgusting being who merely wants to rob humankind of his enjoyment, peace, and freedom.

He is if the Bible is anything to go by.

He wants the best for everyone. The problem is, most people don't know what is best for them.

Obviously not.

They go off their feelings and desires, rather than their true needs.

Which are?

And, to be honest, I have no idea what heaven will be like. But what I do know is that it will be a place where their will be no more tears, no more pain, no more suffering, no more sin, no more illness, no more trials and temptations.

The sad thing is, you don't. You've already proved earlier on that you couldn't be happy in heaven.

Hell, on the other hand, will be just the opposite of Heaven. With that said, I can only guess as to how the issue (having friends in Hell) may be resolved. And it isn't pleasant. I have the slightest feeling that when I do get to heaven, I will literally forget all of those who are in Hell. I may be wrong, but, since God Himself can forget our sins, when we are filled with the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ, and we will be just like Him, it makes sense that we will forget all those who do not enter heaven.

And it's a great story, unfortunately for you one without a single shred of evidence to back it up and mountains of evidence to do the opposite.

[Ltcolshepjumper]

*Sigh.* I promised myself I wasn't going to get involved in this, but my conscience dictates I say something.

Why is it that we HAVE to believe in God to go to heaven exactly? There are plenty of people who don't believe in God or in version XYZ of God and still live by ethics that the Bible says they should live by. Is God going to send them to hell just because these people happened not to believe in your particular version of the truth? If He's going to send a good percentage of His children to hell just for that, I don't think I'd want to give my love and support to such a petty deity.

I'm sorry, that's just my point of view, and I don't mind if you believe something different. If you don't like it; too bad.

One, I'm not bashing your beliefs. I respect them. If you don't like what I believe, I can't do anything about it. I'm not trying to offend anyone. That said, I would have to say that my perception is that God is the lord of Heaven. If you don't believe in Him, you don't accept His invitation into heaven. Also, as I have been trying to say, god does not send you to Hell. When you die, there are only two places you can go- Heaven, or Hell. If you decline to go to heaven, by declining to follow and obey God ( all gods are not the same), then you will end up in Hell. How is that hard to grasp? furthermore, just believing in the ethics of the Bible (the basic works- being "good") won't get you into heaven. It's not that. Either you truly believe the Bible (everything, including believing that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, who died for your sins, and that only through Him do you have access to God through the redemption of sins, made possible by His death and Resurrection) or you don't. That's why this is so important. The most important thing you can do is to give your life to Jesus christ. There are many "good" people, but only those who are truly the "sons of God" will enter Heaven. And this is only possible if you accept Jesus Christ, and are filled with His Spirit. Also, there is no XYZ version of God. If you believe in Jesus Christ, you believe in the Hebrew God. However, you must believe in Jesus Christ, because just believing in Jehovah is not enough. Why? Because Jesus Christ is our only Savior. Without Him, we are lost. It's like a diseased person who does not know he is sick and will not accept the only way to cure his illness. He knows there is a cure for something, but he will not accept the method for his recovery.

[Ltcolshepjumper]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ltcolshepjumper
Yes it is your fault if you end up in hell. But not entirely. If I never told you why I believe what I believe, and you did go to hell, the responsibility would be on me. But, since I, and many others no doubt, have shared Christianity with you, it is on you now. You have heard, now you must make the decision. And, God never forces you to choose Him the way some Jihadist would.

He's forced the choice on me, he's given me no alternative but to chose him or hell.

Quote:
He gives you a choice. If He wanted to force you, He could just as easily make your life here on earth miserable. But He does not do that. He allows you to live the way you choose.

You make it sound like the choice is a gift, but it's not, it's a curse.


Quote:
But, the downside is, you cannot get into Heaven, His dwelling place, without following His way. I don't think that's an unreasonable requirement.

I do, the notion of it is disgusting.


Quote:
After all, if you don't believe in Him, why would you want to go there anyway?

Well if I did believe in him I would want to go there wouldn't I, if the only alternative was hell.


Quote:
Why would He want you there? the Old Covenant existed because mankind chose to disobey Him, bringing sin into the world. Also, just for the record, sin will inevitably bring pain and suffering.

By the Bible's definition? No it won't.

Quote:
Its unavoidable. As I mentioned earlier, which you obviously skipped over or did not understand, With God there is eternal life. The "punishment" is merely a consequence of not choosing God.

Why should I be punished for not doing what a book tells me to? Why should I be punished for not doing something I don't believe in?


Quote:
With God there is eternal life, peace, light, and happiness. Without God, there is death, pain, darkness, and suffering. I don't see how that is hard to understand. Look at it this way:
You are in front of a house. Inside is light, warmth, and shelter. But, you choose not to enter the house, because it is not your "style". As a result, you do not get that warmth, light, or shelter. Is the owner of the house to blame?

That's not the same situation though is it? Why is it so hard for you to understand that if what you believe is true, it was your god that created the choice! He created hell so that anyone who didn't accept him would suffer for an eternity. Now ask yourself, what sort of sick, self centered egotistical disgusting person would do such a thing? Can't you see how evil that is?


Quote:
Also, no, I would not be happy if my atheist friend was going to Hell.

So then how can heaven exist?


Quote:
But that is why I'm typing this post, isn't it? While I am defending my faith, I am also trying to reach out and convince whoever reads this thread that God is real,

He's not.

Quote:
and that He is not this disgusting being who merely wants to rob humankind of his enjoyment, peace, and freedom.

He is if the Bible is anything to go by.


Quote:
He wants the best for everyone. The problem is, most people don't know what is best for them.

Obviously not.


Quote:
They go off their feelings and desires, rather than their true needs.

Which are?


Quote:
And, to be honest, I have no idea what heaven will be like. But what I do know is that it will be a place where their will be no more tears, no more pain, no more suffering, no more sin, no more illness, no more trials and temptations.

The sad thing is, you don't. You've already proved earlier on that you couldn't be happy in heaven.


Quote:
Hell, on the other hand, will be just the opposite of Heaven. With that said, I can only guess as to how the issue (having friends in Hell) may be resolved. And it isn't pleasant. I have the slightest feeling that when I do get to heaven, I will literally forget all of those who are in Hell. I may be wrong, but, since God Himself can forget our sins, when we are filled with the Holy Spirit of Jesus Christ, and we will be just like Him, it makes sense that we will forget all those who do not enter heaven.

And it's a great story, unfortunately for you one without a single shred of evidence to back it up and mountains of evidence to do the opposite.

You know, there is really nothing more I can say to convince you. the only thing I have left to say is that you cannot prove that God does not exist. I have already told you what I believe. You, for whatever reason, refuse to consider it. And no, I don't have any evidence about Heaven. I admit that.
And I'll tell you this: yes, He did create Hell. But He did not create it for you. he created it for the Devil and his angels, who rebelled against God. As I said earlier, it is by your choice that you choose not to enter Heaven. And yes, the only possible alternative is Hell. And yes, free will is a gift. But with that comes rewards and consequences. If you truly cannot see that, then I can say no more to you.

[Vampyr]

One, I'm not bashing your beliefs. I respect them. If you don't like what I believe, I can't do anything about it. I'm not trying to offend anyone.

I'm just saying my bit, that's all.

That said, I would have to say that my perception is that God is the lord of Heaven. If you don't believe in Him, you don't accept His invitation into heaven. Also, as I have been trying to say, god does not send you to Hell.

Aaaand we can't make this choice after death? We don't get to accept this invitation after we become some metaphysical entity? We go straight to good ol'e Lucifer's domain?

When you die, there are only two places you can go- Heaven, or Hell.

Whatever happened to purgatory?

If you decline to go to heaven, by declining to follow and obey God ( all gods are not the same), then you will end up in Hell. How is that hard to grasp?

Hrrmm... Because I've got jack to support the existence of heaven and hell, and refuse to believe in it until someone can prove they exist.

furthermore, just believing in the ethics of the Bible (the basic works- being "good") won't get you into heaven. It's not that.

O rly? I have to telepathically tell Him that I love Him and symbolically eat the flesh of his Jewish zombie of a son?

Either you truly believe the Bible (everything, including believing that Jesus Christ is the Son of God, who died for your sins, and that only through Him do you have access to God through the redemption of sins, made possible by His death and Resurrection) or you don't.

I'm not sure Jesus existed, but I acknowledge the possibility that he did. Assuming he did, was he the son of this God you keep referring to? We have only the word of a book that was written quite a few years after his death. Sorry, that just doesn't cut the ice with me.

That's why this is so important. The most important thing you can do is to give your life to Jesus christ.

Sorry, it almost sounds like you're preaching to me.

There are many "good" people, but only those who are truly the "sons of God" will enter Heaven. And this is only possible if you accept Jesus Christ, and are filled with His Spirit.

Which brings me back to the point that God seems to be a fairly touchy chap. He only gives a chance to people during their lives, when they have no way of really determining (read: empirical evidence) if He exists or not and doesn't give them a chance to accept after death.

Also, there is no XYZ version of God.

I was referring to the numerous other creeds when I said that.

If you believe in Jesus Christ, you believe in the Hebrew God. However, you must believe in Jesus Christ, because just believing in Jehovah is not enough. Why? Because Jesus Christ is our only Savior.

All we have is the word of a couple thousand year old book that Jesus was.

Without Him, we are lost. It's like a diseased person who does not know he is sick and will not accept the only way to cure his illness. He knows there is a cure for something, but he will not accept the method for his recovery.

You keep implying that we know this God exists. We don't. There (as far as I know) is no empirical evidence that God exists, so all we have is faith which does NOT equate to knowledge.

[jenks]

You know, there is really nothing more I can say to convince you. the only thing I have left to say is that you cannot prove that God does not exist.

I can't prove that there is no god, but I can prove that the Christian god doesn't exist, and that many of the stories in the Bible are bogus.

I have already told you what I believe. You, for whatever reason, refuse to consider it.

Oh I've considered it, laughed a bit, then dismissed it.

And no, I don't have any evidence about Heaven. I admit that.
And I'll tell you this: yes, He did create Hell. But He did not create it for you. he created it for the Devil and his angels, who rebelled against God. As I said earlier, it is by your choice that you choose not to enter Heaven. And yes, the only possible alternative is Hell. And yes, free will is a gift. But with that comes rewards and consequences. If you truly cannot see that, then I can say no more to you.

If the Christian God existed and was truly omniscient, then everything is predetermined, and free will can't really exist.

[Daedalus-304]

I can't prove that there is no god, but I can prove that the Christian god doesn't exist, and that many of the stories in the Bible are bogus.

Really where is the proof that the Christian God does not exist. And where is the proof the the biblical stories are bogus?

If the Christian God existed and was truly omniscient, then everything is predetermined, and free will can't really exist.

Not exactly, omniscience does not mean everything would have to be predetermined.

[Ltcolshepjumper]

I'm just saying my bit, that's all.



Aaaand we can't make this choice after death? We don't get to accept this invitation after we become some metaphysical entity? We go straight to good ol'e Lucifer's domain?


Whatever happened to purgatory?



Hrrmm... Because I've got jack to support the existence of heaven and hell, and refuse to believe in it until someone can prove they exist.



O rly? I have to telepathically tell Him that I love Him and symbolically eat the flesh of his Jewish zombie of a son?



I'm not sure Jesus existed, but I acknowledge the possibility that he did. Assuming he did, was he the son of this God you keep referring to? We have only the word of a book that was written quite a few years after his death. Sorry, that just doesn't cut the ice with me.



Sorry, it almost sounds like you're preaching to me.



Which brings me back to the point that God seems to be a fairly touchy chap. He only gives a chance to people during their lives, when they have no way of really determining (read: empirical evidence) if He exists or not and doesn't give them a chance to accept after death.



I was referring to the numerous other creeds when I said that.



All we have is the word of a couple thousand year old book that Jesus was.



You keep implying that we know this God exists. We don't. There (as far as I know) is no empirical evidence that God exists, so all we have is faith which does NOT equate to knowledge.

Well, you know, it does require faith. to believe in the Christian God. But, I would also argue that there is evidence that some sort of divine being exists. you want evidence? Look it up (because it's late and I have neither the time nor the energy right now, and I'm not even sure it would help in this debate)

And, I don't believe in purgatory (there is no Biblical evidence to truly support this yes I am assuming that the Bible is an accurate source of info. And yes, you cannot make this choice after death. Because immediately after death, the decision is final. There's no other way I could put it. that's jsut the way it is. Also, jenks, you cannot prove the Christian God is not real. furthermore, you can argue that from a natural perspective, the Bible cannot be true. But, if you look at it from a supernatural perspective, combined with the level of understanding of the time, I think it could become less implausible. And no, I do not have evidence that supernatural events do occur (you cannot prove the opposite)

Also, I would appreciate it if you would give me the same respect that I have given you.

[./freelancer]

Also, jenks, you cannot prove the Christian God is not real.

And no, I do not have evidence that supernatural events do occur (you cannot prove the opposite)

This is one of the things I hate the most about people like you (yes, I'm generalizing). You fail to realize that the burden of proof lies on you. What if I said there was an invisible flying rock that only I could see, do you think anyone would believe me? I mean, they can't prove it doesn't exist.