All you ever wanted to know about the 9th chevron

[rarocks24]

I think the whole concept of the nineth chevron is to dial back to the Ori galaxy.

There's the strong possibility that the human race didn't even evolve in our local group.

[Lightbane]

1-6th Chervon dialing Sequence
7th Chervon Normal point of orgin
8th Chervon Galactic point of orgin (travel to a different galaxy)
9th Chervon Universal point of orgin or Date of orgin (travel to a paralle universal or travel back or forward in time)

[plunkotica]

i like the idea of the 9th chevron enabling time travel, could be some interesting stories to be had right there.

[Blitz]

Now lets see...if the 9th chevron was time travel WHY would they need to build the time machien in WoO and then the Time Jumper....

As for different dimension/paralel universe...I doubt it....as they'd have no way of being able to control it unles they had a lil control like the mirror(s1) did...this brings up even more questions...

Personally I think the 9th chevron is either:

1) Able to open 2 way wormholes
2) Allow the Stargate to stay open
3) Order Pizza

Truth being: I got NO idea what its used for...and I hope if its ever done, isnt a stupid idea like time travel, or immediate ascension.

[sarge]

I like the 9th chevron for the parallel universe idea.
We know the Ancients had the capability to travel between universes with the quantum mirrors. So it is entirely possible that they incorporated the tech into the Gate.

[Blitz]

I like the 9th chevron for the parallel universe idea.
We know the Ancients had the capability to travel between universes with the quantum mirrors. So it is entirely possible that they incorporated the tech into the Gate.

1) Was it ACTUALLY said they DID build the mirror?

2) Why would they do it in the first place?

3) The gates were most probably built LONG before the quantum mirror, so unless they went around, picked up each gate and added the extra chevron onto it....I doubt it works for the idea

[sarge]

1) Was it ACTUALLY said they DID build the mirror?

Not that I know of. However we can safely assume the ancients had a good working knowledge of the mirror tech

2) Why would they do it in the first place?

Why not have one transport system that can do all transport methods?

3) The gates were most probably built LONG before the quantum mirror, so unless they went around, picked up each gate and added the extra chevron onto it....I doubt it works for the idea

1. We have know way to know what order they were built
2. Would it be hard to replace each gate? With our tech: yes. With the knowledge of the Ancients?? Who knows?

[Flyboy]

What if the 9th chevron doesnt jump between Parallel universes. But allows travel to other universes.

This is where we need ton differentiate between the Multiverse theory and Alternate Universes. The AU's are as we saw in episodes like Point of Origin. Multiverse is the collective term for universes like our own. The idea is that there are endless numbers of them scattered throughout nothingness in a similar wein to the way galaxies are scattered throughout space. In between each universe there is NOTHING, not even space, not even time. These universes are individual, no alternate Carters or anything, just universes where the entire composition of the universe is different.

The 9th Chevron could do that.

[stargate maniack]

maybe with the 9th chevron you can go to another dimension...'cause the other ideeas like time travel, alternate universes, imediate ascension, ori galaxy bla bla bla don't seem so plausible......anyway, that's my ideea...

[Flyboy]

Another dimension IS an alternate universe.

What I was referring to is a DIFFERENT universe in the same dimension as ours.

[SpikeBad]

Another dimension IS an alternate universe.

What I was referring to is a DIFFERENT universe in the same dimension as ours.

Actually, according to my theory, there can only be existing alternate realities, demensions, and universes.

According to my theories, alternate realities are changes in the timeline where a different decision may have been made instead of the one that actually took place. The people and lifeforms involved in each reality stay the same as they are in others, only with different choices and events taking place. That is my theory of alternate realities.

Alternate Dimensions are completely different worlds that often have little resemblance to the one currently occupied in the home dimension. The existence of lifeforms in an alternate dimension can sometimes have never of existed or be completely different in a way that choice was not involved in the making of the differing worlds. The worlds just started out as different. An alternate form of creation if you will. For instance you can have and entire world composed entirely of just shrimp and where humans may never have even existed. You can also have alternate realities within alternate dimensions. Thus, the alternate dimension is dominate over the alternate reality. That is my theory of alternate dimensions.

Alternate Universes are the most different worlds. In alternate universes, the very laws of physics may be entirely different where as the laws of physics must be the same in each alternate reality and dimension. An alternate universe would contain what would be paradoxes to each corresponding universe such as, up would become down, and black would become white. It would also be impossible for a living creature to exist in a universe outside of it's own for the physics of the universe would be different and would very well destroy the creature. It is also possible for an alternate universe to contain alternate realities and dimension within them but the laws of physics for each must match that of it's corresponding universe to avoid a paradox within itself, and also alternate universes can be paradoxal to eachother but cannot contain paradoxes within themselves. Thus, the alternate universe is dominate over the alternate reality and dimension. That is my theory of alternate universes.

These thoeries lead to the basic foundation of science in the stargate universe. The time traveling puddlejumper and solar flare gate time travel was used to create alternate realities. The quantum mirror was used to travel through those realities. So far, there has been no recorded travel through dimensions or universe. Each would however be impossible to acomplish without the use of a form of energy that could break the laws of physics such as magick. Magick remains to this day to be unproven. Only mythical beings such as gods are reported to have such powers and abilities to break the very laws and foundations of physics. Thus, they would be dominant over alternate realities, dimensions, and universes. They, like magick, remain to be unproven by modern science.

And you know what? Even after all this scientific babble that I have forced you to read (which I only did to show you how smart I am), after knowing completey how the science involved in the stargate universe works...I still don't know what that damn ninth chevron was used for.

[Flyboy]

Actually, according to my theory, there can only be existing alternate realities, demensions, and universes.

According to my theories, alternate realities are changes in the timeline where a different decision may have been made instead of the one that actually took place. The people and lifeforms involved in each reality stay the same as they are in others, only with different choices and events taking place. That is my theory of alternate realities.

Alternate Dimensions are completely different worlds that often have little resemblance to the one currently occupied in the home dimension. The existence of lifeforms in an alternate dimension can sometimes have never of existed or be completely different in a way that choice was not involved in the making of the differing worlds. The worlds just started out as different. An alternate form of creation if you will. For instance you can have and entire world composed entirely of just shrimp and where humans may never have even existed. You can also have alternate realities within alternate dimensions. Thus, the alternate dimension is dominate over the alternate reality. That is my theory of alternate dimensions.

Alternate Universes are the most different worlds. In alternate universes, the very laws of physics may be entirely different where as the laws of physics must be the same in each alternate reality and dimension. An alternate universe would contain what would be paradoxes to each corresponding universe such as, up would become down, and black would become white. It would also be impossible for a living creature to exist in a universe outside of it's own for the physics of the universe would be different and would very well destroy the creature. It is also possible for an alternate universe to contain alternate realities and dimension within them but the laws of physics for each must match that of it's corresponding universe to avoid a paradox within itself, and also alternate universes can be paradoxal to eachother but cannot contain paradoxes within themselves. Thus, the alternate universe is dominate over the alternate reality and dimension. That is my theory of alternate universes.

These thoeries lead to the basic foundation of science in the stargate universe. The time traveling puddlejumper and solar flare gate time travel was used to create alternate realities. The quantum mirror was used to travel through those realities. So far, there has been no recorded travel through dimensions or universe. Each would however be impossible to acomplish without the use of a form of energy that could break the laws of physics such as magick. Magick remains to this day to be unproven. Only mythical beings such as gods are reported to have such powers and abilities to break the very laws and foundations of physics. Thus, they would be dominant over alternate realities, dimensions, and universes. They, like magick, remain to be unproven by modern science.

And you know what? Even after all this scientific babble that I have forced you to read (which I only did to show you how smart I am), after knowing completey how the science involved in the stargate universe works...I still don't know what that damn ninth chevron was used for.

Ok.

*Recalls his college Physics*

What you are defining as "Alternate Realities" is pretty much the standard definition. For every choice on the quantum, atomic and physical level, thousands of paths are instantaneously created, spawning a vast number of realities, the closest of which (relatively speaking) is near as damn identical, where as the further away you get the more different they are, however, based on the billions upon billions of choices that are made every second, if one HAD a device such as a quantum mirror, in reality (no pun intended) it would take billions of turns of the dial to actually find a reality where there are any difference as significant as whether or not the Goa’uld invaded. You'd have to go through billions of realities where the only difference is based on a choice you made about two seconds before. Also the further back the decision when, the further away it would be. By the time SG1 used the quantum mirror in point of view, the Goa'uld invaded realities should have actually been bloody far away.

I disagree entirely on your definition of alternate dimension. To me your paragraph says to me that what you are defining is merely an alternate reality spawned from ours A LONG time ago, way before the dawn of man, maybe even before the dawn of Earth, possibly even shortly after the universe came into existence. This would create the appearance of the reality being completely alien, and yet it is still nothing more than an alternate reality.

The alternate universe is a tricky situation indeed. If we are using the multiverse theory, then it is TYPICALLY depicted in layout as being similar to the galaxies within our universe. Of course that's a very crude assessment. We can never be sure. You are quite right when you say that the laws of physics are completely different. I believe scientists have been suggesting that the way it works is something line a line of petri dishes, each with a different variable. Things that we take as universal fact, speed of light maybe, would be completely different in the varying universes. Some of these universes would (theoretically) be incapable of supporting life (though few scientists consider that life might adapt to be supported in such an environment (god that made me sounded arrogant))and then there's our "magical" universe where all the variables are JUST right to support life.

To clarify, the multiverse, the collective term for all universes, consists of an infinite about of totally unrelated universes that have had no interaction what so ever. As you quite rightly said, due to the fundamental differences on a quantum level, no life from another universe could possibly exist in ours or vice versa (with the exception of a show like SG1 where Super Sam would find a way). The fact that outside of these universes there is nothing. No time, (which coincidentally, lends credence to time travel theories), no reality and no space brings about a difficult question. Is reality top in the hierarchy, as in, is reality the thing which everything exists in. Or is the Multiverse that which everything exists in, with realities only existing within the individual universes. I prefer the latter to be honest.

With the latter being the most likely case, our model for the Multiverse and realities would consist of something like this:



(I apologise for the crudeness of the model)

Of course, that image is over simplified, but its the general idea.

Now you talk of Magick, (interesting that you use a K on the end, I assume you study such traditions in your free time?). I personally believe in magick to a certain degree, but merely as a manipulation of physics. Where there are laws there are loop holes. Even with the laws of physics. Now especially within the SG1 universe where Gods and mythical beings use magick, this is far more likely. SG1 shows that all myths and Gods have a route in physics and science in the form of aliens and alien tech. Now, aside from the fact that inter-reality travel is technically impossible (you could journey to another reality, but getting back would be a bugger, because from the moment you’ve left, your reality ceases to exist because billions of choices are made post leaving and then you end up getting further away from the universe that looks closest to your one, then of course there’s the choice of which reality you went to, meaning that in theory, every reality could get a version of you, and if you all tried to get back, in theory, an infinite number of you could return to one reality... kinda sucks, but that’s a LONG and very different discussion)... SG1 overlooks these problems, so why not with the inter-universe travel?

In theory to travel through time you have to take yourself out of time, to journey to a different point in time. The only place where time does not exist is the quantum level (Time moves in jumps, it is not continuous, it moves forward bit by bit at a plank length), but one could also theorise that the only other place that time does not exist, is in the multiverse. Its possible, that the Time Ship jumps to the multiverse, and then BACK to the universe at a different reality.

There are flaws in this theory however. Realities and Time are highly interlinked. Obviously in the future there will be more realities than there were in the past. Unfortunately, unlike the SG1 presentation of realities, there is not one single reality for us that can be changed as in Moebius. There are an infinite amount, all equally legitimate. So when you travel to the future... which future are you travelling to? There are an infinite amount of possible outcomes. Travelling to the past is easier. There is a fixed line of where our reality came from. Its like backwards tracing a route. But then in theory, the memory of this route must be built into the time machine so that it can return to the present, however the very nature of appearing in the past would destroy this, as all of a sudden your PRESENCE changes everything, meaning your original reality doesn’t exist in the same form ever again, even if it looks very similar with no significant changes. The fact you were there in the past IS a change, and thus you reality is gone - regardless of anchor. When you return to the exact same point in time as you left, it will only be an approximation as to which reality is closest to the one you left.

So time travel would be possible, but it would mess a HELL of a lot up, even then, the choice of WHEN you return to, would have the same effect as travelling between realities, and the same problems and dangers.

However, I’ve gone off at a tangent, and if you’re still reading this WELL DONE! My point is, if indeed, the time ship goes into the multiverse in order to relocate at a different point of time (time which seems to run constant throughout the universe - and yes I know time isn’t constant) then surely the time ship could relocate in another universe. Of course, this doesn’t get around the fact it SHOULDNT exist in that universe... but the Ancients could probably find a way round that.

How that relates to the 9th Chevron I have NO idea. The Stargate itself only travels within our reality, suggesting no possibility of anything more. But the fact it was used to travel through time, and thus into a different reality of sorts (the future, one of many possible ones) the wormhole does appear to occasional travel outside the realms of reality, possibly outside the realms of the universe, being as though our universe consists entirely of realities. If this is the case, as it does appear so, then in theory, a jump to another universe COULD be possible, as the wormhole would have to have exited the boundaries of reality to travel to a different reality.


EDIT: Of course, on reflection, I have stupidly neglected to discuss the possibility of worlds within our reality that merely exist on a different phase, like the weird bugs in Sight Unseen, however it's not a big deal, this would just fit under "Reality" as they are still governed by the passing of our time completely and operate on every principle in time and space that our reality does. Though I suppose you could call the world in which those bugs live another dimension, which in the truest sense of the word might be true, but I don't like the idea.

[SpikeBad]

The sad fact is that I completely understood everything you just said. I watch way too much Sci-Fi. But, anyway you're right about the bugs in Sight Unseen being from another dimension instead of another reality. I was just trying to support the fact that an alternate dimension can have a monumental difference to our own dimension rather than an alternate reality would. Think of the alternate dimensions used on the shows Buffy and Angel like Pylea and Q'uortoth. Those would in fact be alternate dimensions. And if you think of the alternate reality made by Cordelia when she wished that Buffy had never come to Sunnydale in The Wish, that would infact be an alternate reality. It created a difference in the timeline which then transported Cordelia to the alternate reality. In Pylea and Q'uortoth there was no difference in the timeline. At creation, those worlds were already different then the one we now occupy. No matter how many perfect decisions that could have been made an alternate dimension would never closely resemble our own dimension unlike an alternate reality would. Realities exist within dimensions, which then exist within universes.

Still don't know what that ninth chevron is used for.

[pyrodude]

I thought that one reality is one universe and within that universe there are multiple dimensions. Well 11 dimension acording to string theory and that is the science the shows creators went with.

[Flyboy]

I thought that one reality is one universe and within that universe there are multiple dimensions. Well 11 dimension acording to string theory and that is the science the shows creators went with.

Simply? No