The Ancients. Who are they really???

[Ltcolshepjumper]

The shield on Proclarush was not active; there were no power readings. The shell of rock came down not because the ZPM was unplugged, but rather because they ringed through it and destroyed its structural integrity. The shield had probably been down for centuries.
(Note also that Proclarush is the name of the planet, following the "Terre" naming convention. Taonas would be the name of the outpost/former city)

There! ZPMs don't last for millions of years. The shield couldn't have been up because the atmosphere inside was toxic, and everything looked dead.

About willful submission to a dictator- if it's done as a result of deception and in ignorance, it's not justified. The system under the Roman Empire was much less about tyranny (only in the eyes of its opponents- the senators) but more so about security, honor, strength.

[thekillman]

well remember:


1: they ring down
2: jack activates the chair, terra atlantus, etc
3: he takes off his helmet: a biodome has been activated.
4: he puts it on again, removes the ZPM.
5:the dome collapses.


so its not an incident.

[Giantevilhead]

Well, would you think that ZPM's are so great if you knew that its full name is actually Zero Point Hussein Module?

[Finger13]

Well, would you think that ZPM's are so great if you knew that its full name is actually Zero Point Hussein Module?

Pfft, Iraq can't invent anything.

[morrismike]

Finger
Iraq (Mesopatanians/Babylonians) invented irrigation, windmills, batteries, engineering....... they spoke and wrote in their own language while the other cultures were painting cave walls.

[thekillman]

and asphalt.

[Finger13]

Finger
Iraq (Mesopatanians/Babylonians) invented irrigation, windmills, batteries, engineering....... they spoke and wrote in their own language while the other cultures were painting cave walls.

I don't need a history lesson, history is one of my obsessions. While Euopeans were stuck in the Middle Ages the rest of the world (well, the civilized world) retained the knowledge previously discovered and improved upon it, especially the Middle Eastern countries. I know that.

It was an off-handed joke at the present (and recent) state that Iraq has been in. The Middle East isn't exactly a hotbed lately for innovation, excluding Israel and MAYBE Iran.

Obviously an entire civilization's history cannot be summed up in one ignorant statement, I was joking.

[Quadhelix]

Hmm? Curious...so since evolution tells us how all things strive to survive, it therefore tells us nothing about a need to survive?

Odd argument there.

Of course Evolution speaks to morality; any worldview does, and Evolution is most certainly a worldview. It is really quite simple; Natural Selection pushes all things to survive; therefore, we should attempt to do things which help us survive. This is clearly a "moral" statement. It is inescapable.

Sorry it took me so long to respond to this, and I know it is something of a bother, but this cannot go unchallenged.

Evolution does not tell us how "all things strive to survive," evolution tells us that individuals of a species with traits that allow them to produce more descendants will eventually out compete their "weaker" brethren. Is this a good thing? To that question, the theory of evolution has no answer. Indeed, ethologist and evolutionary biologist Richard Dawkins argues that "we should not derive our values from Darwinism, unless it is with a negative sign."

That is not entirely true. Our behaviours are influenced by our evolution. So certain notions of right and wrong emerged because they increase chances of survival. Morality to some extend is the result of our evolution as a social animal.

You misunderstand me. While our evolution might influence our concepts of morality, the Theory of Evolution should not.

Wraith would be different because we have souls; its exactly the same problem as Zipacna had in his rationalization of the Goa'uld; animals aren't rational, humans are.

Actually, Genesis 1:30 seems to imply that all animals have souls: "And to every beast of the earth, to every bird of the sky, and to everything that moves on the earth, within which there is a living soul, every green herb is for food.

[Lt. Col. Mcoy]

I don't recall that particular translation (then again, I may just have forgotten), but this is an excellent time to distinguish something. All living things have souls; if you read my posts, you will see that I distinguish between "rational" and "irrational" beings. Life implies a soul, but only humans have rational souls because only humans were created in God's own image.


Still, MMD said to stop this conversation, so I will refrain from replying to the rest of the post.

[Ltcolshepjumper]

I don't recall that particular translation (then again, I may just have forgotten), but this is an excellent time to distinguish something. All living things have souls; if you read my posts, you will see that I distinguish between "rational" and "irrational" beings. Life implies a soul, but only humans have rational souls because only humans were created in God's own image.


Still, MMD said to stop this conversation, so I will refrain from replying to the rest of the post.

Everything that lives has a soul. However, there is a difference between a soul and a spirit. Animals do not have a spirit.

What was this thread about again? Last I remember, it was about repositories. And something about the Nox and Ascended's noninterference policies. Oh, that's what it was. Yeah, I remember something about evil triumphs when the good do nothing. Yeah, deception sounds like evil. Oppression seems evil. Letting an entire galaxy fall to an oppressive, power hungry, genocidal enemy seems pretty evil to me. Isolationism never works. The Ascended feared becoming corrupt. Possibly because they thought people would start to worship them. Hmmm. They didn't have to actually show themselves. Maybe the whole belief-energy thing is involuntary. For the Nox, it seems as though they may have possessed some advanced technology, but they seem to possess only a little tech. They are advanced physiologically, with the ability to "cloak" things, heal, and live for a very long time. Maybe if their isolationism was to survive. They don't really seem like the type of race that would form an alliance with anyone.

[thekillman]

the nox have advanced so much that they can allow themselves to live as they live

[Lt. Col. Mcoy]

But allowing others to suffer (needlessly) while you live in peace and comfort...

Never mind; off topic.

[Quadhelix]

Yeah, I remember something about evil triumphs when the good do nothing.

However, do not forget "power corrupts" and "the evil in my subconscious is too strong to resist. The only way to win is to deny it battle."

The Ascended feared becoming corrupt. Possibly because they thought people would start to worship them. Hmmm. They didn't have to actually show themselves. Maybe the whole belief-energy thing is involuntary.

Maybe the Ancients realize that they are "human" and thus can fall prey to temptation: if they make an exception to the rule of noninterference for a good cause, what is to stop them from intefering when their cause is not so just?

Still, MMD said to stop this conversation, so I will refrain from replying to the rest of the post.

Oops, sorry about that!

However, if the rest is okay, then I would like to make the following point (if it is not, feel free to reply anyway, as the error and guilt are mine):

All living things have souls; if you read my posts, you will see that I distinguish between "rational" and "irrational" beings. Life implies a soul, but only humans have rational souls because only humans were created in God's own image.

But if humans have rational souls because we were created in the image of God, and the Wraith were "created" in the image of man, then would not the Wraith also have rational souls as they were, however indirectly, created in the image of God as well?

[Professor D.H.D. Puddlejumper]

Still, MMD said to stop this conversation, so I will refrain from replying to the rest of the post.

Speaking of the Major, where'd he go? Major?. . . Major. . .?

[Lt. Col. Mcoy]

But if humans have rational souls because we were created in the image of God, and the Wraith were "created" in the image of man, then would not the Wraith also have rational souls as they were, however indirectly, created in the image of God as well?

I probably shouldn't reply to this, but if you look at my debate on previous pages with Crazy Tom, I explained my position on that point. (which is actually a good point)



And "the Major," I believe, was on a couple of days ago. I don't know why he didn't pop in.