Stargate History - Theory on History of the Ancients

[jonos101]

glad i can make some1 laugh, lol, if u hadnt guessed i am crap at spellin lol!!

ur not the only bad speller

[Professor D.H.D. Puddlejumper]

It makes no sense that the Alliance would have been formed after the Ancients returned to Earth. The Ancients had little civilization here of their own to return to, having come through the stargate leaving Atlantis at the bottom of the sea in Pegasus. After their return here the Ancients are said to have dispersed themselves around the globe and integrated with the new burgeoning civilizations of the time (Rome, Greece etc.) If they had any kind of civilization here at this time where was it based? The Antarctic outpost was too small for that and the whole region was now a frozen wasteland (thanks to millions of years of continental drift.)

It seems to me that the abandonment of Atlantis and return to Earth essentially marks the end of the Ancients as any kind of viable civilization. One of their legacies was the passing on of their ancient gene to subsequent generations of humans.

[kymeric]

It makes no sense that the Alliance would have been formed after the Ancients returned to Earth. The Ancients had little civilization here of their own to return to, having come through the stargate leaving Atlantis at the bottom of the sea in Pegasus. After their return here the Ancients are said to have dispersed themselves around the globe and integrated with the new burgeoning civilizations of the time (Rome, Greece etc.) If they had any kind of civilization here at this time where was it based? The Antarctic outpost was too small for that and the whole region was now a frozen wasteland (thanks to millions of years of continental drift.)

It seems to me that the abandonment of Atlantis and return to Earth essentially marks the end of the Ancients as any kind of viable civilization. One of their legacies was the passing on of their ancient gene to subsequent generations of humans.

It actually makes alot of sense from the perspective of refugees. They had nothing and needed the indegenous races of the MW that had arisen since they left. Leading to the alliance and the sharing of stuffs.

Some joined human cultures and did some breeding, some set up societies, some ascended, some left headgrabber libraries. All either died or ascended in the end.

[Professor D.H.D. Puddlejumper]

It actually makes alot of sense from the perspective of refugees. They had nothing and needed the indegenous races of the MW that had arisen since they left. Leading to the alliance and the sharing of stuffs.

Some joined human cultures and did some breeding, some set up societies, some ascended, some left headgrabber libraries. All either died or ascended in the end.

I realize we're debating on a somewhat fine line of speculation here. I can only reiterate that the Ancients, by this time having dispersed, had no central base of their own here from which to establish the alliance. And I'd always thought of the alliance as one that endured for many thousands of years and not one created partially on the basis of need by one dying civilization. The alliance was termed, I believe, as one of four "great" races.

However, further to that, consider this. The true golden age of the Ancients on Earth is one that I have never seen discussed in these forums. This is the period beginning when the Ancients arrived on Earth some fifty (?) million years ago. At that time the supercontinent Pangea was breaking up and continental drift was slowly separating the land masses of earth. Antarctica was much farther north and lush with forests and vegetation, possibly some of it even sub-tropical. The city was established on this continent around this time (this is verified in "Lost City" by the Proclarush Taonas hologram, although it's not clear whether the Ancients built Atlantis here or brought it with them.) This is a time only about 15 million years after the extinction of the dinosaurs. Earth would have been a much different place. Here is a civilization that endured here for for over 40 million years at the end of which the drift of the continents placed Atlantis in the south polar region to become a frozen wasteland. (Why they didn't just launch the city and place it in a more temperate climate I can't guess.)

This 40-million-year epoch (compare that to our own civilization of a few thousand years) would have been the Ancients' true golden age. What kind of a civilization did the Ancients have during all that time that they were here?. We know they spread throughout the galaxy but did they also expand beyond the boundaries of Atlantis to other parts of Earth? How did they interact with other species here on Earth? Perhaps there are mysteries here of the Ancients' past waiting to be solved, maybe even the mystery of the Furlings. It is during this age of "greatness" that I could see the establishment of an alliance of four great races, an alliance that would have endured for many millennia. There are many stories from this era waiting to be told.

[kymeric]

Hmmm how about that? Thats something that hasnt even been touched on in either SGA or SG1 other than the tail end of lost city and the first 4 min of rising.

What would you folks like to see from the ancient empire on earth. Goverment/personal styles/interaction with humans. Huge cities? Furling flinging contests?

We know it ended with the plague and the Lanteans flying off for Pegasus.

[Pogo01]

Don't forget the Ancients have numerous outposts in the Milky Way. Although for some odd reason the writers have only introduced two of them. The Ancients could've rebuilt their entire civilization with what little numbers they had. I mean they had Ancient outposts in who know how many planets, they have the gate network with all the addresses to each planet, they have the Ancient Database. As well as the Asgard, and the Nox, and the Furlings?

[Prior_of_the_Ori]

Post-Lantean era:[LIST][*]The Lanteans return to Earth through the stargate in Egypt. Spreading upward, many of the Lanteans ascend or mingle with the native peoples, helping their civilizations to grow.

Uhm wasnt the Egyptian Stargate brought to Earth by Ra? After all there was the Antartica gate which was in the Ancient outpost but somehow got buried within the snow?

So if the Ancients were returning they would have gone through either the Antartica gate which got buried in the snow sometime after their arrival OR they came back during the reign of the Goa'uld....

Anyway the Alliance could have been made either pre or post Pegasus. Both are likely scenarios but both lack evidence to confirm them. Pre-Pegasus allows for peace and thousands of years of cooperation along with the line "the Ancients left our region of space thousands of years ago". Post-Pegasus means they had sufficiently low numbers to warrant the creation of an Alliance in the first place.

[Professor D.H.D. Puddlejumper]

Don't forget the Ancients have numerous outposts in the Milky Way. Although for some odd reason the writers have only introduced two of them. The Ancients could've rebuilt their entire civilization with what little numbers they had. I mean they had Ancient outposts in who know how many planets, they have the gate network with all the addresses to each planet, they have the Ancient Database. As well as the Asgard, and the Nox, and the Furlings?

Good point. But there's no indication that they did spread out to these outposts after their return. The outposts had probably fallen into ruin after they fled to Pegasus.

[2ndgenerationalteran]

It makes no sense that the Alliance would have been formed after the Ancients returned to Earth. The Ancients had little civilization here of their own to return to, having come through the stargate leaving Atlantis at the bottom of the sea in Pegasus. After their return here the Ancients are said to have dispersed themselves around the globe and integrated with the new burgeoning civilizations of the time (Rome, Greece etc.) If they had any kind of civilization here at this time where was it based? The Antarctic outpost was too small for that and the whole region was now a frozen wasteland (thanks to millions of years of continental drift.)

The 4 great races could not have existed before the Ancients left, the Asgard would have been as primitive as us. 30,000 years ago they had hyperdrives that are just about as good as the Goulds which are 500 years more advanced than us. So when the Ancients left there probably was an aliance but it was of 3 races the Nox, Furling and the Ancients. When the returned they found the Asgard worthy and invited them in. From there it seems likely that the Ancients realized that they couldnt rebuild their civilization and decided to make the Asgard their legacy teaching them all they could (just like what the asgard did for us when they came to their end). This would actually explain a whole lot such as how the Asgard advanced so quickly, and how they couldnt fully comprehend the ancients technology.

[Pogo01]

The 4 great races could not have existed before the Ancients left, the Asgard would have been as primitive as us. 30,000 years ago they had hyperdrives that are just about as good as the Goulds which are 500 years more advanced than us. So when the Ancients left there probably was an aliance but it was of 3 races the Nox, Furling and the Ancients. When the returned they found the Asgard worthy and invited them in. From there it seems likely that the Ancients realized that they couldnt rebuild their civilization and decided to make the Asgard their legacy teaching them all they could (just like what the asgard did for us when they came to their end). This would actually explain a whole lot such as how the Asgard advanced so quickly, and how they couldnt fully comprehend the ancients technology.

I thought it was already set in stone that the alliance existed before the Ancients fled to the Pegasus Galaxy?

It is wrong to assume that the Ancients invited the Asgard into the Alliance after they came back. The Asgard for all we know could've been more technologically advanced than the Nox and the Furlings. The Ancients would have had nothing to offer upon their return to Earth other than their knowledge, they failed to bring any useful technology or they would've rebuilt their once great civilization, they weren't able to colonize any of their outposts. And if the Ancients did have contact with the Asgard, the Nox, or the Furlings, i'm sure they would've been more than willing to have shared their knowledge with them and rebuilt their civilization.

Hence the fact that they did not rebuild their civilization, they put what knowledge they possessed into what we know as the Ancient Database.

[2ndgenerationalteran]

In the fifth race i dont remember the asgard saying anything that would set their entering the Alliance before they say the Ancients left this region of space many millenia ago. region of space could mean our plane of existance as well as a location. And when looking at the time line its just not possible that the asgard could have entered the alliance millions of years ago when they were not spectacularly advanced 30k years ago. They are closer to us in age than the other races, they are wise because they each had thousands of years to live.

[Raj_2006]

I realize we're debating on a somewhat fine line of speculation here. I can only reiterate that the Ancients, by this time having dispersed, had no central base of their own here from which to establish the alliance. And I'd always thought of the alliance as one that endured for many thousands of years and not one created partially on the basis of need by one dying civilization. The alliance was termed, I believe, as one of four "great" races.

However, further to that, consider this. The true golden age of the Ancients on Earth is one that I have never seen discussed in these forums. This is the period beginning when the Ancients arrived on Earth some fifty (?) million years ago. At that time the supercontinent Pangea was breaking up and continental drift was slowly separating the land masses of earth. Antarctica was much farther north and lush with forests and vegetation, possibly some of it even sub-tropical. The city was established on this continent around this time (this is verified in "Lost City" by the Proclarush Taonas hologram, although it's not clear whether the Ancients built Atlantis here or brought it with them.) This is a time only about 15 million years after the extinction of the dinosaurs. Earth would have been a much different place. Here is a civilization that endured here for for over 40 million years at the end of which the drift of the continents placed Atlantis in the south polar region to become a frozen wasteland. (Why they didn't just launch the city and place it in a more temperate climate I can't guess.)

This 40-million-year epoch (compare that to our own civilization of a few thousand years) would have been the Ancients' true golden age. What kind of a civilization did the Ancients have during all that time that they were here?. We know they spread throughout the galaxy but did they also expand beyond the boundaries of Atlantis to other parts of Earth? How did they interact with other species here on Earth? Perhaps there are mysteries here of the Ancients' past waiting to be solved, maybe even the mystery of the Furlings. It is during this age of "greatness" that I could see the establishment of an alliance of four great races, an alliance that would have endured for many millennia. There are many stories from this era waiting to be told.

I love this idea of the Golden Age of the Anicent civalization. Since they introduce a Anicent story arc in season nine they could of done this for season eleven! During the Ori threat. Think about it .

[Durgia]

hmm, what if the alliance was developed after the plague but before the Lantian return and formalized when they returned to MW(stick with me for a minute)

We know the Ancients had more then one city ship (at least 2 in Pegasus) so I thought I would throw a different theory out.

When the Ancients left the MW they sent ships to multiple galaxies, including Pegasus, Ida, and possibly wherever the Furlings come from. During this time they built Stargate systems in all these galaxies.

In each of the galaxies the ancients watched new races emerge over millions of years. In Pegasus, they did not immediately find sentient life and seeded some, later discovering the Wraith. In Ida the Ancients found the Asgard.

When the Ancients saw the Asgard developing as a great people, they helped them along and eventually left that galaxy for the Asgard to develop. They then either went to Pegasus (The Tower ship) or back to the MW (no show evidence)

Eventually the Lantians were the last of the Ancients around (that we know of) and returned to Earth. At this time they discovered the different races their sister expeditions had found, all exploring the MW. They then formalized an alliance with them.

[jnadreth]

Interesting, very interesting. One thing is is that the Nox and the Furlings as far as we know are a Milky Way native. Another would be that the Asgard had really fast hyperdrives so IMO the Asgard found the Ancients while exploring the MW or PG. If the Ancients knew of the Asgard during the Wraith war could they not have asked for Asgard help in defeating the Wraith?????

[Durgia]

Well the Asgard only developed uber tech in the last 10k years in my scenario. Mainly because of the knowledge they gained from the alliance. Before that they were Goa'uld level tech possibly so would not have been much use to the Lantians.

The Nox and the Furlings we know next to nothing about. Any guess is as valid as the next where they are concerned I think. For one of the "great races" we only ever encountered Nox tech on 1 planet, we dunno if that is their home planet, perhaps that is like their version of Atlantis, an outpost. We know even less about the Furlings.