'Sabotage' (116) General Discussion

[garhkal]

I dunno. If the kino episode is really all it seems to be, then doesn't it seem distinctly unfair that Wray can have lesbian sex while in someone else's body, and yet the woman she swaps with can't have the same sort of freedom? Surely she is aware that the volunteers agree to let the visiting person use their body in the same way they would their own. After all, each person faces the same possibilities: sex, disease, getting drunk, getting in a car wreck, whatever. I wish they would clear it up completely, one way or the other, but I hate the idea that Amanda and Rush can't ever be together, while Wray and Sharon can do whatever they like. The biggest difference in my mind is that Destiny is a much smaller population, where everyone knows everyone else and birth control is, for all we know, non-existant.

That does bring up a point. Why should it work one way (goig home, those inhabitted forfeit/sign over the rights etc, but going to the destiny you cannot do XYZ.. I for one would rather it be one rule for both ways...

As I said, I can't believe Wray (or most people for that matter) would sign up for it. I would sign up for a "no use my body for sex" swap.

Agreed. Out of 34 or so i have chatted to in the mil here and bac in gulfport, when i was chatting about SGU, only 7 or so said "IF it was possible wht they are doing, the body swapping thing, would i agree to let sex or something similar happen". How that is just under 1/5 of those i have chatted to. NOW place this into the SG verse where they have seen LOTS of things happen with body swapping stuff, or alternates. COULD you honestly say that a good chunk of their personnel would be willing to do this, especially with the knowledge that if either side of the deal dies, BOTH die.?
No. hence my statement else where, that i think some of them were 'Voluntold to sign up'...

[xxxevilgrinxxx]

.....y it just wasn’t shown? In my mind the implication was clear....

"in my mind" seems to sum up a great deal of this argument as very little is actually shown on the show itself. I agree with you that Kino 23 does seem to answer the question though.

http://josephmallozzi.wordpress.com/...d-the-mailbag/

yep, minor changes are normal for anything
I love the little extra we get on James, that makes it more clear why she freaked out

[SG7]

I think if they can get a competent doctor using the stones and remove a tracking device that was near Rush's heart by using what is available on Destiny then they can surely figure a way to do almost anything in the medical field. Speaking of the stones, they allow for more occassional SGC member guest appearances. I think using SG-1 or Atlantis past characters on occassion keeps everyone remembering that it all ties in together with the whole Stargate saga. You can still do that without messing up the SGU theme. Shouldn't everyone been excited that Daniel Jackson FINALLY made it to the Pegasus galaxy. Seeing Shepard/Mitchell and McKay/Carter interacting together with Weir on Atlantis. In my opinion that appearance with SG-1 did not hurt the Atlantis show at all and those type of "occassional" guest appearances shouldn't hurt this one either.

Agreed on the SG1/A characters showing up. What I always enjoyed was when I would get to see Walter from SG1 show up. Even though he was only a secondary character and not one of the main characters, I always enjoyed seeing him in SGA and seeing him in the pilot of SGU. So it isn't just the main characters returning in subsequent series that can add to the show.

And yes, if it is done right, main characters can show up in the series and it can be really really good. Like when Amanda Tapping showed up in the pilot commanding the "Hammond". That did seem fitting for her and didn't overshadow the SGU cast. Much like when O'Neill and Jackson were in the pilot of Atlantis. It seemed really fitting that Jackson was there up in the Antarctic. And was great how they got Sheppard introduced to the Stargate program and going to Atlantis. "All I did was sit in the chair!" And next thing we see is him heading off to Atlantis.

[SG7]

That does bring up a point. Why should it work one way (goig home, those inhabitted forfeit/sign over the rights etc, but going to the destiny you cannot do XYZ.. I for one would rather it be one rule for both ways...

Agreed. Out of 34 or so i have chatted to in the mil here and bac in gulfport, when i was chatting about SGU, only 7 or so said "IF it was possible wht they are doing, the body swapping thing, would i agree to let sex or something similar happen". How that is just under 1/5 of those i have chatted to. NOW place this into the SG verse where they have seen LOTS of things happen with body swapping stuff, or alternates. COULD you honestly say that a good chunk of their personnel would be willing to do this, especially with the knowledge that if either side of the deal dies, BOTH die.?
No. hence my statement else where, that i think some of them were 'Voluntold to sign up'...

I don't know if sex during swapping floats my boat. Ranks right up there in the "eeewww" factor as basically it is someone else taking over your body. What happens if sex does occur and the person winds up pregnant or something? I can see kissing, cuddling and even sleeping (without sex) in bed with someone, but sex during swapping I think would creep me out.

[myhelix]

I don't think Eli was pissed at all just surprised and bewildered.

To me he seems to be cranky when the topic comes to Rush. Or was it because Amanda say "maths boy" to him? I think I have to watch the scene again.

[LtColCarter]

To me he seems to be cranky when the topic comes to Rush. Or was it because Amanda say "maths boy" to him? I think I have to watch the scene again.

I think its just the name...because he asks her not to call him that...

[Girlbot]

I don't know if sex during swapping floats my boat. Ranks right up there in the "eeewww" factor as basically it is someone else taking over your body. What happens if sex does occur and the person winds up pregnant or something? I can see kissing, cuddling and even sleeping (without sex) in bed with someone, but sex during swapping I think would creep me out.

I certainly have to agree with this. The body you have swapped with is not yours , it is borrowed for a purpose, and even if that purpose would be to get in touch with relatives and friends or others, common decency would be not to use it for any sexual purpose, that would be abusing it.
Let's just keep the stones for the purpose of helping the Destiny , not partying or playing.

[LtColCarter]

I certainly have to agree with this. The body you have swapped with is not yours , it is borrowed for a purpose, and even if that purpose would be to get in touch with relatives and friends or others, common decency would be not to use it for any sexual purpose, that would be abusing it.
Let's just keep the stones for the purpose of helping the Destiny , not partying or playing.

We've had this discussion in another thread. The thread came about when Wray swapped bodies and the issue was about swapping bodies with someone of a different sexual orientation.

[Coronach]

Agreed. Out of 34 or so i have chatted to in the mil here and bac in gulfport, when i was chatting about SGU, only 7 or so said "IF it was possible wht they are doing, the body swapping thing, would i agree to let sex or something similar happen". How that is just under 1/5 of those i have chatted to. NOW place this into the SG verse where they have seen LOTS of things happen with body swapping stuff, or alternates. COULD you honestly say that a good chunk of their personnel would be willing to do this, especially with the knowledge that if either side of the deal dies, BOTH die.?
No. hence my statement else where, that i think some of them were 'Voluntold to sign up'...

I highly doubt they were forced (i.e. "voluntold"?) to do anything. There are a lot of people involved in the Stargate program. Even if the amount of people willing to volunteer was under 1/5 of the total, that would still be quite a fair number who are willing to body-swap. And considering the low number of people aboard Destiny, I doubt it'd ever be a problem.

Any personal issue that people may have with swapping aside, I think there is no shortage of able and willing body-swap participants. Some of the scientists, especially, seem like they would do anything to get aboard the Destiny and work for a while. And remember, there are many civilian members of the Stargate program that could volunteer (and have on the show so far) who are not directly linked to the military.

[myhelix]

I certainly have to agree with this. The body you have swapped with is not yours , it is borrowed for a purpose, and even if that purpose would be to get in touch with relatives and friends or others, common decency would be not to use it for any sexual purpose, that would be abusing it.
Let's just keep the stones for the purpose of helping the Destiny , not partying or playing.

Apropos abuse, Young do have sex with his wife in Telford´s body, and nobody seems to care about that. And after that he has the guts to be jealous of Telford for being a bit to fond of his wife, still don´t get that.
Is it something different when a man get´s used that way and not a women, it´s still rape isn´t it?

[LtColCarter]

I highly doubt they were forced (i.e. "voluntold"?) to do anything. There are a lot of people involved in the Stargate program. Even if the amount of people willing to volunteer was under 1/5 of the total, that would still be quite a fair number who are willing to body-swap. And considering the low number of people aboard Destiny, I doubt it'd ever be a problem.

Any personal issue that people may have with swapping aside, I think there is no shortage of able and willing body-swap participants. Some of the scientists, especially, seem like they would do anything to get aboard the Destiny and work for a while. And remember, there are many civilian members of the Stargate program that could volunteer (and have on the show so far) who are not directly linked to the military.

I concur...there are a lot of people who'd be willing to swap bodies. I think they'd still do it even if they knew the person they were swapping with was going to bump uglies.

[Blackhole]

I don't know if sex during swapping floats my boat. Ranks right up there in the "eeewww" factor as basically it is someone else taking over your body. What happens if sex does occur and the person winds up pregnant or something? I can see kissing, cuddling and even sleeping (without sex) in bed with someone, but sex during swapping I think would creep me out.

I agree that the practical considerations of an arrangement like that would be problematic at best, unwanted pregnancy, disease etc. The point of Earth visits for many of the Destiny crew is to spend intimate time with their loved ones. The price for unlimited use may be the willingness to allow it for their own body as well. The Kino 23 We Volunteer To Do This Video is trying to show that Stargate Command is aware of the sensitive and awkward nature of body swapping and is trying to make sure the volunteers are making an informed decision. For all we know there may be different levels of intimate exchange available. There could be a limited G version available. The problem then arises how are they going to monitor and police what goes on during the exchanges? What is to stop someone from being sneaky and choosing a G version and then going ahead and having sex anyway. That way they get to have sex and their own body does not. Assuming the G person they switched with isn’t sneaky as well. The whole situation could quickly deteriorate and become unworkable. The easiest way to handle it may be to specify that all exchanges are unlimited and intimate encounters are an assumed risk for all that volunteer. SGU is a 43 minute weekly show. They may not want to focus on all the complicated scenarios that would arise from body swapping; so they put out the Kino 23 video and leave it at that.

[xxxevilgrinxxx]

I agree that the practical considerations of an arrangement like that would be problematic at best, unwanted pregnancy, disease etc. The point of Earth visits for many of the Destiny crew is to spend intimate time with their loved ones. The price for unlimited use may be the willingness to allow it for their own body as well. The Kino 23 We Volunteer To Do This Video is trying to show that Stargate Command is aware of the sensitive and awkward nature of body swapping and is trying to make sure the volunteers are making an informed decision. For all we know there may be different levels of intimate exchange available. There could be a limited G version available. The problem then arises how are they going to monitor and police what goes on during the exchanges? What is to stop someone from being sneaky and choosing a G version and then going ahead and having sex anyway. That way they get to have sex and their own body does not. Assuming the G person they switched with isn’t sneaky as well. The whole situation could quickly deteriorate and become unworkable. The easiest way to handle it may be to specify that all exchanges are unlimited and intimate encounters are an assumed risk for all that volunteer. SGU is a 43 minute weekly show. They may not want to focus on all the complicated scenarios that would arise from body swapping; so they put out the Kino 23 video and leave it at that.

maybe they expect adults to act like adults and don't need to be policing it once consent is given between the people involved? Why is it anyone elses' business what consenting adults do with their bodies? If two adults want to have sex with each other via stone, and the three people involved have consented to that, why is it any of my business what they do?

[LtColCarter]

I agree that the practical considerations of an arrangement like that would be problematic at best, unwanted pregnancy, disease etc. The point of Earth visits for many of the Destiny crew is to spend intimate time with their loved ones. The price for unlimited use may be the willingness to allow it for their own body as well. The Kino 23 We Volunteer To Do This Video is trying to show that Stargate Command is aware of the sensitive and awkward nature of body swapping and is trying to make sure the volunteers are making an informed decision. For all we know there may be different levels of intimate exchange available. There could be a limited G version available. The problem then arises how are they going to monitor and police what goes on during the exchanges? What is to stop someone from being sneaky and choosing a G version and then going ahead and having sex anyway. That way they get to have sex and their own body does not. Assuming the G person they switched with isn’t sneaky as well. The whole situation could quickly deteriorate and become unworkable. The easiest way to handle it may be to specify that all exchanges are unlimited and intimate encounters are an assumed risk for all that volunteer. SGU is a 43 minute weekly show. They may not want to focus on all the complicated scenarios that would arise from body swapping; so they put out the Kino 23 video and leave it at that.

This is pretty much the conclusion we came to in the "body swapping with people of other sexual orientations" thread. When you volunteer, your consciousness isn't in your body...its in another body.

[Girlbot]

Apropos abuse, Young do have sex with his wife in Telford´s body, and nobody seems to care about that. And after that he has the guts to be jealous of Telford for being a bit to fond of his wife, still don´t get that.
Is it something different when a man get´s used that way and not a women, it´s still rape isn´t it?

I cared . It is offensive no matter what the gender.